I just replaced the cam chain tensioners on my '02 again at 140,0000Km on the odometer (this is my fourth set by the way) and stuck my finger in the rear tensioner hole while I was replacing that one. The chain guide basically stopped with a quite metallic clunk as opposed to any kind of increasing tension. I'm wondering if that's normal - or would you feel the tension build as you pushed with your finger, like you would with the drive chain to the rear wheel?
However I can definitely say that changing the tensioners removed the noise - and it's worth noting a couple of things. I replaced the front tensioner first and then started the bike again - the noise was definitely still there and did not go away until I replaced the rear tensioner. So in my case at least the rear one was also noisy.
Also with regards to the "front tensioner not getting oil" I can categorically say this is bollocks. I forgot to put the cap bolt over the new front tensioner (you know, where the locking pin goes) and it pissed oil everywhere when the engine was running. There is definitely oil coming up through the motor and being delivered into the tensioner assembly. It's fairly low pressure thanks to the restrictor hole in the tensioner gasket, but oh boy does it fill up fast. Right now the V of my motor underneath the throttle bodies has a decent amount of oil in it, along with both fairings. Whoops...
Your discovery does give credit to Oil getting up in there, I only hope a few weeks from now your not getting the same noise like several who've replaced them.
The reasons for ocsillation, and it doesnt matter whether the tensioner is new or old, they both have High oscillation potential. But your not the first to have oscillation tensioner issues that will more than likely return down the road.
The only known fix seems to be the manual tensioner, or trying the car type oils which might provide some type of coating to Quelch the ocsillations.
[image: View Post]spud786, on 10 February 2011 - 11:52 PM, said:
Your discovery does give credit to Oil getting up in there, I only hope a few weeks from now your not getting the same noise like several who've replaced them.
Unlikely - this is my fourth set for a reason: I know the replacement works for about 40,000km!
[image: View Post]spud786, on 10 February 2011 - 11:52 PM, said:
The reasons for ocsillation, and it doesnt matter whether the tensioner is new or old, they both have High oscillation potential. But your not the first to have oscillation tensioner issues that will more than likely return down the road.
The only known fix seems to be the manual tensioner, or trying the car type oils which might provide some type of coating to Quelch the ocsillations.
May I ask what kind of oil you are running?
I run car oil - Shell Helix Plus 10w40 synthetic - and have done so for the last four years or so. Prior to that I ran motorcycle oil exclusively, Honda 4T or whatever it's called, which was still 10w40. I can't say that changing oils has necessarily made the tensioners any different, but possibly they're taking longer to wear out than before. The first set wore out at 16,000KM and Honda replaced everything from the camchain up to the camshaft sprockets completely under warranty - something to do with a known defect and the part codes changing? Since then I have only ever changed the tensioners.
Honestly I would have fitted APE tensionsers but it was cheaper and quicker to buy the Honda units locally still.
Anyway, my question was about the cam chains themselves reaching limit of travel and if this is possible?
[image: View Post]kaldek, on 11 February 2011 - 12:43 AM, said:
Honestly I would have fitted APE tensionsers but it was cheaper and quicker to buy the Honda units locally still.
Anyway, my question was about the cam chains themselves reaching limit of travel and if this is possible?
The Honda manual doesn't show a service limit on the cam chain itself. I still have an new/unopened APE tensioner in my tool box, and I can measure to see how far it extends into the bore if you'd like.
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 11 February 2011 - 02:23 AM, said:
[image: View Post]kaldek, on 11 February 2011 - 12:43 AM, said:
Honestly I would have fitted APE tensionsers but it was cheaper and quicker to buy the Honda units locally still.
Anyway, my question was about the cam chains themselves reaching limit of travel and if this is possible?
The Honda manual doesn't show a service limit on the cam chain itself. I still have an new/unopened APE tensioner in my tool box, and I can measure to see how far it extends into the bore if you'd like.
Sorry, your post has just made me realise that I stuffed up my question! It wasn't the cam chain tensioner itself I was concerned about, but the cam chain slider assembly. In other words, if the chain becomes so slack that it is physically impossible to tighten it given the space inside the head and crankcase to do so.
