Air filter opinions

I would like to hear from folks who have swapped their factory air filters for an aftermarket like K&N. Is there any real performance advantage?

I haven't noticed anything...But supposedly you get 5 more hp...I like them because you just clean and go. I have one in my pickup truck too. Why buy a disposable when you can buy 1 for the life of the vehicle.

[image: View Post]Goosechef, on 08 April 2010 - 02:51 PM, said:

I would like to hear from folks who have swapped their factory air filters for an aftermarket like K&N. Is there any real performance advantage?

I have been taking my filters out of the bike and Jeep and just blasting them with the air chuck. Cleans them right up. Any reason that is a bad idea? 5 hp is reasonable, I would think if that was a gain, you'd feel it

I have never noticed a performance gain on my VFR, but I did gut the intake on my truck and put one in there, and the throttle response is instant! I can heel/toe downshift now, and it sounds great! On the bike there's a very small difference in sound, but not easily noticeable, probably a bit louder if you de-snorkel the airbox. The main reason for My choice of K&N on the bike is it's almost the same price as a factory one, and it can be reused.

[image: View Post]tincan1200, on 08 April 2010 - 03:56 PM, said:

Why buy a disposable when you can buy 1 for the life of the vehicle.

So you don't have to futz around cleaning filters! :biggrin:

[image: View Post]Goosechef, on 08 April 2010 - 04:51 PM, said:

I would like to hear from folks who have swapped their factory air filters for an aftermarket like K&N. Is there any real performance advantage?


Zero HP gain here, just a no-pitch item advantage, clean and reuse.....now a BMG filter MAY? boost hp as it LOOKS? to have more air flow than the K&N>

The performance gain is in your pocketbook every time you don't have to replace that expensive OEM paper filter. The disposable filter is nearly as expensive as the K&N and after the second replacement interval you are ahead.

I'm not sure about the 6th Gen, but on the 5th Gen K&N the media area is actually SMALLER than stock. I think that is because the K&N flowed so much more air that it was too much for the EFI computer to handle without going too lean.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/uploads/1270149015/gallery_7252_5239_33484.jpg

K&N filter is on the left -stock filter on the right.

[image: View Post]tincan1200, on 08 April 2010 - 02:56 PM, said:

I haven't noticed anything...But supposedly you get 5 more hp...I like them because you just clean and go. I have one in my pickup truck too. Why buy a disposable when you can buy 1 for the life of the vehicle.
:+1: :+1: I have one in the VFR and the pickup too, clean and go.

If I were buying today, I'd get the BMC for it's larger surface area.

I've already got a K&N though, the bike came with it when I bought it.

Goose.... Serenity_VFR hit the nail on the head with all the others..... I've been using K&N on all my cars/bikes since the 70's, nothing ever needed adjusting, If anything it will help our bikes not to run as lean, which I heard some say they could run richer(an epa thing)which would be good?

As for cleaning them, you don't want to use a powered air blast as it will seperate spots on the gauze(leaving to big a hole/s) that's fitted between the screens.... I rince them under a slow flow water faucet(water stream the opposite of the air flow. Then use spray-on filter oil(spraying on one side only,"lightly", and that being on the side that the outside air is pushing on). I know you said you blast the paper ones, it just made me think to mention the how/to's on the gauze K&N's.

You want to go riding this weekend?

I love my K&N. It feels less wasteful to clean and recharge it annually than to buy a new paper filter every year.

I can't say my VFR gained hp with the K&N, but it's a fun, easy and inexpensive "performance" mod! ;)

how often do you replace it making the oem so expensive?

[image: View Post]ericlw, on 09 April 2010 - 08:10 AM, said:

how often do you replace it making the oem so expensive?

The maintenance schedule says every 12k -which isn't even a year's riding. In more severe environments, dirty and dusty (like riding backroads with the common gravel/dirt road, and chipseal and sand everywhere it gets dirty even faster. My K&N gets filthy dirty after a few months and they "claim" that the filter can go 50k without a cleaning since it is so superior -I never let it get more than a year.

A dirty air filter doesn't flow air creating a loss of power and rich running. (yeah, the computer compensates by leaning out the mixture even more. Less gas and less air = less power output) Going cheap and stretching filter changes isn't good for the lifetime of the engine either. Dirt eventually works its way through. Look at how filty my stock filter was after about 6-7k -especially under where the snorkel and flapper are!

So going a little under 10k for me because I often ride in dusty conditions, at 100k that's about ten $45 filters. I've got better things to spend money on than $450 on just disposable paper filters. If they were the price of a normal car air filter it wouldn't be so bad (I still have a K&N in my Camry even though filters are about $10 and I've been ahead for the last 200k). But at the $tealer price it's just obnoxious. Buying it at those prices just validates their crazy pricing structure. It just gives them the go-ahead to keep on doing it to you because the buying public accedes to the gouging willingly. Only if people refuse to be butt-gouged will they ever learn and come around to selling parts at decent prices.

Who knows why Honda couldn't have put a shaped plastic "plate" in the airbox into which a standard automotive filter could be inserted/snapped-in rather than make a specialized filter that ONLY fits one model and generation without any crossover. Oh, I DO know why -it's an opportunity to raid your wallet. If those who just let them do it, then they are going to keep doing it.

$$$$$ :owned: $$$$$

Just say no -buy a K&N or other option. I refuse to bend over to the Honda parts counter man.

:beatdeadhorse:

wait a second, you said the 5th gen is $45 for the oem filter? WTF why is the 4th gen $75!! The price difference between the OEM and K&N on the 4th gen is just a few cents and the K&N cost maybe a bucks worth of oil after cleaning it is a no brainer. I went for the UNI filter since it was half the price at $30, not that it matters to me but it is reported to flow better then the KN and BMC.

