1st new set of tires

Leave it to Honda to make removing the rear wheel, from a single sided swing-arm, difficult! :laughing6-hehe:lol

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Took me longer than I expected given I had to figure out how to get the rear wheel off. Turns out, I had to not only disconnect the Akro exhaust, but remove the right side, rear-cowl and unbolt the flapper valve servo so the exhaust could be moved out of the way.

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Then, of course, it's easy!

Mileage on the new VFR is at a lovely:
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...and I think she was definitely due
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Showing typical, left-favoring wear.

The front wasn't quite as worn, but for sure is close to end of life and worn to a nice "V" profile.
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I want to experience the Pilot 2ct as a set anyway, so I've changed both.

Off with the old
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And on with the new
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Isn't that pretty?
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Strangely, there were no weights on the rear wheel at all. ...and it ended up not needing any either.
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Time for the front:
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Despite moving the tire around to different locations on the wheel, I was never able to get it to naturally balance, so some weight needed to be added.
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All done (and only 1:30am ...should have started a bit earlier than 11pm, and it took a while to figure out removing the rear-wheel / exhaust bit).
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Boring to most, but I LOVE this bike and on my commute via Mulholland this am she handled great, even taking it easy for scrub-in. :fing02:

You mean you don't know about the quick disconnect so you don't have to take all that stuff :pinocchio: off ?

I like these post, not boring to me...... Thx.

Putting a Pilot power rear on a 700'lb bike, bad choice IMO Way too flimsy of tire for that.

[image: View Post]spud786, on 31 March 2011 - 05:50 PM, said:

Putting a Pilot power rear on a 700'lb bike, bad choice IMO Way too flimsy of tire for that.


I agree, it should be interesting to see how long it lasts?? Keep us posted. :fing02:

600lb not 700lb bike

[image: View Post]Alang, on 31 March 2011 - 06:34 PM, said:

600lb not 700lb bike


591 full of fluids and fuel... with that exhaust probably 585. Or about 35lbs more than a VFR800ABS. I think he'll be ok. ;)

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 06:04 PM, said:

[image: View Post]spud786, on 31 March 2011 - 05:50 PM, said:

Putting a Pilot power rear on a 700'lb bike, bad choice IMO Way too flimsy of tire for that.


I agree, it should be interesting to see how long it lasts?? Keep us posted. :fing02:



More so than wear, its too flimsy of tire support wise, that handling trait should really show up on the heavier 1200, if not new, especially, once it gets some wear on it.

[image: View Post]phobe, on 31 March 2011 - 06:57 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Alang, on 31 March 2011 - 06:34 PM, said:

600lb not 700lb bike


591 full of fluids and fuel... with that exhaust probably 585. Or about 35lbs more than a VFR800ABS. I think he'll be ok. ;)


your right

I yeild to the truth>G< after the PPower is done, which shouldnt take long, go to road two, and you'll say damn, this feels so good right out of the gate. MY vfr 800 abs is heavy enough to make the rear ppower quiver at times, chop the trhottle in a 100 mph sweeper and you dent the rim, for lack of sidewall support , but they do have good traction, I went back to a Road 2, and the rear end felt so much better right out of the gate, and its not traction wise, its the supprtiveness of the tire.

Which I suspect will show up even more on the heavier 1200.

[image: View Post]spud786, on 31 March 2011 - 06:58 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 06:04 PM, said:

[image: View Post]spud786, on 31 March 2011 - 05:50 PM, said:

Putting a Pilot power rear on a 700'lb bike, bad choice IMO Way too flimsy of tire for that.


I agree, it should be interesting to see how long it lasts?? Keep us posted. :fing02:



More so than wear, its too flimsy of tire support wise, that handling trait should really show up on the heavier 1200, if not new, especially, once it gets some wear on it.



Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:


Never run any of the Michelins, so it's all an experiment to me. Not too worried about the strength of the tire, I'll be lucky to get 1500 miles out of it probably. Next will be the Pilot Roads. ...I just wish Avon made the Azaro in a 190 (still tempted to try the 180 on this bike, but that's at least two sets away).