Sounds to me that since there is no measurable service limit on the cam chain, that what I experienced was just normal behaviour. I guess cam chains don't get progressively tighter in feel when you push on them. Maybe that's just because of the technology used in modern bike cam chains?
Im not familiar with the Shell Helix, thanks for the info, but I have 55,000 miles on my replaced front tensioner and 84,000 mile on my rear original tensioner, neither have oscillation noise issues,
As far tensioner, wind up tensioner up with a small screw driver, and see how many turns it has, should be around 1 and 1'4 turn, if more than 1. 5 turn you probably have some chain stretch. Cant answer on the value of using your finger.
I was commending you on discovering the oil flow through the tensioner , I never bothered to do that intentionally or accidently, more speculation being that front tensioner being so vertical with the tiny oil port.
The ten thousand miles I dealt with kronic klacking back in the 20 to 30,000 mile range. Was all from my front tensioner, never had issue on the rear , I tried various methods to correct, they all failed so I bought a new one, and it was a klacker too after about 3,000 mile. I just happend to install some 10w40 valvoline, and during a ride, holy crap noise is gone, but I hated that oil for shifting, and ran 10w40 exxon superflow, recently ive gone back to some diesil 15w40's with no noise, So basically my noise disappeared several years ago, never to come back as of yet. But the bike has 84,000 mile now.
I wonder if there's some coating or property in oil that the tensioners like, I mean I had kronic klack noise, then just dissapeared after that valve change. I know mobil1 was a klacker oil, and even more so with the 15w50 car oil. I think theres more too ii than just any car oil, since some have seen success with these oils and others not. But every time, its always an oil that I have not used.
I dont expect to ever have to replace any more tensioners, my issues seem to have been solved long ago, but I would go with a manual if i ever had any more issue. As hondas new tensioners are reall no better than the old ones. You having replaced 4 sets, is proof enough to me, even though my own experience said I never buy another tensioner.
I have often wondered this... Is the cam chain susceptible to stretching like the final drive chain??? And if so to what degree??
I recently removed my CCTs and tighetened up the springs... to around 150% their original "preload". This has not stopped what I'm pretty sure is the rear one from clacking madly at idle when cold. This must be where BusyLittleShop's indications on different oils having different properties at different temps, despite having the same clasifications on the label, comes to be an advantage. Perhaps I should try his oil recommendations. Thing is I put new oil in it recently. Been using a scooter oil (all the standards like API, JASO, 4T, Density, meet the service manual specs).
I will be buying new tensioners shortly. I will send the old springs to a spring suppliers and have them match the springs in order to source a (much cheaper) replacement than having to buy the housing and piston... I believe Suzuki supplies a new spring for one of their bikes' CC Tensioners...
It really bugs me just how many extra "maintenance" elements the VTEC has over the 5th gen (and older gens)... and just how many years they stretched this model out before superceding it with the 1200.
My rear cct has never had noise, the front was kronic for along time, I even replaced and the new one shortly started klacking. Might try one of my car oils , or install a manual cct.
car oils , are valvoline 10w40 or Exxon superflow 10w40. only costs $12 for 3 quarts , ride 100 mile , either worked or it doesnt. But Im on the same kronic noisy tentioner, 50,000 mile noise free. After running car oil. In the last 15,000 mile Ive switched to 15w40 diesil Delo (where motorcraft diesil had produced noise thousand of miles back).mobil1 ect
What does these certain car oils do? I think they offer some kind of waxy property the cct's like.
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 24 June 2011 - 04:34 AM, said:
I will be buying new tensioners shortly. I will send the old springs to a spring suppliers and have them match the springs in order to source a (much cheaper) replacement than having to buy the housing and piston... I believe Suzuki supplies a new spring for one of their bikes' CC Tensioners...
May as well buy some APE manual tensioners mate. Same price, and they last forever.
[image: View Post]kaldek, on 24 June 2011 - 09:05 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 24 June 2011 - 04:34 AM, said:
I will be buying new tensioners shortly. I will send the old springs to a spring suppliers and have them match the springs in order to source a (much cheaper) replacement than having to buy the housing and piston... I believe Suzuki supplies a new spring for one of their bikes' CC Tensioners...
May as well buy some APE manual tensioners mate. Same price, and they last forever.
