Powercommander for VFR1200f

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

[image: P1030317.JPG]

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

I contacted Powercommander last week. They told me they were working through proprietary discussions with Honda on the development of the connectors and were in the process of developing the unit. He estimated 6 months or so before it will be available.

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

I contacted Powercommander last week. They told me they were working through proprietary discussions with Honda on the development of the connectors and were in the process of developing the unit. He estimated 6 months or so before it will be available.

Thanks for the information :)

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

Is there an issue to be addressed by PC?
What gives?

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

And hopefully we can get rid off the speedlimiter.

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

And hopefully we can get rid off the speedlimiter.

Hey ya, that would be really cool :biggrin:

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

And hopefully we can get rid off the speedlimiter.

I remember when the Aprilia Milles came out and you could get your dealer to install a new chip that upped the performance same as the European versions had. It's just a matter of time before the potential of the 1200 is fully uncorked. Aftermarket can, K&N, unrestricted electronics. It'll be fun to hear the reports as they come in.

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

My thoughts exactly.

I hope they come up with a solution for throttle mapping so we can get the damn butterflys to open in the first 2 gears.

I don't know what this "first two gears" thing is all about. My 12 goes like stink in 1st and 2nd

Mine to and 3rd and 4th also.

Mine to and 3rd and 4th also.
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5th and 6th are proving to be no slouch on mine as well

:cool: especialy compaired to the VFR800 :+1:

Don't hold your breath. Aprilia RSV4 owners are still waiting on Dynojet's PC V, more than 18 months since that bike's first introduction. BPD has since stepped up to the plate with their all-in-one fuelling, quickshifter and traction control controller, with on-the-fly adjustments via two switches mounted on the handlebar: [image: Posted Image] [image: Posted Image]

http://www.bazzaz.ne...;Itemid=181

:cool: especialy compaired to the VFR800 :biggrin:

Any trouble with your cam chains yet? :huh:

:dry: especialy compaired to the VFR800 :blush:

Any trouble with your cam chains yet? :dry:

Gotta love these comments from people who don't own a 12. "Owned", yea, more like "don't own"

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

How does your VFR run with the AK pipe and stock EFI? That's the pipe I'm thinking about getting. Any installation issues? Thanks. Ride safe.

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

How does your VFR run with the AK pipe and stock EFI? That's the pipe I'm thinking about getting. Any installation issues? Thanks. Ride safe.

Installation is simple. Akra supplies very good instruction documentation. Quality is very good The exhausts fits very easy. Riding is much smoother. Espesialy in the 3000 -4000 rpm region. ( baffle out )
Please also check http://www.akrapovic...-on-021200582f/

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

Talked to DynoJet sales rep in the US and he states that they have a new VFR in the back room but no date for release as yet. I called Fuel Moto, a big Power Commander reseller, who states that DynoJet tells them that is is scheduled for release on July 16th. Hope that is true but won't hold my breath!

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

Talked to DynoJet sales rep in the US and he states that they have a new VFR in the back room but no date for release as yet. I called Fuel Moto, a big Power Commander reseller, who states that DynoJet tells them that is is scheduled for release on July 16th. Hope that is true but won't hold my breath!

Looks like some vendors are selling the PC-V for the 1200 online now. I've contacted one of the vendors to see if they are just taking pre-orders, with no real delivery date in sight.
They said they are in fact pre-orders, but they are expecting units on their shelves by the end of the month! :fing02:

EDIT: Still no PCV in sight. Apparently Fuel Moto was blowing smoke up my ass when they told me they were in the mail.

Did the AK fit directly to the end of the header pipe? Did the hardware/fasteners come with from AK? Did the stock flapper cable attach?

How is the sound? Performance?

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

Did the AK fit directly to the end of the header pipe? Did the hardware/fasteners come with from AK? Did the stock flapper cable attach?

How is the sound? Performance?

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

Yes the Akra fitted very easy on the stock header pipe. All fitting stuff is with tthe akra. Sound is on the loud side when db killer is removed. With the db killer fitted the sound is OK.
Performance increase is best notticed when db killer is removed. The torque dip between 3000 and 4 K rpm is gone. But also acceleration in the higher rpm zone is smoother.
With the db killer present the torque low down is still better then stock but the dip is still there but smaller.

For fitting details please check http://www.akrapovic...00f_10_so_t.pdf

I've been in contact with DynoJet as well, offered them my bike for R&D if needed...

I was told that the sub-connector for the VFR1200's throttle bodies is new and apparently proprietary to Honda. Until they figure out how they're gonna deal with it, things aren't progressing very quickly. I would guess that Honda made some "new" bits for their Throttle-By-Wire system.

Did the AK fit directly to the end of the header pipe? Did the hardware/fasteners come with from AK? Did the stock flapper cable attach?

How is the sound? Performance?

I have a VFR1200f with a highmount Akrapovic applied. I want to have the fueling right. When is a powercommander available ?

Yes the Akra fitted very easy on the stock header pipe. All fitting stuff is with tthe akra. Sound is on the loud side when db killer is removed. With the db killer fitted the sound is OK.
Performance increase is best notticed when db killer is removed. The torque dip between 3000 and 4 K rpm is gone. But also acceleration in the higher rpm zone is smoother.
With the db killer present the torque low down is still better then stock but the dip is still there but smaller.

For fitting details please check http://www.akrapovic...00f_10_so_t.pdf

THANKS FOR THE INFO! MUCH APPRECIATED! Ride safe.

Hi, I was searching for VFR1200 gears from a local webshop here in Finland.

This popped up PC-V VFR1200
They didn't have any in stock but they had a price for it (385 Euros).

I tried to find more details with the code KNN-16-020 but could find anything.

-J-

I've been in contact with DynoJet as well, offered them my bike for R&D if needed...

