cat-less header install on '02

Hi everyone, I'm finally getting around to installing a catless header (and Micron exhaust!) in my 02 vfr. this weekend I pulled the stock exhaust and header off and have the catless (its also jethot coated) header on the bike. I haven't tightened anything down yet because I'm trying to get the alignment right. which brings me to a couple questions -

the old header had a metal tab on the catalytic converter that kept the center stand from swinging too far back. the catless header doesn't have this tab, should I be worried about this?

two of the header tubes wrap around the right leg of the center stand (the bike is on the centerstand as I do the work) very closely. it looks like they might prevent the centerstand from swinging out of the way. should I be worried about that?

anyone with experience installing the micron exhaust for 6th gen? how difficult was it to get everything lined up?

any info/advice would be a great help. thanks

jim

Sorry I can't actually help you with your questions - I've never done that mod - but I'm surprised no one else has given any advice. Surely it's been done before. I've read about catless header mod installs around here before. Anyone?

[image: View Post]jim v, on 24 May 2010 - 11:41 AM, said:

Hi everyone, I'm finally getting around to installing a catless header (and Micron exhaust!) in my 02 vfr. this weekend I pulled the stock exhaust and header off and have the catless (its also jethot coated) header on the bike. I haven't tightened anything down yet because I'm trying to get the alignment right. which brings me to a couple questions -

the old header had a metal tab on the catalytic converter that kept the center stand from swinging too far back. the catless header doesn't have this tab, should I be worried about this?

two of the header tubes wrap around the right leg of the center stand (the bike is on the centerstand as I do the work) very closely. it looks like they might prevent the centerstand from swinging out of the way. should I be worried about that?

anyone with experience installing the micron exhaust for 6th gen? how difficult was it to get everything lined up?


Hi buddy,

Your Micro exhaust should fit without a problem - the large downpipe should line up with the collector box on the headers without a drama. The whole exhaust system allows a lot of free play up there under the seat, especially if the pipes are stainless steel because it is quite springy.

As for the headers, I assume you're installing 1998 model headers rather than aftermarket Motad or Delkevic? The Motad headers definitely have the tab which stops the centrestand from coming back too far. I would have thought the 1998 headers also have this? I am unsure what the centrestand hits if there is no tab in place, but it probably wouldn't be what you want. I recommend welding on a tab to ensure that the centrestand is kept in the right position.

So, what headers are you fitting - Honda 1998 model headers or Motad/Delkevic?

I did this same mod couple of years ago with my 02. I removed a bunch of stuff while I did this mod (PAIR valve, EVAP cannister, oxygen sensors, install Power Commander III usb , etc.) including the center stand. So I didn't have to deal with the stand problem. You might try the same thing. Or you could attempt to make a stopper yourself somehow, because the center stand will hit the headers under the bike.

I was able to get an aluminum rod that fit through the holes where the center stand attaches when setting up the bike to work on it. So the only downfall was not having the centerstand attached to the bike for trips, but I was able to attach it no problem when I got it back to my garage. I actually liked the look of the bike without the center stand better anyway.

As far as the Microns, congrats. Your gonna love them. Best sounding cans I've heard on a VFR. I love mine. Couldn't think of having stock cans after hearing the Microns. Install was simple. Shoudn't have any problems. I have some pics for ya to show the process. I would mark all the wires in the back when you take the rear end off though. Just saves time. Something I did that helped. Good luck, have fun, and enjoy!

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Do some searching. I did this mod several years ago. Seems like I just wrapped a section of radiator hose around the right side of center stand where it hit the headers. Secured it with a couple of stainless steel zip ties. I've since dumped my center stand so it's no longer a worry.

I know I posted some pics on here a few years back. You just need to do some searching.

Hey, I went to PhotoBucket and found my pics:

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[image: View Post]wooly72, on 22 June 2010 - 09:34 PM, said:

I did this same mod couple of years ago with my 02. I removed a bunch of stuff while I did this mod (PAIR valve, EVAP cannister, oxygen sensors, install Power Commander III usb , etc.) including the center stand. So I didn't have to deal with the stand problem. You might try the same thing. Or you could attempt to make a stopper yourself somehow, because the center stand will hit the headers under the bike.


Are those Motad headers you fitted? My Motads had the centrestand stopper on them.

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)

Isn't this just the happiest place on earth? Jim, I hope you're reading this. After a small kick in the pants to vfrd members (my call for help in post #2), look at all the help you got!

Seriously, it's amazing. Some of guys seem to tear down your viffers every weekend and rebuild them just for fun.

