Stator Failed... R/R's fine!

So I posted a couple months ago that my R/R finally gave out, even with all the wiring mods you could think of. I honestly had one of the most solid charging systems I've ever seen on a VFR, holding a solid 14.3v no matter what accessories, lights, etc I had turned on.

Here's the start.

I'm riding home one night, my left headlight shuts off ( I have HIDs by the way ). Odd... I have my headlights switched separately, so I switched it off and back on to reset the ballast, well when I did this it shut the other light off too... so i'm riding up the turnpike with no headlights at night time. I glance down and I see my dash getting dim.... uh oh.... I knew what was happening instantly. Well this section of the turnpike is pitch black dark, not the area you want to break down in. So I flipped my emergency blinkers on and halled a$$. The next exit was about 3-4 miles way. Not sure if I would actually make it that far, I was going to give it a shot. I hit the exit ramp 3-4 miles later @ about 140mph (Disclaimer: for legal purpose these speeds may be exaggerated) and the bike died as I'm about half way down the ramp. I had enough speed to make almost to the gas station off the exit, then I pushed it the rest of the way.

I take my right side fairing off and see the nice and toasted R/R connector, then just called my wife to have her hook up my trailer and come pick me up. I get home and hooked the bike up to the tender to recharge the battery. Then a couple weeks later finally decide to verify my assumption... disconnect the stator, test resistance across the stator: 0.7, 0.8, 0.8 ( looks good ). Hook it back up, start the bike up, voltage with no headlights on is 12.3vdc, with headlights on is 10.7vdc ( so only one headlight will actually start up ). I disconnect the monitor wire.... nothing changed on the R/R output, the R/R wasn't even warm to the touch. So I ordered a new R/R.

Two months later.... I finally decide i should probably get my motorcycle fixed. I've been so busy with mountain biking and cyclocross races I've not had any free time. So, I install the new R/R.... I'm getting the same results as before, 12.3vdc w/o lights and 10.7vdc w/ lights. Not cool! The way my wiring is I have two additional red wires going straight to the battery (fused) besides the two that go through the bikes wiring harness, as well as additional grounds and a bypassed monitor wire, so there is no other area's for issues to occur that aren't obvious. Could the new R/R be bad too? I had used one on another VFR so I tested this one before I took it off the other bike and it charged around 14vdc. So I hook it up and same thing.... 12.3vdc. So.... I disconnect the R/R and test the resistances again with a different meter with the same results: 07, 0.8, 0.8. Hmmm.......

So, with the R/R disconnect I start the bike and test voltage across the stator with the bike running: 32vac, 32vac, 0vac. With the bike running I test resistance again: 0.7, 0.8, 0.8. Craziness. Resistance is fine, but voltage output on one circuit is 0vac. I've heard of this before but never seen it. So because i have spare everything laying around, I put another stator in the bike and hook up my original R/R and ....... chaaaching! 14.3vdc again. So I put the new R/R on the bike since I have it, put the old one that has 45k miles on it and still running strong in my drawer for a spare.

In the end, I learned to not only look at resistance, because in this situation it tested normal even though the stator was shot. Also proves that no matter how well you wire something up.... something else will fail. Owe well. its fixed now! Sorry for the long writeup, just thought people would find this interesting with all the common R/R failures around.

Quote

then just called my wife to have her hook up my trailer and come pick me up.

Now that's a good woman!! My wife would have been clueless. Glad you got it sorted those electrical gremlins can be a real pain the arse. My buddy Vince's 4th Gen has been out of commission for more than 6 months due to electrical issues. I think we finally got it all sorted now after replacing his R/R , Harness, and Stator.

Rollin

Look on the bright side, now you have an extra R/R for when that one goes bad!

What ohms scale were you using to check stator to ground, too small of scale you'll not pic up the short, if its not a strong short?

seems like you only checked ohms between the yellow wires

[image: View Post]tinyminds, on 08 January 2011 - 04:33 PM, said:

.... So because i have spare everything laying around, I put another stator in the bike and hook up my original R/R and ....... chaaaching! 14.3vdc again. ...

I was thinking "what sort of a bloke just happens to have a spare stator hanging around?" until I read your signature -> '02 VFR800 (crashed)' ... mmmmm that'd be the donor I suspect :happy:

Anyway, good post Jason - thx for the info!

[image: View Post]spud786, on 08 January 2011 - 06:09 PM, said:

What ohms scale were you using to check stator to ground, too small of scale you'll not pic up the short, if its not a strong short?

seems like you only checked ohms between the yellow wires


I had the same problem with my '02 stator. Ohms read fine, but zero volts on one phase.

[image: View Post]kaldek, on 08 January 2011 - 10:33 PM, said:

[image: View Post]spud786, on 08 January 2011 - 06:09 PM, said:

What ohms scale were you using to check stator to ground, too small of scale you'll not pic up the short, if its not a strong short?

seems like you only checked ohms between the yellow wires


I had the same problem with my '02 stator. Ohms read fine, but zero volts on one phase.



My point, if not using a high ohms scale you can miss a short, my last two stator failures on different bikes, the stator ground check was my first step, no need to look else where it was bad. From this post only the 3 yellow wires were tested for continuity to each other and thats not the main ground check for a shorted stator.

What Im looking for, Is this answer. I tested each yellow wire to ground, on the highest ohm scale avalable, and it was infinite. Then the stator passed the Ground check along with the yellow wire continuity amongst each other, Then you can move to voltage checks.