Sorry guys; with my first post in here, I've got to inform you all that the coveted appointment with Powercommander would be me. :cool: I have a confirmed appointment for October 8th to drop it off. I contacted them back in March before it went off to Corbin for a lengthly stay.

Honda wouldn't release the rights to their plug, so Dynojet will have to dig deeper into the harness near the injectors to access the system. I have to bring them the original muffler along with the bike for a week's stay in Las Vegas.

After that, It goes to K&N. They are building air filters for our beasts.

[image: Posted Image]

I've been in contact with DynoJet as well, offered them my bike for R&D if needed...

Sorry guys; with my first post in here, I've got to inform you all that the coveted appointment with Powercommander would be me. :cool: I have a confirmed appointment for October 8th to drop it off. I contacted them back in March before it went off to Corbin for a lengthly stay.

Honda wouldn't release the rights to their plug, so Dynojet will have to dig deeper into the harness near the injectors to access the system. I have to bring them the original muffler along with the bike for a week's stay in Las Vegas.

After that, It goes to K&N. They are building air filters for our beasts.

[image: Posted Image]

Please keep us posted. Thanks in advance

Ask Dynojet if they can enable throttle position mapping

This will be my first bike with a Powercommander, so if you guys have suggestions for them, let me know now (like the throttle position mapping). I'm primarily an old-school carburetor person..

This will be my first bike with a Powercommander, so if you guys have suggestions for them, let me know now (like the throttle position mapping). I'm primarily an old-school carburetor person..

Please ask them to get rid of the speed limitation in 6th gear and power limititation in 1st and 2nd gear.

Just a question that someone might know the answer too, have they speed limited the VFR1200 more for a safety reason for the drive shaft. I know there are cages speed limited for this reason.

This bike bugs the shit out of me mainly because I want one but there are so many unknowns that are stopping me buying one. Unfortunately a test ride from a dealer doesn't answer my questions, like the limitation on power 1st & 2nd gear & how that might effect me & if those limitations can be removed if I do find it limiting, buy fitting a power commander or some other way. I have a problem that until I own a bike I can't ride it in anger which is why test rides tell me nothing, tight corners are my passion & there is nothing better that on exit using a fist full of throttle & using every bit of tyre grip available. I don't fit touring tyres I fit sports tyres as wear doesn't bother me, it's the price I pay for the buzz factor. For example my CBR1000RR is lighter & has 170hp on tap all the time so with a heavier bike with less hp being limited in 2nd which is a gear I would use allot in tight corners puzzles me the effect it would have. Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more.

The third gear roll on out of a corner on this bike is fantastic. Better than any other bike I have owned or ridden in that respect.

Just a question that someone might know the answer too, have they speed limited the VFR1200 more for a safety reason for the drive shaft. I know there are cages speed limited for this reason.

This bike bugs the shit out of me mainly because I want one but there are so many unknowns that are stopping me buying one. Unfortunately a test ride from a dealer doesn't answer my questions, like the limitation on power 1st & 2nd gear & how that might effect me & if those limitations can be removed if I do find it limiting, buy fitting a power commander or some other way. I have a problem that until I own a bike I can't ride it in anger which is why test rides tell me nothing, tight corners are my passion & there is nothing better that on exit using a fist full of throttle & using every bit of tyre grip available. I don't fit touring tyres I fit sports tyres as wear doesn't bother me, it's the price I pay for the buzz factor. For example my CBR1000RR is lighter & has 170hp on tap all the time so with a heavier bike with less hp being limited in 2nd which is a gear I would use allot in tight corners puzzles me the effect it would have. Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more.

Just a question that someone might know the answer too, have they speed limited the VFR1200 more for a safety reason for the drive shaft. I know there are cages speed limited for this reason.

This bike bugs the shit out of me mainly because I want one but there are so many unknowns that are stopping me buying one. Unfortunately a test ride from a dealer doesn't answer my questions, like the limitation on power 1st & 2nd gear & how that might effect me & if those limitations can be removed if I do find it limiting, buy fitting a power commander or some other way. I have a problem that until I own a bike I can't ride it in anger which is why test rides tell me nothing, tight corners are my passion & there is nothing better that on exit using a fist full of throttle & using every bit of tyre grip available. I don't fit touring tyres I fit sports tyres as wear doesn't bother me, it's the price I pay for the buzz factor. For example my CBR1000RR is lighter & has 170hp on tap all the time so with a heavier bike with less hp being limited in 2nd which is a gear I would use allot in tight corners puzzles me the effect it would have. Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more.

Even with the restriction, the VFR still has more torque at 4000RPM than the CBR1000 does at peak. ;) And at 6000RPM it's got about a 20hp advantage.

Just a question that someone might know the answer too, have they speed limited the VFR1200 more for a safety reason for the drive shaft. I know there are cages speed limited for this reason.

This bike bugs the shit out of me mainly because I want one but there are so many unknowns that are stopping me buying one. Unfortunately a test ride from a dealer doesn't answer my questions, like the limitation on power 1st & 2nd gear & how that might effect me & if those limitations can be removed if I do find it limiting, buy fitting a power commander or some other way. I have a problem that until I own a bike I can't ride it in anger which is why test rides tell me nothing, tight corners are my passion & there is nothing better that on exit using a fist full of throttle & using every bit of tyre grip available. I don't fit touring tyres I fit sports tyres as wear doesn't bother me, it's the price I pay for the buzz factor. For example my CBR1000RR is lighter & has 170hp on tap all the time so with a heavier bike with less hp being limited in 2nd which is a gear I would use allot in tight corners puzzles me the effect it would have. Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more.

