Who actually switches to a heavier oil in warmer months?

Is it really that imperative to change viscosity or is that a thing the air cooled crowd has to be more strict about?  I'm really digging the Rotella 5W-40 syn.  But I mean come on, there is no 50 weight unless I go Mobil V-Twin and pay out the wazoo, or another super expensive "throw your money out the window" synthetic.  It is very hot in the Northeast right now.

Let's put it this way... Honda says 10/40 year round.... and from what we've been told on this forum.... thicker oil leads to problems with the cct not getting the oil splash it needs....... If you feel concerned in the summer just change it more often..........

If there one thing an owner has control of it's the viscosity of their
engine oil...  your manufacture recommends a 40wt... so it's a safe
bet... and you may notice that your engine may actually run cooler
laboring against a lower viscosity oil... you may notice a slight hp
gain on the dyno... and technically speaking owners are not
complaining of wearing out their engines... reliability is not a
problem... basically 50 wt gets the nod now a days based
solely on peace of mind...

I've had 2 fiftth gen vfr's that I would run the Mobil 1 15w50 automotive oil because I liked the way it shifted with that oil.I ended up gong back to the Mobil 1 10w40 bike oil because it became obvious the vfr ran afew degrees hotter with the 15w50,as if those things don't already run hot enough.Now I'm sticking with the 10w40 synthetic.

nope. not I. even up in South Dakota, riding around in the teens & whatnot, i never swapped weights (10W40 only) between the 2 seasons. just run a good synth, and have nary a problem.

p.s. but i will say this, obvious to most people but not to a certain stealorship, putting in an extra quart or so does NOT help it run any better. don't ask how i know. ...

I have never believed in regular engine oil for a bike, regular engine oil does not, for me, take into account the special needs of the wet clutch
I have only used the Honda specifies oil, to 10W40 GV4
As the specified weight is already containing a 40W, I see no need to try and shove any thicker stuff into it
But that's just my 2�...

About 25 years ago I installed an oil temp gauge in the sump of my Suzuki GS850G. Much to my surprise I discovered that the 20W-50 Castrol that I put in during the summer ran about 10-15 degrees hotter than the 10W-40 that I was running before. Since then I've never used 20W-50 oil in my bikes or cars. IMO the extra viscosity isn't worth the increased heat level.

Last year a local G.I, Joe's went under and I got a case of Amsoil 10w-40 for 1/2 price so I've been running that May-Sept and Rotella 5w-40 the rest of the year.  Unless I can get another killer deal on a good 10w-40, I'll just run the Rptella year round when the 10w-40 runs out.

I've been running Shell Rotella T 15w-40 in my bikes for years.  It's actually made for heavy duty engines like truck fleets.  I run it year round since we have hot summers and mild winters here in Atlanta.  

Rollin

Shell RTS 5w40 year round in everything I own (except the F-150 which gets MC 5w-20 year round). Winter lows in the 40s, summer highs in the low to mid 100s.

I had the same experience Larry did. Heavier oil makes the engine run marginally hotter.

I change my oil once per season.  Period.

Alright thanks crew, Rotella t6 year round it is.

[image: View Post]Monk, on 08 July 2010 - 02:17 AM, said:

Let's put it this way... Honda says 10/40 year round.... and from what we've been told on this forum.... thicker oil leads to problems with the cct not getting the oil splash it needs....... If you feel concerned in the summer just change it more often..........


I dont buy that. I use honda dino 20-50 most of the year in NC.  I just replaced my cct's after 57K miles. The cct's only made a little noise every once in a while. I changed them mainly for peace of mind.

I believe the manual states that 20-50 is fine if temps are above 60-70F. The manual does state that 10-40 is fine year round. It depends on your climate.

Rememer the W stands for winter not weight.

I've been running Golden Spectro 20-50 year round for a couple of years on the recommendation of my trusted mechanic, who does the same on his bikes. It's probably not a big deal if you switch to 20-50 or 10-40, as long as you change the oil when necessary.

[image: View Post]Toppers, on 08 July 2010 - 11:28 AM, said:

Alright thanks crew, Rotella t6 year round it is.

I don't recomend Rotella because I can not prove it has one key additive... in
particular antifoaming additives... which are important due to the high RPMs
that can create cavitation and starve bearings from necessary lubrication
in the process... Diesels are very low RPM engines...

[image: View Post]TripleH, on 08 July 2010 - 07:25 AM, said:

I have never believed in regular engine oil for a bike, regular engine oil does not, for me, take into account the special needs of the wet clutch
I have only used the Honda specifies oil, to 10W40 GV4



Quote SportBike

Can synthetic oils cause my clutch to slip?

