I usually have a friend around, but I like to work on my bike when ever I get the notion. Which means an extra hand is not always around. It usually takes 2 or 3 people to measure sag, one to hold the bike, the rider to sit on it, and one to take measurements. Most folks skip the holder and have the rider stand on his tip toes while holding the bike up.
I decided to give it a try SOLO with some ingenuity I came up with a plan that WORKED! The front sag can be done with a zip tie solo. However the back is what presented the problem.
HERE IS MY SOLUTION REAR SAG
[image: user posted image] It consist of a conical shaped table leg, a long hard piece of wire (flexible to bend but not soft), and a zip tie.
I wrapped one end of the wire around my key, tight enough to not move too much, hardly at all, I took off the plastic cover on the wheel and stuck the conical wood piece in and marked a spot for the wire to go thru, then I drilled a 1/8 hole all the way thru it. I attached a zip tie to the wire and tightened it to stay but move then it was touched. The key in the helmet lock is a great place since it is directly above the center of the wheel (98-01) and it is far out enough to be a strait drop down to the piece of wood.
[image: user posted image]
There was a slight amount of free play in the wire but only about a mm, it hardly moved at all.
With the bike on the rear stand I marked the point where it came to rest, (shock fully extended)
[image: user posted image]
At this point I let the bike down to the kick stand, it sort of bounces, then I set the zip tie all the way down to the wood to recalibrate it, gently sat on the bike, and for a moment lifted up my legs to get full sag reading, gently sat it up and then back onto the center stand, this is the result.
[image: user posted image] I marked it with a pen and took off the wire to measure it. 43mm from point to point, give or take a mm for free play.
[image: user posted image]
I added a click of preload and remeasured (39mm) then 2 click more preload (and now I am correct at 32mm) I have my rear preload 4 clicks from full soft now to get the recommended 32mm of rear sag. My half arsed tool worked great!
[image: user posted image]
FRONT SAG
This is way easier to measure, this only requires a jack, a zip tie, and a ruler or something to measure. I have a sliding metal ruler with a stop on it that moves.
Begin by placing the bike on its kick stand, and place a zip tie around the fork like so. reach in and push the zip tie all the way down.
[image: user posted image]
Now gently get on the bike and sit her up, you can see the zip tie thru the opening near the handle bars, if you accidentally bump it too much then just push it down from above, then sit down and let it come to a rest, gently get off. The zip tie should stay in place if you put it on tight enough.
Now I put the bike on the center stand and then jacked up the front wheel to get my sag measurment.
[image: user posted image]
The distance from the oil seal to the bottom of the zip is the sag! Mine was at 43mm so I cranked the preload down 3 full turns till it came to 32mm.
It worked on Craigs bike too, his key is slightly forward so the wire was sort of at an angle.
we set his at 1996 VFR at 35mm front and 35mm in back sag. He likes the bike to be a little lower.
I have also been reading that the rear should have less sag than the front say 35mm in front and around 30mm in back. I have not tried that. Mine is shimmed 2mm in the rear so I am probably in that neighborhood anyway.
TourXcrosS, Sep. 25does the weight of the rider affect the sag settings? do we still follow the sag standard 30mm-35mm say if the rider's weigh less than 150lb???
The VFR suspension operates best when the bike is sagging 30-35mm front and rear. A lighter rider will require less preload to sag at that height than a heavy guy. The sag number is the constant here, rider wieght and preload settings are what change with a different rider.
So to answer your question the bike should be set to sag between 30-35mm for both a 250lb rider and a 175lb rider in order to get the bike into the correct ride hieght and geometry relative to the ground. I have my sag set at 32mm in the front forks and 30mm in the swingarm.
Yes follow 30mm-35mm for sombody less than 150lbs. There is a constraint when considering a rider who is extreamly heavy and one who is underwieght of standard riders the springs. A super heavy guy might not have enough spring strength no matter how much preload you crank on to raise his sag to the 30mm number, in that case a spring change for a stronger rate is what is needed!
Thats what I did for my bike I got a stronger shock spring put on I weigh in at 240lbs and stronger fork springs. If your 140lbs you might have the opposite problem - your preload will not back off enough to get to the 30mm number 27mm for example so a lighter spring might be in order, if your at the limit of the preload settings to reach the optimum sag you might consider a different spring cause the bike will bottom out or top out on big bumps.
