I've been looking for a good set of headers since I know that my '01 header will not last for ever.
And while I believe that a good exhaust with a good catalyst could flow as well as just a well constructed set of pipes, I'm not going to go insane trying to find a good aftermarket cat equipped header.
But today I just stumbled across this brand of exhaust and found that they have a stainless header for the 5th gen VFR's.
Has anyone installed one of these.
and does anyone know where we could get them here?
I got a reply from the UK site that they will have their US dealer get in touch with me.
I don't ever seem to get that sort of response from a vendor anymore, so I'll just keep my eyes/ears out.
I did not have time to hunt down a good picture of a motad header yesterday, so I'll take a good look when I get a chance today.
that is assuming that I actually get a chance to sit in-front a computer around here today.
[image: View Post]JES_VFR, on Mar 13 2009, 06:50 AM, said:
I got a reply from the UK site that they will have their US dealer get in touch with me.
I don't ever seem to get that sort of response from a vendor anymore, so I'll just keep my eyes/ears out.
I did not have time to hunt down a good picture of a motad header yesterday, so I'll take a good look when I get a chance today.
that is assuming that I actually get a chance to sit in-front a computer around here today.
The best one I could find. The D's look different. Share the info when you find out.
[image: Posted Image] D8HR-Motad.jpg
back info:
http://www.vfrdiscus...p...45&hl=motad
I'm by the ocean but figured I'd wait before a high $ purchase for a no air flow gain pipe. 6th gen headers are stainless, albeit fugly, right? :rolleyes:
Here is what I think, the beginning of the pipes on the far end on the Delkevic headers cross over each other,
just like the stock Honda pipes. Now the Motad headers,I believe, dont cross over each other. I am not sure
what method is better,but header pipe placement has to do with firing order and exhaust scavange (sp?)
As I said ,I believe I am correct,but if someone could verify this I would appreciate it. eddie
These headers look far from hi tech, however being 304 stainless and all and
a price of $250.00, its not a bad deal. I have never seen a set of Motads in
person, but in their pictures seems the tubes,bends and welding look a little
more race oriented than these. eddie
yeah, I agree with onedowneaster. The Motads don't have the large bulb thing on them. I would definitely buy them. The ones on eBay don't look much better than my stocker BUT 304 stainless should hold up much better and not become orange with oxidation. The price is reasonable too.
Delkevic (sounds a bit like "Akrapovic", doesn't it...) is the own brand of DK Motorcycles, a huge motorcycle breakers (salvage yard)/parallel importer in the UK. They are not Motads; they are made somewhere in Asia (Motads are made in the UK). I've never had a set in my hands, but I've heard several stories about their, er, variable quality. I was just reading a thread on ST-Owners.com about someone puzzling about a 5/16" mismatch in some Delkevic ST1100 flanges... Make sure you've got a solid importer if you buy them--they might have to go back a time or two!
Motad and Predator, though, are effectively the same. I bought a set of VFR800 headers from Predator in January and they came in a Motad box... Both only claim to be OEM replacement headers, not performance headers, so I wouldn't (and don't) expect more performance than OEM. TBR headers (no longer made) were supposedly designed for enhanced performance, but it was never totally clear how much actual performance development went into their design.
Delkevic (sounds a bit like "Akrapovic", doesn't it...) is the own brand of DK Motorcycles, a huge motorcycle breakers (salvage yard)/parallel importer in the UK. They are not Motads; they are made somewhere in Asia (Motads are made in the UK). I've never had a set in my hands, but I've heard several stories about their, er, variable quality. I was just reading a thread on ST-Owners.com about someone puzzling about a 5/16" mismatch in some Delkevic ST1100 flanges... Make sure you've got a solid importer if you buy them--they might have to go back a time or two!
Motad and Predator, though, are effectively the same. I bought a set of VFR800 headers from Predator in January and they came in a Motad box... Both only claim to be OEM replacement headers, not performance headers, so I wouldn't (and don't) expect more performance than OEM. TBR headers (no longer made) were supposedly designed for enhanced performance, but it was never totally clear how much actual performance development went into their design.
Ciao,
Howdy JZH, Thanks for enlightening us. I am asking this question because I truly dont know the answer,however since no one is currently producing performance headers for the fifth gen. machines or possibly any VFR ,who in the past made a set worthy of a performance type header? I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us. Somewhat like a group purchase. Business as it is, a company may be easier to convince to do something like this. In my way of thinking ,headers are one of the best ,cheapest and easiest ways to add to horsepower and torque. The addition of torque makes a bike much easier to ride and so much faster on the track,if you so desire. Just my thought ,but if we could get possibly 10 interested parties to buy in on a run of perf.headers. that may be enough to get a company to provide them. If we have some other serious searchers for additional power,please respond and lets see what happens.eddie
Me likey. Its 100% stainless? Post up when you know about what the thing costs.
