Riding Again After An Accident

As many of you know, I recently totalled my beloved 2003 VFR, and replaced her with a clean 2002 ABS model. Now that I'm riding again, I'm a little jumpy, I almost feel nervous back in the saddle. Part of it could be the worn and cupping D208's making the bike feel twitchy in corners, but it's probably mostly me. I've only done about 350 miles on the new bike, but I had thought that would be enough to get back into the swing of things. Anyone ever experience anything similar or have any advice?

Just seat time!

Coming from someone who's totaled a bike, I know the feeling. It's been over two years now and the accident is still fresh in my head.

Don't let it get you down. Before you know it, you'll be back into the swing of things. :fing02:

KPerhamJust seat time!

I totally agree with this. As someone that has been down a couple of times and have witnessed a few bike accidents; the number one thing is to get back on and ride as much as possible. Sometimes it can take a whole season or more to get back into the swing but take it easy, ride well within your comfort/safety margins and put those miles on!

It's all about confidence. And it sounds like yours is shaken, understandably so. If the tires are bothering you, replace them. You need to have complete confidence in your machine, so you can work on the confidence within. You will get there!

Yup, just gotta ride, and slowly start working your confidence level back up. I've lowsided twice, and both times it took me a while to regain my mojo. You know what I've found really helps, though? A trackday. Getting out there and railing on your bike does wonders to remind you of what it--and you--are capable of. I've noticed the same thing during springtime... after several months of skating around on cold tires, rarely doing any riding other then freeway commuting, it takes me a while to get the feel for sport-riding back... usually until I do my first trackday of the season, then I'm right back into it. :biggrin:

But, yeah, get some sticky tires on there first!

you could try hypnosis or accupuncture. :biggrin:

yea they said it....seat time. try commuting on it for a while and before you know it, you will beg for some interesting riding.

I suspect it's something like "Post traumatic shock syndrome". I can relate to the feeling. I never crashed my motorcycles since I started riding as a kid, but I did crash badly on a racing bicycle (lowsided going at least 30MPH on a curve). Got real bad roadrash on my right side and arm and had to heal/treat myself, foolishly avoiding the doctor because I was a poor college kid. I tell you, the trauma I went through scrubbing the debris away by myself from my road rash was some of the worst pain I have ever felt and it affected my racing bike riding from them on in a major way and surely continued to affect me many years after on my motorcycles. I don't feel as invincible as I felt back then before I had that bicycle crash (before when I dove through turns so agressively and without much fear or calculation), which in someways must have saved my life as a motorcycle rider, because I try to use my head to ride as smartly as I can every minute I spend on the saddle since that fateful crash many years ago. You'll surely get more comfortable later, it just takes time, but your riding will definitely change to most likely many better ways. Do change out that awful cupped Dunflop 208. I'm 100% sure it's not helping out and making that front end nervous feeling. Spoon on some smooth handling Michelin PR2CTs on that bike and it will be night and day difference for the better...I guarantee!

Beck

95 VFR

Took me several years before I felt comfortable on a bike again after a nasty spill. You'll gradually get more and more confident over time. I take it much, much easier now that I've had a get-off - slower pace, enjoy the scenery, and stay alive.

I think the suggestion of a track day would be a good place to start too. Although I've never done one, I've done lots of training for a local motorcycle training class. Having a place to push things and find out what you and your bike can do made a big difference.

BeckI suspect it's something like "Post traumatic shock syndrome". I can relate to the feeling. I never crashed my motorcycles since I started riding as a kid, but I did crash badly on a racing bicycle (lowsided going at least 30MPH on a curve). Got real bad roadrash on my right side and arm and had to heal/treat myself, foolishly avoiding the doctor because I was a poor college kid. I tell you, the trauma I went through scrubbing the debris away by myself from my road rash was some of the worst pain I have ever felt and it affected my racing bike riding from them on in a major way and surely continued to affect me many years after on my motorcycles. I don't feel as invincible as I felt back then before I had that bicycle crash (before when I dove through turns so agressively and without much fear or calculation), which in someways must have saved my life as a motorcycle rider, because I try to use my head to ride as smartly as I can every minute I spend on the saddle since that fateful crash many years ago. You'll surely get more comfortable later, it just takes time, but your riding will definitely change to most likely many better ways. Do change out that awful cupped Dunflop 208. I'm 100% sure it's not helping out and making that front end nervous feeling. Spoon on some smooth handling Michelin PR2CTs on that bike and it will be night and day difference for the better...I guarantee!

Beck

95 VFR

Agree with everyone here about seat time, but even more so with Beck's suggestion to replace the crappy and worn tires!

The last thing you need right now is some twitchy confidence robbing junk tires on the bike! :wub:

Replace them right away with something decent, it will help remove unneeded worry! :biggrin:

I have a coworker that laid his bike down in rush hour freeway traffic to avoid crashing into a car. He avoided hitting anything, picked up his bike and rode it home. The next day he was back on his bike riding again even before replacing the plastic.

Some great responses here, especially Beck.

Yeah, I have been there and done that...totalled a bike and then felt the nervousness. And before that I too had some bicycling crashes that made me jumpy. Just like folks say, it is a combo of seat time and working on your mind and attitude. Use the conservative tendency to be safer but DON'T tense up and be too jumpy or you WILL get into trouble. Go ZEN, baby...just clear your mind before you ride, remember you are on the motorcycle so focus on the task completely. And YES, replace that tire and do whatever is required to trust the bike completely. Good luck...you'll be fine!

I think one of the biggest problems many riders encounter returning after a crash and especially if you happen to hit something or slide on that unseen dirt/gravel/oil is a habit of looking right in front of the bike(front wheel) to make sure you don't hit something again. :biggrin:

Doing this instead of always looking as far forward as possible just messes everything up as it overloads your mind! :wub:

alwaysawareI have a coworker that laid his bike down in rush hour freeway traffic to avoid crashing into a car. He avoided hitting anything, picked up his bike and rode it home. The next day he was back on his bike riding again even before replacing the plastic.

^^^ That guy is hardcore :biggrin: Though I knew a guy in Perth (AUS) who was knocked down on the 4-lane by a mid-size truck. He got up, shook it off, and chased the driver down. He won the court case too, got some awesome compensation and a new bike!