I would say based on your description of your riding style that the VFR1200 is probably not the bike for you. While sporty and very competent, it can't compete with the balls out hp of a supersport liter bike, nor match it's ultimate handling due to it's weight. If your expectation is that it be like a CBR1000R in the twisties, you will be sorely disappointed. You already have the weapon of choice for your riding.

Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more. <<utter and absolute horseshit. sorry, just calling a spade a spade!

Anybody that owns a VFR1200 & has come off a gen 5/6 feel the VFR1200 has less drive out of corners in 2nd or more. <<utter and absolute horseshit. sorry, just calling a spade a spade!

Sorry I don't understand your reply, what is absolute horseshit? If you read my quote it is a question not a statement as I don't own a VFR1200 so have no idea but I did own before my CBR a VFR800VTEC for 5 years, it is probably my mistake for not including a ??????? after the sentence.

Solomoto: I understand your reply but as this is the internet you don't always add all the facts & only used the CBR as an example due to my current ride. Before the CBR I had a VFR800VTEC which I owned for 5 years & as far as cornering goes was as good as the CBR but in it's own way. Yes the CBR is a purpose built sportbike & is made to eat corners granted & the reason I bought it (maybe mid life crises) but as I mainly do major km trips these days & I'm not getting any younger it is becoming impractical.
Reason I wish to go back to a sports tourer, but having been corrupted by the extra hp of the CBR the only bike that I feel fills my needs is the VFR1200, if the need for extra hp wasn't a wish then I would happily go back to a VTEC.

So as my question above, how do people find the VFR1200 handling & drive out of tight corners compared to the GEN5&6? because my concern is mainly the limiting of 1st & 2nd power on the VFR1200.

My apologies...without the question mark it appeared to be another crap statement about the so called lack of power of the 1200 in the lower gears. I believe the performance numbers are 0-60 in 2.7 secs and 0-100 in 5.7 secs. It slingshots me out of the corners. The computer mapping in the lower gears is so overly exaggerated...you really just need to ride one to see. There is virtually nothing about this bike that is similar to the previous generations and I personally don't know why they kept it under the interceptor name. Completely different machine.

My apologies...without the question mark it appeared to be another crap statement about the so called lack of power of the 1200 in the lower gears. I believe the performance numbers are 0-60 in 2.7 secs and 0-100 in 5.7 secs. It slingshots me out of the corners. The computer mapping in the lower gears is so overly exaggerated...you really just need to ride one to see. There is virtually nothing about this bike that is similar to the previous generations and I personally don't know why they kept it under the interceptor name. Completely different machine.

Thank you for a owners input, I have had a test ride but as stated the limited use & not being my bike with a major $$ hit if shit happens I can't really tell if the limiting will have an effect that may bug me. I have looked at the figures but doesn't really relate to real world application so an owners input is worth much more. I understand it is very hard to compare to any other bike but the power delivery should have similar characteristics to the other gens due to motor configurations. What I liked most about the VTEC was the smooth constant rear wheel power that builds like it has no end, unlike an inline 4 which at a certain point becomes ballistic. My concern was with a heavy bike like the VFR1200 opening the throttle & not having expected motor response which in turn can have the feeling the bike just wants to fall over when your at an extreme lean angle in a slow corner. My example is I enjoy very tight corners & these on my VFR800 & the CBR are mostly second gear corners (they can be 1st gear on the CBR but things become to twitchy for road riding) & there isn't very much information on the effect if any the limiting of the VFR1200 1st & 2nd gear power may have in the real world.

My apologies...without the question mark it appeared to be another crap statement about the so called lack of power of the 1200 in the lower gears. I believe the performance numbers are 0-60 in 2.7 secs and 0-100 in 5.7 secs. It slingshots me out of the corners. The computer mapping in the lower gears is so overly exaggerated...you really just need to ride one to see. There is virtually nothing about this bike that is similar to the previous generations and I personally don't know why they kept it under the interceptor name. Completely different machine.

Thank you for a owners input, I have had a test ride but as stated the limited use & not being my bike with a major $$ hit if shit happens I can't really tell if the limiting will have an effect that may bug me. I have looked at the figures but doesn't really relate to real world application so an owners input is worth much more. I understand it is very hard to compare to any other bike but the power delivery should have similar characteristics to the other gens due to motor configurations. What I liked most about the VTEC was the smooth constant rear wheel power that builds like it has no end, unlike an inline 4 which at a certain point becomes ballistic. My concern was with a heavy bike like the VFR1200 opening the throttle & not having expected motor response which in turn can have the feeling the bike just wants to fall over when your at an extreme lean angle in a slow corner. My example is I enjoy very tight corners & these on my VFR800 & the CBR are mostly second gear corners (they can be 1st gear on the CBR but things become to twitchy for road riding) & there isn't very much information on the effect if any the limiting of the VFR1200 1st & 2nd gear power may have in the real world.

I can see where you're coming from now. I've posted in another thread about the 1st/2nd gear flat spot inherent in the VFR1200. The 2nd gear flat spot below about 5500 rpm is indeed very annoying when riding aggressively in the tight twisties which I do enjoy doing from time to time. With the DCT, I generally leave it in sport mode when riding the twisties so I can concentrate on the lines and braking, but when coming out of relatively tight corners, it puts the bike in 2nd gear and when I open the throttle at say 4000 rpm, the flat spot really makes itself known. Nothing happens until about 5500-6000 rpm then wham! it takes off. It creates a distinct disconnected sensation between the rider and bike. This is the one flaw in an otherwise stellar machine. The rest of the time when I'm riding a more moderate pace, the flat spot is not so much of an issue, mainly because I'm more likely to be in 3rd gear which doesn't have the flat spot and I'm just rolling on the throttle as opposed to snapping it open. I do hope Honda issues a software patch to address this issue.

Honda may not, but Powercommander will.. keep talking guys, Friday's coming. I'll print out this thread and take it with me.