Heading out from the office soon to tear around the Santa Monica Mountains before heading home. ...we'll see how they do. :)

[image: View Post]ZenMoto, on 31 March 2011 - 07:18 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:


Never run any of the Michelins, so it's all an experiment to me. Not too worried about the strength of the tire, I'll be lucky to get 1500 miles out of it probably. Next will be the Pilot Roads. ...I just wish Avon made the Azaro in a 190 (still tempted to try the 180 on this bike, but that's at least two sets away).

Heading out from the office soon to tear around the Santa Monica Mountains before heading home. ...we'll see how they do. :)


Looks like you've got a No-Mar.....smart man! :fing02: Looks like a Pro model?? if so, I'm jealous! :biggrin:

ZenMoto,

Don't you have the factory service manual? It details exactly how to remove the rear wheel. If not, I can sell you one (very slightly used) real cheap, plus shipping.

Thanks,
anbark22

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:30 PM, said:

Looks like you've got a No-Mar.....smart man! :fing02: Looks like a Pro model?? if so, I'm jealous! :biggrin:


Yep, the older version of the No-Mar Pro. I have a mechanic buddy that retired and I bought out a bunch of his stuff (tools, boxes, lift, balancing stand and the mother of all ...that tire machine. Now I will never have to go to a shop, for anything!!! :fing02:

Anbark, I have the manual, but I like doing it the hard way. :) I really should read it and see if there's an easier way (probably), but I like taking things apart! :goofy:

Congrats, looks good! :fing02:

The Pilot Power is a great tires, but IMO the PP2ct REAR is a complete Waste of money! Hope The 1200's torque and a little extra weight doesn't generate enough heat to cause the problem with PP2ct's seen at the track, they get too hot and turn greasy when run Hard! :blink:

Standard PP on the rear is a much better choice next time and as mentioned the PRoad2ct would be a great tire on that bike! :beer:

Being a Michelin man myself, I have to say those tires look great. :cool:
Two sets of PP2ct tires lasted a little more than 4000 miles each pair on my 01 Blackbird, so I went to PR2 which then lasted 8000+ miles each pair {x 2} until the next set that were damn near still new when I sold her to make room for the VFR1200F.

My new front PR3 got here yesterday and I am still waiting on the rear from backorder but, I will be installing them ASAP because the original Bridgestones suck and wore out in less than 4300 miles.
I got great prices for my Michelin Pilot Road 3 tires and I could not resist the deal, I just wish they both would have gotten here already because I ordered them 3 weeks ago.
Check out the front PR3 tire if you like, it is next to my 6000+ miles PR2 on my 79 CBX.
http://i34.photobuck...er/IMAG0182.jpg

[image: View Post]spud786, on 31 March 2011 - 07:09 PM, said:

[image: View Post]phobe, on 31 March 2011 - 06:57 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Alang, on 31 March 2011 - 06:34 PM, said:

600lb not 700lb bike


591 full of fluids and fuel... with that exhaust probably 585. Or about 35lbs more than a VFR800ABS. I think he'll be ok. ;)


your right

I yeild to the truth>G< after the PPower is done, which shouldnt take long, go to road two, and you'll say damn, this feels so good right out of the gate. MY vfr 800 abs is heavy enough to make the rear ppower quiver at times, chop the trhottle in a 100 mph sweeper and you dent the rim, for lack of sidewall support , but they do have good traction, I went back to a Road 2, and the rear end felt so much better right out of the gate, and its not traction wise, its the supprtiveness of the tire.

Which I suspect will show up even more on the heavier 1200.

If what you say is true, why then does Michelin list the pp2ct as a recommended tire for the VFR1200 on their website? This would be a serious liability to them if the tire behaves as you described. My guess is that you are under inflating the tires which causes the problem. I run pp2ct and so far have 4K miles on them, will replace at around 4.5K, but I've not experienced what you've described. I keep the tire pressure at 40+ psi in the rear, 36 psi in front as recommended. No problems.

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:


"Flimsy"??