BaileyrockI think one of the biggest problems many riders encounter returning after a crash and especially if you happen to hit something or slide on that unseen dirt/gravel/oil is a habit of looking right in front of the bike(front wheel) to make sure you don't hit something again. :blink:

Doing this instead of always looking as far forward as possible just messes everything up as it overloads your mind! :huh:

I couldn't agree more!

BaileyrockI think one of the biggest problems many riders encounter returning after a crash and especially if you happen to hit something or slide on that unseen dirt/gravel/oil is a habit of looking right in front of the bike(front wheel) to make sure you don't hit something again. :blink:

Doing this instead of always looking as far forward as possible just messes everything up as it overloads your mind! :huh:

Exactly! That and the twitchiness is part of what make me so nervous. Which makes me realize my riding is off and I'm more likely to crash, which makes me more twitchy, nervous, and target-fixating. Kind of a vicious cycle.

superfunkomaticTook me several years before I felt comfortable on a bike again after a nasty spill. You'll gradually get more and more confident over time. I take it much, much easier now that I've had a get-off - slower pace, enjoy the scenery, and stay alive.

:blink:

I got hit head on by a squid trying to pull 70+ through crud corner (us 129) (on a bmwk1200gt no less) last april 15, 2008, got thrown about 75 feet slid another 50 and rolled another 50. I walked away but came very close to loosing a leg from swelling (compartment syndrome) (ps I guess it was a good thing my tank bag with the s&w in it was thrown into the woods and took a little while to find smile.gif ). oddly I have had no apprehension getting on a bike and was riding 2 weeks later.... but about a month later I totaly lost self control when I was in the cage and a moron turned left in front of me it was all I could do to not chase them down and hurt them really badly. Oddly enough I have more anxiety in the cage than on the bike since the assault on my person. For some reason I feel I can escape on the bike and am in control of everything, in the cage I feel trapped (since the incident)

I guess the response is just different for different folks.

I do find myself entering turns later now and always using a late apex with a sharper turn when I am facing bike traffic now though, just to keeep my line further from the middle, my only anxiety on a bike is, when is that damn squid boy going to blow a fast rt, and take me out. ( I tense a bit when I see a group in a right turn coming toward me, usually hanging over the line :huh: and they are all bunched up so if one hiccups they are all going down and taking me with them :blink: )

just time and FOCUS makes this go away, if you are thinking what if you do not have your head in the ride!!!! try to concentrate on the ride and let it happen and the what ifs just fade away (meditate and set your mind on the task)

1. Replace tires stat. Ensure all controls work properly and are adjusted to suit your personal needs.

2. Set a personal goal for another TMAC. We'll be waiting for you.

3. Realize you're not going to ride as smooth or as fast as you used to, eventually maybe somewhere down the road, but NOT right now, enjoy that you're able to at least still ride!

4. Don't play hero. Continue to Ride Red (or a Titanium 1100 :wub: ) just don't RIDE RED (anymore) and enjoy the two wheel experience, whilst paying EXTRA attention to blind spots or whatever threw you off the first time.

5. Avoid any attempts at shaving your lap times on the Interstate as you navigate through the lapped traffic (or blowing by some ahole in an SUV w/ cell phone to teach him a lesson).

6. Stand up to your friend, the curve doctor on the yellow VFR, who means the best, but avoid his request of leading a group of twisty/speed dehydrated Fla COPS through the rainy/misty roads of the Mighty Cherahola, she's a cruel mistress, and there's nothing worse than seeing 8 bikes right on your six, when you're thinking "TelliCafe".

7. Pay attention to your body and what it's telling you. Really focus and learn from it, develop compensation techniques, if need be to ride like you used to, again, if need be.

8. Enjoy the feeling that you're having more fun in a simple commute/ride to work than everyone else on the road in their cage. Idiots.

9. Give Dale (theoxmole) a big kiss and a squeeze for giving you a ride home... he's ok, maybe curious, but ok, I swear... :goofy:

10. Don't be afraid to RIP IT when the time arrives....

Enjoy man, you'll be alright. Pain fades, Chicks dig scars, and leave your brains in the toolbox... jk... Enjoy what others can only dream about doing... :fing02:

See ya at TMAC next year!

alwaysawareI have a coworker that laid his bike down in rush hour freeway traffic to avoid crashing into a car. He avoided hitting anything, picked up his bike and rode it home. The next day he was back on his bike riding again even before replacing the plastic.

I agree with all the posts and strongly recommend getting new tires. If you are spending time riding and feel the bike is touchy or 'iffy', don't risk another fall;. replace the tires. I have read that when fighter pilots crash a plane, they want the pilot to return to the air quickly so he/she keep their nerve and touch. The more miles you ride, the more comfortable you will become. If you are riding 'stiff' that will cause issues too. Too tight on the grip pressure, rigid posture, tense neck/upper torso muscles will screw your riding up. In summary...

1.) Get new rubber

2.) Relax a little and enjoy the ride

3.) Miles and miles of riding will see you ready for TMac '10

Ride safe, JD

Ryan, all are correct. Give it time. I have been down on the road a few times (lost all the skin on my right arm in one low side on my first one, nothing but a bruise from my second one and after the third one regained consciousness on the center line of the highway wondering how did I get here... hey didn't I have a bike?.... oh shit that looks like it waaaaay over there) and it just takes lots of riding time and miles to get the comfort level back. I noticed that on returning home from TMAC I was more nervous in my riding I think as a result of seeing a few crashes there. Kind of makes the point "it could happen to me too" Since then the more I ride the more relaxed I am. Just keep at it and we will see you next year. :blink: Tom

Focus on technique. By getting back to square one, you'll regain your confidence. Good technique breeds good riding.

JayWalkerYou need to have complete confidence in your machine, so you can work on the confidence within.

:blink:

well said.

Track Day!... :blink:

Come to the Gilmore on Sunday and ride demo bikes! :biggrin: They have new tires!

Take your time and go at your own pace. Don't let anyone else put any demands on you. Don't put any unrealistic demands on yourself.

I've found for me that it takes riding the right roads get me back into the groove. Usually the mountains where conservative riding still requires decent lean angles.

