I must be bored. Two polls in one week. However, this one I think about often. I could have added an "all of the above" option, but I want to hear what folks do most often. If I'm having bad feelings about a ride, I usually start out and then decide relatively quickly to continue riding or to just turn around. So, I'm a "turn around and head home" guy first and then I usually alter some combination of the other options if I decide to continue riding, the only exception being the "beer" option.
I believe in gut instinct and one incident in particular stands out above all. I was out riding with a few friends the Saturday before Easter a few years back. We had a great ride initially, but as the day wore on and comfort and confidence increased, we began to ride a bit on the edge. I was riding a ZX-6R at the time and my buddies were on R1s and CBR900s. The riding day passed without incident except that my friend on the R1 dropped it while coming to a stop in some gravel up on Richard Russell Scenic Highway (Hwy. 348), near the top.
I really had no intention of staying the night with my friends because the following day was Easter, and I needed to be with my family. However, I had an overwhelming sense of dread, doom, anxiety... whatever you want to call it, about the following day's ride. I advised my friends that I might come up later in the day, but I knew there was no way I was going to set rubber anywhere near the North Georgia mountains. I expressed my concern sincerely to my friends and cautiously rode home.
Sunday I received a call from one of my friends. Seems that our riding companion, the one that dropped his R1 the day before, was hit by a drunk driver who crossed the double yellow on 129 at the top of Blood Mountain. Apparently, my friend was knocked about 100' in the air, or as high "as the tree tops," and landed some distance away from the wrecked bike. He was airlifted to the hospital in Chattanooga where the doctors discovered two shattered legs, broken pelvis, broken back, and a ruptured aorta, among various other less serious injuries. As a result of that accident, my friend no longer walks today and is no longer able to fly as a pilot for a major airline.
Moral of the story, listen to your "gut" and to anyone around you that loves you. Pay attention and don't overlook the smallest of details. Being attentive to the small details might very well be the best decsion you'll ever make. I believe that one can actually hone their ability to "tune in" and "feel" impending danger in an effort to avoid it.
It dont matter what If you have a scene stuck in your head just stay home and do work around the house. If you think somthing is gonna happen just dont go, you will be worried the whole trip anyway and wont enjoy yourself so no sense in going.
Thanks for sharing the story. I feel for you and your buddy. I know those feelings of anxiety or impending doom. Always good to listen to your instincts. Nature put them there for a reason. There have been times when I left home, felt totally out of sync with the bike or felt really anxious, turned around and put the bike away. I'm glad to know there others out there that hae similar feelings.
I clicked 'stay home' but that isn't entirely accurate. Most of my riding is commuting; either to the train or into Chicago. If I'm planning to ride my commute on a given day, and if one or both of my kids get upset that I'm leaving, I take it as a sign, and I take the car instead.
I have turned around and come home many times. If I get that nagging feeling I just go home. Better safe than sorry and I can always ride another day.
I feel like I am well past due fora major get off and I am wearing leather exclusively because of this. I have quite a bit of textile gear that will be hanging in the closet this year. :unsure:
I have the same 6th sense / ESP when I go riding or driving my cage. I usually feel it while I'm putting my gear on to ride. If I don't feel 100% and have a "funny" feeling in my gut, I just stop and drop all plans for riding that day. I also have this wierd thing when I feel that I have to back off on my speed when I'm driving my car or my bike. 100% of the time that I go through this, I will spot a speed trap on the side of the highway a little bit further up the road, or a leo mobile would suddenly appear amongst the traffic behind me. It has never failed me and I have been ticket and accident free for close to 20 years on the road! I agree about listening to your gut feeling. You can't lose if you do so. Better safe than sorry!
baileyrock, Apr 13 2005, 09:34 PMYour scaring me ! :unsure:
Actually I wanted a "all of the above" button !
No, my intent was not to scare. I'm of the school of thought that we don't have to crash and can avoid EVERY accident. The books Proficient Motorcycling and More Proficient Motorcycling discuss the topic of never having to have an accident. The author just talks about riding in a fashion that allows you to see that car that's turning left in front of you, or any other hazard. I've read both books and both Twist of the Wrist books, and any other scrap I can find. Racing schools and track days really helped as well. Just trying to bring to light another "accident avoidance" tool at our disposal that it would seem most already know about. Call me crazy but it's for real. Some things are just not a coincidence ;) .