Come on, that's bollocks. As long as the Weight rating on the tyre matches the manufacturer recommendations the tyre will behave as designed. Michelin have a 75W tyre available, so why wouldn't you use it?

Unfortunately in the case of the PP2, it won't last long, because hey it's a freakin' sport tyre. Nothing to do with it being "flimsy".

You rode those Dunnies pretty hard, harder then I have been riding the big 12 anyway on my veefalo. Still a little gun shy ever since my run in with that dude in Tennesse that ran me off the road. I just dont push it no more, I havent found that rythm yet but I connected a few times in Boise and in Oregon last summer. I am a Michelin man too - I like the road 2's on her they handle much better and have had NO slips at all, 6k on those tires, the OEM dunlops did not last half that! Though I rode up a local pass a few weeks ago with all winter off some 4 months off the bike and it felt fantastic, zipping around cars in the narrow mountain pass. I think I may have shaken that nagging residual fear finally.

[image: View Post]kaldek, on 03 April 2011 - 05:34 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:


"Flimsy"??

Come on, that's bollocks. As long as the Weight rating on the tyre matches the manufacturer recommendations the tyre will behave as designed. Michelin have a 75W tyre available, so why wouldn't you use it?

Unfortunately in the case of the PP2, it won't last long, because hey it's a freakin' sport tyre. Nothing to do with it being "flimsy".


Agreed - the PP2 is rated for it, dont know how long they will last but I think they will rival the Dunlops! I always got at least 3k out of powers on the old girl, the Veefalo is not as hard on tires as you would think it would be with all that torque.

If what you say is true, why then does Michelin list the pp2ct as a recommended tire for the VFR1200 on their website?))))))))))

_______________


I dont like all mich tires, i do some of them, what they advertise is meaningless. MOst males are Numb to handling , feel and fineese. I have the touch of a Woman! :fing02:

Really though Im exclusive to PPower fronts on the VFR, have been for years, but the rears, arent as supportive weight wise as a Road 2 which i dont really like either, but they last long and offer decent traction, and feels better than the more flimsy power rear. The power rear does offer more traction, its just has flimsy waffle at times and thudding via lack of rim support with heavier bikes. A power rear, that carries the heavier carcass OEM slated for particular heavier bikes, might be better than the standard Ppower, I assume they exist.

You run lower pressure than i do FYI , under inflation is not in the picture.

Well, I have about 250 canyon miles on the PP2cts now. ...no issues whatsoever (and we don't exactly have "smooth" pavement here). Very grippy tires, and I've been able to throw the V12 into turns pretty hard with no drama at all. She's still a bit heavier than my 4th & 5th gen Viffers, but she also tracks better leaned over than either of them did.

When I get the money to have the suspension done right, this thing will be an absolute beast. :)

[image: View Post]ZenMoto, on 03 April 2011 - 08:23 PM, said:

When I get the money to have the suspension done right, this thing will be an absolute beast. :)

I second that motion. Lindemann+Penske+proper springs is the real deal :fing02:

Solomoto, on 03 April 2011 - 09:26 PM, said:

I second that motion. Lindemann+Penske+proper springs is the real deal :fing02:


Amen. I actually have a Penske sitting on a shelf here, just need to confirm it will fit the new Viffer (it was on my 5th gen briefly) but definitely needs a re-valve (hence the "briefly" bit. lol

That part is actually affordable, it's the forks that are going to cost a small fortune! ...and, of course, that's the end that needs the most help IMHO :pissed:

kaldek, on 03 April 2011 - 05:34 PM, said:

Luvmyvfr, on 31 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Yup they are flimsy, If you've ever mounted one on a hot day, you can almost do them with your fingers :goofy:


"Flimsy"??

Come on, that's bollocks. As long as the Weight rating on the tyre matches the manufacturer recommendations the tyre will behave as designed. Michelin have a 75W tyre available, so why wouldn't you use it?

Unfortunately in the case of the PP2, it won't last long, because hey it's a freakin' sport tyre. Nothing to do with it being "flimsy".