As for driving hard out of corners, my riding is a little more sedate than that on the street.. :tour:

it sounds like this bike could benifit from a tre (timing retard eliminator). not for advancing timing, but just for tricking the bike into thinking that its always in say third fourth or fith gear .(which ever gear is not limited by the throttle possition). this is what they do on the busa's (which are limited by timing instead of throttle) to regain the power in the lower gears, as well as erase the top speed limit...
its a fairly simple and cheap mod.

it sounds like this bike could benifit from a tre (timing retard eliminator). not for advancing timing, but just for tricking the bike into thinking that its always in say third fourth or fith gear .(which ever gear is not limited by the throttle possition). this is what they do on the busa's (which are limited by timing instead of throttle) to regain the power in the lower gears, as well as erase the top speed limit...
its a fairly simple and cheap mod.

I sent an email to power commander about the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & there response wasn't conclusive on the way honda have gone about doing the limiting, my guess is fueling will have no effect so fitting a pc alone won't help the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & it is performed with the timing. What you have said makes sense but it would be nice to know exactly what Honda have done.

I found this dyno map that has a 2nd gear run over layed onto 3rd & 4th gear run, you can plainly see the dip & 20hp odd less power in 2nd gear.

[image: Posted Image]

it sounds like this bike could benifit from a tre (timing retard eliminator). not for advancing timing, but just for tricking the bike into thinking that its always in say third fourth or fith gear .(which ever gear is not limited by the throttle possition). this is what they do on the busa's (which are limited by timing instead of throttle) to regain the power in the lower gears, as well as erase the top speed limit...
its a fairly simple and cheap mod.

I sent an email to power commander about the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & there response wasn't conclusive on the way honda have gone about doing the limiting, my guess is fueling will have no effect so fitting a pc alone won't help the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & it is performed with the timing. What you have said makes sense but it would be nice to know exactly what Honda have done.

I found this dyno map that has a 2nd gear run over layed onto 3rd & 4th gear run, you can plainly see the dip & 20hp odd less power in 2nd gear.

[image: Posted Image]

yeah that dip doesnt look like fun...
funny this who time i thought the limiting was done with the throttle bodies, not just pulling back igniton timng.
well it makes sence, honda does it to the cbr1000rr and 600rr.
anyways if its timing its a simple fix that any of these companies can make for the vfr...
just look up :
dyno jet ignition module,
TRE
bazzaz z bomb.
all the tuning companes have solutions for this.
almost every suzuki bike has restricted timing.
and honda pulled almost 10 hp off the top of the new us model cbr1000rr to meet noise emissions:

http://www.motovatio...ct=article&id=6

http://www.bazzaz.ne...mart&Itemid=181

http://www.ivansperf...cts.com/tre.htm

..and honda pulled almost 10 hp off the top of the new us model cbr1000rr to meet noise emissions

Stay tuned for 2013 when all new model bikes must have OEM exhaust (that has the stamping). It's not going to be fun at all. Horsepower is going to go down again to meet decible restrictions..

Honda wouldn't release the rights to their plug,

Great way to sell bikes Honda - offering the aftermarket zero support? Anyway ,

I can't get my hands on the part i suspect needs modified. Fueling all works with a simple gear position signal to the ECU along with rpm count from the engine. Throttle grip to ECU and ECU to throttle bodies.

After tricking the gear position switch into sending the ECU a 3-4-5th gear signal , then will be best time to build a clean performance map . My guess is the servo is holding off opening the throttle blades in the lower gears based on gear position signal to the ECU which could be as easy as jumping two solder connectors or wires if it use's a rotary style switch. . There's chance of course that massive ignition retard is going on but i really doubt it considering how power is reported to kick in.. The engine does use a knock sensor as a FWIW. It pulls timing and the ECU could be managed to do same , dependent of what gear.

Can someone come up with the actual location of the gear change switch? Currently the parts fiche don't show great detail . Although i believe DynoJet has in the past offered their one version of a TRE , defeating top speed restriction does not seem the number 1 item to target to fix for right now.

I'll try my best to come up with actual photos of the gear position switch Suzuki uses which might make better sense.It's located behind the clutch basket. A TRE is no longer needed on the Hayabusa as example .Each gear had a separate fuel map and ran excessive fuel in the lower gears only to enable to obtain max ignition timing in 6th gear. The 1200F might be a bit simpler in that it will not have ram air compensation in the ECM fuel tables..

If the lower rpm HP neutering can be fixed, i will be riding a VFR1200F within weeks . It's the only bike i have been excited about in a good number of years.

Can an owner look at their bike and tell how many wires is coming off the gear switch here? This might just be the neutral switch is why i ask.


Parts Fiche

Can an owner look at their bike and tell how many wires is coming off the gear switch here? This might just be the neutral switch is why i ask.


Parts Fiche

On the scematic i can find a shift spindle angle sensor ( 3 wires: yellow/red pink and grey ) ( suzuki is calling the thing gear position sensor )
it is conneced to pin a32 p spdl on the ecu

Can an owner look at their bike and tell how many wires is coming off the gear switch here? This might just be the neutral switch is why i ask.


Parts Fiche

On the scematic i can find a shift spindle angle sensor ( 3 wires: yellow/red pink and grey ) ( suzuki is calling the thing gear position sensor )
it is conneced to pin a32 p spdl on the ecu

The shift spindle angle sensor sounded familiar so i googled. Perhaps that is used for the 1200FA model.

Honda uses it on Foremans, FourTrax ect .

My link

[/quote]

If the lower rpm HP neutering can be fixed, i will be riding a VFR1200F within weeks . It's the only bike i have been excited about in a good number of years.
[/quote]

It's really a minor issue in second, and if you ride with the revs over 4.5k you won't notice it.

