VFR Discussion Group -> Brake recall now on NHTSA web site

The brake recall is on the NHTSA web site (can access via www.recalls.gov), but isn't on the Honda Owner Link yet. I think that the number of units affected includes linked+ABS VFR/ST and ? GW, because 36000 seems high for VFRs alone.

Make / Models : Model/Build Years:
HONDA / CBR1100XX 2002-2003

HONDA / ST1300 2003-2004

HONDA / ST1300A 2003-2004

HONDA / VFR800 2002-2004

HONDA / VFR800A 2003-2004

Manufacturer : AMERICAN HONDA MOTOR CO.

NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 05V010000 Recall Date : JAN 18, 2005
Component: SERVICE BRAKES, HYDRAULIC
Potential Number Of Units Affected : 36046
Summary:
CERTAIN MOTORCYCLES EQUIPPED WITH COMBINED-BRAKE SYSTEMS HAVE A PROPORTIONING CONTROL VALVE (PCV) THAT MECHANICALLY PROPORTIONS BRAKE FORCE WHEN THE REAR BRAKE IS APPLIED. A SEAL IN SOME PCVS IS IMPROPERLY SHAPED, AND BRAKE FLUID LEAKAGE MAY OCCUR.
Consequence:
IF THE MOTORCYCLE CONTINUES TO BE USED AFTER A LEAK OCCURS, THE REAR BRAKE WOULD EVENTUALLY BECOME INOPERATIVE. A LOSS OF REAR BRAKE FORCE COULD INCREASE THE RISK OF A CRASH.
Remedy:
DEALERS WILL INSPECT THE REAR BRAKE FORLEAKAGE. IF LEAKAGE IS CONFIRMED, THE DEALER WILL REPLACE THE PCV. THE RECALL IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN ON FEBRUARY 3, 2005. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT HONDA AT 866-784-1870.
Notes:
HONDA RECALL NO. P65. CUSTOMERS CAN ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION�S AUTO SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-DASH-2-DOT (1-888-327-4236).
CERTAIN MOTORCYCLES EQUIPPED WITH COMBINED-BRAKE SYSTEMS HAVE A PROPORTIONING CONTROL VALVE (PCV) THAT MECHANICALLY PROPORTIONS BRAKE FORCE WHEN THE REAR BRAKE IS APPLIED. A SEAL IN SOME PCVS IS IMPROPERLY SHAPED, AND BRAKE FLUID LEAKAGE MAY OCCUR.
Consequence:
IF THE MOTORCYCLE CONTINUES TO BE USED AFTER A LEAK OCCURS, THE REAR BRAKE WOULD EVENTUALLY BECOME INOPERATIVE. A LOSS OF REAR BRAKE FORCE COULD INCREASE THE RISK OF A CRASH.
Remedy:
DEALERS WILL INSPECT THE REAR BRAKE FORLEAKAGE. IF LEAKAGE IS CONFIRMED, THE DEALER WILL REPLACE THE PCV. THE RECALL IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN ON FEBRUARY 3, 2005. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT HONDA AT 866-784-1870.
Notes:
HONDA RECALL NO. P65. CUSTOMERS CAN ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION�S AUTO SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-DASH-2-DOT (1-888-327-4236).

It's not just 2004. Since I have an '03, I ran the report for that year and it came up with the same thing. :angry:

SpamIAm, Jan 30 2005, 09:25 PMIt's not just 2004.  Since I have an '03, I ran the report for that year and it came up with the same thing. :angry:

According to the local Honda Dealership...it's the entire 6th generation, regardless of year. Actually, it's every bike with this version of LBS.

Ditto for my 2002.

This is the third "recall" from Honda on the 6th gen.

Altenator/Stator
Sub-Frame
Rear brake proportion valve seal

I'm beginning to think they rushed this version into production. Can't remember any of the previous generation Viffers with this many "recalls".

Perfect! Been avoiding a bleed and fill like the plague and they're about due.

Looks like somebody else gets the honor. :beer:

Pembo, Jan 31 2005, 11:55 AMThis is the third "recall" from Honda on the 6th gen.

Altenator/Stator
Sub-Frame
Rear brake proportion valve seal

I'm beginning to think they rushed this version into production.� Can't remember any of the previous generation Viffers with this many "recalls".

dont be too dramatic on this. 3 recalls in 4 years of production? when people swoon to the idea of a new model every 3 or so years, it doesnt give a manufacturer much time for life span testing. the proprtioning valve? its only an o-ring issue! if yours isnt leaking they are not going to change it from what the recall states. i find leaking o-rings every day at work. how many years did the R/R issue carry on through. they still can't get it right on the early gens. things happen, it is a piece of machinery after all. there are 5 recalls alone on a 1998 honda accord

At least Honda doesn't issue recalls just to drive up business in the service departments and sales depatments like the big three US automakers. I don't think three recalls is too bad. As I have stated earlier...Honda is anal about rider safety, if they get one or two failures they will recall the entire model line.