"Chancho, sometimes... when you're a man.... you tear down your VFR... on the weekend.... it's for fun."
Nacho

P.S. female VFR-types, no disrespect meant, just quoting a movie!

[image: View Post]Bartmaneh, on 23 June 2010 - 06:22 AM, said:

Isn't this just the happiest place on earth? Jim, I hope you're reading this. After a small kick in the pants to vfrd members (my call for help in post #2), look at all the help you got!

Seriously, it's amazing. Some of guys seem to tear down your viffers every weekend and rebuild them just for fun.

"Chancho, sometimes... when you're a man.... you tear down your VFR... on the weekend.... it's for fun."
Nacho

P.S. female VFR-types, no disrespect meant, just quoting a movie!


this place is great - where else are you going to get instructions w/ pictures! when I button everything back up i'll post some photos of my own......

thanks guys

jim

Jim,

When I came up with this mod, I simply ran a longer bolt through the bottom mid-pipe clamp there where it joins up with the header. On the end of the longer bolt, I slipped a piece of rubber hose on to it. No more clankity-clank when I rolled it off the centerstand. To make it more sanitary, I would suggest a rubber vacuum plug instead of the hose. You can find a boxed assorted supply of them at an auto parts store.

This is the only pic I currently have of the header mod in the gallery and you can't see the bolt but at least you can see the angle of the c-stand that it holds it at.

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[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 06:04 AM, said:

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)


This is almost exactly what I did as well. Pull the rubber stopper off of the old exhaust headers, and install the new headers. When you swing the centerstand up it will hit the exhaust on the right hand side; just JB Weld the stopper on to that spot on the c-stand so you don't have metal-on-metal. I actually trimmed the stopper down some so the centerstand retracts up higher (more ground clearance, y'know...)

[image: View Post]sckego, on 23 June 2010 - 11:41 AM, said:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 06:04 AM, said:

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)


This is almost exactly what I did as well. Pull the rubber stopper off of the old exhaust headers, and install the new headers. When you swing the centerstand up it will hit the exhaust on the right hand side; just JB Weld the stopper on to that spot on the c-stand so you don't have metal-on-metal. I actually trimmed the stopper down some so the centerstand retracts up higher (more ground clearance, y'know...)


Could maybe drill a hole in the centerstand too, then just re-insert the rubber there? I just don't trust JB Weld much myself.

[image: View Post]SEBSPEED, on 23 June 2010 - 12:00 PM, said:

I just don't trust JB Weld much myself.



Seb:

I thought JB Weld was what you used at work to assemble the aircraft you're making. :biggrin:

Pete

[image: View Post]SEBSPEED, on 23 June 2010 - 12:00 PM, said:

[image: View Post]sckego, on 23 June 2010 - 11:41 AM, said:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 06:04 AM, said:

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)


This is almost exactly what I did as well. Pull the rubber stopper off of the old exhaust headers, and install the new headers. When you swing the centerstand up it will hit the exhaust on the right hand side; just JB Weld the stopper on to that spot on the c-stand so you don't have metal-on-metal. I actually trimmed the stopper down some so the centerstand retracts up higher (more ground clearance, y'know...)


Could maybe drill a hole in the centerstand too, then just re-insert the rubber there? I just don't trust JB Weld much myself.



2 years, thousands of miles...no problem and counting.... :fing02:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 09:39 PM, said:

[image: View Post]SEBSPEED, on 23 June 2010 - 12:00 PM, said:

[image: View Post]sckego, on 23 June 2010 - 11:41 AM, said:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 06:04 AM, said:

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)


This is almost exactly what I did as well. Pull the rubber stopper off of the old exhaust headers, and install the new headers. When you swing the centerstand up it will hit the exhaust on the right hand side; just JB Weld the stopper on to that spot on the c-stand so you don't have metal-on-metal. I actually trimmed the stopper down some so the centerstand retracts up higher (more ground clearance, y'know...)


Could maybe drill a hole in the centerstand too, then just re-insert the rubber there? I just don't trust JB Weld much myself.



2 years, thousands of miles...no problem and counting.... :fing02:


I've witnessed JB WELD fail on several occasions, usually after about two years or so in the field. Something happens as it ages which causes the bond to weaken significantly.

