Hello all.
Been lurking on the site for a while, trying to answer my own 'dilemma' as it were. Excuse me if this post is a bit long-winded but I'm thinking out loud as I write.
I'm possibly in the market for a new bike, preferably a smallish, lightweight ST style bike, one I can take on 3-5 day jaunts & will afford me better wind protection and comfort than my current ride, an '03 Kawasaki ZRX1200. Funds, however, are limited so it's the used bike market for me. I also expect I'll end up modding the bike to fit me better.
The bikes under consideration include the:
2008-10 Triumph Sprint ST
2006-09 Honda VFR800
2011-12 Suzuki GSX1250Fa
2011-12 Kawasaki Ninja 1000
The last 2 are probably not truly in consideration because of their respective costs. The Suzuki GSX1250Fa, altho a great bike by all records, does not sing to me. i could probably fall in love w/it eventually but I fear it'd take time & a bit o' $$$. Likewise, the Kawi N1K is also reportedly a great bike but I've read lots of reports about buzziness in the grips, seat & pegs. To my eye, it also has some peculiar lines but as a long-time Kawi guy, I've got to look at it.
That leaves the Sprint ST, a bike I've slobbered over since it's remake introduction in '05. This bike has its own peculiarities (what Brit bike doesn't?) but this bike pulls at my heart strings. I've blown 3 great deals in the last 1.5 years on '08 graphite gray models- my fave- because of procrastination. I kicked myself each time.
Also left standing is the VFR800 ('07 & up preferably). I've read its praises here on this site & on various other sources. It's got a loyal following, not unlike my own ZRX1200 crowd. Every time I see one, I like it more & envision the possibilities.
My concerns w/the VFR relate primarily to comfort, weight & power. From all I've read, I think I can mod this bike to fit my gorilla-esque 51 yr. old body. There's little I can do about its weight and may have to just learn to put up w/it. I swore that after my ZZR1200, I'd never own another bike that surpassed the 550 lb. mark but the VFR might be the exception.
That leaves the power aspect to deal with. I've read enough to know that there are little performance gains to be had & as a guy who likes bottom end torque, that's what concerns me most. I'm not a rickey road racer but I do enjoy roll-on power. My ZRX has that in abundance, to the tune in excess of 82 ft/lbs of torque. The Sprint ain't far behind.
I know the VFR's gearing can be changed to move the powerband down a little lower but will it be enough to keep me satisfied?
I figure this may be one of my last bikes. 'Course, I say that every time I buy a bike & I've been riding for almost 35 years now.
Now seeing as I'm asking a partisan crowd, I'm kinda curious about your opinions, especially those folks who have either ridden or owned any or all of the above bikes. I'm gonna shut my 'mouth' now & listen. Thanks for your time fellas.
Lee
Went through all that 12 months ago, reality is that it's down to your own taste & what you want & expect from the bike of your dreams. Mine is my last bike. I came close to buying a 2nd hand BMW 800ST (twin) 3 YO with only 900 kays on the clock + the bike I owned at the time was terrific as well, many choices in that price range & nearly drove myself mental. I went for the Honda & have no regrets (except for getting reamed on the trade), Honda's have well earned rep for over all reliability. The VFR pulls like a train & the motor has what they say Honda's never have & that's character. The V4 rumble is addictive.
The Triumph is also a great bike & (correct me if I wrong), but here it also comes with a set of luggage & produces more ponies + those pommie bastards know how to build bikes. If you have lusted after the Trumpie, then go for it, you can always trade it in later if it don't live up to expectations.
I have had the same dilemma and have already owned several of these bikes, so I hope you don't mind me sharing my personal experience.
I have MUCH experience with the Triumph Sprint ST. I owned an '05, an '08 (when the switched to the steel tank, thank goodness) and also a GT. And trust me, the Sprint IMHO is not that great. I was hoping the '05 was just a bad example and gave the '08 a shot, and then the GT b/c I am a glutton for punishment.
The only good thing about all of the Sprints to me, really is the engine, let's get that out there right away. The triple 1050 is awesome with way more torque than the VFR. The VFR has great torque, but you still have to ride it like a 4 cylinder. YOu cant be as lazy shifting as you can with the 1050 triple. After that, other than the engine, there isnt much good to say about these bikes.
Engine- The 1050 triple stomps the 800 cc VTEC. It sounds cooler to boot. The VTEC is nice but loses out by sheer cc. Mileage, not so great. Advantage- Sprint
Fairing- It looks great. Lust city. Awesome looking headlight especially when it came out in '05. But...its crap. The windscreen is terrible. So, its a Draw on the vFR 800's screen which is also bad. . The Sprints headlights are also terrible. You can't see anything at night, especially in the corners. Also the early Sprints had nylon tanks...and you can't use a magnetic tank bag. Overall, the VFR fairing, despite the bad screen, is way better for sport touring than the Sprint.