IMHO, I do not mind recalls. At least they have balls to recall their product if they feel something has to be corrected. Do you guys remember the Intel fiasko with their first Pentium processor? They refused to accept their processor makes a mistake at certain calculating cases. Of course finally they gave in. The recall does not mean each and every bike is bad. They just want to prevent being badmouthed. And maybe it is cheaper to recall now than having lawsuit later.

oyama, Jan 31 2005, 12:33 PMIMHO, I do not mind recalls. At least they have balls to recall their product if they feel something has to be corrected. Do you guys remember the Intel fiasko with their first Pentium processor? They refused to accept their processor makes a mistake at certain calculating cases. Of course finally they gave in. The recall does not mean each and every bike is bad. They just want to prevent being badmouthed. And maybe it is cheaper to recall now than having lawsuit later.

Exactly

A mere 3 recalls and only the first for my '03. I've had 6 on my 2000 Ford Focus. I'm waiting for them to replace the entire car. That would be nice. Also, any plans for Honda to recall the ECU on the 6th gen? I think it's a safety issue.

767fixer, Jan 31 2005, 06:06 PMdont be too dramatic on this.� 3 recalls in 4 years of production?� when people swoon to the idea of a new model every 3 or so years, it doesnt give a manufacturer much time for life span testing.

I'll agree with that...I'm a product engineer for a consumer products company and I can tell you for a fact that I never have enough time to get everything right up front. But they'll give me all the time and all the funds I need to fix it after the fact. All that matters initially is shipping product on time.

To me that's ass backwards but maybe that's why I'm an employee and not an employer. :wacko:

FWIW,I called the Honda # this morning and the guy said that Honda has not issued anything yet(Feb. 3rd possibly), but that we should be getting notice in the mail if we are affected.....just like before.

This came off the recall.gov website. It shows all models effected.

Make / Models : Model/Build Years:
HONDA / CBR1100XX 2002-2003

HONDA / ST1300 2003-2004

HONDA / ST1300A 2003-2004

HONDA / VFR800 2002-2004

HONDA / VFR800A 2003-2004

Manufacturer : AMERICAN HONDA MOTOR CO.

NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 05V010000 Recall Date : JAN 18, 2005
Component: SERVICE BRAKES, HYDRAULIC
Potential Number Of Units Affected : 36046
Summary:
CERTAIN MOTORCYCLES EQUIPPED WITH COMBINED-BRAKE SYSTEMS HAVE A PROPORTIONING CONTROL VALVE (PCV) THAT MECHANICALLY PROPORTIONS BRAKE FORCE WHEN THE REAR BRAKE IS APPLIED. A SEAL IN SOME PCVS IS IMPROPERLY SHAPED, AND BRAKE FLUID LEAKAGE MAY OCCUR.
Consequence:
IF THE MOTORCYCLE CONTINUES TO BE USED AFTER A LEAK OCCURS, THE REAR BRAKE WOULD EVENTUALLY BECOME INOPERATIVE. A LOSS OF REAR BRAKE FORCE COULD INCREASE THE RISK OF A CRASH.
Remedy:
DEALERS WILL INSPECT THE REAR BRAKE FORLEAKAGE. IF LEAKAGE IS CONFIRMED, THE DEALER WILL REPLACE THE PCV. THE RECALL IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN ON FEBRUARY 3, 2005. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT HONDA AT 866-784-1870.
Notes:
HONDA RECALL NO. P65. CUSTOMERS CAN ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION�S AUTO SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-DASH-2-DOT (1-888-327-4236).

Interesting, I have a 2002 VFR800A, so I may be OK

redsars, Jan 31 2005, 03:05 PMInteresting, I have a 2002 VFR800A, so I may be OK

I think I wondered the same thing...seemed kind of odd. :unsure:

Pembo, Jan 31 2005, 01:21 PM...I never have enough time to get everything right up front.  But they'll give me all the time and all the funds I need to fix it after the fact.  All that matters initially is shipping product on time.

To me that's ass backwards but maybe that's why I'm an employee and not an employer. :wacko:

Hilarious. I'm responsible for product at my company and you just quoted our motto. It's usually the CEO that is wacko.

I can't fault Honda here. In my experience, their product -- cars or motorcycles -- is significantly more reliable than most competitors. Now if I could just cure my intermittent abrupt 7k VTEC transition. :blink:

VFRFun, Jan 31 2005, 07:07 PM  Now if I could just cure my intermittent abrupt 7k VTEC transition.  :blink:

dont rev to 7k :P

i agree i ,ve had a second gen and now the sixth gen with no problems even though i did take mine in for the recalls there was nothing i could find wrong and believe you me i have the tools and the time to look honda supports their products and we should be glad they are leaders in this sort of thing because many other mfr,s leave you high and dry after the initail sale to figure it out on your own those of you that have had other makes know what i,m talkin about give credit where its due honda cares about its products.

So, just where is this part that they are going to "inspect"? I can do that and save the trip if it's not leaking....

wczimmerman, Feb 3 2005, 03:03 AMSo, just where is this part that they are going to "inspect"?  I can do that and save the trip if it's not leaking....

