Another Darn Cct Question

I was beginning to change my CCTs beginning with the rear one when I hit a snag. I checked the winding procedure to retract the tensioner with the unused new one and found that to fully retract the head it takes 6 complete turns. When I went to remove the old one I was able to get to 4 full turns before it gave so much resistance that the the tool would bend. I tried a few more times with the same results and decided to stop until I found out for sure if it is necessary to fully retract the head with the 6 turns or are 4 enough? 

I would guess that the in service CCT is bearing on the chain so won't extend as far as the CCT that is uninstalled.


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Just  make  sure  it  can  not  spring  out when you  start to  remove it. If the key has  it  lock  just  remove  the  bolts slowly . 4  reverse turns   should  be enough and  that  maybe all there is.  Back  it out  one revolution on each  bolt and take  your  thumb and apply pressure  to  the  CCT and see if you can  press down on the CCT assembly  then  rotate it another   turn  and do the same  procedure .  IT should be back off  more  pressure. If   not  then  CCT  key  is  not  locking  down  the spring.   

Thanks for the replies.

That is what I was thinking, that the shaft is not at full extension and that 4 turns is all it takes to draw it back in. Having seen an exploded diagram here on VFRD of the engine the rear one seems to be closer to the tension guide on the chain and so does not extend as much. Just wanted to be safe after reading a couple of posts where the cap fell in and the hassle it was to fish it out.

Just to rant a bit. That tool is a joke. It is murder on the fingers and once it gets some of the dripping oil becomes almost impossible to handle. It is amazing that a company with the resources like Honda puts out such a mediocre design. Bad enough they took away the gear driven cams, but do they have to them follow with poorly designed CCTs that are a hassle to work with? This is followed with the VFR 1200 CCT that requires a major engine tear down to replace. Wonder what the deal is with the 8th gens.

you should fully compress the tensioner, with a screwdriver, install the key to hold it , Mount the tensioner, remove the key at it will go where it needs to go, very simple.

Here  the  internals .

[image: cct_falling_to_pieces.jpg]

And  a  great  write  up .

http://www.vfrdiscus...e-body-removal/

The new one is tensioned and ready to go. My problem was when tensioning the rear old one to remove it I was only getting about 4 full turns before it would not turn anymore without the tool beginning to bend. My understanding now is that since the shaft does not fully extend when in use it takes less full turns to retract it than when the shaft is extended outside of the engine. By my count it was 6 turns for the new one outside vs. 4 turns for the old one that was inside the engine. Does this seem correct?

And yes, that was the write up I was using as a guide. It is only focused on removing the front one but pretty much walks you through the whole routine.

The new one is tensioned and ready to go. My problem was when tensioning the rear old one to remove it I was only getting about 4 full turns before it would not turn anymore without the tool beginning to bend. My understanding now is that since the shaft does not fully extend when in use it takes less full turns to retract it than when the shaft is extended outside of the engine. By my count it was 6 turns for the new one outside vs. 4 turns for the old one that was inside the engine. Does this seem correct?

And yes, that was the write up I was using as a guide. It is only focused on removing the front one but pretty much walks you through the whole routine.

You don't wind the tensioner to remove only lock it in place, so it doesn't extend any more. 

Ah, now that makes more sense. Fortunately I have you good people to consult instead of guessing. By the way, does anyone know the torque values of the 2 mounting bolts and the cap bolt? Can't seem to find them in the service manual.

It doesn't matter.

Obviously it is already somewhat compressed when fitted to the bike. So you won't get 6 full turns as it isn't fully extended.

You can turn it 4 times to wind it in and lock the key in place. Or you can just lock the key the first time it aligns with the locking slot.

It doesn't matter.

The idea is just to avoid the thing jumping backward or outward when removing the two mounting bolts as this MIGHT cause the end cap to get knocked off the tensioner INSIDE the motor. Just makes life easier and the procedure safer from Homer Simpson "D'oh!!" moments.

Torque would be snug with a small socket wrench. Wrist force at most... definitely not full arm force. Like surely no more than 10-12 Nm.

Edit: I underdid it there. Don't know my own strength. You get a feeling for these things but it wouold be best to be scientific, and it is in the workshop manual:

[image: MueyMlo.jpg]

Sidenote, if you don't find the specific value for the specific bolt, there is usually a generic indication in these manuals:

[image: NirGlYj.jpg]

Funny thing, found a (very stereotypically japanese) typo in the torque section:

[image: nBJ59vL.jpg]

Got it, I will turn the tensioner a turn or 2 and lock the tool in. Made sense once all the replies came in.

As for the torque, I had seen those two tensioner flange bolt values but when I checked further found that they were referring to bolts that secure the actual tensioner on the chain inside the engine. The standard torque value chart you provided was what I was looking for. I think I will first snug up to 9lb, continue and then stop when I feel resistance. Engine runs great and cruises smooth as silk but when idling that rattle is so annoying. Hopefully changing the tensioners will be the end of it.

Thanks to everyone for your help.

[image: cam chain guide.JPG]

Increase the oil port in the gasket to 2.75mm  , other wise dry lube scenario will have it rattling again, the next day , a week , or within a couple months.

Got it, I will turn the tensioner a turn or 2 and lock the tool in. Made sense once all the replies came in.

As for the torque, I had seen those two tensioner flange bolt values but when I checked further found that they were referring to bolts that secure the actual tensioner on the chain inside the engine. The standard torque value chart you provided was what I was looking for. I think I will first snug up to 9lb, continue and then stop when I feel resistance. Engine runs great and cruises smooth as silk but when idling that rattle is so annoying. Hopefully changing the tensioners will be the end of it.

Thanks to everyone for your help.

[image: attachicon.gif]cam chain guide.JPG

Glad this is working out.  Agreed that Honda has done and continues to do a lousy job on the CCT's.   

How many miles did you have on it when you began to notice the rattling?