Brakes- Terrible Nissin calipers. Lots of issues and service bulletins here. Weak and no feel despite ss line. Advantage- VFR
Bags- Wobbly, leaky and dont even hold a full face helmet. What? yes, they don't hold anything more than a sandwich and wont even keep it dry. BUT, the Honda does not come with bags. If you can score a used one that does come with the Honda OEM bags (made by Givi), they are vastly superior to the Triumphs lunch boxes. Advantage- slightly to the VFR.
Ergonomics- This is a matter of taste, but the ergos on the VFR to me are way better. Easier to touch the ground. A better seat. Less reach to the bars for me. I dont feel like i am hunched over the VFR as much. Advantage- VFR unless you are really a big guy is my guess.
Passenger- my wife HATED the Sprints passenger seat. It leaned her forward, was too high (She always felt like she was going to get blown off the back) and there is the underseat exhaust which completely fries the passenger AND rider. This thing acts like a heated seat! How Triumph let this out of the factory like that, who knows. Again, service bulletins on this but only helped slightly. The VFR is very cool for the rider and passenger. Advantage- VFR
Resale value- A 2007 VFR books for around $7k. I am not sure what the Sprint is but my guess is that because of how poorly they sold new and leftover inventory, with no help to move them from Triumph, not that great.
Unless you really find a great deal on a Sprint ST, I would lean towards the VFR. The GT was slightly better than the ST but some people complained about the weight. It feels about 100 lbs heavier than the VFR but the bags are way better and actually hold a helmet. Triumph is blowing these out at the moment. Heck I bet there are even some brand new leftover Sprint STs out there!
I am very happy with my '01 and '07 VFRs and feel like there is a reason why Triumph copied them. first with the Sprint 955 (against the Gen 5 VFR) and the 1050 in '05 (against the Gen 6). They had years to get it right, but always have fallen short.
Hopefully this long winded description helps you with your decision. Good luck!
Well Triumph dealers used to do demos and that really helped sell them. Hard to get a demo ride I hear these days...
I took a demo on a 26k mile VTEC RWB just like what I bought, and liked it so much I had to have one. So I hear ya... Don't ride it if you dont want to buy it!
My local dealer has two Sprints in stock, I ride by there every day to and from work.... :idea3:
Let me ask you this, and then I'll stop hijacking this thread. :ph34r: Do the Sprints have more leg room? My VFR feels small to me. I'm 6'1", 230 lbs.
That must be Hap's. Good guys. I believe that the Sprint DOES have more leg room than the VFR. I am 5'10 and it seems like the Sprint had a longer reach and it was harder for me to get both feet flat on the ground.
Triumph seems to be phasing out the Sprint in favor of the RT...I mean Trophy 1200. So you can probably get a good deal...
[image: View Post]deltaboxii, on 17 September 2012 - 09:06 PM, said:
That must be Hap's. Good guys. I believe that the Sprint DOES have more leg room than the VFR. I am 5'10 and it seems like the Sprint had a longer reach and it was harder for me to get both feet flat on the ground.
Triumph seems to be phasing out the Sprint in favor of the RT...I mean Trophy 1200. So you can probably get a good deal...
You guessed it! Hap's in Sarasota. :smile: They have two demo Sprint GT's '11 & '12 But I'm looking at one a little older ( less expensive) Thanks for your input. I have some thinking to do..... :happy:
Unfortunately, since about the 3rd gen, Honda VFRs have always been sort of a "soft" bike suspension-wise and power-wise compared to most other contemporary to it ST's. The VFR's had only been saved from humiliation by mostly it's high build quality as it usally could not do any better than mid-pack on most performance comparo testing. That's why a lot of euro mags, and then the US mags afterwards to some extent, can only describe the VFR as a "gentleman's" bike...whatever the heck that really means........ :rolleyes:
BTW, for it's displacement, the VFR ain't no "lightweight" ST either....It's been considered a porker of a bike for many years now.
Just being honest.....
I'll weigh in as I've spent a considerable amount of time (or what I'd call considerable without owning one) on a ZRX, both 1100 & 1200. I talked my BIL into buying an 1100 and then talked a friend into a 1200, telling them both that that's the bike I'd buy if I were in the market. Then when I was in the market I went and bought the VFR. You are going to give up alot of the lower rpm torque when you get off a ZRX onto a VFR. And comfort wise, the ZRX is better for short/around town jaunts IMHO with it's up-right seating position. But with that seating position you do get blasted with whatever Mother Nature decides to throw at you. But the VFR you have much more protection from the elements, although you give up the up-right riding style. By no means do I regret my decision with buying my VFR instead of the ZRX, and both my BIL and friend have enjoyed their respective bikes as well. The ease of riding that comes with the ZRX is not there with the VFR. You will find yourself having to move around in gears much more than you do on the ZRX. From what I recall, the ZRX is just as content putting around at 35mph in 5th gear as it is blasting down the highway at 135mph in 5th gear. You just can't do that with the VFR.
Thanks for all the great input so far. I really appreciate your comments.