I have a DCT which means it changes from 1st to 2nd pretty quickly (whether it's in S or D mode) but the way to get a quick getaway is to manually select 1st and flick the button to change up. Hey presto! Problem cured Posted Image

Prior to this fork in the road..:

I dropped the bike off @ Powercommander Friday. The tech is well aware of the info I relayed to him. Powercommander will do their best to see if the 2nd gear issue can be improved, but keep in mind that their product is an interface to the ECU, not a replacement for it.

And so the process begins.

Power Commander knows how to tackle ignition problems and add to their product list.

Honda performance part from Power Commander

..and this is a bad thing for our VFRs?

Such a wonderful bike. Now only if I had the room for one more

Can an owner look at their bike and tell how many wires is coming off the gear switch here? This might just be the neutral switch is why i ask.


Parts Fiche

Please look in this topic http://www.vfrdiscus...599#entry739599

i have posted the scemetics.

Good news:

I just spoke with Powercommander, they are finished with my bike. Between the Jardine exhaust and their interface box, there is 9 hp. more than stock. Jardine had said that their pipe dynoed @ +7 over stock alone.

The bike has not yet been to K&N for the filter treatment.

The bad news: Honda has not given permission for Powercommander to have access to the harness plug parts that would make this installation quick and easy (seat removal only). Instead, they had to tear deep into the bike to access the injector plugs (which apparently are the same as the GSXR). It was a major PITA, and not for the average "Joe". For those brave souls that wish to tackle the project, they will make all they have available for purchase. No price as yet (if ever). I told them I would certainly help with any Honda confrontation since Honda USA is about an hour's ride away from me.

For now, this is the one-and-only. Don't fall for any claims that someone has a Powercommander V for this bike at all, but it's not a dead issue yet.

No, I haven't ridden it yet, I have to go after it first.

Good news:

I just spoke with Powercommander, they are finished with my bike. Between the Jardine exhaust and their interface box, there is 9 hp. more than stock. Jardine had said that their pipe dynoed @ +7 over stock alone.

The bike has not yet been to K&N for the filter treatment.

The bad news: Honda has not given permission for Powercommander to have access to the harness plug parts that would make this installation quick and easy (seat removal only). Instead, they had to tear deep into the bike to access the injector plugs (which apparently are the same as the GSXR). It was a major PITA, and not for the average "Joe". For those brave souls that wish to tackle the project, they will make all they have available for purchase. No price as yet (if ever). I told them I would certainly help with any Honda confrontation since Honda USA is about an hour's ride away from me.

For now, this is the one-and-only. Don't fall for any claims that someone has a Powercommander V for this bike at all, but it's not a dead issue yet.

No, I haven't ridden it yet, I have to go after it first.

The injector plugs aren't too bad to get at. Take off the tank cover, take off the airbox... voila.

Will the PCV have an autotune that ties into the O2 sensors?

I'm assuming so, but I'll be getting more details from Chris when I pick it up.

They did ask permission to weld an O2 sensor bung into it for the dyno testing. It won't be visible outside the bodywork.

Now the wait is gonna kill me; I don't have a free weekday until the 25th.

I'm assuming so, but I'll be getting more details from Chris when I pick it up.

They did ask permission to weld an O2 sensor bung into it for the dyno testing. It won't be visible outside the bodywork.

Now the wait is gonna kill me; I don't have a free weekday until the 25th.

Any news from powercommander ? What are the bennefits from the PCV ?

I'm assuming so, but I'll be getting more details from Chris when I pick it up.

They did ask permission to weld an O2 sensor bung into it for the dyno testing. It won't be visible outside the bodywork.

Now the wait is gonna kill me; I don't have a free weekday until the 25th.

Any news from powercommander ? What are the bennefits from the PCV ?

From what I understand so far is that I'll have 9 more horsepower between it and the Jardine pipe. I won't know about mileage impact until I go for several runs after I get it back from Vegas this week. I'm sure there will be a penality for more horsepower.

I'm assuming so, but I'll be getting more details from Chris when I pick it up.

They did ask permission to weld an O2 sensor bung into it for the dyno testing. It won't be visible outside the bodywork.

Now the wait is gonna kill me; I don't have a free weekday until the 25th.

Any news from powercommander ? What are the bennefits from the PCV ?

From what I understand so far is that I'll have 9 more horsepower between it and the Jardine pipe. I won't know about mileage impact until I go for several runs after I get it back from Vegas this week. I'm sure there will be a penality for more horsepower.

Any news from powercommander ? How much HP did you gain ?

I have 9, just lke they said; two from the Commander, seven from the Jardine.

Idle has smoothed out and the flat spot seems to be gone. I won't know about mileage until my right wrist settles down for a long cruise. I jumped on the freeway yesterday and had to back out of 102! It's accelerating as fast as my old CBR1000RR. :fing02:

[image: Posted Image]

Congratulations on being the first to have a PC for this bike.

Can you tell me if you notice a difference in the 3k - 4k throttle performance? Is the "snatchy" throttle syndrome gone that drives me crazy in city driving?

Don

[image: View Post]MSGTR, on 26 October 2010 - 09:04 AM, said:

I have 9, just lke they said; two from the Commander, seven from the Jardine.

Idle has smoothed out and the flat spot seems to be gone. I won't know about mileage until my right wrist settles down for a long cruise. I jumped on the freeway yesterday and had to back out of 102! It's accelerating as fast as my old CBR1000RR. :fing02:

[image: Posted Image]

Don't know about the snatchy throttle yet, gotta have some traffic first..

I rode it from Elsinore to Carlsbad via the 15 / 76 / College Blvd. The return trip was about the same (with a side trip).