14.3 volt is weak for a 6th gen

I think it's a pathetic statement on Honda that they have so many completely inexcusable electrical problems. It's one reason I won't own another Honda. Wish i could feel differently but this is 2011 and electrical systems passed Honda by several decades ago. Other than that, they do get one from point a to point b....usually..... :biggrin:

When I look at electrical amongst all brands , including Harley.

They all are about the same of the top brands, if you get more than 50,000 mile out of a stator, thats above average for any brand.

This flowchart gives a complete checkout of the charging system, and would have found the fault.
I suggest you Bookmark it, download and print/laminate/stick it up in the garage. It's worked for me a couple of times.
http://electrosport....t-finding-guide

[image: View Post]steve27bha, on 09 January 2011 - 02:00 PM, said:

This flowchart gives a complete checkout of the charging system, and would have found the fault.
I suggest you Bookmark it, download and print/laminate/stick it up in the garage. It's worked for me a couple of times.
http://electrosport....t-finding-guide

How good is that chart!? :fing02:

Thx for posting Steve - it'll save me fumbling around the bike with a multi-meter next time I have an issue :comp13:

[image: View Post]spud786, on 08 January 2011 - 06:09 PM, said:

What ohms scale were you using to check stator to ground, too small of scale you'll not pic up the short, if its not a strong short?

Honda workshop manuals always used to include a note regarding the use of the "recommended multimeter", mentioning that "Other manufacturer's equipment may not allow you to obtain the specified values...due to the characteristics of semiconductors, which have different resistance value depending on the applied voltage." However, I dunno if this would account for the "false negative" in this case.

Ciao,

[image: View Post]spud786, on 09 January 2011 - 01:51 PM, said:

When I look at electrical amongst all brands , including Harley.

They all are about the same of the top brands, if you get more than 50,000 mile out of a stator, thats above average for any brand.



Soooooooo, for the average bloke who owns a 6th gen --or any other gen maybe--, what this implies is that when we get to about 50,000miles we should just replace the stator and r/r just as preventive maintenance, right? Would you say that this would dramatically improves our chances of never having an electrical problem? Or would the old wiring/connections still overheat and give us headaches?

Christian

i only made it 18k. my stator tested 3vac, 8vac & 16vac on the "good" phase lol. it looked like a burnt marshmellow when i pulled it out. i was scared into replacing the rr and stator at the same time(threw on a vfrness too) for fear that a bad rr could kill a new stator. i wonder if ive got a perfectly fine rr sittin in my tool box now? lol oh well. hopefully i dont gotta worry about this again for a while...

The vfr is typically a post 50,000 mile stator, the cost and hassle tend to be a( replace on failure type item), cause you can go longer than that. There's no sure thing with stators, they are a pretty weak, high failure item on a bike. Some bikes are lucky to see much more than 20,000 mile, some fail at 10,000 mile. The VFR stators are really one of the more reliable stators.

Interesting to note, on my vfr stator falure at 56,000 mile, normaly the floating voltage level on a ride is 14.5 to 14,8 . For the 2 weeks prior , the voltage sat much of the time at the lowend end of that scale around 14.2 v way too much, I never saw above 14,5 which was odd comparison as to normal. I noted that, but the voltage read was still in spec. But that was my intial notice there was an abnormality going on . I see than again, I wont wait 2 weeks and die in the middle of the road. The day it died, I left the driveway, with a read of 14.7 volt, somehere in the next 30 milutes, the stator completely died. So its not simple to catch, till it actually goes. My Radar detector squealed low voltage, i was having a grand ole time, and didnt even notice the failed charging system when it went out. Some bikes will ride a full day with failed stator, the vfr uses to much electrical and will kill a battery charge, very quick.

[image: View Post]spud786, on 10 January 2011 - 11:22 PM, said:

The vfr is typically a post 50,000 mile stator, the cost and hassle tend to be a( replace on failure type item), cause you can go longer than that. There's no sure thing with stators, they are a pretty weak, high failure item on a bike. Some bikes are lucky to see much more than 20,000 mile, some fail at 10,000 mile. The VFR stators are really one of the more reliable stators.

Interesting to note, on my vfr stator falure at 56,000 mile, normaly the floating voltage level on a ride is 14.5 to 14,8 . For the 2 weeks prior , the voltage sat much of the time at the lowend end of that scale around 14.2 v way too much, I never saw above 14,5 which was odd comparison as to normal. I noted that, but the voltage read was still in spec. But that was my intial notice there was an abnormality going on . I see than again, I wont wait 2 weeks and die in the middle of the road. The day it died, I left the driveway, with a read of 14.7 volt, somehere in the next 30 milutes, the stator completely died. So its not simple to catch, till it actually goes. My Radar detector squealed low voltage, i was having a grand ole time, and didnt even notice the failed charging system when it went out. Some bikes will ride a full day with failed stator, the vfr uses to much electrical and will kill a battery charge, very quick.


I understand that this stator may fail pretty much anytime, right? This is making me want to carry a spare stator with me all the time on long trips, just so that I'm not stranded in the middle of nowhere with a dealership having to order one and wait for it to get there within 7 days or so... Pretty heavy extra luggage though, right?
C
Thanks for this thread though. Very informative.

Having a spare stator would add about 3-4 pounds to your luggage...and isn't really replaceable on the side of the road unless you also have the tool to remove the flywheel...but I suppose both might be doable.

Waiting 7 days is insane...One can always be overnighted to you unless you are in outback somewhere.