To answer this in one word: No. Clutch slippage is caused by many
things, but the use of synthetic oil alone is usually not the culprit.
The truth is that some bikes seem to suffer clutch slippage no matter
what oil goes in them, while others run fine with any oil. This is
most likely caused by factors other than the oil, such as the spring
pressure, age and clutch plate materials. If you have a bike known for
clutch problems, you may have to be more selective in your oil
choices. Moly is often blamed for clutch slippage, and it can have an
effect-but moly alone is not the problem. We wish there was a hard and
fast rule to follow, but it is just not that easy. Simply put, you
will have to try an oil and evaluate it. If you experience slippage
with the new oil, and have not had problems before, it may be the oil.
The plates and/or springs could also be worn to the point that they
have finally started to slip. Simply change back to the previous oil
and see what happens. You can also check the test data in next issue's
article to see if that particular oil has a significant amount of
moly. If so, try one that does not have as much moly next time.

We talked to Mark Junge, Vesrah's Racing representative, who has won
numerous WERA national championships using Vesrah's clutches. He said
that in his years of engine work he has yet to see a slipping clutch
that could be pinned on synthetic motor oil. Junge felt that nearly
every time the clutch was marginal or had worn springs, the new oil
just revealed a problem that already existed.

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 08 July 2010 - 04:26 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Toppers, on 08 July 2010 - 11:28 AM, said:

Alright thanks crew, Rotella t6 year round it is.

I don't recomend Rotella because I can not prove it has one key additive... in
particular antifoaming additives... which are important due to the high RPMs
that can create cavitation and starve bearings from necessary lubrication
in the process... Diesels are very low RPM engines...


Poppy-Cock.

How do you know it doesn't have any anti-foaming additives?   Do you think that just because a diesel doesn't turn 10k  they would totally disregard the need to control foaming?  I could whip up plenty of foam at 3k.  Are you aware the newest version of Rotella T6 5w-40 meets the requirements for JASO MA?  Part of the requirements for JASO MA are it's ability to resist foaming.

Don't make me have to whip out the wife's mixer and start testing oils!       :fing02:

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 08 July 2010 - 04:26 PM, said:

I don't recomend Rotella because I can not prove it has one key additive... in
particular antifoaming additives... which are important due to the high RPMs
that can create cavitation and starve bearings from necessary lubrication
in the process... Diesels are very low RPM engines...

I don't rely on additives... just my brain.  Keith Code taught me how to ride my bike so as to avoid foaming.   :fing02:

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 08 July 2010 - 04:26 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Toppers, on 08 July 2010 - 11:28 AM, said:

Alright thanks crew, Rotella t6 year round it is.

I don't recomend Rotella because I can not prove it has one key additive... in
particular antifoaming additives... which are important due to the high RPMs
that can create cavitation and starve bearings from necessary lubrication
in the process... Diesels are very low RPM engines...


How fast does the turbocharger spin on a modern diesel engine......   :fing02:


120,000 RPM?   :owned:

We don't really have seasons here... in summer the hottest it gets is around 26C, and the coldest it gets in winter is just above freezing, and then only until the sun comes up. No need to think about oils; I usually just choose whatever has the prettiest labels.
:491:

Speaking of winter - I started my bike today! :owned:
Not allowed to ride, so I just warmed it up until the engine temp was about 72C, then snicked it into gear and let it run for a while, before shutting it off again for the next few weeks. I doubt I could ride it, let alone put it back on the centrestand.   :fing02:

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 08 July 2010 - 10:58 PM, said:

[

How do you know it doesn't have any anti-foaming additives?

I don't know and that is the problem to which I stated... oil
companies don't put unneeded additives in Diesel oil because the more
additives the higher the ash content... Detroit Diesel has found that
high ash oils (greater than 1.0%) cause deposits to form on the
exhaust valve, which can fuse with the valve face at elevated valve
temperatures. The result is a burnt valve in the two-stroke engine.
Detroit Diesel recommends the use of low ash oils in these engines...

but if you can show proof that Rotella T6 specific has an anti foaming additive then post it up...

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 08 July 2010 - 11:41 PM, said:

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 08 July 2010 - 10:58 PM, said:

[

How do you know it doesn't have any anti-foaming additives?

I don't know and that is the problem to which I stated... oil
companies don't put unneeded additives in Diesel oil because the more
additives the higher the ash content... Detroit Diesel has found that
high ash oils (greater than 1.0%) cause deposits to form on the
exhaust valve, which can fuse with the valve face at elevated valve
temperatures. The result is a burnt valve in the two-stroke engine.
Detroit Diesel recommends the use of low ash oils in these engines...

but if you can show proof that Rotella T6 specific has an anti foaming additive then post it up...


[image: Posted Image]
Rotella T6 5w-40

Silcone is used as anti foaming additive

Again, it meets JASO MA.

Yep, me, too! About every 10,000 kilometres (roughly 6,000 miles).
I use the automotive 10w30 Mobil - no issues with the clutch, works fine in our cool climate and worked fine on a trip through Death Valley, Nevada and Utah in 40+ (100 degree heat).
Not sure why you would need to change to a heavier weight.