"Paranoia, paranoia everybody's out to get me...."
Can't remember the name of the song....
Anyway, ever get the feeling you've 'been here before' but of course you never have, 'someone is watching me' but you are home alone with the curtains drawn and you may even go outside to find no one there... all mind games.
etc
etc
etc
The number of times this has happened to me, and you go, and nothing happens is large.
It is usually after a really quick run the weekend before and I'm feeling a bit guilty.
We all like to think we have a degree of ESP about us but predicting the future is not going to happen.
Following a car and change lanes for no particular reason? Your subconscious has picked up on unusual movements by the driver.
Slowed down just before a cop either goes flying past, has a gun up ahead etc? Feeling guilty again? Or, a thought that, woops yep 30kph over the limit is pushing it a bit.
Sorry to be a wet blanket but seriously nothing stops me from going on a ride.
Rain, road weather alerts, 40C heat, yep done it all. Including been pushed 2 meters off line to the very edge of the road by a blast of wind whilst going around a corner, riding in a white out situation it was raining so hard.
Hell I'd even jump on the bike to check the mail box 10 meters away...
Impending feeling of doom?
Just be aware.
If it is your time to go then not much you can do about it and I'd rather go doing something I really love than being struck by lightning mowing the lawn....
vfrgreg, Apr 14 2005, 02:14 AM"Paranoia, paranoia everybody's out to get me...."
Can't remember the name of the song....
Anyway, ever get the feeling you've 'been here before' but of course you never have, 'someone is watching me' but you are home alone with the curtains drawn and you may even go outside to find no one there... all mind games.
etc
etc
etc
The number of times this has happened to me, and you go, and nothing happens is large.
It is usually after a really quick run the weekend before and I'm feeling a bit guilty.
We all like to think we have a degree of ESP about us but predicting the future is not going to happen.
Following a car and change lanes for no particular reason? Your subconscious has picked up on unusual movements by the driver.
Slowed down just before a cop either goes flying past, has a gun up ahead etc? Feeling guilty again? Or, a thought that, woops yep 30kph over the limit is pushing it a bit.
Sorry to be a wet blanket but seriously nothing stops me from going on a ride.
Rain, road weather alerts, 40C heat, yep done it all. Including been pushed 2 meters off line to the very edge of the road by a blast of wind whilst going around a corner, riding in a white out situation it was raining so hard.
Hell I'd even jump on the bike to check the mail box 10 meters away...
Impending feeling of doom?
Just be aware.
If it is your time to go then not much you can do about it and I'd rather go doing something I really love than being struck by lightning mowing the lawn....
I don't think John Kocinsky will like your post! ;^)
The day I didn't listen to my inner voice saying "don't walk any further up the hill towards the gym!. Skip the workout today! Turn around and go home!" (And I fought the thought all the way up the hill) - was the day I broke my leg walking home after a workout at the gym. I slipped on black ice and my foot got caught in an irregration thingy (the official word :P ). I had to hop on one leg to get help (this is the Yukon). And I got a cab 20 minutes later and went to the hospital.
So now when it comes to the bike - I listen! I've stayed home on days I didn't feel right about something. There is so much we are aware of on a sub-conscious level - more so than we acknowledge in the conscious realm. It is truly amazing. I've even been taught how to "feel" when you're being tracked by a wolf! This was by a native elder when I was actually being tracked by a family of wolves while walking my dog near the edge of the "city". (The dog would have been their dinner...but...wasn't).
Our body can tell us so much if we listen. One aspect of motorcycle riding is to be aware and keep your body able to be aware. Maybe that is why as rider's we are more aware of our surroundings????? I don't think of it as a "sixth sense". I think of it as our primary awareness. Something we tap into when we listen hard enough. Something that can keep us alive.
Did you ever ask your friend if he sensed/knew/felt anything before his accident? (Obviously you're very aware). I wonder why he wasn't?
hey if i listened to the little voice saying 'don't go to the gym please don't go today' i would NEVER get to the gym!!! ;)
hold on, i never go to the gym!!! i'll just go ride my (mtn) bike instead...
seriously, i haven't had any gut intincts to tell me one way or the the other but i ain't saying it isn't so. i just hope i know to listen when i feel it.