Never been able to tell any performance difference from aftermarket to the stock filter.

[image: View Post]rchecks, on 09 April 2010 - 08:49 AM, said:

wait a second, you said the 5th gen is $45 for the oem filter? WTF why is the 4th gen $75!! The price difference between the OEM and K&N on the 4th gen is just a few cents and the K&N cost maybe a bucks worth of oil after cleaning it is a no brainer. I went for the UNI filter since it was half the price at $30, not that it matters to me but it is reported to flow better then the KN and BMC.

It's been "a few years" since I priced a 5th gen OEM paper air filter element either online or from a $tealer.

I just looked, and right now the OEM paper filter is $51.50 plus shipping from Bikebandit.com.

Your $75 figure is probably right on for a paper OEM element via a brick & mortar $tealership. It might be even more as many dealerships are jacking up prices on everything right now to make rent.

For what it is worth, apples to apples (internet price to internet price) that puts the K&N in the position as an immediate cost savings at the very first purchase -as it can be found at indysportbikes.com right now for $49.26 plus shipping. (note: picture in product page is NOT the VFR element but looks like a random K&N filter photo). That's about 2 bucks cheaper and you get something reusable instead of disposable.

Hug a tree, be green.

Reduce, Reuse, Recycle.

Do it for Woodsie -Hoot-hoot!

I don't have any particular faith in any of the non-paper element filters because you can through them... sure, you spray them with oil (remember oil bath air filters?), i still don't buy that you can flow more air through a smaller surface area with the same filtering ability.

Whining aside, I got mine with a K&N and I the first couple times I went to clean it there was crap that had gotten though into the bottom of the airbox (stock, recommended oil amount, lid installed properly) and in the snorkels - not much, but some. I cleaned it out, put a layer of BMC foam don't remember the thickness, 1/2 inch or so over the K&N fitted to the edge of the inside of the airbox. I left that in for about 8 months, maybe 8,000 miles. Took it out a month ago, the foam was filthy, the K&N under it was spotless and the snorkels/airbox looked new. I never noticed any difference in power, idle, mileage, anything -- but it was clearly cleaner inside.

[image: View Post]Serenity_VFR, on 08 April 2010 - 08:44 PM, said:

The performance gain is in your pocketbook every time you don't have to replace that expensive OEM paper filter. The disposable filter is nearly as expensive as the K&N and after the second replacement interval you are ahead.

I'm not sure about the 6th Gen, but on the 5th Gen K&N the media area is actually SMALLER than stock. I think that is because the K&N flowed so much more air that it was too much for the EFI computer to handle without going too lean.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/uploads/1270149015/gallery_7252_5239_33484.jpg

K&N filter is on the left -stock filter on the right.


From this picture, you can see the problems with the K&N.

First the element goes down instead of up, deceasing the distance between the 'exit' of the filter and the throttle openings. Second, the throttle bores are actually pretty far apart. The K&N doesn't 'cover' them near as well as the factory. The air is forced to make a sharper narrower pair of turns. I'm guessing this would starve the motor on the top end. It would be better if they increased the layers of cotton to make the filter flow the same instead of decreasing the element size.

The reason they made the filter element smaller was to make it bench flow the same. Unlike cars, bikes don't have a airflow meter. If you increase the flow on a bike, all you do is make the bike run lean. The bike has no way of knowing that more air is coming in and will use also the same amount of fuel if there is no filter or a plugged filter. The only thing that might have a small influence, is the MAP sensor.

Don't get me wrong, I've used K&N's in my cars and trucks for years, I just don't think it's a good fit on the VFR.

[image: View Post]ericlw, on 09 April 2010 - 09:10 AM, said:

how often do you replace it making the oem so expensive?

Money wise.... Give or take a few dollars either way.... When the time comes to change your first filter... If you get the K&N you'll be ahead by close to one air filter, when it comes time to replace the 3rd......

[image: View Post]Serenity_VFR, on 09 April 2010 - 08:03 AM, said:

Hug a tree, be green.

Reduce, Reuse, Recycle.

Do it for Woodsie -Hoot-hoot!

Not exactly sure using more petroleum products in the filter and subsequently washing and rinsing them into the water system is a net positive, environmentally speaking, but okay...

FWIW, you could always tear the paper out of the OEM element and recycle it. Possibly the plastic, too. :idea3:

Hi Guys,

Currently live in Melbourne, Australia and own a 2007 VFR800 with 3,500 kms on the clock.

Just installed a "Pipercross Air Filter" manufactured in the UK and used by Triumph as OEM.

Looked at K&N and a lot of other high-end filters, but the Pipercross filter has a 100% foam filter area. No large plastic frame such as on the OEM and K&N filters.

Whilst installing the new air filter, I also removed the vacuum hose from the Variable Intake Port Diaphram, so the airbox intake ports remains open 100% of the time. A PAIRS Valve Removal Kit was also installed.

The intake has an improved intake roar .... about 10-15%

Throttle response did improve between 2,000 - 5,000 rpm with the PAIR Kit and I'm able to hold an exact RPM when moving around "roundabouts" which is very confident inspiring, when compared with the original rubbish throttle response.

Whilst I'm not claiming a horsepower increase, the front end does go "very light" now under hard acceralation in 1st and 2nd gear ... something that it didn't do before. Thought it was just great traction, low temperature (dense air) or a light fuel load the first few time it did it, but it still lift the front wheel ever so slightly under power.

Just my two bits in this discussion.

Warren