I think I'd prefer them to have some sort of chushioning effect as provided by a spring... the OEms also have a hydraulic (tiny oil pressure hole)... those manual ones are completely rigid... that will wear the guide much faster I reckon
The tiny Hole is to lubricate the cct body internals, and its the body that rattles not the chain is loose or anything. Ive not tired it but wonder enlarging that hole would aide the front tensioner.
Really the rear tentioner is flooded with oil, Iv never had issue with it , so it must have a lot of play if noise is coming from there.
There no cushioning effect via spring , once it advances it will not return the spring turnes a cork screw, that pushes the plunger out, it cant return unless you manually turn it in via the tiny screw.
if the spring actually brok I suppose it could unwind and the corkscrew could begin to loosen.
[image: View Post]spud786, on 25 June 2011 - 02:55 PM, said:
The tiny Hole is to lubricate the cct body internals, and its the body that rattles not the chain is loose or anything. Ive not tired it but wonder enlarging that hole would aide the front tensioner.
Really the rear tentioner is flooded with oil, Iv never had issue with it , so it must have a lot of play if noise is coming from there.
There no cushioning effect via spring , once it advances it will not return the spring turnes a cork screw, that pushes the plunger out, it cant return unless you manually turn it in via the tiny screw.
if the spring actually brok I suppose it could unwind and the corkscrew could begin to loosen.
Are you kidding?? There is nothing stopping it from being pushed back in... not like the Suzuki GSXR1000R ones for example.. it's damn tough, a lot of resistance to overcome for bare human hands (mine at least), but there is no mechanism stopping it from being pushed back in. There is just a spring and the oil in there (and the hydraulic pressure hole). If the spring creates no cushioning effect, then why did they bother with the spring?? And moreover, why that particular spring with it's particular srping rate??... why didn't they just put a manual tensioner in there (nothing more than a solid threaded rod that neither neither retracts nor extends itself)??
[image: View Post]Auspañol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:07 PM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 25 June 2011 - 02:55 PM, said:
The tiny Hole is to lubricate the cct body internals, and its the body that rattles not the chain is loose or anything. Ive not tired it but wonder enlarging that hole would aide the front tensioner.
Really the rear tentioner is flooded with oil, Iv never had issue with it , so it must have a lot of play if noise is coming from there.
There no cushioning effect via spring , once it advances it will not return the spring turnes a cork screw, that pushes the plunger out, it cant return unless you manually turn it in via the tiny screw.
if the spring actually brok I suppose it could unwind and the corkscrew could begin to loosen.
Are you kidding?? There is nothing stopping it from being pushed back in... not like the Suzuki GSXR1000R ones for example.. it's damn tough, a lot of resistance to overcome for bare human hands (mine at least), but there is no mechanism stopping it from being pushed back in. There is just a spring and the oil in there (and the hydraulic pressure hole). If the spring creates no cushioning effect, then why did they bother with the spring?? And moreover, why that particular spring with it's particular srping rate??... why didn't they just put a manual tensioner in there (nothing more than a solid threaded rod that neither neither retracts nor extends itself)??
I agree with Spud that there is nothing to keep the tensioner from being pushed back in other that overcoming the spring pressure. But I'll disagree with him that it's the actual tensioner that causes the noise. I had a clack for several thousand miles. And when I finally dove into the noise, I could replicate the sound when I would loosen/tighten the inner screw on the CCT. In other words, I could make the sound completely disappear when I tighten the inner screw on CCT, then as I loosened inner screw, the sound would return. The more I loosen the screw, the worse the sound, until the point that the CCT wasn't touching the chain. The clack wouldn't get any louder at this point, but it stayed the same. This should prove that it is the actual cam chain making the noise, not the CCT itself. This work was obviously done with the little sealing bolt removed, and oil did spill out into the "V" of the engine.
Now in regards to the APE CCTs, once the tension is set, there is no slack. The chain is running in a clean environment around completely fixed components, so a need for a CCT with any type of anti-reversing mechanism is not needed.
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 02:30 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Auspañol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:07 PM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 25 June 2011 - 02:55 PM, said:
The tiny Hole is to lubricate the cct body internals, and its the body that rattles not the chain is loose or anything. Ive not tired it but wonder enlarging that hole would aide the front tensioner.