I didn't say that they would not work, I just said that the sidewalls are incredible flimsy.....and on a hot day, I can almost remove/reinstall them with out any tools. :biggrin:

I 've had over 50 sets of tires on my bike (my 04 alone) and like the pp 2ct's, but they don't last very long. I've also changed tires1-2 times a week for the last couple of years for others and have seen lots of other brands, and I'm just saying that they have the least amount of sidewall strength I've ever seen :fing02:

As for manufacturers always knowing best. I still remember when Dunlop really screwed up on the D207s when they built the 170 rear tires too wide (They were defnihtely 180+mm wide and not 170) for 5 inch rims and they still went ahead and specified it for the 4th gens. I went through hell with that wider rear tire with their tippy unpredictable handling because of the pinch tires and the steep edge profiles that resulted from it.
It was so bad that Dunlop was forced to reissue a narrower version of the tire for the 4th gen VFR's 5 inch rim. I should have returned the tire after they issued the new one and ask for a free exchange.

Beck
95 VFR

Beck, on 04 April 2011 - 11:41 AM, said:

As for manufacturers always knowing best. I still remember when Dunlop really screwed up on the D207s when they built the 170 rear tires too wide (They were defnihtely 180+mm wide and not 170) for 5 inch rims and they still went ahead and specified it for the 4th gens. I went through hell with that wider rear tire with their tippy unpredictable handling because of the pinch tires and the steep edge profiles that resulted from it.
It was so bad that Dunlop was forced to reissue a narrower version of the tire for the 4th gen VFR's 5 inch rim. I should have returned the tire after they issued the new one and ask for a free exchange.

Beck
95 VFR

"Always" is a rather absolute statement. No, not "always" best or right as any company knows, mistakes happen. But between a manufacturer with decades of experience and millions of product in the market, and some goofy internet forum hearsay, I'll choose the expertise of the company every time.

I'll reiterate, that I have 250 canyon miles on these tires on the V12 now, and if you look at the OEMs I pulled off, you'll get an idea of how hard I push tires. ...these haven't exhibited any weirdness at all, just fantastic grip and great handling.

...still have no idea how well they'll wear, but I'm pretty sure they'll be long off the bike before the consistently hot weather hits SoCal. :biggrin:

They did mount very easily; in fact, the front beads seated at about 14psi. But fully aired up (only running 38 rear 36 front) they offer a very planted feeling!

That's a tad bit low from the manual specs. How big is your center (straight cruise) footprint? If it's bigger than 1/3rd, maybe you should air up a little more.

[image: View Post]Solomoto, on 04 April 2011 - 12:31 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Beck, on 04 April 2011 - 11:41 AM, said:

As for manufacturers always knowing best. I still remember when Dunlop really screwed up on the D207s when they built the 170 rear tires too wide (They were defnihtely 180+mm wide and not 170) for 5 inch rims and they still went ahead and specified it for the 4th gens. I went through hell with that wider rear tire with their tippy unpredictable handling because of the pinch tires and the steep edge profiles that resulted from it.
It was so bad that Dunlop was forced to reissue a narrower version of the tire for the 4th gen VFR's 5 inch rim. I should have returned the tire after they issued the new one and ask for a free exchange.

Beck
95 VFR

"Always" is a rather absolute statement. No, not "always" best or right as any company knows, mistakes happen. But between a manufacturer with decades of experience and millions of product in the market, and some goofy internet forum hearsay, I'll choose the expertise of the company every time.


Well no, never trust the manufactures on expectation, they no Jack in real time , especially the test reviews , need to be taken with a grain of salt. You have to read between the lines in many cases for accuracy. The Truth, I was talking about was the 7th gen was 600lb versus 700lb, still heavy. once the flimsy PPower rear gets to half life, the weirdness will escalate. Like I said,if the guy road 2's the rear after the power, he'll say damn, much better. It offers more support.