Well, there are two Proportional Control Valves (PCV), a "servo" and "rear." Both are located near the back of the fuel tank. The servo PCV is on the left just in front of the battery and the rear is on the right side.

I just finished bleeding the brakes last week and didn't see any leaks.

Great information -- I called the dealer and yes, I'm bringing it in for a check. Depending on how the check goes, the bike could be further disassembled. If that happens, and parts are needed, I have to wait for the parts to arrive. I was told parts couldn't be ordered until after the check confirmed that they were needed. Oh well. At least I have some business travel next week, so dropping the bike for service won't be that bad.

Learned today that my '04 needed the new parts, so it will sit in the shop until they arrive. Anyone else get similar news?

THe viffer and I just returned from my trusty honda dealer to have them do the latest recall check....

My 03 VTEC--

No electrical problems.
No subframe cracking.
No brake Proportional Control Valve problems.
No kickstand bolt torque failures.
No swapped out 02 sensors.
No surging.

It's still above 55 degrees...I'm gonna go for a ride.

:P

Your killing us from the north with the nice weather. I figure I have about two months before the snow melts and I can get the VFR to the dealer. For now I just look at the bike, wondering if I have a problem with the brakes. :huh:

vtecal, Feb 11 2005, 04:46 PMIt's still above 55 degrees...I'm gonna go for a ride.

:P

Can anyone please tell me if any-one knows someone who has been involved in an accident due to the recent ABS recall? Please respond

deep, Feb 13 2005, 01:46 AMCan anyone please tell me if any-one knows someone who has been involved in an accident due to the recent ABS recall? Please respond

its not a ABS recall its a proportioning valve recall wether you have abs or not....apparently someone has because there is now a recall

767fixer, Jan 31 2005, 10:06 AMdont be too dramatic on this.  3 recalls in 4 years of production?  when people swoon to the idea of a new model every 3 or so years, it doesnt give a manufacturer much time for life span testing.  the proprtioning valve?  its only an o-ring issue!  if yours isnt leaking they are not going to change it from what the recall states.  i find leaking o-rings every day at work.  how many years did the R/R issue carry on through. they still can't get it right on the early gens.  things happen, it is a piece of machinery after all.  there are 5 recalls alone on a 1998 honda accord

I agree.

I've done a little research on the recalls of the 6th Gen. Regarding the Alternator, Honda went to a lower output alternator on the 6th Gen in order to keep the RR's from burning out, although they also repositioned the RR and put cooling fins on the RR's so the lower output alternator was unnessary. They also used a four headlight configuration on the 6th Gen, so when people had their highbeams on and the fan kicked on, the alternator could not keep up with the load and the battery died. They have since used a higher output alternator, with no ill effects on the RR's and now the battery usually does not die with the highbeams and fan on at the same time. Unless of course, the battery is old and needs to be replaced (battery issue).

The seat rail issue...a very small percentage of all the 6th Gen VFR's on the road have had a crack in the area under the seat. This is probably due to really beating on the bike. Most riders would never have a problem, although Honda decided to reinforce the area in the interest of safety. I got this info from a VFR owner that works at a local Honda Dealership that was actually one of the only people to actually crack the area under the seat rail. He reportedly rides his bike pretty hard.

I have had the alternator and seat rail recall work done on my bike, although I never experienced any problems and probably never would have. I usually don't keep my highbeams on in heavy traffic while the fan is running and I don't pull wheelies or jump curbs on a regular basis.

I don't think Honda rushed the 6th Gen out the door. They identified some issues that are probably more isolated incidents than widespread problems and corrected them. I still think the VFR is the best all around bike and the fit and finish is second to none. I would buy another one in a heartbeat.

Dave.:wheel:

I received the recall notice yesterday, and it applies to "certain" 2002-2004 model year VFR800/A motorcycles.

The recall states, "The brake proportioning valve could develop a leak." But there is no reference to which proportioning valve is affected, i.e., the rear proportional control valve, or the servo proportional control valve.

I inspected both and found no evidence of leakage.

Question for those have done the brake fluid drain and fill. Page references below are for the 2002 -2004 VFR800/A Honda Service Manual.

Page 15-13 shows the an air bleed valve for the rear proportional control valve. You can also see this air bleed valve on page 15-33, third photo, and on page 16-32 (ABS), first photo.

No such air bleed valve exists on my non-ABS model. But I believe the ABS models have an air bleed valve for the rear proportional control valve, as shown by the photos in the service manual. Can any ABS model owner(s) confirm this?

It seems that all the photos in the service manual were taken using an ABS model. Honda should have made a note in the manual that only the ABS model has an air bleed valve on the rear servo proportional control valve. :angry:

There is an air bleed valve on the servo proportional control valve, as shown on page 15-3 and page 15-35, second and third photos (oil bolt).

I got my recall notice in the mail Friday the 11th.
I'll take it in to get looked at sometime next week.
I'm not worried about this at all, I've never had a leak of any kind.
Last summer when I flushed and bleed all the brake fluid I had no problem with it sealing properly.