Really the rear tentioner is flooded with oil, Iv never had issue with it , so it must have a lot of play if noise is coming from there.
There no cushioning effect via spring , once it advances it will not return the spring turnes a cork screw, that pushes the plunger out, it cant return unless you manually turn it in via the tiny screw.
if the spring actually brok I suppose it could unwind and the corkscrew could begin to loosen.
Are you kidding?? There is nothing stopping it from being pushed back in... not like the Suzuki GSXR1000R ones for example.. it's damn tough, a lot of resistance to overcome for bare human hands (mine at least), but there is no mechanism stopping it from being pushed back in. There is just a spring and the oil in there (and the hydraulic pressure hole). If the spring creates no cushioning effect, then why did they bother with the spring?? And moreover, why that particular spring with it's particular srping rate??... why didn't they just put a manual tensioner in there (nothing more than a solid threaded rod that neither neither retracts nor extends itself)??
I agree with Spud that there is nothing to keep the tensioner from being pushed back in other that overcoming the spring pressure. But I'll disagree with him that it's the actual tensioner that causes the noise. I had a klack for several thousand miles. And when I finally dove into the noise, I could replicate the sound when I would loosen/tighten the inner screw on the CCT. In other words, I could make the sound completely disappear when I tighten the CCT, then as I loosened inner screw, the sound would return. This work was obviously done with the little sealing bolt removed, and oil did spill out into the "V" of the engine.
Now in regards to the APE CCTs, once the tension is set, there is no slack. The chain is running in a clean environment around completely fixed components, so a need for a CCT with any type of anti-reversing mechanism is not needed.
Spud didn't say that there is nothing to keep the tensioner from being pushed back in other that overcoming the spring pressure, I did!! So you wouldn't be in agreement with him there either!! :cool:
If the plunger were not able to retract, then it wouldn't be necessary to remove the CCT in order to tighten up the preload on the spring... you could just turn the "little inner screw" until the clacking went away, put in the little sealing bolt and carry on... but you can't because the spring just unwinds (instead of the plunger extending as it does when it's off the bike, because the chain guide stops it from doing so). We'd all be a lot happier with the POS OEM part since it wouldn't require so much rigmorole to tighten the buggers up!!!
It is so much easier just to swap them out... but you might be lucky to save a bit of cash for a few tens of thousands of km more before having to finally get new ones.
But I'll disagree with him that it's the actual tensioner that causes the noise. I had a klack for several thousand miles. And when I finally dove into the noise, I could replicate the sound when I would loosen/tighten the inner screw on the CCT. In other words, I could make the sound completely disappear when I tighten the CCT, ))))))))))))))))))
I tried that with no success, you have maybe 1/16th turn counter clock wise to force the plunger out, its insignificant. If you turn the screw clockwise then you release tention and I would not doubt the noise would stop or change.
But if you really are serious with increasing tension, heres how you do it. Loosen the base cct bolts about 2mm , this witll cause the tensioner to seperate from the block. and the plunger will extend taking up the slack, so when you retighten, it forces a tighter pressure on the chain . Thats How I kwew it wasnt the chain rattling, cause I went out about 3mm with limited effect. I went far enough out the rattle changed to a Knock. So i was putting alot of tension on there.
I did my testing, Guaranteed its body rattle of the CCT :pinocchio:
PS. for the readers, dont try this method, it adds chain stress and doesnt fix the issue, I did it for testing purposes.
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:38 PM, said:
....snipped for lengthiness....
It is so much easier just to swap them out... but you might be lucky to save a bit of cash for a few tens of thousands of km more before having to finally get new ones.
I may have been one of the first to go with the APE manual tensioner, so I'm pretty sure I won't ever be buying any other new ones! :cheerleader:
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 06:16 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Auspañol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:38 PM, said:
....snipped for lengthiness....
It is so much easier just to swap them out... but you might be lucky to save a bit of cash for a few tens of thousands of km more before having to finally get new ones.
I may have been one of the first to go with the APE manual tensioner, so I'm pretty sure I won't ever be buying any other new ones! :cheerleader:
Yep , you removed the infection, no risk of noise again from the auto cct ..
only bad thing is getting them set right, and sometimes they have a tendancy to leak
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 06:16 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:38 PM, said:
....snipped for lengthiness....