In a perfect world, I'd keep both my ZRX & an the ST but in reality, I cannot afford nor justify both. I love my ZRX- she's my 2nd. She's a looker, been wonderfully modded, puts out great power, does practically everything I ask of her but on longer rides, she gets tiresome. Lots of my fellow ZRX owners tour w/theirs but I guess I'm not manly enough. And if you live in South Florida, like I do, it's 6 hrs just to get out of the state, before you even get close to somewhere else. That's a long time to tide w/out some wind protection.
I've been using the site, http://cycle-ergo.com/, to see how close I can get the various ST's ergonomically to my current ZRX, which I'm pretty comfortable on. From what I've researched so far, it looks like the VFR needs a set of Helibars, a Sargent seat & lowered pegs to bring me closer to the ZRX's dimensions. Throw on a different screen, some Givi 35's, a Throttlemeister & I think the day is close to being done. And yes, I do love listening to modded exhausts on the VFR- that V4 is intoxicating.
The Sprint wouldn't require the bags but just about everything else. Like every other marque, they have their fans but I'm realistic about them too- I know they have some quirks- the brakes, the lights, regulators- & are not perfect so it's good to hear from previous owners, like deltaboxii, who's been thru 3! You must be a glutton for punishment!
In the last week, I've let 3 really good VFR deals slip past, 2 gray '08's and one red '07. Likewise, I let a nearly new '08 gray Sprint get past me so I'm back to shopping again. I found a low mileage, blue '07 Sprint in very nice condition in AL but would really prefer an '08 if possible. Ditto for the VFR- I just love gray so an '08 is my choice. I guess I gotta keep shopping.
I'm late to this party, but I'm actually a little older than you and pulled off a 900 mile weekend over labor day. Mods are seat, pegs, bars, and screen. I found my 02 with bags. You will find less roll on torque, but more shelter than your current ride. I have more than enough power to get into trouble.
Yeah, hondalover makes the point about the abundance of torque present on my ZRX and particularly in comparison to the VFR. I'm no rocket racer so revving the thing to kingdom come is really not my goal. But in reality I also know that because of the VFR's powerband & ergonomic situation, I'm going to have the urge to twist the throttle more often than not. On my ZRX, I don't often need to do that, no matter the gear, cuz the roll-on power is so strong.
I started doing some serious internet surfing the last few days and found several leftover/new 08's w/zero miles and a number of low mileage 08's. The only problem is none are w/in 350 miles of me- ratz- and I am not a huge fan of buying long distance. I'll keep shopping until something close pops up again.
Lee
If you really want comfort and good roll on power and torque, you should ride an ST1300. Yes, it's a porker, but the only time I feel all that girth is when I'm trying to move it around my garage or a parking lot. And did I mention the wind and rain protection?
[image: 2006 ST1300 in Arkansas, spring 2012]
2006 ST1300 in Arkansas, spring 2012
I have a riding buddy w/one of those & he loves it but I say 'nah.' I swore after selling my 600+ lb. ZZR1200 I'd NEVER own another 600+ lb bike and set a 'next bike' limit of around 500 lbs. max. Once under power, the ZZR never felt like its weight either but it was ponderous rolling it around & I was always terrified of dropping that beast.
If I was going to go the heavyweight route, I'd look at FJR1300's but I'm not, so I ain't! Now a Moto Guzzi Norge 8V would be given consideration too but I don't have that kind of scratch either so I'm back @ the VFR800 & Sprint for my serious considerations.
Lee
I have a riding buddy w/one of those & he loves it but I say 'nah.' I swore after selling my 600+ lb. ZZR1200 I'd NEVER own another 600+ lb bike and set a 'next bike' limit of around 500 lbs. max. Once under power, the ZZR never felt like its weight either but it was ponderous rolling it around & I was always terrified of dropping that beast.
If I was going to go the heavyweight route, I'd look at FJR1300's but I'm not, so I ain't! Now a Moto Guzzi Norge 8V would be given consideration too but I don't have that kind of scratch either so I'm back @ the VFR800 & Sprint for my serious considerations. Lee
Yeah, horsing around the 700 lb beast is a real chore for my little 5'7" 165 lbs. The good thing about the ST is that if you drop it, it's a non-event. The tip over bars support the bike totally and the covers are made of a softer, pliable plastic that doesn't crack. I replaced one because it was scuffed a little and I think it was about $20. FJR's are cool, but like the ST are in need of a serious update. Can't speak to the Guzzi except that you better have a fully outfitted shop and lots of mechanical know-how or go broke. It's clear you aren't interested in the bigger ST bikes, but the qualities you said you were looking for are found in just those types of bikes. It's almost unbelievable how comfortable and easy it is to put on lots of miles on my ST.
Disclaimer: I'm 51 years old and starting to feel my age...
My brother has a Ninja 1000 and absolutely loves it. Never mentioned any buzziness or anything. I had a 6th gen and loved it. Can't speak of the Sprint. Never rode one. My 6th gen was a very sporting street bike and comfortable all day long. I did a few longer trips on it and was very satisfied with how it handled itself. In the end, you will likely be happy with any of them.
