6th Gen - where is the 10amp Sub Fuse? UPDATE

Hi guys,

My bike left my high and dry yesterday, a couple hours into my father's day ride, and the first ride in a month. Suffice to say I was disappointed.

Anyhow, quick story is I stopped at a store, shut the bike off, came back turned it on and although the starter motor cranked over, it would not start. After some head scratching, and investigations, I notice that the fuel pump is not kicking in when the key is turned on, and my headlights (all of them) are not working. Now, those two things don't seem related to me, but who knows. (the lights were working immediately prior, as confirmed by the guy who was leading). So i checked all the fuses I could and they all checked out. After an hour of investigations, I decided to get a long tow home.

So now I'm here and going through the service manual to diagnose the problem. I've immediately noticed that the starter relay connector is melted partially. But it is working and is not shorting so that doesn't appear to be the main issue (I will of course replace it). I then went to the check the fuel pump and it does not seem to be getting power, as the brown 2P connector has no continuity voltage (p. 5-54 of the manual). So now I'm going through the things to check (as per p. 5-54) and the next thing is says to check is the 10A sub-fuse. WHERE IS THAT DARNED THING?? I sure don't know.

Can someone help and tell me where it is please.

Thanks. (I may be back with more questions later if you'll indulge me).

The 10amp sub-fuse is on the right-front side of the bike under the nosecone (upper cowl) fairing. You can get to it by using the supplied tool kit and the allen keys. All the fairings will need to come off - left, then right, then the upper cowl.

POSSIBLY it may be reachable by removing the black cover on the inside of this fairing - the one you would use to get to the right turn indicator bulb. If not, you have to remove the upper cowl I think!

Any other takers? I've never had to replace any of these fuses!

Hang on, I found out how to do it without removing the fairings. The owners manual (page 96) shows that you can do it by removing the inner panel.

Removing the inner panel isn't too hard. You need to remove the hex bolt which is the one on the fairing under where your right hand would be when riding. Next remove the bolt which is on the under-side of this section of fairing. Then remove the plastic clip at the bottom right of the dashboard. After that you can gently prise thise small piece of fairing out and access the fuses.

Download the 2007 model owners guide from the downloads link here on the forum and go to page 96 for a picture!

Hang on, I found out how to do it without removing the fairings. The owners manual (page 96) shows that you can do it by removing the inner panel.

Removing the inner panel isn't too hard. You need to remove the hex bolt which is the one on the fairing under where your right hand would be when riding. Next remove the bolt which is on the under-side of this section of fairing. Then remove the plastic clip at the bottom right of the dashboard. After that you can gently prise thise small piece of fairing out and access the fuses.

Download the 2007 model owners guide from the downloads link here on the forum and go to page 96 for a picture!

Yup...right inner panel. I go there when I go to the track to disable the lights.

You can pull the right panel next to the gauges without pulling anything else. Just remove the bolts and trim clips, push the panel in enough to grab the end of it and it'll just pop right out.


[image: Posted Image]

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Hi guys,

although the starter motor cranked over, it would not start.

the fuel pump is not kicking in when the key is turned on, and my headlights (all of them) are not working.

I then went to the check the fuel pump and it does not seem to be getting power, as the brown 2P connector has no continuity (p. 5-54 of the manual). So now I'm going through the things to check (as per p. 5-54) and the next thing is says to check is the 10A sub-fuse.

A couple of potentially useless thoughts (different year bikes and I've been sampling some Makers Mark).

If the starter is cranking it's probably not the the 10A fuse "C".

Did you check Main Fuse "B" under the seat? The fuel pump doesn't power up when it blows.

Is it possible the lights were off while cranking the starter? because the lights are bypassed at the switch while starting.

My manual says to do a voltage check, not a continuity check at the 2 pin brown connector for the fuel pump.