I rely on insticnt when I ride all the time. You need all 5 senses plus the 6th going full time. Sometimes I get a high pitched tone in my head, :idea3: which usually indicates radar ahead. A friend rides with a radar detector and I pick it up before him. Sometimes it's just an a feeling that the speed tax collectors are around :unsure: and they are. Sometimes I get a thought that there might be crap on the road so I slow down. The more you use it the better it works. After a while you can tell the difference between being a worry wort and intuition. All those coincidences aren't just coincidents. Just listen when you ride. Glenn
X-Euro, Apr 13 2005, 09:29 PM I must be bored. Two polls in one week. However, this one I think about often. I could have added an "all of the above" option, but I want to hear what folks do most often. If I'm having bad feelings about a ride, I usually start out and then decide relatively quickly to continue riding or to just turn around. So, I'm a "turn around and head home" guy first and then I usually alter some combination of the other options if I decide to continue riding, the only exception being the "beer" option.
I believe in gut instinct and one incident in particular stands out above all. I was out riding with a few friends the Saturday before Easter a few years back. We had a great ride initially, but as the day wore on and comfort and confidence increased, we began to ride a bit on the edge. I was riding a ZX-6R at the time and my buddies were on R1s and CBR900s. The riding day passed without incident except that my friend on the R1 dropped it while coming to a stop in some gravel up on Richard Russell Scenic Highway (Hwy. 348), near the top.
I really had no intention of staying the night with my friends because the following day was Easter, and I needed to be with my family. However, I had an overwhelming sense of dread, doom, anxiety... whatever you want to call it, about the following day's ride. I advised my friends that I might come up later in the day, but I knew there was no way I was going to set rubber anywhere near the North Georgia mountains. I expressed my concern sincerely to my friends and cautiously rode home.
Sunday I received a call from one of my friends. Seems that our riding companion, the one that dropped his R1 the day before, was hit by a drunk driver who crossed the double yellow on 129 at the top of Blood Mountain. Apparently, my friend was knocked about 100' in the air, or as high "as the tree tops," and landed some distance away from the wrecked bike. He was airlifted to the hospital in Chattanooga where the doctors discovered two shattered legs, broken pelvis, broken back, and a ruptured aorta, among various other less serious injuries. As a result of that accident, my friend no longer walks today and is no longer able to fly as a pilot for a major airline.
Moral of the story, listen to your "gut" and to anyone around you that loves you. Pay attention and don't overlook the smallest of details. Being attentive to the small details might very well be the best decsion you'll ever make. I believe that one can actually hone their ability to "tune in" and "feel" impending danger in an effort to avoid it.
Beats me why I just posted all of that...
It's all in your mind, and your mind is fucking with you. Your mind knows the consequences of speed and the body's vulnerability and the results of both in a crash, and a part of it is saying, "what the hell are you doing, don't you want to live forever?". That's the brain's job, or we would all be an episode of "jackass" on MTV. My suggestion is to study the statistics, you know, bikes owned divided by bikes crashed, and then step back and analyze. Most bike crashes are because the rider was an idiot and exhibited behavior that all but guaranteed he would crash, is that you? Another percentage is just plain old stupidity by other drivers, but that is offset by a large percentage by riding with focus and utilizing good rider skills. Then there is just plain bad luck, karma, shit happens, dudu occurs, stuff that will get a percentage of the population no matter where they are or what you are doing--don't even waste your time worrying about that bit because it could get you right now while your reading this....is that an asteroid I hear streaking toward your house? Embrace that fear, it's what keeps you from making really stupid choices, but also manage it, because if you don't you'll never enjoy life, instead you'll buy and Apple computer, a Volvo (or Subaru, depending on your age), and stay at that job that you hate while life passes you by. Then again I have been drinking and could be full of shit. AC
acmaui, Apr 14 2005, 06:46 AMIt's all in your mind, and your mind is fucking with you.� Your mind knows the consequences of speed and the body's vulnerability and the results of both in a crash, and a part of it is saying, "what the hell are you doing, don't you want to live forever?".� That's the brain's job, or we would all be an episode of "jackass" on MTV.� My suggestion is to study the statistics, you know, bikes owned divided by bikes crashed, and then step back and analyze.� Most bike crashes are because the rider was an idiot and exhibited behavior that all but guaranteed he would crash, is that you?� Another percentage is just plain old stupidity by other drivers, but that is offset by a large percentage by riding with focus and utilizing good rider skills.� Then there is just plain bad luck, karma, shit happens, dudu occurs, stuff that will get a percentage of the population no matter where they are or what you are doing--don't even waste your time worrying about that bit because it could get you right now while your reading this....is that an asteroid I hear streaking toward your house?� Embrace that fear, it's what keeps you from making really stupid choices, but also manage it, because if you don't you'll never enjoy life, instead you'll buy and Apple computer, a Volvo (or Subaru, depending on your age), and stay at that job that you hate while life passes you by. Then again I have been drinking and could be full of shit. AC
Agreed, fear is healthy and should be embraced and analyzed when ecountered. However, what I'm suggesting is that there may be a little more to it and maybe it's just experience. No, I'm not talking about ESP or anything like that, just a simple distinction between abnormal fear and an internal (or external - depends on your belief or faith in such things) warning.