I went ahead and pinned this thread as many riders go through the exact same thing when returning to riding after a drop/crash so hopefully others can also learn from our leaning process! :biggrin:

Thanks Baileyrock!

And one more thing. This can happen in lots of ways. About 25 years ago I was bicycling to work on a junker lender bike (my new bicycle was being built) and near the college campus two cuties jaywalked right in front of me. I chose to swerve behind them since they were taking my space. Well unfortunately they took two giant steps BACKWARDS right into my path. Short version is she ended up ok. (As she lay there kinda dazed I pulled the gum out of her mouth because I was afraid she would choke. I figured I possibly saved her life.) It was all their fault but a few weeks later her father's high-powered lawyer made noises about suing ME (poor college student...they gave up real quick!). But the point is I was afraid to bicycle; I was afraid to drive or be in a car. I was even tentative WALKING! It took me about 6 months to get back to "normal." We can easily get spooked when it comes to vehicular accidents. It is understandable and we all have different rates of recovery. Anyone who goes through walks a unique path. Take your time and figure out your fears, confront them and then move on. You'll get your mojo back and you'll be smarter and safer for the experience.

I think every one has given you some good info and i really can't disagree with anyone. The piece that i think has been left out, and has been the most helpful to me, is truly understanding the reason you crashed. I've crashed more times then i can count growing up riding in the dirt, and only twice since making a switch to pavement. I've had a nasty high side @ 35mph and a far gentler low side @ approx the same speed. About 35K miles separates these crashes and each happened for different reasons.

The single most important thing for me (and everyone is different) to get comfortable and back in the groove is to understand my crashes. And then followed closely is seat time. I found that if i don't understand the mechanics of how i crashed and why i crashed then my brain is scared it will happen again. My high side was a combination of events that took some time to truly understand what happened. but the low side was simple, i coasted through a traffic circle that i normally am accelerating through. Acceleration shifts weight off the front end and the decreases the demand on the front tires contact patch. By coasting and running the same lean angle, i merely overloaded the contact patch, and hit the deck.

Best of luck, get back in the saddle and ride because you want to, not because you feel you have to.

RockCityVFRI think every one has given you some good info and i really can't disagree with anyone. The piece that i think has been left out, and has been the most helpful to me, is truly understanding the reason you crashed. I've crashed more times then i can count growing up riding in the dirt, and only twice since making a switch to pavement. I've had a nasty high side @ 35mph and a far gentler low side @ approx the same speed. About 35K miles separates these crashes and each happened for different reasons.

The single most important thing for me (and everyone is different) to get comfortable and back in the groove is to understand my crashes. And then followed closely is seat time. I found that if i don't understand the mechanics of how i crashed and why i crashed then my brain is scared it will happen again. My high side was a combination of events that took some time to truly understand what happened. but the low side was simple, i coasted through a traffic circle that i normally am accelerating through. Acceleration shifts weight off the front end and the decreases the demand on the front tires contact patch. By coasting and running the same lean angle, i merely overloaded the contact patch, and hit the deck.

Best of luck, get back in the saddle and ride because you want to, not because you feel you have to.

I'm a newbe, but it might also help to get into a class. (I am not suggesting you do not know how to ride) I just think one of the advanced rider classes (or even the basic class again) through the safety council or local bike shop. This would allow you to get back to basics, and maybe remember why / how you first started riding.

Look at this as an opportunity to start from scratch.

Coming from someone who totaled his 04' VFR and injuring his knee. I think you already passed the first hurdle by getting back on another bike. With seat time, you'll regain your confidence and be back to your old self.

For me, as soon as I can walk I went out and got another bike. I knew the longer I waited the less likely I'll get on another bike again. Thanks to a great group of friends that I ride with, I slowly worked my way back. Just take your time and hopefully things will return to normal.

I can tell you the following things from direct personal experience. I got nailed by some @$$hat in a scion when I had my first bike in 2002 ( a 1992 yamahaha secaII ). she hit me in a corner by merging into my lane and completely tossed me. it was very suckish and i was literally rendered speachless, I couldnt answer the first responders question of " did you take your helmet off or did it get thrown off" ( i actually threw it off and was fuming mad looking for blood but the offender RAN). I could answer him in my head but it wasnt making it to my mouth.. got some wires crossed for a few I guess. Anyway I, and many of the other guys above, are proof that youll be fine.

Here is what I strongly recommend you do. 1) PLEASE go get new tires, cupped tires arent stable and certainly are not confidence inspiring. 2) go ride dirtbikes.. ride the piss out of them, it doesent hurt to crash in soft dirt and it really helped me feel better on the street afterwards. 3) take long slow scenic rides, im talking a hundred miles or more each way preferably on country backroads with easy corners and not many cagers.

Those 3 things have helped me in the past BIGTIME. I had a bike with cupped tires and thought it was just not a well balanced bike and couldnt handle well ( it was a 1990 zx-7), as soon as I replaced the tires it was so much better and stable in the corners, i felt 100% more confident on it. take care man!

Jay

. . . . . . . . . and don't be afraid to seek professional help if you need to. Sometimes things like what you went through can be hard to get over.

alwaysawareI have a coworker that laid his bike down in rush hour freeway traffic to avoid crashing into a car. He avoided hitting anything, picked up his bike and rode it home. The next day he was back on his bike riding again even before replacing the plastic.

Similar thing happened to me not too long ago, except it was an inattentive pedestrian I was avoiding and it wasn't technically a freeway. Picked the bike up, apologized for dropping her, made sure everything looked straight and lofted the front a little to make me feel better. :beer:

When my confidence is shaken I kept on riding at a reduce pace and

treat my condition as a barrier to overcome...

First signs to watch for are my vision... when it starts to narrow and

hunt frantically for my awareness I start to make mistakes... so I

check that by concentrating on pushing my field of vision back to

wide... only with wide vision will I see enough space to stay calm and

begin make accurate decisions that will definitely boost confidence...

Next is breathing... I monitor for first signs of panicky short and

rapid rates and then concentrate on calming it down with long slow

breaths...

Finally I busy my thoughts with the 3 basic tools of cornering more effectively...