[image: Posted Image]


Main fuse "B"
[image: Posted Image]

Thanks for the replies guys! I didn't realize sub-fuse "c" was the "c" fuse in the fuse box. I thought it was more of a main fuse like the "a"and "b" main fuses and thus in line somewhere. Not sure why I thought that. Anyhow I had already checked all the fuses in the 2 fuse boxes and they are all good. So I'll continue down the list of items to check on p. 5-54. I'll report on what I find.

Thanks again.

[edit:oh and VFRo: yes I did check the main fuses a and b. And the lights don't work period - not when the ignition is on nor when the starter button is pressed (when they of course aren't supposed to be on.) Appreciate the thoughts. ]

I was sure it was main fuse "B" as that's the symptoms mine had when it blew after trying to jump start it...no fuel pump charging. Replaced the fuse, (20 Amp instead of 30 since I added the VFRness with fuse block) started right up. Which brings me to my second recommendation...mine only started right up after I replaced the battery! Check your battery...may be just that.

Have you had the Harness RECALL work done? Sounds like the infamiss Blue connector ground problem to me!

BR

Have you had the Harness RECALL work done? Sounds like the infamiss Blue connector ground problem to me!

BR

No, I haven't.

So far I've ruled out everything on p.5-54 EXCEPT the bank angle sensor (and the ECU which I can't test b/c I don't have the necessary tools: ie. a test harness! duh, no kidding). I can't test the bank angle sensor b/c it says to turn it horizontal and see if the engine stop relay clicks but gives cuts off power. Well, the engine stop relay won't click period in any position. I've check it according to the manual and it is not faulty - it clicks when connected to the battery directly and has resistance when doing so. Same thing seems to be happening with the headlight relays too-no clicks (although I haven't checked them yet).

I wonder if there is a quick "workaround" for the blue connector ground problem....I'll have to search. Maybe if I can bypass the connector ground I can see if things work???? [EDIT: Found the Thread. Will do that fix now and see the results.]

Thanks for all the thoughts guys.

Well,my blue connector was a bit melty at the ground wire as Bailey reckoned. So I did the ground bypass to the blue connector (as per Kanadian Ken) but it hasn't made any difference. Hmm. I'm out of ideas (not that I had many to start).

As mentioned earlier - hows your battery? Get it tested and see if thats the issue.

Blue connector (Ground fix) USUALLY fixes that issue every time - I think you have something else going on.

Well,my blue connector was a bit melty at the ground wire as Bailey reckoned. So I did the ground bypass to the blue connector (as per Kanadian Ken) but it hasn't made any difference. Hmm. I'm out of ideas (not that I had many to start).

Maybe try to re-seat the connector on the ECM and it might be worth testing to see if you are getting voltage to the connector at the fuel pump. That would give an indication whether it's a fuel pump/ground issue or instead one of the relays is not passing power.

As mentioned earlier - hows your battery? Get it tested and see if thats the issue.

Blue connector (Ground fix) USUALLY fixes that issue every time - I think you have something else going on.

The battery has enough juice to fire the starter motor for as long as I press the button, so it sure would appear to be ok, no? Voltage is good and battery is only a year old.

Well,my blue connector was a bit melty at the ground wire as Bailey reckoned. So I did the ground bypass to the blue connector (as per Kanadian Ken) but it hasn't made any difference. Hmm. I'm out of ideas (not that I had many to start).

Maybe try to re-seat the connector on the ECM and it might be worth testing to see if you are getting voltage to the connector at the fuel pump. That would give an indication whether it's a fuel pump/ground issue or instead one of the relays is not passing power.

I have no voltage at fuel pump and none of the front relays sound like they are clicking when the ignition is switched on. I'm wondering if I should just get the new front harness and put it on. Sure seems like the issue might be in there. I don't mind paying for it as it'll take the shop weeks to do it on recall I'm sure.

Well,my blue connector was a bit melty at the ground wire as Bailey reckoned. So I did the ground bypass to the blue connector (as per Kanadian Ken) but it hasn't made any difference. Hmm. I'm out of ideas (not that I had many to start).