As a former Marine, I have the honor of riding with some Vietnam veterans from time to time. One gentleman in particular is a very good friend of mine. He's shared quite a bit with me about his tour. He led a Marine Recon Unit and scouted ahead of the main force well behind enemy lines gathering intelligence. This guy knew in advance when something bad was coming down. He worked with another guy that just knew when they were getting ready to step on a trip wire or some other trap - he'd find it and disarm it, and then replace it for the NVA and Viet Cong. My friend called it a "feeling," but, like you say, I'm sure it evolved out of fear first, sense of awareness second, and then just honing and refining the subconscious feelings and awareness into a tool for self-preservation. These guys were good and learned to survive.
So, if they can stay alive in a hostile jungle environment, I think we can do the same. Call it what you want, but there's a skill out there to be acknowledged and learned.
By way of example, there are some roads I ride that command my respect more than others (although, I respect all roads and the ride and recognize the risk). The Cherohala Scenic Skyway is one of those roads. I get on that road and it's like I'm getting ready to do battle. The battle is not to see how fast I can ride those 43 glorious miles - the battle is with myself. The best analogy I can think of is the Greek Mythology story of the Three Sirens.
"In Greek Mythology, Sirens were part human, part bird. The Sirens lived on a rocky island in the middle of the sea, possibly near Italy. They sang melodies so beautiful that sailors passing by couldn't resist getting closer to them. Following the sound of music, the sailors would steer their boats towards them or jump in the water to get closer. Either way, it always ended in disaster on the rocks."
The above sums it up quite nicely. The Cherohala will suck you in and spit you out unbelieveably quickly. It's smooth and fluid and fast (if you choose) for miles, and when you least expect it, she'll throw a fast downhill decreasing radius turn at you. I've seen it too many times for it to be ignored. Folks ride the Dragon and then think the Cherohala is a joy ride. These folks in their underestimation of this road usually end up under guard rails. It's horrendously sad and the accidents are no less horredndous. In fact, I believe the statistics show that the Cherohala has claimed more than the Dragon, and I believe it does so on an annual basis.
Most of my experience comes from seeing downed riders and analyzing what brought them down. I've witnessed probably no less than 20 downed riders in the last five or six years. Some died and some were crippled. I've watched them die on the road and I've watched them recover in intensive care. Despite it all, I still ride but have learned quite a bit as a result. The most important lesson? Listen to your gut and ride in a way so as to be able to ride another day. Hey, that rhymes :thumbsup: !
On several occasions during my commute, which is 50 miles each way on secondary 2-lane roads, rather than passing slow traffic as I usually do I just sat back and relaxed. Low and behold I either passed a trooper or deputy coming the other way or shooting radar on the side of the road. Wierd.
That being said, maybe it's just that those are the times when we notice such things. When you slow down and don't see a LEO you may not think anything of it. Just like we seem to notice more when things go wrong than when they go right. I'm not a particularly superstitious person, so I'm inclined to think the 'sixth sense' is a combination of all your senses working well together combined with mental focus. As far as bad things happening when you have a bad feeling, it's easy to find something when you're looking for it. Sadly, bad things happen when you don't have bad feelings too. jm02 :mellow:
Yes be aware. Especially when riding in the area of North Georgia. North Carolina and the surrounding states. US 129 and the Skyway are just two of the roads up there that will bite you rather hard if you get caught out. I'm sure that every area of the world has roads like this so be aware and ride safe.
i'll admit that ive turned around after a couple of blocks and back into the garage it went.it's because i knew i wasn't up for a ride, the cagers looked especially stupid, the weather looked like it would foul the fun, or something along those lines. i'll believe in a 6th sense once i can figure out how to open that third eye in my forehead.