Update:

I topped off last week before coming home from work (San Diego to Lake Elsinore) via I-15 in 5 pm traffic. With some street riding to get out of Point Loma, some slow sections and lane splitting, and fast sections on the freeway (honestly, I kept the speed down), I topped it off again at my destination.

44 mpg over an 80 mile trip with a Power Commander and a Jardine pipe! :cheerleader:

thats awesome milage. glad to hear it didnt go down at all with the pc. did it wind up eliminating the 1st and second gear restrictions? or the topspeed limiter? thanks

[image: View Post]CandyRedRC46, on 10 November 2010 - 12:28 AM, said:

thats awesome milage. glad to hear it didnt go down at all with the pc. did it wind up eliminating the 1st and second gear restrictions? or the topspeed limiter? thanks


No it did not. Only modify the fueling.

.. and I'm not that crazy or even the slightest bit brave in trying to find out.. I like all my body parts right where they are and in good working order.

It pulls strong and hard, just like my 06 CBR1000 RR, but I'll not turn it loose on the street.

Maybe someday when I take it to a track.

Like Dutchy said, just the fuel mapping.

these guys have mastered the art of de-restricting the factory ecu's limitations. maybe theyll crack the vfr1200's ecu one day...

http://www.jetttuning.com/ecunleashed_

the 2009 and up US model r1's have a throttle by wire limitation that closes the throttles to 80% at about ten grand and up. effectively cutting the euro model's 160 rwhp to the us model's 145 rwhp.

If that was the case, buying a Euro-ECU would be the easiest solution: plug-n-play.

yeah its not that easy as the euro models come with sercurity systems... (think HISS) and the euro computers wont agree with the american ignitions and keys.

[image: View Post]MSGTR, on 26 October 2010 - 09:04 AM, said:

I have 9, just lke they said; two from the Commander, seven from the Jardine.

Idle has smoothed out and the flat spot seems to be gone. I won't know about mileage until my right wrist settles down for a long cruise. I jumped on the freeway yesterday and had to back out of 102! It's accelerating as fast as my old CBR1000RR. :fing02:



I don't in particular need the map but if you have the PC-V software on a lap top computer " to take to the bike" and can pull the existing map out of the unit and email it to me ---- i would be very interested in seeing it.

I can walk you through how to "get" the "map" if needed.

Unfortunately, they only gave me the installed system on the bike, no accessories. Eventually, I'd like to go purchase the interface kit. If you have one, your welcome to do a "mind-meld" if you're in the neighborhood.

Thanks much for the reply but unfortunately my USB cable and lap top are about 1500 miles from your neighborhood <grin>

The free downloadable software is on the PC site . Just need the cable to communicate with the PC-V as a FWIW .

I will make my map available soon however it won't be very close to optimum for stock, unmodified engines.

PS
I really like these bikes !.

None of the information is likely to appear on the site. Call this guy for the details:

Chris Kelly
Dynojet Research
2191 Mendenhall Dr. Suite 105
North Las Vegas, NV 89081
1-800-992-4993

[image: View Post]MSGTR, on 01 December 2010 - 10:23 AM, said:

None of the information is likely to appear on the site. Call this guy for the details:

Chris Kelly
Dynojet Research
2191 Mendenhall Dr. Suite 105
North Las Vegas, NV 89081
1-800-992-4993


I believe you are misunderstanding my comments about the software you were talking about wanting to purchase is actually on PC's website for free as a download. You just need one cable to be able to communicate to the PC with a lap top after downloading the software that usually comes on a disc with the PC unit.

See this link - you can still tweek your existing map for whatever reason - say addition of functional ram air for instance <grin>

PC-V software - Firmware

I have spoke with Chris and know your PC-V has been modified internally.

Thanks anyway .

Sorry about that; I was assuming that the software and cable came as a kit (like all the other system accessories).

[image: View Post]CandyRedRC46, on 04 October 2010 - 09:49 PM, said:

[image: View Post]zRoYz, on 04 October 2010 - 07:58 PM, said:

[image: View Post]CandyRedRC46, on 04 October 2010 - 06:37 PM, said:

it sounds like this bike could benifit from a tre (timing retard eliminator). not for advancing timing, but just for tricking the bike into thinking that its always in say third fourth or fith gear .(which ever gear is not limited by the throttle possition). this is what they do on the busa's (which are limited by timing instead of throttle) to regain the power in the lower gears, as well as erase the top speed limit...
its a fairly simple and cheap mod.


I sent an email to power commander about the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & there response wasn't conclusive on the way honda have gone about doing the limiting, my guess is fueling will have no effect so fitting a pc alone won't help the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & it is performed with the timing. What you have said makes sense but it would be nice to know exactly what Honda have done.

I found this dyno map that has a 2nd gear run over layed onto 3rd & 4th gear run, you can plainly see the dip & 20hp odd less power in 2nd gear.

[image: Posted Image]


yeah that dip doesnt look like fun...
funny this who time i thought the limiting was done with the throttle bodies, not just pulling back igniton timng.
well it makes sence, honda does it to the cbr1000rr and 600rr.
anyways if its timing its a simple fix that any of these companies can make for the vfr...
just look up :
dyno jet ignition module,
TRE
bazzaz z bomb.
all the tuning companes have solutions for this.
almost every suzuki bike has restricted timing.
and honda pulled almost 10 hp off the top of the new us model cbr1000rr to meet noise emissions:

http://www.motovatio...ct=article&id=6

http://www.bazzaz.ne...mart&Itemid=181

http://www.ivansperf...cts.com/tre.htm




In looking at your hp chart I noticed that you tq and hp did not cross at 5252 rpms, That leads me to beileve that there is some issue with the valididy of this chart.

Hp is defined as (tq X rpm)/5252, therefore the TQ and HP lines must cross at 5252 rpms.