The first reply from the US distributor is 260 for the header. He did confirm any of the other questions that I had, so I did not jump on it yet.
Now I realize that these are not race headers or performance headers. But These are stainless steel headers without the cat.
That is really all I'm looking for right now. It is possible that when I get Toro's SC installed the old oem cat could melt down. To replace that would with a new on from honda would run me close to 700 in parts. Here is a header for 1/3 that in stainless.
The best one I could find. The D's look different. Share the info when you find out.
[image: Posted Image] D8HR-Motad.jpg
I'm by the ocean but figured I'd wait before a high $ purchase for a no air flow gain pipe. 6th gen headers are stainless, albeit fugly, right? :goofy:
Yeah but that picture is shows exactly what I don't like about the Motad header. For a regular street header replacement its a jigsaw puzzle of pieces. The Delkevic's are not pieced together pipes but single runs welded at the ends. they also seem to have descent price.
My 5th gen headers are supposedly stainless, but they dirt brown in color. Much like oem car exhausts, the grade of stainless in them is not the best and with the other plans I have for the VFR, I seriously doubt they will last much more. That has me shopping now before I melt down the catalyst and have glowing chunks of hot metal flying out the end of can.
I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us. Somewhat like a group purchase.
TBR has been approached in the past by several VFR800 owners and asked if they would make another limited batch of the headers and the answer was a flat NO.
They are focused on building thousands and thousands of systems for Gixxers and CBR's and the like.
I'm not sure if Erion Racing was ever approached though. Might try them.
AND, Borla (the car exhaust guys) also used to make a full stainless system for the VFR800. I asked them myself if they'd do a short group run of them, answer, NO.
My 5th gen headers are supposedly stainless, but they dirt brown in color.
I don't think any 5th gen had SS headers, if I'm not mistaken the 02 was the first year Honda went to SS headers on a VFR. :cool: The 00-01 were steel, had a cat and dropped in size from 43mm to 41mm just like the vtec's headers.
I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us.
Can you say China? :cool:
In my way of thinking ,headers are one of the best ,cheapest and easiest ways to add to horsepower and torque. The addition of torque makes a bike much easier to ride and so much faster on the track,if you so desire.
Larger tube headers will almost always result in a Loss of Low/mid range HP & torque because they are mush less efficient at scavaging at lower rpm's than smaller tubes and usually don't result in any real gains until higher rpms. This won't make the bike easier to ride, smooth torque curves or advanced electronics do that! :huh:
I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us.
Can you say China? :cool:
In my way of thinking ,headers are one of the best ,cheapest and easiest ways to add to horsepower and torque. The addition of torque makes a bike much easier to ride and so much faster on the track,if you so desire.
Larger tube headers will almost always result in a Loss of Low/mid range HP & torque because they are mush less efficient at scavaging at lower rpm's than smaller tubes and usually don't result in any real gains until higher rpms. This won't make the bike easier to ride, smooth torque curves or advanced electronics do that! :huh:
Hi BR, I didnt say anything about header tube size,you are correct,usually smaller tubes improve low end power. What I am saying is,has any company previously made a race/high performance set of headers for the 5th gen? If that is even remotely true,they probably still have the C.A.D program that they used to make them. Now I know all of this could be a long shot,but no one knows what a company is going to say until we approach them. And yes, optimized electronics do play a part in improving torque,but so do a good set of well formed equal length tubing headers. In addition engine performance can often be changed by matching or running different tubes with each other. Part of my rational for thinking this way,was when one of the guys stated that the small selection of headers that we have to choose from are really just replacement headers, we dont know if the units out there really help the cause. However I do believe the ones with the cats.may scrubb off a little H.P on the top end. eddie
My 5th gen headers are supposedly stainless, but they dirt brown in color.
I don't think any 5th gen had SS headers, if I'm not mistaken the 02 was the first year Honda went to SS headers on a VFR. :cool: The 00-01 were steel, had a cat and dropped in size from 43mm to 41mm just like the vtec's headers.
Well I could be mistaken, but I thought that the 2000-2001 VFR's got stainless because of the cats? Either way, my oem header is not gonna last forever. And the cat is likely to die when I get all crazy with the boost.
So, I need another and for 260 in all stainless with nicely bent pipes, not bits-a this and bits-o that construction, how bad could it be?
Or maybe I just have to push Dan's buttons some more about that ti exhaust teaser he has on the A&A site.