Maybe try to re-seat the connector on the ECM and it might be worth testing to see if you are getting voltage to the connector at the fuel pump. That would give an indication whether it's a fuel pump/ground issue or instead one of the relays is not passing power.

I have no voltage at fuel pump and none of the front relays sound like they are clicking when the ignition is switched on. I'm wondering if I should just get the new front harness and put it on. Sure seems like the issue might be in there. I don't mind paying for it as it'll take the shop weeks to do it on recall I'm sure.

Still sounds like the front harness isn't Grounding! it's only point of ground for all though relays & bank sensor(fuel) is the single ground in teh Blue connector! :unsure:
Can I ask how you did the repair? The front half of the harness(front sub harness) is the side needing a ground the most.
You can really test it buy stuffing a wire into the green wire pin on the front side of the blue harness and touch it to a good ground and with teh key on the fuel pump should fire instantly if that's the issue.
There were a few rare other issues(see "Vtec elec problems") but the bround wire fix cured 90% of the bikes with aproblem.

BR

Well,my blue connector was a bit melty at the ground wire as Bailey reckoned. So I did the ground bypass to the blue connector (as per Kanadian Ken) but it hasn't made any difference. Hmm. I'm out of ideas (not that I had many to start).

Still sounds like the front harness isn't Grounding! it's only point of ground for all though relays & bank sensor(fuel) is the single ground in teh Blue connector! :fing02:
Can I ask how you did the repair? The front half of the harness(front sub harness) is the side needing a ground the most.

BR

I "repaired" it by splicing a wire into the front side of the harness onto the green ground wire, and then grounding it to the same place Ken did (i.e. right to the frame. I know it's a good ground point b/c I checked it for voltage by connecting to the battery postive terminal and got a good reading).

I'll do some more searching as well. I've read all the electrical threads through the years and have done many of the "upgrades" (eg. VFRness, beefed up Main Fuse "B" harness).

Again, thanks for helping.

Make sure kill switch is on "Run", try pulling in the clutch w/ bike in neutral & try to start.

Check/Test the kickstand switch, kill switch, and clutch switch. Also check the connection for the bank angle sensor. Has the bike ever been down/crashed?

You mentioned that your starter relay was melted. Are you sure that's not where your problem lies? When mine did that everything visibly looked ok but I wasn't getting any power through there even though both fuses were still good.

You mentioned that your starter relay was melted. Are you sure that's not where your problem lies? When mine did that everything visibly looked ok but I wasn't getting any power through there even though both fuses were still good.

This is a good suggestion. Tonight I'm going to cut off the old connector from the harness and connect each wire directly to the relay connectors just to be sure. (I'm going to order new connectors at some point from Tightwad.)

I haven't yet checked the side-stand switch or the clutch switch - I'll check those tonight too. (Only so much time after work!) I can't check the bank-angle sensor at this point b/c none of the relays seem to be getting power. The bike has never been crashed or otherwise abused. It's got 125,000km on the clock and was running brilliantly.

Guys, I really appreciate all the help. I've got next week off, so I'm hoping I can get this sorted out as I was hoping to get away for a couple of days.

Well after much effort I've found the issue and thought I'd give an update in case it may help someone else someday. . It was the bank angle sensor. It wasn't passing ground through to the engine stop relay. So I've removed it and shorted the grounds at it's connector until I replace it.

I think what might have happened is that when the main/front harness connector melted at the ground wire, the front harness lost most (or all) of it's ground and tried to get it all through the angle sensor ground, which couldn't handle the load at startup and it fried.

Anyway I've got a new front harness on the way (recalled version) and in the meantime I should be good to go. Hope so, as I'm heading out for a two day trip to the adirondacks tomorrow.

Thanks for the help guys.

Congrats on finding and then sharing the fix! :huh:


I actually might have a bank angle sensor issue on my Vtec track bike which was stumbling for a 1500-2000 rpm range somewhere between 7-10k but only when flicking it left and right, not going straight! http://www.vfrdiscus...tyle_emoticons/default/huh.gif

BR