1 How quickly do I steer the bike???

2 How much lean angle do I use???

3 Where do I begin my turn in point???

And finally I grade my performance after each corner and assign a number from 1 to 100...

1 did I rolling off the gas to early???

2 did i tighten on the bars???

3 did I narrow my vision???

4 did I fix my attention too long on something???

5 did I steer too early or not quick enough???

6 did I brake when it wasn't necessary???

If I start receiving grades in the 75% range do I begin feeling a real rise in

my level of confidence...

Good stuff BLS.

+1 For Seat Time.

Let's get a ride in soon...only if you're comfortable riding with others again.

Sondance1. Replace tires stat. Ensure all controls work properly and are adjusted to suit your personal needs.

2. Set a personal goal for another TMAC. We'll be waiting for you.

3. Realize you're not going to ride as smooth or as fast as you used to, eventually maybe somewhere down the road, but NOT right now, enjoy that you're able to at least still ride!

4. Don't play hero. Continue to Ride Red (or a Titanium 1100 :wub: ) just don't RIDE RED (anymore) and enjoy the two wheel experience, whilst paying EXTRA attention to blind spots or whatever threw you off the first time.

5. Avoid any attempts at shaving your lap times on the Interstate as you navigate through the lapped traffic (or blowing by some ahole in an SUV w/ cell phone to teach him a lesson).

6. Stand up to your friend, the curve doctor on the yellow VFR, who means the best, but avoid his request of leading a group of twisty/speed dehydrated Fla COPS through the rainy/misty roads of the Mighty Cherahola, she's a cruel mistress, and there's nothing worse than seeing 8 bikes right on your six, when you're thinking "TelliCafe".

7. Pay attention to your body and what it's telling you. Really focus and learn from it, develop compensation techniques, if need be to ride like you used to, again, if need be.

8. Enjoy the feeling that you're having more fun in a simple commute/ride to work than everyone else on the road in their cage. Idiots.

9. Give Dale (theoxmole) a big kiss and a squeeze for giving you a ride home... he's ok, maybe curious, but ok, I swear... :goofy:

10. Don't be afraid to RIP IT when the time arrives....

Enjoy man, you'll be alright. Pain fades, Chicks dig scars, and leave your brains in the toolbox... jk... Enjoy what others can only dream about doing... :fing02:

See ya at TMAC next year!

LMAO @ #6 Rob......too funny! We did have a blast that day......and you kept a good pace. It was no Rossi curve doctor yellow VFR pace (Tracy!) but then again only Dave on his C14 could keep up with him anyways--------as we all found out in the end!

Okay back to this thread:

I would suggest taking some advanced rider courses. You can never stop learning about motorcycles. I watched National Geographic TV about some motorcycle crashes......think it was called crash science and I learned quite a bit about how and why certain crashes occur. Good information. Take some advances courses and practice, practice, practice. I don't mean taking track days. I mean practice going about 35mph or so and then boom maximum braking to slow down......then swerve to avoid an potentional crash. It will improve your reaction times drastically if you practice monthly.

I too had the jitters after my crash. I took some advanced training (and realized I wasn't as good as I thought I was...at that time:-) My confidence was not only restored but improved. As was my lust and love for motorcycling. Just take your time and keep a good pace.....there will always be someone faster out there....

Ryanme17

As many of you know, I recently totalled my beloved 2003 VFR, and replaced her with a clean 2002 ABS model. Now that I'm riding again, I'm a little jumpy, I almost feel nervous back in the saddle. Part of it could be the worn and cupping D208's making the bike feel twitchy in corners, but it's probably mostly me. I've only done about 350 miles on the new bike, but I had thought that would be enough to get back into the swing of things. Anyone ever experience anything similar or have any advice?

Not sure how much I can help you other than tell you to get right back to riding.

When I went down in august of 2008, I did not have the luxury of taking my time. My bike was my way of getting to work everyday. So I was back on a bike in about a week (with my still cracked ribs).

And it was not a perfect machine either, It was my three week old RC51. I bought it as a theft recovery and it had lots of little problems. The big ones were a slipping clutch, a busted throttle tube and an Iron hard shinko rear tire (in the wrong size of course).

Maybe having to focus on making it all work as best I could, while I got parts in was how I got past the worries and fears.

Although I have never been down on the street, I did find my skills in doubt when I changed from my 02 to my 03. After much study and help here, I found that the bikes setups were just that different. Worked on the 03 and got back in shape. Just sayin that maybe its not you as much as you think. Good luck with it.

Hey Ryan, How you doin man? Saw this thread come up and it got me wondering. How do you feel about being on the bike after the rest of this past season? Just kind of looking for an update. Let us know. :fing02:

motorhead1977

Hey Ryan, How you doin man? Saw this thread come up and it got me wondering. How do you feel about being on the bike after the rest of this past season? Just kind of looking for an update. Let us know. :blush:

Funny you should ask that, I was just thinking about this, actually.

Well, I ride differently, but I'm not sure if that's a bad thing. The main problem was that I would get tense. Too tense, tense to the point that I couldn't react as quickly or appropriately. This has mostly been solved with saddle time, but not completely. Also, I haven't enjoyed riding quite as much because I'm worried about crashing and my insurance going up. Not about dying, mind you... I have focused on my riding a lot and I'm more smooth, but there's still just a little bit of that tension left.

Also, I feel like I ride at a much slower pace, but perhaps it just feels slower because I've focused so much on technique.

:goofy: I would say that :beer: :beer: :beer: heavily before riding should do wonders for your confidence!

Then you can be all :ph34r: :squid: :wheel: and stuff.

Just let us know beforehand, so that we can get it on :blush: and be all like :lurk: :blink: :ohmy: :excl: :fing02: when you crash.

Then, we'll go all +1.gif and post it up on VFRd while you're in the hospital and you might even make the homepage!

And if you believe all this, then.... :491:

Srsly, I have no idea, but ask me next year when I get my bike back together. Hells, even when I drove a car for the first time after my accident, it felt weird. A little like vertigo.