Where does the 30mm-35mm sag suggestion come from? any shock will generally perform at its best if it sagging around 1/3 of its total travel for a touring mode, 1/4 of total travel for track days. 35mm gets you in between their sport touring 1/3.5
The front suspsension has 120mm of travel so does the back
1/3rd of 120mm is 40mm touring mode Another thing to consider for the VFR is that the springs are progressive they are wound tighter at the bottom the calculations are bit more complicated for a progressive suspension but the end result is the ideal sag is a bit different than the 1/3rd It comes out to between 30mm-35mm.
HispanicSlammer, Mar. 12I have also been reading that the rear should have less sag than the front say 35mm in front and around 30mm in back. �I have not tried that. Mine is shimmed 2mm in the rear so I am probably in that neighborhood anyway.
That's what I did, and I love it. The bike feels more balanced when the sag is slightly less in the rear. I try to keep them about 5mm apart. 30-35 for the rear, 35-40 front.
I removed the rear shim, and set the forks down 5mm in the clamps, it flicks better that way and the sag is even front and back now. 32mm is what I ended up with. You got to remember it changes when the temperature changes, springs contract when its cold. So check it when your doing your monthly maintence.
It feels like it rides on rails now, I had my compression too high on the OHLINS and now I have it dialed in.
the stock unit does not have that many preload settings just 6 so you might have difficulty getting your sag exactly on 30mm so thats what the 30mm-35mm range is for, some built in error there.
As far as rebound the stock setting is 1 1/4 from full hard turns, dont mess with that unless your bouncing around on the upstroke too much or have an unstable feel still AFTER you set your sag correctly.
Wouldn't it make sense to set the sag settings while the fork & shock oil are at operating temperatures (i.e. after a ride). This would allow you to set your sag with ride time accuracy. Or, does the 35mm sag take this into account?
FifeDog, Mar. 27 2004Wouldn't it make sense to set the sag settings while the fork & shock oil are at operating temperatures (i.e. after a ride). �This would allow you to set your sag with ride time accuracy. �Or, does the 35mm sag take this into account?
It wouldn't hurt to do this after a ride, but I don't think it will change the results. Sag relates to the preload on the springs not the temp of the damping fluid (shock/fork oil). The springs should not change behavior in the small range of temps from static/cold to operating temp.
What it might do is reduce the level of stiction in the front end. However, if you use the hi/lo averaging approach at the front stiction shouldn't be a problem.
It makes sense to me, since the shock has a nitrogen charge, and the forks have an air pocket which acts like a spring as the fork comresses. Heat effects the way it behaves boyles law. I never did, and havent read anything that suggested that you warm up first.
Tried the Hispanic's method of checking rear sag solo - it all ended in tears! I don't recommend wrapping the wire around the key in the seatlock . I had to move my vfr in hurry ( scared of idiot next door hiting it with his car) . Rear wheel rotates , wire wraps round wooden stale - pulls key partially from lock & snapped it into 2 pieces , 1 piece jammed in lock barrel - not good ! Guess its better to get a few mates & give you a lift with it......... :doh: Better luck next time !
Well in my defence I never made a suggestion to try to ride or move the bike with the rod and wood wedged in the hub? Sorry this happened but................Not my fault.
Hi HispanicSlammer, may i knoe how heavy r u?? im weighin in round 85kg. settings should be the same as u? so the ideal sags r round 30-35mm rite?? will it make a difference in the settings or use different settings if i take a pillon quite frequently?
I made my Handy Dandy Slamarony Sag adjuster. I made the coat hanger long enough to touch the gound sat on the bike measured > repeated the process 3 times and took out a little pre load to come up with the 32mm. Its not perfect but I'll bet it is better than 95% of the bikes on the road.
I checked my sag. BUT, the superbike magazin says on road bikes (etc VFR) the fron sag with rider on it shuld been BETWEEN 35-50mm! The rear sag should been BETWEEN 30-45mm. (they give the static (without rider) sag 30-40 front, and 15-25 rear) I had 45mm fron, and 32mm rear. When i had set the front preload to full, the ride was too hard and bumpy, and the bike had feel less stable.