It is so much easier just to swap them out... but you might be lucky to save a bit of cash for a few tens of thousands of km more before having to finally get new ones.
I may have been one of the first to go with the APE manual tensioner, so I'm pretty sure I won't ever be buying any other new ones! :cheerleader:
Hey did you ever service your rear axle after running through that deep Creek?
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:35 PM, said:
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 06:16 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:38 PM, said:
....snipped for lengthiness....
It is so much easier just to swap them out... but you might be lucky to save a bit of cash for a few tens of thousands of km more before having to finally get new ones.
I may have been one of the first to go with the APE manual tensioner, so I'm pretty sure I won't ever be buying any other new ones! :cheerleader:
Hey did you ever service your rear axle after running through that deep Creek?
Nope! But I've only put about 15K on it since then.
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:24 PM, said:
only bad thing is getting them set right, and sometimes they have a tendancy to leak
I don't see how they could leak if they aren't supplied with oil. The new gasket blocks the oiling orifice.
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 06:41 PM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:24 PM, said:
only bad thing is getting them set right, and sometimes they have a tendancy to leak
I don't see how they could leak if they aren't supplied with oil. The new gasket blocks the oiling orifice.
The orings crack, or they leak through the threads themsselves, requiring alittle RTV. Probably not an issue on the front tentioner, the rear on the otherhand, would be more subceptible.
[image: View Post]hondalover, on 26 June 2011 - 06:39 PM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:35 PM, said:
Hey did you ever service your rear axle after running through that deep Creek?
Nope! But I've only put about 15K on it since then.
Actually it would be "Deep Creek" as that is the name of the creek. The crossing is named "Pillsbury Crossing" on Deep Creek.
I've been through Pillsbury at least 10 times since I bought my bike... I now have over 28,000 on the the OEM bearings. Any small amount of water that would seep past the seals would soon "boil" off via the heat of the higway riding it takes to get there and back. It's no worse than riding in the rain. Yeah, it not the best thing to do to a bike... there are some real Prom Queens here on VFRD who would never do it, that's fine. But for the average guy who wants to have fun and enjoy his motorcycle, it's no worse than riding in the rain. As I tell everyone I take there.... "The worst that can happen is that you'll fall over, get trapped under your bike and drown." As for the bearings... replace them when they start to growl.... it's only money.
[image: View Post]Auspañol, on 26 June 2011 - 02:07 PM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 25 June 2011 - 02:55 PM, said:
The tiny Hole is to lubricate the cct body internals, and its the body that rattles not the chain is loose or anything. Ive not tired it but wonder enlarging that hole would aide the front tensioner.
Really the rear tentioner is flooded with oil, Iv never had issue with it , so it must have a lot of play if noise is coming from there.
There no cushioning effect via spring , once it advances it will not return the spring turnes a cork screw, that pushes the plunger out, it cant return unless you manually turn it in via the tiny screw.
if the spring actually brok I suppose it could unwind and the corkscrew could begin to loosen.
If the spring creates no cushioning effect, then why did they bother with the spring?? And moreover, why that particular spring with it's particular srping rate??... why didn't they just put a manual tensioner in there (nothing more than a solid threaded rod that neither neither retracts nor extends itself)??
Its not a simple compression spring design , those do float somewhat normally in between the teeth , you can see the wear in the tooth and paw areas. The wind up type can fail too, but theres more in the design , but when I tested a tighter tention, the CCT never returned to a lighter setting. I knew exactly where the adjustment screw was, and it did not return to a lighter setting, if there was anyfloat to return , Im sure it would have.
Course Im talking about a good condition cct, nothing wrong with other the internal body oscillation , and was a brand new unit.