Baileyrock

I think one of the biggest problems many riders encounter returning after a crash and especially if you happen to hit something or slide on that unseen dirt/gravel/oil is a habit of looking right in front of the bike(front wheel) to make sure you don't hit something again. :fing02:

Doing this instead of always looking as far forward as possible just messes everything up as it overloads your mind! :wheel:

Yep......and, from someone that has totaled Motorcycles and Race Cars, don't rush it. If You see Your mind isn't into it fully on a particular day, do something else...let it run it's course...You will eventually get back to where You were in due time. My Wife laid a Bike down a coupla' years ago after several seasons, and several thousand miles of riding. I would simply put Her on the back of mine, or drag out the car if She was havin' an anxious day. She eventually got right back to Her level of riding (and beyond) that She was at before the wreck......JUST ENJOY THE RIDE for a while, at whatever Pace, and still practice all of the right techniques while doin' it.....GOOD LUCK... :blush: :goofy:

Sorry to hear about your fall.

Losing confidence can suck big time. For mine terminex nailed it. Go back and do some lessons. That will iron out any bugs or confirm you are doing it right. And that all helps confidence quicker than being thrown in the deep end of the pool all by yourself. Hey if guys like tiger have to always go back and see a swing coach. What makes us riders any better ??? I know I am not that good. And hey it's a fun day in a safe enviroment,

Ryanme17

As many of you know, I recently totalled my beloved 2003 VFR, and replaced her with a clean 2002 ABS model. Now that I'm riding again, I'm a little jumpy, I almost feel nervous back in the saddle. Part of it could be the worn and cupping D208's making the bike feel twitchy in corners, but it's probably mostly me. I've only done about 350 miles on the new bike, but I had thought that would be enough to get back into the swing of things. Anyone ever experience anything similar or have any advice?

take/retake an MSF course or private rider safety course.

Some track day groups will offer entry level instruction for track days and this is never a bad thing. The riding school I work for offers beginner sessions and encourages people who just obtained their motorcycle license to try it. It is not "racing" school or about being fast, you get 20 min on the track with some 1:1 instruction, 20 min classroom instruction and a 20 minute break. It is a great day and you will build your confidence/skills.

Boy I forgot about this thread and how good it was, thanks for reviving it guys! :fing02:

Funny I pinned this thread just a few months before breaking both my legs in a track crash! :blush:

This crash actually had little effect on my confidence or ability to ride again, it was only wondering if I ever would again and then concerns about re-injuring my legs once I did start to ride again. :huh:

I've been down several times at the track all lowsides and up in the mph's, but always walked away. The highside was very different as is street riding.

Last weekends Deer and cartwheeling bike incident shook me a little more for some reason, I've run a rapid Pace for over 100,000 miles and have never given too much thought to deer before. Now I'm imagining them behind every bush. :blink:

Haven't ridden since, but may head out tomorrow and will just have to see where my mind is.

BR

BaileyRock

Boy I forgot about this thread and how good it was, thanks for reviving it guys! :fing02:

Funny I pinned this thread just a few months before breaking both my legs in a track crash! :blush:

This crash actually had little effect on my confidence or ability to ride again, it was only wondering if I ever would again and then concerns about re-injuring my legs once I did start to ride again. :huh:

I've been down several times at the track all lowsides and up in the mph's, but always walked away. The highside was very different as is street riding.

Last weekends Deer and cartwheeling bike incident shook me a little more for some reason, I've run a rapid Pace for over 100,000 miles and have never given too much thought to deer before. Now I'm imagining them behind every bush. :blink:

Haven't ridden since, but may head out tomorrow and will just have to see where my mind is.

BR

About a month ago I was riding a section of local twisties I've done a hundred times, and for the first time everything clicked in place. You know the feeling when the bike just turns itself, yet you're in complete control. Everything is smooth and all you can do is smile. So, a year and a half for complete mental recovery?

When I got the new VFR back in June of 09 I immediately replaced the tires (that was obvious) took the Lee Parks course, and just focused on technique for a year. It just took me a long while for the new technique to turn into muscle memory. I am the type of person to immediately tackle any obstacle when I fail, and so I wanted to get right back on and ride as fast and as smooth as I had before, and when it took time I would get frustrated. What really helped was just letting time pass and staying relaxed while staying in control and focusing on technique. At times I would try to focus on technique and I would be "in my head" too much. If this happens I would just have to slow down, ride relaxed and wait pass.

In summation:

Make sure bike is in good running order, good tires can equal confidence.

Work on technique.

Ride slow, ride relaxed while realizing it may take some time and work for everything to flow smoothly again, but we'll get back there.

Thanks for your help everyone! It's nice to be able to look back on this.

Let's keep this thread going.

I've been down several times, once woke up in the hospital, no recollection of anything from about .25 seconds before the ground apparently attacked me. I was not able to ride the rest of that year (needed to save up to repair her). When I got it rebuilt the next spring, I got back on with no loss of nerve. I cannot say why it seemed to have no effect (other than a large pain in my wallet) on my desire to ride. I suspect a lack of memory helped.

A famous formula 1 driver once said "It takes a certain lack of imagination to do this sort of thing".

All the advice given in this thread is valid. Take the advice, get your head straight, then try to forget fearful part of the experience.

You lived through the experience; focus on that positive!

A MSC basic rider course presented the philosophy: "One starts out with an empty bucket of skill and a full bucket of luck. Your goal is to fill up the experience bucket before the luck bucket is empty.'

The only way to get the experience bucket full is to get back on the machine.

Sending all a wish for a huge bucket of luck.

Glad to see this back again! :smile:

Crash a couple more times, after you have the first couple that happens but around the fourth or fifth it gets a lot easier ... And I'm not kidding.

It's true what switchblade says that after you've crashed a couple of times you know you'll probably recover and you might as well get on with it.

Something no one else seemed to mention to watch for becoming reckless after a crash. After my last big crash in 03 i proceded to loose my good driver discount in a big way during the year after. I got five tickets for stuff like rolling stops at stop signs and ten over speeding tickets, riding inside the "cone zone" right in front of a black and white, pure stupid stuff, not the Sunday morning ride like your hairs on fire stuff.

I started riding again before the bones were fully knit because I just couldn't sit in a car listening to NPR for one more commute which may have had something to do with it.

I learned to take a zen moment before I got on the bike and clear my mind, trying to be aware of everything but focusing on nothing. It really helped. I try to do it to this day.