[image: View Post]Rice, on 08 July 2010 - 10:58 AM, said:

I change my oil once per season.  Period.

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 09 July 2010 - 10:33 AM, said:

[image: Posted Image]
Rotella T6 5w-40

Silcone is used as anti foaming additive

Again, it meets JASO MA.

True but deceptive... according to BlackStone Labs silicone in their
test is either dirt or silicone anti foam additive added by the owner
or silicone gasket sealer... your 3ppm is unique to your oil...
testing another owners Rolella T6 will produce different silicone
numbers up to 70ppm... your 3ppm is not representative of an anti
foam additive package... if you ask Blackstone I think they will say
the 3ppm is most likely dirt...

http://www.blackston...con-bugaboo.php

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 09 July 2010 - 04:50 PM, said:

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 09 July 2010 - 10:33 AM, said:

[image: Posted Image]
Rotella T6 5w-40

Silcone is used as anti foaming additive

Again, it meets JASO MA.

True but deceptive... according to BlackStone Labs silicone in their
test is either dirt or silicone anti foam additive added by the owner
or silicone gasket sealer... your 3ppm is unique to your oil...
testing another owners Rolella T6 will produce different silicone
numbers up to 70ppm... your 3ppm is not representative of an anti
foam additive package... if you ask Blackstone I think they will say
the 3ppm is most likely dirt...

http://www.blackston...con-bugaboo.php


Yet, you fail to respond to the oil being JASO MA certified.    I'll give you the silicon position, but arguing this point will prove most interesting.

And, on BITOG many oil nuts on that site whom are far more informed than most support the use of the oil in question.  In fact, it has widespread endorsement by many active members.

First rule of VFRdiscussion - BusyLittleShop is always right.
Second rule of VFRdiscussion - In spite of evidence to the contrary, supported by most, including science, see rule #1.

I'm hoping at some point he's able, with all his knowledge, to write posts that exceed 50 characters in width - quite an accomplishment

[/end sarcasm]

You are   :biggrin:

[image: View Post]BusyLittleShop, on 09 July 2010 - 04:50 PM, said:

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 09 July 2010 - 10:33 AM, said:

[image: Posted Image]
Rotella T6 5w-40

Silcone is used as anti foaming additive

Again, it meets JASO MA.

True but deceptive... according to BlackStone Labs silicone in their
test is either dirt or silicone anti foam additive added by the owner
or silicone gasket sealer... your 3ppm is unique to your oil...
testing another owners Rolella T6 will produce different silicone
numbers up to 70ppm... your 3ppm is not representative of an anti
foam additive package... if you ask Blackstone I think they will say
the 3ppm is most likely dirt...

http://www.blackston...con-bugaboo.php


That's why I posted an oil test of a  virgin sample, from a sealed bottle.  'Virgin' means unused.   The owner didn't add anything and there was no gasket sealer since the oil was never near a gasket.

You said if I can show proof that Rotella T6 specific has an anti foaming additive then post it up.  Well since this was a virgin sample, the silicon got there because the manufacture added it., therefore it's an additive.  Silicone helps reduce foaming, I'm calling that a anti foaming additive.

Of course, there are more ways to control foaming then silicone, not all of which can be detected with a simple oil test.  I'm sure Shell uses several of them since the oil meets the requirements for JASO MA .

I do.

Oh wait,it's warm here 12/52/365.   :biggrin:

[image: View Post]coderighter, on 09 July 2010 - 10:03 PM, said:

That's why I posted an oil test of a  virgin sample, from a sealed bottle.  'Virgin' means unused.   The owner didn't add anything and there was no gasket sealer since the oil was never near a gasket.

You said if I can show proof that Rotella T6 specific has an anti foaming additive then post it up.  Well since this was a virgin sample, the silicon got there because the manufacture added it., therefore it's an additive.  Silicone helps reduce foaming, I'm calling that a anti foaming additive.

Of course, there are more ways to control foaming then silicone, not all of which can be detected with a simple oil test.  I'm sure Shell uses several of them since the oil meets the requirements for JASO MA .


I'm taking this on probably more than you like because I was Specter
Oil Analysis monitor in the USAF... I ran my 500 Interceptor oil
through the lab and established a history,,, and the lab rats rated
silicone ppm as dirt... So do you think 3 parts per million is enough
of an additive to do anything??? Do you have more than one Rotella
test??? what are your other silicone reading??? for it to be an
additive placed by the manufacture the 3ppm would be a constant
right??? but I think you'll find that the longer the oil is in use the
higher the silicone because it's dirt...

[image: View Post]superfunkomatic, on 09 July 2010 - 09:45 PM, said:

First rule of VFRdiscussion - BusyLittleShop is always right.


Negative super... when I'm proven wrong I always say "thanks for pointing that out"... check it...