Once in a while I get a feeling of a cop in the area 90% of the time I'm right the other 10% heck thats ok I need to slow down more anyway. My radar detector is a big help ya'll should get one,won't solve it all but does help real big sometimes
I get that "Nagging Feeling of Doom" just before my wife gets home if there are VFR body parts in the living room, because I don�t want to become body parts :P
Moral of the story, listen to your "gut" and to anyone around you that loves you.
Before each and every ride I live my death over and over again in the most horrible mental pictures... however once I swing a leg over the bike I switch to a survivors mind set... I reserve my fear in nooks and crannies of my mind because the function of fear is to warn us of danger... not make us afraid to face it... because fear tends to produce the very thing that you're afraid of... crashing... In short "Fear Smells"...
Here is a real scary one. I had a great ride down the Skyline drive. 35 to 50 mph 'pace'. I turned down Rt 211 East and found a road with 10 nice wide hairpins. Spectacular! All of a sudden I was overcome by the fear. Sure enough around the next corner a group of bikes and rescue trucks. Some poor guy was sitting up against the guard rail writhering in pain. Who knows what went wrong. after offering to help, I just rode by... stunned. Everybody I love has expressed their gut feeling that M/C riding is just a matter of time. Is it fun you bet but risks out weigh the desire. The bike is for sale.
Pillowsplat, Apr 18 2005, 07:25 PMEverybody I love has expressed their gut feeling that M/C riding is just a matter of time. Is it fun you bet but risks out weigh the desire. The bike is for sale.
kophey, Apr 15 2005, 07:40 AMi'll admit that ive turned around after a couple of blocks and back into the garage it went.it's because i knew i wasn't up for a ride, the cagers looked especially stupid, the weather looked like it would foul the fun, or something along those lines. i'll believe in a 6th sense once i can figure out how to open that third eye in my forehead.
How you gonna see out of helmet wit 3rd eye :blink:
johne, Apr 18 2005, 02:40 PMWhat?! Your done??? :blink:
The bike is listed and if it sells I'm done. I just envision the 45 mph slide across the pavement and tangling up in the guard rail or running wide on a corner. I'm not usually a scarity cat but I was a professional ski racer and had a great set of skills. I fell once every 10 times out. I rode bicyles in excess of 10,000 miles / year and would go down about every 15000 miles. It was usually weird stuff. A binding failing, a chain breaking..... it happens. I don't have the skills and the learning curve has an extreme consequence. The idea of low siding or even worse high siding with out a gravel run out sounds bad. Don't worry I'll still protect the 'Ducts'.
I think we can all agree on this. Im 25, the family dare-devil, half crazy/half stupid, and Im sure I have a chemical imbalance (twice the normal amount of testosterone was spilled into the mixing bowl that made me)...however, I still can understand that hard riding should be reserved for the track and on the street the craziest anyone should get is to ride the turns a bit hard and stay slow on the straights. Its the turns that got us all hooked anyway. Just my two cents, maybe buy a beater 600 and throw it on the track once a month. My ex girlfriends dad said thats why he doesnt ride on the street, its all worked out on saturday and sunday at the track every few weeks.
BTW, where is the "Felt something ominous, went anyway, crashed hard, slept in the hospital for a few days, learned from it, glad I learned at 17 instead of 25" button?
I haven't participated in this thread up till now, not sure why. But I'd say this is really about the realistic fear that riders face ea time they ride.
For me it's more a mental battle (between the desire to ride and fear of crashing etc) and not a gut level feeling of any kind. I think the battle is won when you get control of your feelings and determine if the situation calls for slowing down, taking a break, stopping completely and going home, or your fear is out of control and clouding your judgement.
This isn't to say that somedays I might start out to ride and end up saying naaa, but it's based on (one or more of:) not feeling too sharp, riding too much - pushing luck?, not sure about people riding with, weather, planning seems helter skelter and I'm not comfortable...
I think we're all saying pretty much the same thing, but I dont' think of it as a "gut level feeling" or "something I can't put my finger on". But this is not to say I think theres anything wrong with Rossi or anyone else praying before ea ride :) Hank
End of thread · 30 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 8 May 2005