Ride safe.
PS. He had a ZZR1200 prior to his Ninja 1000. It was a big, heavy missile. I mean a bulllet, but, not as sporting as the Ninja 1000, VFR800, or VFR1200. VFR1200 is the bike that does it all for me. A very sporting street bike that is comfortable all day, refined, and a missile waiting to be fired when asked. Great bike. VFR800 is all that with a little less engine. Still, plenty of motor on the 800.
My local dealer has two Sprints in stock, I ride by there every day to and from work.... :idea3: Let me ask you this, and then I'll stop hijacking this thread. :ph34r: Do the Sprints have more leg room? My VFR feels small to me. I'm 6'1", 230 lbs.
I am 6'4" and 210pounds. Definitely get the footpeg lowering blocks from 'Busy Little Shop' (VFRD member). Makes a world of difference. And yes, the bike ('07 VFR 800) does seem small to me.
I've always really liked the look of that ZRX. Comparing the ergonomics on that site makes it look pretty comfortable compared to my '93 (which isn't bad). 11 degree straighter back would sure be nice.
If you like the old style UJM and want to be upright in your riding w/practically no weight on your wrists yet still have a sporty composure, then the ZRX is your bike. Honestly, I love my ZRX & in a perfect world, I'd keep it & whatever ST I end up with. It's a great bike & practical for so many arenas- commuting, city, day rides. It's got plenty of power, & handles/brakes well enough for the average mope. It's easily modded too & virtually bullet-proof. Criminy, sounds like I'm selling my bike to me!
Lee
Judging by the amount of decel burble, I'd say they're not quite done tuning it yet. Mine has none at all. My ZRX, w/its performance mods, dynoed (as I recall) @ 128 rwhp & 82 ft/lbs of torque- not bad for an 'older' bike. Better, w/all the mods & takeoffs I've done to my bike, I'll bet my bike has lost 35-40 lbs. Yeah, she'll scoot if asked....
Lee
I understand your quandry ... I have a VFR, then bought an FZ1 while on the search for "the best bike" (then sold it), then bought a 1050 ST and still have a hard time choosing between the 2
At 5'10" and 215, pilot comfort is better for me on the Triumph with high bars vs Honda with helibars
Passenger comfort is better on the Honda
Torque and hp are better on the Triumph but you don't "feel" faster than when riding the Honda
Build quality is better on the Honda
Bags are better on the Honda (by far!)
MPG is equal
Weight is better (lighter) Triumph at LOW speed; better (more stable) on the Honda at HIGH speed (80mph+)
Lights are better on the Honda
Gearbox is better on the Honda
Looks ... I keep yearning for the Honda
Why do I have a Triumph again?
I heard a quote from Johnny Depp recently saying, "If you love 2 women, marry the 2nd one. If you really loved the 1st one, you wouldn't have looked for the 2nd."
Maybe I need to change the quote to "... marry the next one."
Judging by the amount of decel burble, I'd say they're not quite done tuning it yet. Mine has none at all. My ZRX, w/its performance mods, dynoed (as I recall) @ 128 rwhp & 82 ft/lbs of torque- not bad for an 'older' bike. Better, w/all the mods & takeoffs I've done to my bike, I'll bet my bike has lost 35-40 lbs. Yeah, she'll scoot if asked.... Lee
The comment attached to the video said he got 147hp out of it...with tons of engine mods though
I own and ride an 01 VFR and an 09 Triumph Sprint St. I love them both for different reasons. The VFR for its build quality, exhaust note, and gear whine, and longevity. The Sprint for its looks, comfort, and addicting torque and acceleration. ( especially with one tooth down on the front sprocket ) I would have to say though, that if I was forced to only have one bike, then it would be my VFR.
I'm not sure if you've ridden all or any of the bikes you have on your list but I would think that is a very important step in deciding what to get and seeing if the power and comfort is good for you. I really enjoyed my 02 vfr for many reason already covered here, but if torque and the ability to effortlessly wind on the speed (especially at highway speed, passing, faster sweeping roads... etc) is high on your list, then you really might want to consider other bikes. (I think this may be especially hard coming from a bike that already has lots of smooth torque)
I have ridden with and on st1300's, FJR's, and FZ1's and they all have far more roll on power and torque than the VFR. And I rode a 2011 speed triple recently and despite always wanting one and loving the engine... the shifting on this almost new model was so notchy and annoying that I would have a very hard time looking past it though I'm not sure all 1050 triumph models would be like this.
Of get the 1200. It has a wet weight of 594lbs compared to the 6th gen 550 or so. You can put a full after market exhaust on it and drop some weight and still have about 140 horses to the rear wheel. And the exhaust will bring out the sound in the V4.
Bags- Wobbly, leaky and dont even hold a full face helmet. What? yes, they don't hold anything more than a sandwich and wont even keep it dry.