[image: View Post]Millertm, on 03 December 2010 - 10:43 PM, said:

[image: View Post]CandyRedRC46, on 04 October 2010 - 09:49 PM, said:

[image: View Post]zRoYz, on 04 October 2010 - 07:58 PM, said:

[image: View Post]CandyRedRC46, on 04 October 2010 - 06:37 PM, said:

it sounds like this bike could benifit from a tre (timing retard eliminator). not for advancing timing, but just for tricking the bike into thinking that its always in say third fourth or fith gear .(which ever gear is not limited by the throttle possition). this is what they do on the busa's (which are limited by timing instead of throttle) to regain the power in the lower gears, as well as erase the top speed limit...
its a fairly simple and cheap mod.


I sent an email to power commander about the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & there response wasn't conclusive on the way honda have gone about doing the limiting, my guess is fueling will have no effect so fitting a pc alone won't help the 1st & 2nd gear limiting & it is performed with the timing. What you have said makes sense but it would be nice to know exactly what Honda have done.

I found this dyno map that has a 2nd gear run over layed onto 3rd & 4th gear run, you can plainly see the dip & 20hp odd less power in 2nd gear.

[image: Posted Image]


because there is two different scales. the one on the left goes to 150 hp and the one on the right

yeah that dip doesnt look like fun...
funny this who time i thought the limiting was done with the throttle bodies, not just pulling back igniton timng.
well it makes sence, honda does it to the cbr1000rr and 600rr.
anyways if its timing its a simple fix that any of these companies can make for the vfr...
just look up :
dyno jet ignition module,
TRE
bazzaz z bomb.
all the tuning companes have solutions for this.
almost every suzuki bike has restricted timing.
and honda pulled almost 10 hp off the top of the new us model cbr1000rr to meet noise emissions:

http://www.motovatio...ct=article&id=6

http://www.bazzaz.ne...mart&Itemid=181

http://www.ivansperf...cts.com/tre.htm




In looking at your hp chart I noticed that you tq and hp did not cross at 5252 rpms, That leads me to beileve that there is some issue with the valididy of this chart.

Hp is defined as (tq X rpm)/5252, therefore the TQ and HP lines must cross at 5252 rpms.



thats because there are two seperate scales. one for toque that goes to 90 ft lbs and one for horsepower that goes to 150...

I have cut n' pasted Chris's response from PowerCommander in here before:

The PowerCommander box does not interface with the Honda computer to alter timing, it only alters fueling.

:beatdeadhorse:

Chris told me Mid February for the VFR1200 PC V

Okay, here's my dyno chart from PowerCommander. It compares the stock with the Jardine, both with the box installed.
There was no K&N filter installed at the time of testing. The bike had about 1400 miles or so on it at delivery.
I brought the stock exhaust with me at their request.

Attached thumbnail(s)

• [image: Attached Image: DynoChart-a.jpg]

That's an amazingly flat torque curve. Let us know if you feel the rear tire squirting out on you on those 2nd gear roll-ons coming out of a nice lean.

Brian

[image: View Post]MSGTR, on 25 December 2010 - 12:07 PM, said:

Okay, here's my dyno chart from PowerCommander. It compares the stock with the Jardine, both with the box installed.
There was no K&N filter installed at the time of testing. The bike had about 1400 miles or so on it at delivery.
I brought the stock exhaust with me at their request.



That's a hell of a lean spot at the bottom of the stock curve.

It's fun, that's for sure!
[image: Posted Image]

Two Brothers racings shows a fuel controller for the VFR1200 on their website, but they have not responded to my e-mail trying to verify this.

I went to their site. I only saw a VALE exhaust, nothing for the "Juice Box."

They are in Santa Ana with an 800 number. Why don't you call this week?

401 South Grand Avenue
Santa Ana, CA 92705
(800) 211-2767
Open Weekdays 9am-5pm

http://www.twobros.c...ion&key=001-287
Power Commander makes the Juice Box Pro for Two Brothers Racing. So, I guess it is in the "beta" stage, with you being one of their highly paid test pilots!

[image: View Post]MSGTR, on 03 January 2011 - 10:46 AM, said:

I went to their site. I only saw a VALE exhaust, nothing for the "Juice Box."

They are in Santa Ana with an 800 number. Why don't you call this week?

401 South Grand Avenue
Santa Ana, CA 92705
(800) 211-2767
Open Weekdays 9am-5pm

Highly paid? :huh:

I am still waiting for my PC-V for the VFR1200. Any news concerning delivering scedual ?

[image: View Post]Dutchgixxer, on 21 April 2011 - 11:43 AM, said:

I am still waiting for my PC-V for the VFR1200. Any news concerning delivering scedual ?


I don't mean to tease but I got mine within 10 days of ordering from Indysuperbikes, at a discounted price from Dynojet's too. Have not got around to have it installed but will report back soon. Cheers.

His distributor is different from yours.
I'll help get to the bottom of it from this end if he wants me to.

PC is installed. 2 different map are loaded. what a difference !! Low ref fueling improved a lot. Acceleration is much sharper. Next week i am going to a tuning center to sort out the fueling for my bike. Now i am using the Jardine map.

[image: View Post]Dutchgixxer, on 25 April 2011 - 05:12 AM, said:

PC is installed. 2 different map are loaded. what a difference !! Low ref fueling improved a lot. Acceleration is much sharper. Next week i am going to a tuning center to sort out the fueling for my bike. Now i am using the Jardine map.


[image: Attached Image: VFR1200 uitdraai.jpg]

Its ready. No jerking anymore. Fine by me :biggrin:

[image: View Post]Dutchgixxer, on 26 April 2011 - 02:57 PM, said:

[image: View Post]Dutchgixxer, on 25 April 2011 - 05:12 AM, said:

PC is installed. 2 different map are loaded. what a difference !! Low ref fueling improved a lot. Acceleration is much sharper. Next week i am going to a tuning center to sort out the fueling for my bike. Now i am using the Jardine map.