THe Power rears have good traction and dont slip, but when the side wall, fails at 100 mph sweeper and you think a flat tire has happened, thats equals suck a$$> :fing02:
Sure if tracking the tire, go original ppower rear, but for street the Proad 2 rear is Far far better performance wise and longevity. you'll go through 3 Ppowers to one Road 2. and the perfomance is nearly the same. You really have to be hammering wet conditions to notice the Ppower increased traction level over the road 2.

[image: View Post]spud786, on 10 April 2011 - 01:14 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Solomoto, on 04 April 2011 - 12:31 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Beck, on 04 April 2011 - 11:41 AM, said:

As for manufacturers always knowing best. I still remember when Dunlop really screwed up on the D207s when they built the 170 rear tires too wide (They were defnihtely 180+mm wide and not 170) for 5 inch rims and they still went ahead and specified it for the 4th gens. I went through hell with that wider rear tire with their tippy unpredictable handling because of the pinch tires and the steep edge profiles that resulted from it.
It was so bad that Dunlop was forced to reissue a narrower version of the tire for the 4th gen VFR's 5 inch rim. I should have returned the tire after they issued the new one and ask for a free exchange.

Beck
95 VFR

"Always" is a rather absolute statement. No, not "always" best or right as any company knows, mistakes happen. But between a manufacturer with decades of experience and millions of product in the market, and some goofy internet forum hearsay, I'll choose the expertise of the company every time.


Well no, never trust the manufactures on expectation, they no Jack in real time , especially the test reviews , need to be taken with a grain of salt. You have to read between the lines in many cases for accuracy. The Truth, I was talking about was the 7th gen was 600lb versus 700lb, still heavy. once the flimsy PPower rear gets to half life, the weirdness will escalate. Like I said,if the guy road 2's the rear after the power, he'll say damn, much better. It offers more support.

THe Power rears have good traction and dont slip, but when the side wall, fails at 100 mph sweeper and you think a flat tire has happened, thats equals suck a$$> :fing02:
Sure if tracking the tire, go original ppower rear, but for street the Proad 2 rear is Far far better performance wise and longevity. you'll go through 3 Ppowers to one Road 2. and the perfomance is nearly the same. You really have to be hammering wet conditions to notice the Ppower increased traction level over the road 2.


Spoken like a person with decades of tire design and testing expertise. I'll be sure to consult your vast technical tire knowledge next time my tires start acting weird. :laughing6-hehe:

That view was from actual Road time and history, Versus just believing in the Marketing headlines as your suggesting. You seem Nieve to my bottom line results.


The Public is Mostly SHEEP!

That's a horrible commute you got there, Zen.
Every time I've been there during the week, it's a traffic choked nightmare. :pinocchio:

Err, I mean, Damn near had the roads to myself. :biggrin:

Nice work and I Like that Elsinores in theback ground, use to have one just like it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[image: View Post]VFR4Lee, on 10 April 2011 - 07:37 PM, said:

That's a horrible commute you got there, Zen.
Every time I've been there during the week, it's a traffic choked nightmare. :pinocchio:

Err, I mean, Damn near had the roads to myself. :biggrin:


Yeah, the SMMs suck, nobody should come here to ride ...ever! :pinocchio:

The Elsinore was my father in-law's, he bought it new in '78 and blew the motor in Baja in '08. ...he just dropped it off with the title, paperwork, manual, etc. and said "It's your problem now!" :biggrin:

[image: View Post]ZenMoto, on 10 April 2011 - 10:17 PM, said:

[image: View Post]VFR4Lee, on 10 April 2011 - 07:37 PM, said:

That's a horrible commute you got there, Zen.
Every time I've been there during the week, it's a traffic choked nightmare. :pinocchio:

Err, I mean, Damn near had the roads to myself. :biggrin:


Yeah, the SMMs suck, nobody should come here to ride ...ever! :pinocchio:
The SMM canyons are a great place to ride during the week while everyone else is at work but, I went up there today after installng my new tire in Reseda at my old boss's motorcycle shop, I only saw one sheriff and he was going the other way on Mulholland.
There was a boatload of squids using the Snake as a personal race track today, that takes a lot of my fun out of the road but, when they tuck that front tire, it is a totally different and thrilling ball game.