[image: View Post]ECX585, on 23 June 2010 - 11:06 PM, said:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 09:39 PM, said:

[image: View Post]SEBSPEED, on 23 June 2010 - 12:00 PM, said:

[image: View Post]sckego, on 23 June 2010 - 11:41 AM, said:

[image: View Post]turtlecreek, on 23 June 2010 - 06:04 AM, said:

i took the rubber pad off the cat unit and cut off the little nub and then jb welded it to my center stand so that it rested against the header.

that is the only modification I had to make. it will work just fine :)


This is almost exactly what I did as well. Pull the rubber stopper off of the old exhaust headers, and install the new headers. When you swing the centerstand up it will hit the exhaust on the right hand side; just JB Weld the stopper on to that spot on the c-stand so you don't have metal-on-metal. I actually trimmed the stopper down some so the centerstand retracts up higher (more ground clearance, y'know...)


Could maybe drill a hole in the centerstand too, then just re-insert the rubber there? I just don't trust JB Weld much myself.



2 years, thousands of miles...no problem and counting.... :fing02:


I've witnessed JB WELD fail on several occasions, usually after about two years or so in the field. Something happens as it ages which causes the bond to weaken significantly.


what does fail mean in this case.....the rubber stopper falls off? no big....put another on. it isn't holding anythign significant and the loss wouldnt hurt you. this is a very simply way to stop the center stand from hitting anything is all.

Finally undertaken this mod myself after procrastinating over it for nearly 2 years now. Got myself some almost band new 98 catless headers (sat on a VFR VTEC as a mod and then never ridden). Been looking at the point where the CS hits the pipes myself. Getting a friend to weld the part lifted off the old pipes put on then all of it painted black. Almost all mods done then. just some small ones left and she will be a thing of beauty (not that she isn't already)

OR............. :idea3: :dry:

The real solution to the rubber stopper thingy....... :491:

USE YOUR OEM EXHAUST!!!! :comp13: :bliss:

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finally got everything put back together and took her out for a spin. pics below. some thoughts

sure is a louder than stock - I think there's a leak where the rear cylinder pipes meet with the collector piece. I've thrown a lot of (way too much) sealant at it, but its hard to get any on the back of the joint. sounds really purposeful past 7000rpm or so. :biggrin: used 330ohm resistors to fool the injection system into thinking the 02 sensors were still there. throttle response seemed just fine - maybe the altitude around here actually helped? anyway a power commander is a future addition (hmmm....pc3 or pc5?)

the header was jet hot coated. I asked for a flat black finish but got a satin-like finish instead. didn't care enought to send them back and get them redone

went ahead and installed a set of Radarsliders while I had things apart. hope I never need them

the license plate "solution" is temporary - got rid of the plastic tail and screwed the plate to the metal tab already there. i'll figure something else out later

next move is a new chain and sprockets, I'll start a new thread soon looking for advice soon. thanks for the help everyone - any recommendations for a good exhaust sealant and how I might get it to the back of the joints would be welcome :biggrin:

jim

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[image: View Post]jim v, on 05 July 2010 - 08:00 PM, said:

I think there's a leak where the rear cylinder pipes meet with the collector piece. I've thrown a lot of (way too much) sealant at it, but its hard to get any on the back of the joint.


This is a common problem with the aftermarket headers. My Motads are the same - you need to use some of the expanding and hardening stuff. I use "Maniseal" which works quite well. Alternatively you can make up a dolly to whack into the header pipe ends and spread them out a bit so it's a tighter fit.

Oh, FYI - exhaust gaskets from a GL1500 gold wing can be used to replace the ones that came with the headers if you damage them while stuffing around in that collector/header joint area.

Kaldek, thanks for the info - something that expands a bit as it cures is would be a big help. I'm going to google mani-seal and see what turns up....

jim

[image: View Post]kaldek, on 05 July 2010 - 08:29 PM, said:

[image: View Post]jim v, on 05 July 2010 - 08:00 PM, said:

I think there's a leak where the rear cylinder pipes meet with the collector piece. I've thrown a lot of (way too much) sealant at it, but its hard to get any on the back of the joint.


This is a common problem with the aftermarket headers. My Motads are the same - you need to use some of the expanding and hardening stuff. I use "Maniseal" which works quite well. Alternatively you can make up a dolly to whack into the header pipe ends and spread them out a bit so it's a tighter fit.

Oh, FYI - exhaust gaskets from a GL1500 gold wing can be used to replace the ones that came with the headers if you damage them while stuffing around in that collector/header joint area.

[image: View Post]kaldek, on 05 July 2010 - 08:29 PM, said:

...... "Maniseal" which works quite well.......



I googled and emailed - Maniseal is only available from CRC Australia, not in the US :angry:

and I haven't found any equivalent stuff on the internets. so, anyone know of expanding, heat activated exhaust sealant available in the USofA? Its hard to believe that an apparently useful product wouldn't be available everywhere these days

jim