Always interesting to come across tid bits like this... Makes me wonder if panniers are sourced from local suppliers in different parts of the word - mate has an ST, panniers are awesome, tight fit, don't wobble or leak and fit a 24 can carton of beer in each one with room for a few more...
Bags- Wobbly, leaky and dont even hold a full face helmet. What? yes, they don't hold anything more than a sandwich and wont even keep it dry.
Always interesting to come across tid bits like this... Makes me wonder if panniers are sourced from local suppliers in different parts of the word - mate has an ST, panniers are awesome, tight fit, don't wobble or leak and fit a 24 can carton of beer in each one with room for a few more...
. I understand that the early panniers did leak, but Triumph corrected that. They could have more space, but IMHO, it would detract from the sleek lines that I find so appealing. To each his own. Ride safe, Dave
Of get the 1200. It has a wet weight of 594lbs compared to the 6th gen 550 or so. You can put a full after market exhaust on it and drop some weight and still have about 140 horses to the rear wheel. And the exhaust will bring out the sound in the V4.
Or you can Toro the 5th or 6th.
I'm one of those folks who actually like the VFR1200. Pics don't do it justice IMO. And the new blue is stunning but....outta my financial league. Perhaps after I won the Powerball this weekend... Lee
I understand your quandry ... I have a VFR, then bought an FZ1 while on the search for "the best bike" (then sold it), then bought a 1050 ST and still have a hard time choosing between the 2
At 5'10" and 215, pilot comfort is better for me on the Triumph with high bars vs Honda with helibars Passenger comfort is better on the Honda Torque and hp are better on the Triumph but you don't "feel" faster than when riding the Honda Build quality is better on the Honda Bags are better on the Honda (by far!) MPG is equal Weight is better (lighter) Triumph at LOW speed; better (more stable) on the Honda at HIGH speed (80mph+) Lights are better on the Honda Gearbox is better on the Honda Looks ... I keep yearning for the Honda
Why do I have a Triumph again? I heard a quote from Johnny Depp recently saying, "If you love 2 women, marry the 2nd one. If you really loved the 1st one, you wouldn't have looked for the 2nd."
Maybe I need to change the quote to "... marry the next one."
Good comparison tips -thanks!
I own and ride an 01 VFR and an 09 Triumph Sprint St. I love them both for different reasons. The VFR for its build quality, exhaust note, and gear whine, and longevity. The Sprint for its looks, comfort, and addicting torque and acceleration. ( especially with one tooth down on the front sprocket ) I would have to say though, that if I was forced to only have one bike, then it would be my VFR.
You are NOT helping me.....(yes, just kidding.) Lee
I'm one of those folks who actually like the VFR1200. Pics don't do it justice IMO. And the new blue is stunning but....outta my financial league. Perhaps after I won the Powerball this weekend... Lee
New 2010's can STILL be found for under $10k...
Just saying... that buys a LOT of some fantastically gray paint. :ph34r:
Dunno what your price range is... I'm just a huge fan of the 1200. It is my do-all bike.
I'm one of those folks who actually like the VFR1200. Pics don't do it justice IMO. And the new blue is stunning but....outta my financial league. Perhaps after I won the Powerball this weekend... Lee
Just saying... that buys a LOT of some fantastically gray paint. :ph34r:
Triumph "fixed" the later panniers by reinforcing the existing shell rather than scrapping and retooling the mold. When they did that, they lost even more storage space. Earlier bags "could" fit a smaller full face helmet. Later bags, no way. All of Triumph's bags were made by the same suppliers, no matter where in the world you are. I know more about this than I should, yes I do realize that
If you like the old style UJM and want to be upright in your riding w/practically no weight on your wrists yet still have a sporty composure, then the ZRX is your bike. Honestly, I love my ZRX & in a perfect world, I'd keep it & whatever ST I end up with. It's a great bike & practical for so many arenas- commuting, city, day rides. It's got plenty of power, & handles/brakes well enough for the average mope. It's easily modded too & virtually bullet-proof. Criminy, sounds like I'm selling my bike to me! Lee
I went on a zrx picture binge after I posted. This will be my next bike (if I can ever afford a second). Something about the square bikini fairing does it for me. Bah, the whole thing looks badass.
Ninja 1000! Or a Sprint or the VFR. Ninja 1000 with the hard bags looks pretty good and the Motor is awesome. The Sprint had some issues with the Hard bag mounting system I believe.
Sounds like you need to keep the ZRX and add touring mods converting it to a ST machine.
Still lacking a fairing though.
I owned a ST1300 along side my VFR800 for about a year. It was an excellent bike. Brilliant wind/weather protection. Great torque (why does it have 5 gears?) and SMOOOOTH.
Yes, it's 700+lbs. But once clutch is fully out, it doesn't feel any heavier than the VFR. The earlier models can be found for well under $8,000. Don't worry about mileage as the engines are darn near bulletproof.
From your list, based strictly on the spec sheet, I'd say the Sprint is your winner.