I mounted up the new front PR3 on my 1200F today and when the rear gets off of backorder {April 30th I was told today}, it will be mounted immediately.
[image: Posted Image]
Normally I would not mix tire brands on my motorcycles but, backorder issues and an immediate need for a front tire forced my hand.
The bike flows into the turns now with the new PR3 front tire unlike the dive into the turns she did with the OEM BT021.

I got 4850 miles out of the front OEM BT021 and still going on the original rear not quite touching the wear bars yet.
The OEM front tire was thoroughly done, she let me know with the vibrations at speed and the following of lines in the road.

It will be interesting to see how the PR3's stand up to mileage...I'm looking forward to your reviews when you get the rear on...

[image: View Post]2thdr, on 16 April 2011 - 09:26 PM, said:

It will be interesting to see how the PR3's stand up to mileage...I'm looking forward to your reviews when you get the rear on...

My old boss does not put anything on it when I buy any kind of new motorcycle parts through him, so my purchase price makes it well worth it and I do the labor while I watch his shop for him during his excusions. Big benefit to staying good friends with the guy that taught me most of what I know about being a motorcycle mechanic.
From what I read about the PR3, it is the same make up compound as the PR2 with different tread patterns.
16 months with 6500 miles+ on my 600+lb CBX's PR2 tires and still going perfectly according to my expectations for tread life and grip, we'll see how the PR3s stand up over the next year's worth of riding on my VFR. :cool:

[image: View Post]fasterspider, on 16 April 2011 - 09:15 PM, said:

I mounted up the new front PR3 on my 1200F today and when the rear gets off of backorder {April 30th I was told today}, it will be mounted immediately.
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Finally after a month of waiting, my rear PR3 got here and I mounted her up today then took her for the break in ride.
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I get good feedback from these tires compared to OEM 021s, it is a smooth transition flowing into the turns now.
I will fully gear up in leathers mid-week takinig her to the canyons to see how well these PR3 tires hold on Los Florez, Piuma, Stunt, Mulholland and Latigo.
Today she handled Mulholland Hwy's "the Snake" well, and I felt very comfortable tossing her into the turns even though I did not ride her aggressively because I was not fully geared up only wearing my work jeans and my old & sun faded Honda textile jacket but, it felt good just the same and I have confidence in these Michelins unlike the Bridgestones that came with the bike.
The rear tire price knocked me for a loop when I had to pay for it today :ohmy: , I can't believe they charge as much as they do to the average joe buying tires. I am glad I only have to pay cost and sticker shock still has me by the huevos.
I installed it, so I don't have to pay to have my tires mounted & balanced. PITA removing the friggin muffler to get the wheel off but, I still got it done in short order.
Each job I do on my VFR makes the next time even simpler, it just looks complicated until you actually get in there & get the hands dirty. Then everything just falls apart as you remove fasteners or it falls together again when you are done.
The bike is visually intimidating to work on at 1st but, it is really no different than working on an old school Honda like I am used to working on.
Had fun and now my bike has the best tires available at any price.

Removing the muffler is not necessary, just loosen the bottom clamp enough to let it sag to allow the upper bracket to clear the foot peg, then swing it out of the way. Of course you need to unhook the cable from the servo first.

[image: View Post]Solomoto, on 30 April 2011 - 07:15 PM, said:

Removing the muffler is not necessary, just loosen the bottom clamp enough to let it sag to allow the upper bracket to clear the foot peg, then swing it out of the way. Of course you need to unhook the cable from the servo first.

Yeah, I figured that out after I was done. :ohmy: .
I know better for the next time she needs sneakers which hopefully won't be for 8000-9000 miles.

The flap cable is already dis-connected from the servo, I just had to remove the 14mm nut.

The job was not that bad looking back at it and I was finished in plenty of time to go eat my lunch on Mulholland Hwy after scrubbing off the tires for 55 miles.

That is the ugliest muffler I have ever seen on a motorcycle underneath that shiny, polished stainless steel shield.
The strange thing is, I like that big contraption Honda deemed nessesary to keep her quiet.