[image: Attached Image: VFR1200 uitdraai.jpg]

Its ready. No jerking anymore. Fine by me :biggrin:


Looks very smooth but doesn't mean a lot without a baseline run plotted over it! ;)

If you search around a little, you'll find the one I posted that has the baseline.
When PC did the evaluation, I had funished both mufflers for the testing.

:fing02: to Dutchgixxer, welcome to the PC club!

phobe, on 26 April 2011 - 03:42 PM, said:

Dutchgixxer, on 26 April 2011 - 02:57 PM, said:

Dutchgixxer, on 25 April 2011 - 05:12 AM, said:

PC is installed. 2 different map are loaded. what a difference !! Low ref fueling improved a lot. Acceleration is much sharper. Next week i am going to a tuning center to sort out the fueling for my bike. Now i am using the Jardine map.


[image: Attached Image: VFR1200 uitdraai.jpg]

Its ready. No jerking anymore. Fine by me :biggrin:


Looks very smooth but doesn't mean a lot without a baseline run plotted over it! ;)


When i came to the tuning centre i had installed the PC with a jardin map and a oem exhaust map on it installed. It was just fine tuning what was needed. I saved me a lot of expensive dyno time. 45 minutes and the VFR was ready to go. Thanks MSGTR

Dutchgixxer,

If that was a sixth gear pull then forget the following .

If the dyno results wasn't a pull using 6th gear , suggest looking over your VSP mod and perhaps even your first/second gear mod wiring .

Torque reading is OK to 9000 rpm but HP should climb past whats shown up to the 10250 limiter. HP is nosing over in your chart and laying flat so either it was a sixth gear pull and the throttle blades are closing down as designed for top speed restriction or it's a lower gear and the the throttle blades are closing for some other reason .

In the future if you check the air fuel upstream of the cat box you will note a marked difference in air fuel ratio after blocking the two pair valves with need to retune. Aftermarket plates are not needed to defeat the PV's in order to obtain best overall tuning results.

In europe honda does the job. I will go to my dealer to get the 2012 map.

I'm in Europe (yes us Brits are Europeans :smile: ). I've heard nth hand that the 2012 ECM is different to the previous ECMs (I wonder if the T/C switch is the reason?) and that the 2012 map can't be downloaded onto the 2010/2011 ECM. As you are both knowledgeable in such matters and about to try to have this done I'd appreciate an update.

I spoke to my dealer today and he said he'd look into it.

Thanks

Peter

I don't know if you have noticed but Dynojet has two new maps on their website for VFR1200.

The new ones are:
"16-020-502 European model Akrapovic slip-on exhaust - no baffle Stock air filter Dynojet O2 eliminators fitted" and
"16-020-501 European model Stock exhaust Stock air filter Dynojet O2 eliminators fitted".

If you look at the adjustment values you see that these maps have a lot of minus figures especially at the low end. The earlier maps were just the opposite.

I tried the new map and the bike seemed to run much better on the low end and kind of "lighter". Also the fuel consumption is lower (as you would expect). There was no loss of power when comparing the maps with a map switch on the road.

I called Dynojet to ask what is the reason for so different map values. He first said that Europe has different fuel than US and that is why the map is different (Europe has normally 95-100 Octan fuel). But then he also said that lot of US users are also using these EU maps with good results. It seems that EU maps are just made by a different (EU) Dynojet tuning center. All the maps can be used both in US and EU. You just have to try which one feels better(??!).

One could think that 2012 maps are different to 2010 maps but it seems that they are recommending same maps for 2010-2012.

It maybe worth while to run a Dyno run to find out the truth. But then you are aiming just for max power. For me the behaviour at low end is as important. Luckily you can have both in this case if you want.

Edit: some typos fixed.

Short update to my earlier post. I run the bike in Dyno yesterday. The bike has BOS exhaust and the map was 16-020-502 which I had averaged a little (to get rid of the biggest ups and downs side by side). The O2 values were perfect with different throttle values and no loss of power at full throttle (the local Dyno has no possibility to run power values with different throttle values).

Electrical harness is probably different and that's why its not listed.

That is what concerned me, then I noticed Bazzaz has there product from 2010-2014 (F350) which tells a different story??

Confused !!  I have emailed PC to clarify.

talk to Dante at Bazazz, he was very helpful

Just had a reply from Power Commander the site now shows a PCV for a 1200 2013.

Which should I buy? PCV or Bazzaz?  :blush:

Or Don G ???

Don G should be first step to go for every user - to see what this bike is really capable of. Just don't upload the MAP into your ecu.

If you decide later on then you still need some alteration then buy PV5 of BZ - they do not differ a lot.

i did the Z-Fi before the Guhl reflash was available...if i had to do it again i would never have cut into my wire harness

Thank you for the advice, u r both right.  Will do a Decat and go with Don G.  :rolleyes:

Off topic just fitted these.  I can not believe the difference, our country roads are real bad.  (Where broke too)

http://www.fgspecial...200 F&year=2010

[FGKFVFR1200M] Front

[H0M062FQEECO] Rear

Just had a reply from Power Commander the site now shows a PCV for a 1200 2013.

Which should I buy? PCV or Bazzaz?  :blush:

Or Don G ???

Spoke with a Dutch VFR1200 rider last weekend, he is very happy with his Bazzaz. He rides his bike every day.

Just got my ECU back from Don! It's back in the bike and she fired right up... I'm hoping to take it out for a quick spin this weekend, but it all depends on how much the snow melts this week.

Edit: Crap... Wrong thread...

Sent from my OnePlus One using Forum Fiend

CJ 

Let us know what you think !!!!!! I will check the right thread.