I had this noise develope a few years back about 20,000 mile at that time, I'd just come off amsoil and started trying various oils , a wide range of mc oil to diesil oil, and the Klacking developed, never dawned on me anything that oil would matter. So I dealt with this over a 10,000 mile period trying different things, nothing worked so I replaced it, the new one started lklacking not much later. So I listened to that for a couple thousand mile . I was cheap, so I bough some valvoline 10w40 and 100 mile later holy moly no more noise. I did try some 20w50 and it came back, so I went back to the 10w40, and changed to my favorite car oil Exxon superflow 10w40. Ran that for 40,000 miles, So all my issue was 60,000 miles ago . But Ive been noise free on tensioners for along time, the rear has near 88,000 mile and the front has, 55,000 mile or so, But Ill never buy anther Honda one, but I really dont expect to ever buy anohter anyway, but it would be the manual if I did.
As for CCT.... I've replaced my front one with OEM. At that time, it seemed that there was not a manual one available for the VFR. I believe Hondalover to have been the first (6th gen) VFR owner to fit a manual one.... I'd never read of anyone else fitting one before him.
My next one (and I believe that will happen) will be a manual one, same as Hondalover. I know Hondalover personally, he's mechanically savvy, if he is happy with his manual I know that I will be tickled pink with one. I would recommend moving toward the manual to anyone and moving away from Mother Honda's poor design.
Creek water is really dirty , all kinds of Grit, since there is a Breathing hole under the swing arm that goes straight to the bearing area, I was wondering.
I have 88,000 on mine ,wheel still spins very free and easy(never touched it), Im thinkin run it till it breaks, I just wanted to see how long a submerged rear axle will do.
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:15 PM, said:
But if you really are serious with increasing tension, heres how you do it. Loosen the base cct bolts about 2mm , this witll cause the tensioner to seperate from the block. and the plunger will extend taking up the slack, so when you retighten, it forces a tighter pressure on the chain .
I don't see how this can be... it physically can't be "taking up any slack"... if you let the piston extend by separating the CCT body from the motor, you're essentially allowing the spring to unwind, thus acheiving the opposite to "tighter pressure"... you're making it slacker!! Until you torque the bolts up again, whereby you are just returning it to how it was before. No change acheived whatsoever.
What you claim would only ocurr if there really was something stopping the piston (plunger) from retracting once extended... but there is no mechanism stopping it from being pushed back in, just as I claim in my previous thread... it is only a matter of force to push that piston back in... there is no mechanical obstacle to it returning... this much I am sure of... having had it in my hands and pulled it apart completely.
Hmmmmm, just wondering if I need to be concerned......53,000+ miles on my "06" and I haven't thought about my CCT's until reading this post. What to do now? Take my earplugs out, put the stock exhaust back on and take a listen? What are consequences other than noise when ignoring this issue?
On the other hand, I do ride in the rain, but guess I am one of VFRD's "prom queens" as I just watched, laughed, and enjoyed as the VFR's took on "Deep Creek" at "Pillsbury Crossing" . Thanks for the memories!
[image: View Post]Auspa�ol, on 27 June 2011 - 08:28 AM, said:
[image: View Post]spud786, on 26 June 2011 - 06:15 PM, said:
But if you really are serious with increasing tension, heres how you do it. Loosen the base cct bolts about 2mm , this witll cause the tensioner to seperate from the block. and the plunger will extend taking up the slack, so when you retighten, it forces a tighter pressure on the chain .
I don't see how this can be... it physically can't be "taking up any slack"... if you let the piston extend by separating the CCT body from the motor, you're essentially allowing the spring to unwind, thus acheiving the opposite to "tighter pressure"... you're making it slacker!! Until you torque the bolts up again, whereby you are just returning it to how it was before. No change acheived whatsoever.
What you claim would only ocurr if there really was something stopping the piston (plunger) from retracting once extended... but there is no mechanism stopping it from being pushed back in, just as I claim in my previous thread... it is only a matter of force to push that piston back in... there is no mechanical obstacle to it returning... this much I am sure of... having had it in my hands and pulled it apart completely.
The design is not supposed to give back once it advances, unless there is a failure of the mechanism. So when you break loose the bolts 2mm you'll see the cct seperate from the block and the tension will advance to take up that slack maintaining the pressure, it will not give back when you retighten those bolts. But that extended plunger will force that additional plunger length to the chain guide tensioner.
Thats exactly what happens, if you doubt, you can monitor the plunger screw and and note it never budges as you retighten the mounting bolts.
End of thread · 30 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 4 Dec 2012