Three of my downers have gone to the foreground of my mind. I start riding again, and working the reasons over.

The 1st was in '72 doing a u-turn on a paved cross over(legal)that I used on a daily basis, this time was at night and some sand truck had been using it, down I went(slow no harm done to me or the bike)lying on my side foot still on the peg, but it was a BMW boxer and the valve cover kept everything from touching the ground. What I learned from it was "If I can't see my exit point I ride as there may be something in my way.(also Colorado gave me 28 years to learn how to roll though sand on the turns in the mountains).

2nd (late '70's) was passing a 3/4 line of of cars in a resi' area when one in line pulled a last sec' left.

What I learned from that was to pull in the clutch when making a power stop so as not to be trying to brake while still giving it the throttle, and the other "TWO" thing was to not pass a line of cars thinking that they'll stay in line, and that passing in a resi' area is not a smooth move in the 1st place. I touched the rear wheel of the left turner with no damage, But had I pulled in the clutch I wouldn't have even touched it.

3rd was a few months ago(key "deer me"), I was riding later than usual and was in the mountains coming around a turn when a bunch(herd) of deer were crossing. I got the speed down to "almost Zero" and instead of not coming to a total stop by choice(was down to about 5 mph or less).... I headed for the last deers butt and would have gone right by, but the deer did a 180º and bumped me in the side which sent me off the pavement into a one foot deep rut/ditch and the bike just fell to the right on a upright bank and pinned my boot between the bike and hill. took a month or two to get back to normal. What I learned from that was not to assume that the deer would keep going. I should have made a complete stop.

So now I'm doing better over-all, from between the sand(1st) and the deer(3rd), I've got my eyes more focused all 'round but keeping more of a long range look going, "and my speed is down", but it's moving back up with time, but I'm doing a lot more power-stops practice (using the clutch)....... And no I don't have abs, and even though I haven't as yet whipped the rear around doing power-stops I wish I had abs, it's got to be better.

Good thoughts there Monk!

And I agree, ABS is a good thing.

Lots of times you may see a deer crossing , cant assume thats all is there is, there can be delayed stragglers too in a full Jaunt, unless there's good easement to view and rule out, take hede.

Thanks MaxSwell and others to pull this thread up.

I may need time to read this carefully...

Robin Rich

It's true what switchblade says that after you've crashed a couple of times you know you'll probably recover and you might as well get on with it.

Something no one else seemed to mention to watch for becoming reckless after a crash. After my last big crash in 03 i proceded to loose my good driver discount in a big way during the year after. I got five tickets for stuff like rolling stops at stop signs and ten over speeding tickets, riding inside the "cone zone" right in front of a black and white, pure stupid stuff, not the Sunday morning ride like your hairs on fire stuff.

I started riding again before the bones were fully knit because I just couldn't sit in a car listening to NPR for one more commute which may have had something to do with it.

I learned to take a zen moment before I got on the bike and clear my mind, trying to be aware of everything but focusing on nothing. It really helped. I try to do it to this day.

+1 stop and take a zen moment.

I find myself pulling off the road and relaxing for a couple minutes.

Smoking a Fat one has always helped me relax! :rolleyes:

Just take your time when re-entering after a crash. Track days, MSF courses and dirt biking can all help.

BR

I Kid about the Fat one, sober is the only way to ride IMO.

Another year later and I'm 10 times the rider that I used to be. It seems like a lifetime ago that I was so nervous and twitchy after the accident. I'm glad I had people's advice to take it slow and to work on technique. It was that working on technique that made me a better rider.

If I could go back and do it all over again, I would have done a track day sooner. I'm sure that would have made me a more confident (and less twitchy and therefore safer) rider. But hindsight is 20/20, and maybe I needed that time to work on technique before doing a track day. The Lee Parks Course, and going to another TMAC really made a big difference.

I sometimes have those same feeling but it usually when I realize I have put myself it a bad position. You know the hair on the back of neck stands up. The little inside warning that says hey the last time this happened I spent two weeks in intensive care unit. I back off or pull over or grab two gears and get the hell out of dodge.

No road crashes, but did on the track early on, then several later as I pushed it to learn more at the edge. It kind of gets it out of your system to see where a reasonable limit is and survive the error, having learned from it. I am not saying that one needs to crash to learn not to crash, but rather saying that focusing on NOT crashing is a good way to sap your attention to actual riding needs and make it more likely to crash. Getting good at leaning and braking on the track prepares your skill set so much that it is way more than you should ever need on the highway. It builds confidence and gets the "tentative" cobwebs of doubt out of your head. I totally agree that seat time heals much, but I heartily endorse those "do a trackday" urgings posted here.

Interesting reading. I have spent more time on VFRD in the past 2 months than ever, as I lay here in a hospital bed in my den wishing I could sleep. It's great to hear all the success stories, and I hope to get back on a bike someday. But like they say, you've got to walk before you can run, and I'm still not able to walk! My head-on accident Nov 25 almost killed me, and I don't know if my wife (my wonderful nurse) could take it again. No matter how good my tires are, or how polished my skills are, I will have a hard time getting over the thought of a car crossing the yellow line. Maybe if this thread stays alive for a few years, I'll post my own success story. So for now, I enjoy watching all the videos you guys post and reminiscing of the good old days. Hope to see you guys at TMAC!

Do you ever get the feeling that you are thread killer? It's like being the last one picked in a school yard ball game.

yup

MikeOnBike

Do you ever get the feeling that you are thread killer? It's like being the last one picked in a school yard ball game.

Mike,

This thread has died and been resurrected enough times that I'm not sure you've killed it. Each time it's resurrected I reflect back on it after however many months have passed. I am not yet convinced that you might not resurrect this thread yourself with tales of you out riding again. Even if it's only on a closed course at slower speeds.

Though I was uninjured (and therefore can't even begin to imagine what you've gone through these past few months), there were times I almost quit riding, but I am glad now that I stuck it out. I'm not ready to give up on you yet.

Hang in there. It's too soon to talk about riding now, but take it one step at a time. First the bathroom, then the world.

+100 on replacing those badly cupped Duncraps.......

I ruined a whole season of riding trying to extend the road life of my also badly cupped front Dunlop tire a couple of years ago. The bike's nervous handling totally took all the pleasure away from riding my VFR.