I have ridden the Ninja 1000 on a 24 mile loop after riding my VFR for over 500 miles the previous two days. While the motor on the Ninja feels more powerful and the bike feels a tad lighter (could also be that I had full Givi luggage that was loaded), I still much preferred the VFR. The VFR has a lot more character, is smoother and with better suspension. If you notice, used Ninja 1000's are fairly inexpensive. I was going to suggest a GSX650F which I found to be remarkably smooth for an inline 4, but if you don't like the GSX1250 you will likely not like the 650. Can I add one more bike to the mix which I think you may like? Look at the 2005-2007 Ducati ST3. They are wonderfully light, provide much more usable power than the VFR with quite a bit of character, and are reliable (not like the older Ducatis). I rode my friend's that had the Termignoni package which he dynoed at 117hp at the rear wheel. The motor, sound and bike in general were wonderful. The price is also reasonable. Lastly, I rented an F800ST in Europe for 10 days and 2500 miles. The bike is certainly lighter than the VFR and although is smaller I think is better tailored for taller riders. It was exceedingly economical with a very torquie motor. But, good luck finding a used one...
The ST1050 is beautiful with an excellent motor. But, to me would be 4th on the list from the other three I mentioned. An older generation FZ1 is better for touring than the newer one and is more sporty than the ZRX. It is certainly different than the light sport touring bikes I mentioned.
I was in the same boat when I was shopping. I wanted a comfy, good all around bike. Multiple friends kept recommending the VFR. I was looking for more touring, so shopped the FJR, FZ, v-strom, ST4 and Triumph. Finally I rode a 1998 VFR and bought it on the spot.
The Duc's required too much maintenance, and have a potentially expensive cam problem. Valve adjusts every 6000, no thanks. The FJR is fantastic, and was my first choice, but was substantially more money. Was also too large for commuting, which I do every day, and needed something smaller for lane sharing. The V-strom was too odd. The FZ offered too little weather protection, had a lousy clutch, and lacked the premium feel of the VFR. The VFR was just right ergonomically, has plenty of torque for sport touring, although not as much as the fjr. If you are looking for deep, smooth power, the fjr is great, but it is heavy. The VFR has great weather protection, without roasting you on hot days like the FJR. I don't regret the purchase for a second. Looked at the triumph briefly, but the older ones don't match the build quality of the VFR by a long measure. I have put over 5000 miles on my VFR, and look forward to many many more. Added some soft bags I scored for free, and a tank bag, and have an awesome sport tourer/ commuter for less than 3,000.
As far as light weight sport tourers mainly for one up, the VFR can't be beat. The later models with the factory bags are nice. Might upgrade some day for two reasons: the hard bags, and ABS.
BTW, I'm 5'5" and 150 pounds, and don't feel the VFR is too heavy. Even the FJR was fine. Wish they were a little lower though. My next bike will be the FJR, Concours, or new Triumph Trophy for 2 up touring. One of those will be my birthday present when I turn 40.
$$ is one of my defining issues here. That pretty much eliminates any new/newer rides like the GSX1250FA & Ninja 1000. The FJR is simply out of my league & way bigger than I'm willing to go. No more 600+ lb bikes- don't care how light they feel once underway. Ducati's, even a used ST3/4, are too maintenance intensive & expensive. I have no taste for Beemer's at all. I like the 1st gen FZ1 (2nd gens are fugly IMO) but it's not going to offer me anything my current ZRX already doesn't so that's out of consideration also. This brings me back, again, to the VFR & the Sprint ST, and even perhaps a Buell XB12XT.
Oh, I hear it already, "a Buell?" you're saying to yourselves? Ayup. I always liked them too. Distinctive, practical, elemental. But like w/the other bikes, I have concerns w/them too- long-term manufacturer support being one of the more significant, the other being a lack of elemental protection from that mini-shield up front. Outside of those issues tho, the bike has always sung to me. What can I say?
Again, appreciate everyone's personal input & insights.
Lee
I looked at the Buell. Too tall for me and felt more cumbersome than the FJR. That is why I went with the Honda feels smaller, but the added weight makes it stable for touring and longer rides. Plus, if you are touring and need service, every back water town in America has a Honda dealer. Not sure about Triumph or Buell. Was the other reason I leaned toward the VFR, not to mention there are simply more for sale than the Triumph, so you can score a better deal.
$$ is one of my defining issues here. That pretty much eliminates any new/newer rides like the GSX1250FA & Ninja 1000. The FJR is simply out of my league & way bigger than I'm willing to go. No more 600+ lb bikes- don't care how light they feel once underway. Ducati's, even a used ST3/4, are too maintenance intensive & expensive. I have no taste for Beemer's at all. I like the 1st gen FZ1 (2nd gens are fugly IMO) but it's not going to offer me anything my current ZRX already doesn't so that's out of consideration also. This brings me back, again, to the VFR & the Sprint ST, and even perhaps a Buell XB12XT.