So i have put the preload seting back to 1 from full hard. I have Wilbers progressive fork springs in front.
My opionion is the front should sag more on a VFR than the back simply because of the greater trail VFR's have over other sportbikes, they are raked out more than most bikes and are very sensitive to sag measurements. If you have more sag in the rear than the front it will feel sluggish turning.
Progressive springs will give more of a harsh feel when adding preload, simply cause you are pushing the springs up into the harder part of the coils. I like to use a baseline of 30-35mm to start with then make small ajustements to get the bike to feel the way I like it. I mean you can feel the difference just by the way it steers and takes bumps.
HispanicSlammer, May 5 2005, 07:30 PMMy opionion is the front should sag more on a VFR than the back simply because of the greater trail VFR's have over other sportbikes, they are raked out more than most bikes and are very sensitive to sag measurements. If you have more sag in the rear than the front it will feel sluggish turning.
Progressive springs will give more of a harsh feel when adding preload, simply cause you are pushing the springs up into the harder part of the coils. I like to use a baseline of 30-35mm to start with then make small ajustements to get the bike to feel the way I like it. I mean you can feel the difference just by the way it steers and takes bumps.
Thanks for fast response!
So is it correct, that now i have 45mm front sag, and 32mm rear sag? Why the superbike magazin says bigger sag?
Yea I have a similar setup, but I dont like having my sag so low on the spring, that is to say with 45mm of sag there is a possibility of bottoming out too easy when hitting a big bump.
So I did somthing a bit different which gives the same geometry with less sag, I set my forks down 5mm in the triple clamps then set the sag to 35mm. which is the same as having the sag at 40mm, the trail is the same but I have the spring settling at 35mm of the fork travel rather than 40mm of fork travel used. You get 120mm of total travel with a vfr fork a big bump can take up 75mm of travel easy and you end up bottoming out. I would suggest dropping the forks a bit and cranking up the preload a little to compensate for the same geometry picking up that added travel.
I tried setting the forks down 10mm in the clamps but it was too far, it felt like the bike was too much weight up front.
Its really like a teeter totter with regaurd to how weight shifts from front to back when preload is changed.
HispanicSlammer, May 5 2005, 01:43 PM Just dont do a stunt like blacknasty with the cone shoved into the axle.
Perhaps drilling the pin to your single sided maintenance stand might work as a guide for the rod... about impossible to pull a backnasty then... not to mention holding the bike level setting the sag...
I just set my sag last night, for the first time ever, after 30-ish years of riding, and 7 bikes. Used a zip tie on the front forks, and a 1-metre ruler on the back, held by my son against the bottom of the bolt on the packrack. Very quick and easy, and the first time I've not just adjusted it and riddne, without knowing (except by feel) whether it was optimal or not.
enzed_viffer, May 5 2005, 05:50 PMI just set my sag last night, for the first time ever, after 30-ish years of riding, and 7 bikes. Used a zip tie on the front forks, and a 1-metre ruler on the back, held by my son against the bottom of the bolt on the packrack. Very quick and easy, and the first time I've not just adjusted it and riddne, without knowing (except by feel) whether it was optimal or not.
I made my measuring tool exactly like the one HS described, but I used a deep socket instead of the wooden chair leg. My roomate has a ton of tools and I found a deep impact socket that had holes drilled on both sides (for the retention pin). I have no idea what size the socket was - I just grabbed a couple and found one that slid into the axle nicely... I also found that the front cable-tie method worked better on the left-when-you're sitting fork than on the right - there was more clearance to get my caliper in there to measure the sag...
As for the adjustment, wow what a difference. I'm 200 lbs and the bike handles so much nicer now.
A 1 1/8" dowel found at Lowes fits my '97 perfectly. Unfortunately the key on a 4th gen isn't directly above the axle so I am gonna have to rig something to hold the hanger plumb and steady.
Thanks for the write-up HS, awesome as usual beer.gif
i'd like to thank Slammer, for the nifty tool for setting the sag. i made mine out of UHMW(hi-tech plastic) and it works great. i thought my bike was set up ,boy was i wrong!!!! the VFR rides much better now!sweepers and twisties are now a lot easier!
now all i have to do if figure what setting for the rebound damper
End of thread · 30 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 19 Oct 2006