Hi BR, I didnt say anything about header tube size,you are correct,usually smaller tubes improve low end power. What I am saying is,has any company previously made a race/high performance set of headers for the 5th gen? If that is even remotely true,they probably still have the C.A.D program that they used to make them. Now I know all of this could be a long shot,but no one knows what a company is going to say until we approach them. And yes, optimized electronics do play a part in improving torque,but so do a good set of well formed equal length tubing headers. In addition engine performance can often be changed by matching or running different tubes with each other. Part of my rational for thinking this way,was when one of the guys stated that the small selection of headers that we have to choose from are really just replacement headers, we dont know if the units out there really help the cause. However I do believe the ones with the cats.may scrubb off a little H.P on the top end. eddie
I hear yah Eddie! :cool: No doubt the smaller tube 00-up headers rob power and I don't doubt Honda reduced tube dia. to maintain velocity through the Cat vs the larger not Cat headers. I had a Full 2Bros system on my 00 and it fore sure lost Low/Mid power, but picked up 6-7 hp on top. :huh:
I really don't want to have to change out the header after the supercharger install, because it blew out the cat.
I'd get rid of the cat first like you said. No saying that the cat will be damaged by the S/C, but, more HP = more fuel burned = more BTU's, = more exhaust heat.
And, the less restriction in the exhaust, the better the breathing (to a point).
I really don't want to have to change out the header after the supercharger install, because it blew out the cat.
I'd get rid of the cat first like you said. No saying that the cat will be damaged by the S/C, but, more HP = more fuel burned = more BTU's, = more exhaust heat. And, the less restriction in the exhaust, the better the breathing (to a point).
Yeah, I know that and more. I even know that oem header is not going to last forever, But.
Part of it though is that Dan want's to test the TC (I'm still gonna call it the ToroCharger) on a stock 00-01 cat equipped bike so that he can work all that out. I had expressed my concern about slagging the cat (since I've done it tuning far too many cages) and I have a good dose of other plans for the VFR after the SC install.
I figure that if I talk to him about it before we move ahead and if it slaggs down, then we should have a header to install picked out. Either that or he needs to think about the teaser he put on his website about Ti headers.
I just ordered the Delkevic header that was on ebay. Hopefully it's decent. I live not too far away from where it's shipped from and the seller has good feedback so I took the shot. I'm basically looking to get rid of the cat and with used 98-99 headers going for way over $200 it looks like a decent deal to me. I'll post up some pic's and my opinion on how well they fit when they get here.
Well I just finished speaking with Luke at the US distributor.
He says that they have several sets in and available for shipping.
the price is 260 as advertized, shipping is 24 buck to my door (CO to NJ).
They don't include gaskets or clamps, how ever so you still have to make a stop at someplace like service honda.
Still that is a third or less than what the dealerships want.
How come the Delkevic site has them for 350 Brit lbs , which is about 700 US, but on Ebay they are 259 US? Hmmmmm.......
304 SS is the most commonly used SS. To get superior corrosion resistance 316 is better. Both are better against corrosion than the mild steel 5th gen OEM headers.
I think this has been sorted already, but neither of these are Motad exhausts. Just in case anyone was still unclear on that... :biggrin:
Additionally, we as a distributor have been watching your "conversation" here as we need to know if one of the many products we represent is still competitive in the market. Price is always a concern, but what we cannot get our hands on from anyone are actual "back to back" dyno graphs, to see how these exhausts perform on real world VFR's...
Does anybody have any graphs showing stock and then either of these pipes? Usual rules, same day, same dyno, no fuel adjustments, etc.
Just back to back's on the pipes to see how the curves look to stock?
We always want to represent good and well priced products, so we are needing some ammunition to see if we can "work" on our supplier a bit here...
So was there ever a reply to the question of horsepower gains with either the Motad or the other headers? I would have to believe that there would be some sort of improvement even of the tube diameter is rather small just from getting rid of the cat. I have an Aprilia RST1000 as well as an '08 VFR and when I gutted the "breadbox" under the Aprilia's engine getting rid of the cat, there were definite gains as it would wheelie much easier with that mod alone.
I am considering installing a header but would really like to see some graphs.
I bought a set of these for my 96 VFR750, because they were half the price of Motad headers, and looked better made than the Delkevics. This is what I found looking down the pipe for the front left cylinder
The pipe to the front right is constructed in a similar manner, but there's a bend in the pipe which makes it impossible to see the joint. I don't think they're going to improve the performance at all.
I emailed the manufacturer with my concerns and they replied that they had not had any complaints about power loss, and that if the headers were faulty they would replace them. It would cost me to send them back without knowing if they would be deemed faulty; and I suspect that any replacements would be similar. In the end I decided that it would be easier to grind away the excess metal using a Dremel. I'm still working on it but I'm not intending to replace the pipes until the winter anyway.
I bought a set of these for my 96 VFR750, because they were half the price of Motad headers, and looked better made than the Delkevics. This is what I found looking down the pipe for the front left cylinder
The pipe to the front right is constructed in a similar manner, but there's a bend in the pipe which makes it impossible to see the joint. I don't think they're going to improve the performance at all.