Oh, I hear it already, "a Buell?" you're saying to yourselves? Ayup. I always liked them too. Distinctive, practical, elemental. But like w/the other bikes, I have concerns w/them too- long-term manufacturer support being one of the more significant, the other being a lack of elemental protection from that mini-shield up front. Outside of those issues tho, the bike has always sung to me. What can I say?
Again, appreciate everyone's personal input & insights. Lee
At the end of the day, you see which bike I have? ;-) My VFR is setup for touring with helibars, full givi luggage, sargent seat, GPS, and MRA vario touring screen. That being said, it is more of a sports bike than a touring bike. The ST1050 is similar as well. I my opinion the Honda is a safer bet and there are so many used ones that the price is OK.
And believe me, my thoughts are leaning heavily that way too. I have no concerns about Honda's quality whereas I fully recognize the Buell has certain quality control issues and Triumphs have their unique British quirkiness.
Today, I found a gorgeous 07 VFR, modded almost to ST perfection like yours- all it needed was a Sargent seat! The owner & I chatted for about 20 minutes so it has moved close to the top of my list. Not so sure about the red- I had my heart on the 08 gray but considering how nice this bike was set up, I may have to change my mind.
Lee
I have a 2000 Sprint RS that sleeps with my 05 VFR. I have put about 20K miles on the RS over the past year or so. I haven't done any really long trips, just from outside of LA to San Diego and stuff like that. Maybe it is due to the fact that I have so much more seat time on the Triumph, but I feel a lot more comfortable in the saddle of the Sprint in the twisties. I think it was due to the weird throttle issue it had before I disconnected the PAIR and flapper. I can comfortably scrape the pegs on the RS, but I get nervous as hell doing it on the VFR, I don't know why. My advice is to ride a Sprint. I haven't ridden an ST, but I lust over how they look. A couple of things to consider is that the service intervals are longer on the VFR, but you can tune to your heart's content for free on the Triumph using TuneECU. I also am down a tooth on my front sprocket of the Trumpet along with a Two Brothers slip on, no cat,( I don't know if it ever came with one) and a K&N filter, coupled with a custom tune from the TuneECU website and that triple screams! A very noticeable difference and the Triumph is lighter, by quite a bit. Also, my fuel mileage on my Britbike is better than the V4, by a long shot. Even if I am running my bike in the canyons with the rpms up a bunch, the Triumph still gets equal or better to my VFR, even with mellow riding. I can't get that thing to even approach 40 mpg. That is what frustrates me, because in an effort to save fuel, I ride like Grandpa Moses, but then I am bored as hell. If I have fun, then my bike gets worse mileage than my 1998 Saturn which is heavier, older and have a much larger engine and is a car with an automatic tranny.I tend to ride with the RPMS up when I am in traffic, in case I need to accelerate or decelerate out of an incident on the freeway. I can do this all day on the Trumpet and not get penalized, yet if I do it on the Viffer, I can almost see the gas guage drop by the mile. Now, this is on an older Trumpet than what you are looking at and that needs to be taken into consideration. I ended up with my Honda based on a recommendation of Will Kennefick, who is the owner of Motorcycle Service Center in Camarillo, Ca. He told me to get a Honda because of the reliability. He has been a lifelong Ducati guy but he has moved to Honda because he almost never gets them in for anything more than maintenance. All that being said, your best bet is to ride a Sprint, even if it a private party bike. At least you can get a feel for it. I don't know which is better comfort wise, as I bought my VFR in Las Vegas and rode it back in the heat of the summer. I don't remember being uncomfortable and it has only been two months since I bought it so I guess that says something. I need to add that the VFR is totally stock, so I guess that says something about the seat comfort for me. Anyway, that's my two cents...
Ive owned 3 VFR's since 95,4th,5th and 6th Gens.Also an ST1100 since 01.Perfect combination of power,comfort,soul and reliability .
Most people were attracted to the VFR's since the first model because it was unique and exotic and a direct descendant of Honda's race bike.Unlike any UJM bike out there.
The 6th gen is a great bike but it's character is changed with the VTEC.Must be run up much higher to get into the powereband than all of the previous models.My 4th and 5th gens had smooth,linear,buttery power from just off idle to just below redline.Still one of the best all around sportbikes,but what used to be the best is now in the middle of the pack of a bunch of other very good ones.
I missed the torque and power curve of my previous bike and bought a 04 Ducati ST4S.It is lighter,superior,brakes and suspension to the 6th Gen.Comes with stock bags and power outlet.Comfort is equal to VFR and for me better.Stock seat is considered the best ST seat,also a DP touring seat was offered that is supposed to be even better.A wiring harness lives under the dash for heated grips.
If you do Hondas suggested valve inspections,about 1K at a dealer(many here dont with no ill effects),maintenance is about the same .Belts every 2 years and valves checked every 10K for the Duc.I do my own maintenance.I also paid 5.5k for a well maintained,great condition,with a couple grand worth of farkles thrown in.6th Gen VFR's will run $3500-6500 depending on year/condition/extras.