It was like rediscovering real riding again after I replaced it with new PR2CTs. Night and Day!

No more Dunlops on my bike ever! Every set of Dunlops I have put on the bike, including the originals cupped badly and never seem to have performed to anywhere near what the bike's real potential is.

Beck

95 VFR

Beck, The Q2 is a very good tire, probably the best Dunlop has to offer(other than track tires).

It handles very good, has excellent grip and didn't have the normal cupping issues most of their other tires had.

I tried a set and enjoyed them, but they don't exceed the performance in any noticeable way of my current PP/PR2 combo and don't last near as long so I won't buy another set until they update them again.

A very good tire though.

superfunkomatic

Took me several years before I felt comfortable on a bike again after a nasty spill. You'll gradually get more and more confident over time. I take it much, much easier now that I've had a get-off - slower pace, enjoy the scenery, and stay alive.

I think the suggestion of a track day would be a good place to start too. Although I've never done one, I've done lots of training for a local motorcycle training class. Having a place to push things and find out what you and your bike can do made a big difference.

Ditto.

Better confidence inspiring tires, some seat time, and lots of left-handed (side I spilled on) sweepers helped me a lot.

And patience.

The key was to overcome my panic instinct (to let up off the throttle when I felt threatened: almost always a bad thing for you and the bike) and push my comfort level SLOWLY.

I still get that feeling once in a blue moon it turns out. Like when I was pushing a corner hard in Utah and experienced some noticeable front tire slide over tar snakes, it kicked in again. I drifted wide in the corner and crossed the centerline, much to my disgust.

I really think track days would help, and I plan on taking part in some next riding season, if possible.

I still panic sometimes especially when I round a corner some cager riding halfway in my lane but not as bad any more .

After my prang on the Nurburgring, my thoughts at max lean are still about crashing. Gotta stop that

I crashed pretty bad back in 2009, 5 weeks before my wedding. Compound fracture of my femur, and also broke tib and fib. My foot was up near my hip somewhere. Sliding into the guard rail was better than sliding off the edge, though.

I remember the road was smooth then bumpy, then i was on the side of the road wondering who took my gloves off, apparently it was me. I managed to take off my belt and wrap it around my leg as a tourniquet, wasn't sure if my femur had torn the artery on its way out or not.

Choppered to hospital (my mates i was riding with almost beat the chopper), 3 weeks in hospital, a lot of conversations with my then fiancee about me still riding, and then married on crutches.

A month out of hospital and i was back on my other bike (gsxr 600 srad) doing laps around the carpark in my apartment block, I just wanted to get back on the horse, so to speak.

I had 2 minor crashes since then ( in the first 6 months after the crash) when i panicked for one reason or another, and then picked the bike up and continued on my merry way; low speed stupid stuff.

I knew i was panicking because of the accident, so i did a california superbike school which helped a lot, it also got me positioning my body better, especially my leg. After it's rebuild my foot isn't quite straight, and it's not a flexible as it was. I've done a few track days on the vfr as well to get used to it - the bike i totaled i had owned for 10 years, a gsxr 711, 185kgs wet weight and 130hp at the wheel. Lovely for a 20 year old bike.

It takes time to get the confidence back, but if you work at it, it'll come.

timmythecop

After my prang on the Nurburgring, my thoughts at max lean are still about crashing. Gotta stop that

You didn't have your monkey !!!!!

timmythecop

After my prang on the Nurburgring, my thoughts at max lean are still about crashing. Gotta stop that

I've been there several times, but only as spectator. In normal weekends the ring is full of idiots driving like crazy. Every time i watched, i saw motorcylce's crashing. 20 kilometers of curves is difficult to learn. And knowing myself i am a crash candidate too. Crashed twice on the open road and hate it. Only professional riders, who know every curve are really fast.

Not his fastest lap time of 7.49.71. but 10 seconds slower, caused by the camera equipment of the ninetys. His trackrecord dates from 1993 on a RC30

My advice for the ring is a good bike with upgraded suspension and a set of supercorsa's or newest pilot powers. On normal roadtyres forget it speeds are to high. I have nearly melted dunlop tyres on the autobahn, only straight out. Make a few rounds before you open up the trothle.

Every year a lot of the Dutch sportriders go to the ring and many of them crash their bikes. It is a challenging circuit.

Ryanme17

As many of you know, I recently totalled my beloved 2003 VFR, and replaced her with a clean 2002 ABS model. Now that I'm riding again, I'm a little jumpy, I almost feel nervous back in the saddle. Part of it could be the worn and cupping D208's making the bike feel twitchy in corners, but it's probably mostly me. I've only done about 350 miles on the new bike, but I had thought that would be enough to get back into the swing of things. Anyone ever experience anything similar or have any advice?

yes i went through same thing- i think every car is gonna cut me off- run a red light and stopsign--- :unsure:

- do a early morning ride with no traffic-- get back to your basics and then it will all come back to ya-practice your stops , turns a few small wheelies etc get back to how you know how to ride---- :cool:

but i will say this these 4 wheelers really drive like crap with these dangum cell phones-- :mad: welcome back i left for a while and now enjoy every chance i get to ride :beer:

Using a cellphone in The Netherlands, without handsfree kit kosts 350 euro, at current rates about 470 dollar. And still every day you see people using them while driving. They are talking, reading email, sending sms, using whatsapp and drive the same way as a drunk driver. Killing about 60 people in the busy Dutch traffic every year.

The best thing after a accident is driving as soon as possible again. After my last accident i was on a motorcycle one day later. But it cost me nearly a year before i rode on my old level.

VFRBert

Using a cellphone in The Netherlands, without handsfree kit kosts 350 euro, at current rates about 470 dollar. And still every day you see people using them while driving. They are talking, reading email, sending sms, using whatsapp and drive the same way as a drunk driver. Killing about 60 people in the busy Dutch traffic every year.

.

That isn't a Dutch problem. It's everywhere. I'm in Texas, in the city, and it's the same shit here. People texting, surfing, emailing, eating, ladies putting on makeup. My bikes are 90% twisty machines but 2 weeks ago I decided to ride to a mates to go see a film. On the way there, on a tollroad highway, a lady was putting on makeup, in the fast lane, doing 80-85 MPH, drifting in and out of her lane. I thought she was drunk at first and sped to get away from her. As I passed her I looked over and she had her visor flipped down, with the light on, applying her makeup. Crazy!