I emailed the manufacturer with my concerns and they replied that they had not had any complaints about power loss, and that if the headers were faulty they would replace them. It would cost me to send them back without knowing if they would be deemed faulty; and I suspect that any replacements would be similar. In the end I decided that it would be easier to grind away the excess metal using a Dremel. I'm still working on it but I'm not intending to replace the pipes until the winter anyway.
Dang!, that look like "gudenuff" engineering to the max! :blink:
Did Sandy Spares think that no one was ever going to look down their pipes and find out about this?? :blink: :angry:
They put enough effort in mitering the pipes together at those intersections, It boggles the mind why they just don't put just a little bit of more time even to just grind out the holes a little closer to pipe ID before welding
In the end, I guess you always get what you pay for. :dry:
[image: View Post]Steve Larson, on 13 April 2009 - 05:40 PM, said:
I think this has been sorted already, but neither of these are Motad exhausts. Just in case anyone was still unclear on that... :biggrin:
Additionally, we as a distributor have been watching your "conversation" here as we need to know if one of the many products we represent is still competitive in the market. Price is always a concern, but what we cannot get our hands on from anyone are actual "back to back" dyno graphs, to see how these exhausts perform on real world VFR's...
Does anybody have any graphs showing stock and then either of these pipes? Usual rules, same day, same dyno, no fuel adjustments, etc.
Just back to back's on the pipes to see how the curves look to stock?
We always want to represent good and well priced products, so we are needing some ammunition to see if we can "work" on our supplier a bit here...
Thanks!
Steve Larson
Only have a graph of a Motad system with a Laser straight through carbon race pipe fitted....
VFR750 1992 FN model....
[image: Posted Image] Base dyno run
[image: View Post]Veefer800Canuck, on 14 March 2009 - 12:39 PM, said:
[image: View Post]onedowneaster, on Mar 14 2009, 06:08 AM, said:
I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us. Somewhat like a group purchase.
TBR has been approached in the past by several VFR800 owners and asked if they would make another limited batch of the headers and the answer was a flat NO.
They are focused on building thousands and thousands of systems for Gixxers and CBR's and the like.
I'm not sure if Erion Racing was ever approached though. Might try them.
AND, Borla (the car exhaust guys) also used to make a full stainless system for the VFR800. I asked them myself if they'd do a short group run of them, answer, NO.
i can get them done for sure if we had 5-6 people in. they will be SS and ceramic coated. they will not have all the chopped parts and won't have inner scrap parts either. they also will not cost $250, more like $600 i bet. i think for that peice you can't go wrong on those other ones as materials cost more then $200
would like to make a full exhaust for the viffer too so let me know anybody if there is some interest
[image: View Post]Mrgrn, on 28 November 2010 - 08:03 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Veefer800Canuck, on 14 March 2009 - 12:39 PM, said:
[image: View Post]onedowneaster, on Mar 14 2009, 06:08 AM, said:
I wonder if it would be possible ,that is if we found a company that previously made a set, for them to make a specified run for us. Somewhat like a group purchase.
TBR has been approached in the past by several VFR800 owners and asked if they would make another limited batch of the headers and the answer was a flat NO.
They are focused on building thousands and thousands of systems for Gixxers and CBR's and the like.
I'm not sure if Erion Racing was ever approached though. Might try them.
AND, Borla (the car exhaust guys) also used to make a full stainless system for the VFR800. I asked them myself if they'd do a short group run of them, answer, NO.
i can get them done for sure if we had 5-6 people in. they will be SS and ceramic coated. they will not have all the chopped parts and won't have inner scrap parts either. they also will not cost $250, more like $600 i bet. i think for that peice you can't go wrong on those other ones as materials cost more then $200
would like to make a full exhaust for the viffer too so let me know anybody if there is some interest
I cant speak for any VFR as of yet, but I do have experience with a Delkevic header. After I acquired my 1998 Yamaha YZF600R, i decided to find a header to couple with the Yosh slip-on so I could complete the exhaust system (in my roundabout way to couple this mod with a K&N air filter so I could justify a stage 1 jet kit for the carbs). The clear impression I got off of the Delkevik header is definitely "good-nuff" engineering. It's obviously a cheap chinese header, not quite the quality youd find with say, a full 2 bros or yosh system, but it also doesnt seem to be a piece of junk yard crap, either. The fitment on the 600R was a little lacking, as it had to be shimmed to get the header flanges to seal correctly to the head, but in the end, the header fits the yosh slip on fine, and the bike runs like a freakin top (and i gotta admit, for a soul-less I4, it does sound pretty cool around 6k on the tach, too).
This is not to say that the VFR products from this manufacturer will be similar or not, this is just me sharing my experience with this particular brand of product. Good, not great, but at least better than stock.
End of thread · 38 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 27 Mar 2016
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