Any of your choices, you'll have a great bike.If you want more soul,but a bike set up for touring with factory options,I think the Triumph or Ducati are the best choices.
I'll buy another VFR in a heartbeat if they make a race-derived,gear driven model with touring equipment.Make an R option with uprated suspension and "Race" exhaust/ECU and I'm putting down a deposit today.Till then the Duc fills that mold.
I have a 2000 Sprint RS that sleeps with my 05 VFR. I have put about 20K miles on the RS over the past year or so. I haven't done any really long trips, just from outside of LA to San Diego and stuff like that. Maybe it is due to the fact that I have so much more seat time on the Triumph, but I feel a lot more comfortable in the saddle of the Sprint in the twisties. I think it was due to the weird throttle issue it had before I disconnected the PAIR and flapper. I can comfortably scrape the pegs on the RS, but I get nervous as hell doing it on the VFR, I don't know why.
My advice is to ride a Sprint. I haven't ridden an ST, but I lust over how they look. A couple of things to consider is that the service intervals are longer on the VFR, but you can tune to your heart's content for free on the Triumph using TuneECU. I also am down a tooth on my front sprocket of the Trumpet along with a Two Brothers slip on, no cat,( I don't know if it ever came with one) and a K&N filter, coupled with a custom tune from the TuneECU website and that triple screams! A very noticeable difference and the Triumph is lighter, by quite a bit. Also, my fuel mileage on my Britbike is better than the V4, by a long shot. Even if I am running my bike in the canyons with the rpms up a bunch, the Triumph still gets equal or better to my VFR, even with mellow riding. I can't get that thing to even approach 40 mpg. That is what frustrates me, because in an effort to save fuel, I ride like Grandpa Moses, but then I am bored as hell. If I have fun, then my bike gets worse mileage than my 1998 Saturn which is heavier, older and have a much larger engine and is a car with an automatic tranny.
I tend to ride with the RPMS up when I am in traffic, in case I need to accellerate or decellerate out of an incident on the freeway. I can do this all day on the Trumpet and not get penalized, yet if I do it on the Viffer, I can almost see the gas guage drop by the mile.
Now, this is on an older Trumpet than what you are looking at and that needs to be taken into consideration. I ended up with my Honda based on a recommendation of Will Kennefick, who is the owner of Motorcycle Service Center in Camarillo, Ca. He told me to get a Honda because of the reliability. He has been a lifelong Ducati guy but he has moved to Honda because he almost never gets them in for anything more than maintenance.
All that being said, your best bet is to ride a Sprint, even if it a private party bike. At least you can get a feel for it. I don't know which is better comfort wise, as I bought my VFR in Las Vegas and rode it back in the heat of the summer. I don't remember being uncomfortable and it has only been two months since I bought it so I guess that says something. I need to add that the VFR is totally stock, so I guess that says something about the seat comfort for me.
Anyway, that's my two cents...
I just bought a near pristine 2000 Sprint RS. I used to have a 2002 ST and the RS steers much faster. And it is lighter. Back in 02, I was too much of a snob to consider a half faired bike, I really missed out.
I would say that the RS handles almost as well as my pristine, 4k mile, 1997 TL1000S. Not bad for a sport touring bike...
MZNYC, the DP seat on the ST4S is considered the second best sport touring seat......after the Aprilia Futura's seat. :happy:
I think I was eyeing the bike you picked up....
I have to say that to some degree I regret putting the helibars on my VFR. I came from an FZ6 and the riding position was way too inclined. I am only 5'8". I think that the handling is probably better if you put more weight on the front and is probably on par with the sprint RS or Ducati ST series (though, ST4S with Ohlins...something else). As a workhorse I consider the VFR superior
If you want serious wind protection consider one of the maxi scooters. I also have a Burgman Executive and with the Clearview large windscreen up you can ride all day with your visor up without the need for earplugs. The 650 twin has plenty of power, there's lots of underseat storage and a good sized glovebox, and 75mph all day long is a non-issue. The seat is the only one I've never complained about as well. It's actually pretty heavy but it is ALL down low. 50 MPG is no problem if you're light on the throttle. Oh, I had an ST1300 with ABS - great bike but HEAVY.
I am not now, nor will I ever consider, exchanging a motorcycle for a...scooter. Lee
Ride one and you'll get it. People who just automatically dispel that category are missing out. The Burgman is much faster off the line than a VFR (yes, the VFR will kill it on the top end). So why has Honda put a DCT in the VFR 1200 and NC700x? They are basically scooters without the step through. No worries about where pegs are located, having to add luggage capacity, chain maintenance, adding cigar outlet (it's in the glovebox), and the best seat you'll ever sit on. Michellin Pilots make them lean and corner like you would not believe. Seriously - try a Silverwing or Burgman or one of the BMWs when you get a chance. You'll have a blast and can tour on them easily.
End of thread · 60 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 30 Jan 2016