Yeah, sad to say but due to phones and the overall rush to get there a lot of people's driving habits have erroded to the point where you have to look at everyone as a potential road zombie who could do the unexpected at any time. After an accident you just become more acutely aware of this. But with time you will regain the confidence that by being alert you will minimize the odds in your favor. Wear your gear, trust your instincts and remember that being alert while relaxed will put you in the best position to react quickly and accordingly.

Best riding advice I ever got was from a late friend whose polio was so bad he could barely walk but the man was easily the best rider I've ever had the pleasure of being behind......."look where you're goin and go where you're lookin." RIP Jake Jacobs

Worst crash I had was actually the day of my license training. So literally the first day I had ridden, passed all the initial skill training such as slalom, slow speed balance, emergency stops, figure 8's etc without issue. Crashed right near the end on the road due to loose gravel, poor visibility, trying to remember a set of 20 instructions for where to go and just inexperience.. not knowing what dangers to look for.

Basically locked the front on the little bit of gravel and once it gripped the front wheel tucked under and the whole bike did a front flip (instructor was right behind me watching this take place.. apparently it was an impressive flip :goofy: )

Anyways, I broke the fall with my right knee and left palm, had gloves on but only denim jeans so fractured the kneecap. Before I even stopped rolling I was on my feet and back to the bike to hit the killswitch since the throttle jammed against the road and it started revving up. I sat down for a minute before starting to seize up a little and noticing the blood on my leg.

The bike was ok, more dents and scratches and both brake levers had snapped. I could still walk though, albeit painfully and it was a country town so the instructor argued with me for 10 mins until I agreed to swap bikes and ride back with him. After that fall I was really nervous about stepping up onto a shiny new red VTR250.. but got back fine.

Obviously this is a pretty tame injury compared to those listed in this thread but for my first day I was still kinda shaken about it. 2 weeks later I limped back into the training centre, went back out for a half hour ride and got my restricted license.

That was 4 years and about 55,000kms on two wheels ago, so I've learnt a lot more and had plenty of experience since.. but something tells me I'll always come back until the day I'm physically incapable of sitting on one.

When my confidence is shaken I kept on riding at a reduce pace and

treated my condition as a barrier to overcome...

First signs to watch for are my vision... when it starts to narrow and

hunt frantically for my awareness I start to make mistakes... so I

check that by concentrating on pushing my field of vision back to

wide... only with wide vision will I see enough space to stay calm and

begin make accurate decisions that will definitely boost confidence...

Next is breathing... I monitor for first signs of panicky short and

rapid rates and then concentrate on calming it down with long slow

breaths...

Finally I busy my thoughts with the 3 basic tools of cornering more effectively...

1 How quickly do I steer the bike???

2 How much lean angle do I use???

3 Where do I begin my turn in point???

And finally I grade my performance after each corner and assign a number from 1 to 100...

1 did I rolling off the gas to early???

2 did i tighten on the bars???

3 did I narrow my vision???

4 did I fix my attention too long on something???

5 did I steer too early or not quick enough???

6 did I brake when it wasn't necessary???

If I start receiving grades in the 75% range do I begin feeling a real rise in

my level of confidence...

I had a low speed low-side early this summer on my now gone VFR. It was on some switchback (10 mph hairpin) corners on a moderate hill in the Ozark Mtns. My mistake was getting too far to the right side of the pavement in a left hander. Left over from the spring thaw along the road edge, there was some chat (finely crushed rock) that the Arkansas highway department uses during the winter for traction. While I was leaned over I cracked open the throttle to exit the corner and exceeded my traction limit in the chat. Before I could say "Oh $4it" I was down. Personally the only thing hurt was my pride and ego, the bike however was a total loss.

I did not hesitate to get back riding as soon as I found a replacement bike and my insurance settled. For a while I was somewhat less confident in leaning the bike over in moderately severe lean angles, but that has disappeared. Now I tend to make assessments of the road surface more frequently and stay away from the road edge in corners. This has been a new challenge for me as I was in a bad habit of "trusting" the road surface and looking as far ahead as I could generally. My new mission is to increase the speed of my road surface scanning so I can do it more frequently without losing my "big picture" for maximum reaction time. I think if my crash had been not due to a mistake on my part (like a deer coming out of nowhere at speed), I wouldn't have been so able to recover so quickly.

Keith Code does have some good instructions, I agree him but a lot of his points are for the track. However couple weeks back when riding with the boys(KB,Matt,Steve and the Grif) I F'up and slid hard in a 25mph curve BUT took a page out of Keith's book and reverse lean the bike then apply brake and re-point the old girl leaned'er down and hit the throttle again. And cleaned my draws ...

I had only one major crash outside of track, but it was a fun one... I needed my tires changed, so I rode my bike to a dealer 20+ miles away, and my best friend drove my truck with the tires in the back. About 3-4 miles from dealership, I pulled over to wait for him to catch up (I was on my Kawi 9R, a "little" faster than my Isuzu Trooper at the time...). Few minutes later, I see him coming, I start getting ready to get in front of him, when I feel a rush of air. I turn my head just enough to see a mass coming towards me....... A minivan mom decided to pass a car in front of her on a shoulder, driving straight into me at 60mph. I broke most of my ribs, lost my spleen, lost my left ankle, and almost died. In irony of ironies, she swerved to avoid driving over me, and hit my truck head-on. In one moment, I totaled my bike, my car, and almost my life. I spent months in rehab, but wanting to get back on the bike is what made it all possible. I now have a fused ankle and live without a spleen... For a while, I thought all was good, but then I noticed that I rode a lot more conservatively on the street. It took a while before I realized that no matter how good I can ride, it's the cage drivers that can decide my fate.

I gave up riding when my wife got pregnant. I thought I was done. Little did I know how much I would miss it! 4 years later, I realized - once a biker, always a biker. There is no quitting, only giving up for a while. Well, I'm back, happy, and ready!

Get that knee down !!!

:goofy: