I just saw a disturbing article and wanted to bring it to peoples attention
who are running or considering running Pilot Road 3s.
I learned of this article from my brother and googled it.
These pics are taken from the fz6 forum and are the property of the forum/owner?
Link to the original topic HERE.
The whole thing just sounds too strange and disturbing to pass the smell test IMHO.
After the rear disintegrated from heat and after noticing heat build-up on the front tire, the guy still kept riding the same front tire, which had caused him to do a head dive into the back of his SO's truck...
This plus the lack of similar reports from others who have used these tires makes it a suspect.
I don't have the facts to doubt his words, I'm just saying that the scant facts at hand make it sound a bit... odd.
This guy is claiming he has 10,000 miles on that tire? Jeez they don't even look worn that much, another guy said he has 16k? I don't anywhere near that kind of milage. Somthing don't sound right?
[image: View Post]Rice, on 27 June 2011 - 01:26 PM, said:
Link to the original topic HERE.
The whole thing just sounds too strange and disturbing to pass the smell test IMHO.
After the rear disintegrated from heat and after noticing heat build-up on the front tire, the guy still kept riding the same front tire, which had caused him to do a head dive into the back of his SO's truck...
This plus the lack of similar reports from others who have used these tires makes it a suspect.
I don't have the facts to doubt his words, I'm just saying that the scant facts at hand make it sound a bit... odd.
I was only trying to inform members to perhaps follow this information as it progresses and or look for simular problems so it can be documented
I was only concerned for safety of members such as yourself and not to cause a discussion on fact or fiction or imply that it is a bad set of tires.
[image: View Post]y2kRC46, on 27 June 2011 - 01:32 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Rice, on 27 June 2011 - 01:26 PM, said:
Link to the original topic HERE.
The whole thing just sounds too strange and disturbing to pass the smell test IMHO.
After the rear disintegrated from heat and after noticing heat build-up on the front tire, the guy still kept riding the same front tire, which had caused him to do a head dive into the back of his SO's truck...
This plus the lack of similar reports from others who have used these tires makes it a suspect.
I don't have the facts to doubt his words, I'm just saying that the scant facts at hand make it sound a bit... odd.
I was only trying to inform members to perhaps follow this information as it progresses and or look for simular problems so it can be documented
I was only concerned for safety of members such as yourself and not to cause a discussion on fact or fiction or imply that it is a bad set of tires.
RIDER SAFETY was my only concern
Regards
P
I wouldn't worry about it bro. I'm sure nobody is up in arms about that. I personally enjoy threads like this as more times that I can remember it leads to some kind of rider error or oversight or neglect on the rider that should be brought out in the light anways. Not to shun the guy who wrecked. It might save a poor noobs life like myself by taking something for granted like Tire Wear or "thinking" something is going to be fine, when in reality it isn't.
I don't know what it is but something is going on there. I've run several sets of michelins with no problems. I hope dude finds an answer and gets his bike, body and tires squared away soon.
Hopefully it is not a bad batch of tires, I would not like to see other riders safety jeopardized as well.
Link to the original topic HERE. The whole thing just sounds too strange and disturbing to pass the smell test IMHO. After the rear disintegrated from heat and after noticing heat build-up on the front tire, the guy still kept riding the same front tire, which had caused him to do a head dive into the back of his SO's truck... This plus the lack of similar reports from others who have used these tires makes it a suspect.
I don't have the facts to doubt his words, I'm just saying that the scant facts at hand make it sound a bit... odd.
I was only trying to inform members to perhaps follow this information as it progresses and or look for simular problems so it can be documented I was only concerned for safety of members such as yourself and not to cause a discussion on fact or fiction or imply that it is a bad set of tires.
RIDER SAFETY was my only concern Regards P
There will be discussions, but no one is directing them at you. It's good that you brought this up, no matter what the end result will be on these tyres.
10,000 miles on a tire that has only been available in the US and Canada since March - that's a lot of riding in just a few months. Both tires blowing? I'm guessing it is a catastrophic failure due to hitting an obstacle on the road. Smells fishy�.
This guy is claiming he has 10,000 miles on that tire? Jeez they don't even look worn that much, another guy said he has 16k? I don't anywhere near that kind of milage. Somthing don't sound right?
I looked at the odometer on the FZ6 (His was a 2006 model) that was wrecked, it shows 10,000 miles, unless it came with PR3's back in 2006, he didn't put 10K on those tires.
Couldn't be for sure if it was the trip meter or odometer, but most trip meters only goes up to 999 miles
+1 I've never gotten 10K out of any tire on any of my bikes. PR2 rear on the VFR lasted about 5000, and it was freakin' done. Granted the FZ6 is a fairly light bike, but the best I ever got out of ST tires on my ZX600 was 6-7K to the wear bars.
There are other factors we don't know about, like what speed and for how long, and tyre pressure, or did he run over something and was losing air at speed.(I'm not over looking what the owner said, but what it could be if he was off in his statement).
What needs to be done is to send it to Michelin, I'm sure they'd love to check it over(as mentioned earlier).
Hell I'm buying a Yamaha next time if you can get 10,000 miles out of a rear tire.
Dude. I got 9,000 out of a PR2 - but only a few hundred of that was in Tennessee or anywhere similar. :biggrin:
The FZ6 guy claimed to be a stickler for tire pressures because he had a blowout on the freeway at 130 in a Mustang.
It's a shame he plowed into his ol' lady's car, but if you are doing 130 mph on the freeway in a cage and don't get the hint about tire failure - well, you need to shut up, buy a new bike, and move on.
As has been said, something don't add up. I'll stick to PR2s as long as they make them, and it wouldn't be because of this incident.
According to the OP in the FZ6 thread he was running 85 mph on the freeway in 100+ degree heat with 33F / 36 R tire pressures. Those pressures sound pretty low to me - I don't have an FZ6 manual but both my vfr and 600rr manuals call for 36/42 so I'd assume the Yamaha would be similar. So it sounds to me like they were underinflated given the conditions. Pretty scary results, nonetheless, if the story is true.
Not that I'm a tire expert, but even if the tires were run with low pressure in ridiculous conditions with a huge load, they shouldn't fail like that should they? The tread shouldn't be able to be pulled apart by your fingers on the tire.
As for his credibility, I read through the entire thread, and he said he bought another tire and paid out of his own pocket for that one. He just left the old tire at the dealership for the Michelin guys to evaluate, but they didn't bother after two weeks to contact the dealer to pick up the tire, so he went back and picked it up himself after his front tire shredded and caused the accident. Sounds like he was figuring it was a freak thing on the rear tire, but when the front went out awhile later he figured something more was going on. Tread seperation can happen, ask Firestone.
I think I believe this guy is legit in his issues, but I do wonder what the heck also, because the whole thing sounds very unlikely.
I gonna have to agree with a few of the other skeptics, there is absolutely no way those tires have 10000 miles on them. Something smells fishy in Denmark. We've been had. 36lb in the rear, must have hanlded like crap. I mean come on, a NASA calibrated pressure checker and he runs them a 36...WTF! :laughing6-hehe:
33lbs in the front isn't much higher then we run in DOT race tires. 29-31 depending. I had a Michelin Pilot Race do that to me at Jennings because of an increase in track temp and me not compensating with air pressure in the rear. Took a HUGE section out of it. I don't blame that on the tire tho.
I'd be curious if the OP had to add air before the given ride(s). I know he said they were "spot" on, but still leaves open the possibility for a leak...goes back to debris or valve stems, etc. We have a tire at work (PR2) that is de-laminated on the inside, but that is from a blowout and subsequent 5 mile ride home. Damage looks almost identical tho. Definitely keeping an eye on this considering i sell quite a few motorcycle tires... would hate to have another Power 2ct fiasco.
I'm not a big tire expert, but that rear looks like it participated in a very long, power brake, smokey burnout.
The front tire shredded at 35 mph. Really? Those tires are designed for what, 150 mph+? Even with a serious flaw I can't imagine it shredding at 35. Why was he so close to the car? Couldn't he use the rear brake to stop the bike when the front started shredding? He didn't say it exploded, he said shredded. He must have had a few seconds to slow the bike down. Something smells fishy.
Maybe he was impressing his woman with a wheelie, realized how close he was to her car, slammed the rear brake, and the front tire blew as it slammed the ground/car and he slammed through the window.
He is probably hesitant to hire an attorney because, well, maybe something like this happened.
I just saw a disturbing article and wanted to bring it to peoples attention who are running or considering running Pilot Road 3s. I learned of this article from my brother and googled it. These pics are taken from the fz6 forum and are the property of the forum/owner?
His front tire failed as well resulting in a crash. I will not post the crash pictures.
Please be careful and check your tires before a ride no matter what brand you may have mounted!
Regards, P
I"ve read the original post, and some things don't sound quite right to me... I have to call BS on this one.
- the poster claimed 10,000 on the tires but they look like fairly new tires that may have went through a long burnout or extended high-speed run (based on the tread depth and tire discoloration).I've ran over a tire stop strip, a series of caltrops placed in the road, and different metal object fallen off cars.... each time the damage to my tires was very close to that pictured. The pictures really look to me like the rider ran over something in the road.
- The poster claimed the front tires "shredded" at 35 mph. I've had front tires go flat on me at over 100+ mph, and not crashed into cars or other objects on the road because of it - and I'm certainly no Evel Knievel. The only way you run under a vehicle at 35 mph, even with a completely flat front tire, is by following too closely or hitting black ice or an oil slick - yet the poster claimed this was a clear dry day and the photos seem to support that. Legally, almost anytime you rear-end another vehicle you are presumed to be following too closely. He doesn't show a very clear picture of the front tire, but even a completely flat front tire wouldn't have caused this accident.
IMO Spike's squiddly scenario is much more likely. Especially since the poster hasn't provided any more details to back up his story. I'm just sayin'.
According to the OP in the FZ6 thread he was running 85 mph on the freeway in 100+ degree heat with 33F / 36 R tire pressures. Those pressures sound pretty low to me - I don't have an FZ6 manual but both my vfr and 600rr manuals call for 36/42 so I'd assume the Yamaha would be similar. So it sounds to me like they were underinflated given the conditions. Pretty scary results, nonetheless, if the story is true.
You hit the nail on the head so to speak. Having been a semi driver, the main cause for those blowouts is underinflation even when using retreads.
I have about 2500miles on my PR3s (yammy R1) and wear is perfect but I am anal about my tire pressure (keep it at recommended spec). The thread in question just reeks of rider error and stupidity. While I am interested to check back on it to see the outcome I am not worried about my current set of PR3s at all. They are a fantastic tire so far. Just like the PR2s.
I have been using pilot roads for years now and the most I have ever gotten out of a rear tire is 6.5k males taking it easy, at least 12 sets and never had that kind of milage nor that kind of wear. I can only think of one recall by Michelin in all the years I have used them on Pilot powers, specific to a certain plant in Spain if I remember correctly. All I can say is I would need more proof, more reports to stop using Michlins. this thread is just too fishy too me - BUT now I will be looking for it in the forums I visit. Searching for other similar reports.
Looks like Michelin is looking into it, all the reports I have seen are comming from this one incident. I also recall a famous motogp race where a Michelin came apart on Valintino Rossi, but thats a race tire under extreme circumstances.
[image: View Post]y2kRC46, on 27 June 2011 - 01:32 PM, said:
[image: View Post]Rice, on 27 June 2011 - 01:26 PM, said:
Link to the original topic HERE.
The whole thing just sounds too strange and disturbing to pass the smell test IMHO.
After the rear disintegrated from heat and after noticing heat build-up on the front tire, the guy still kept riding the same front tire, which had caused him to do a head dive into the back of his SO's truck...
This plus the lack of similar reports from others who have used these tires makes it a suspect.
I don't have the facts to doubt his words, I'm just saying that the scant facts at hand make it sound a bit... odd.
I was only trying to inform members to perhaps follow this information as it progresses and or look for simular problems so it can be documented
I was only concerned for safety of members such as yourself and not to cause a discussion on fact or fiction or imply that it is a bad set of tires.
RIDER SAFETY was my only concern
Regards
P
My comments weren't directed at you. I just called BS on the story.
My own tires will be due soon and I'll be sure to stay away from the 3s until the dust settles. Just in case.
Thanks for posting this.
[image: View Post]deanc1963, on 28 June 2011 - 09:44 AM, said:
He doesn't show a very clear picture of the front tire
Yeah, I wold like to see a pic of the front tire too. The rear doen't look like it has been hot at all, the surface looks too smooth, but then again, those are just phone pics..
[image: View Post]checksix, on 27 June 2011 - 09:24 PM, said:
According to the OP in the FZ6 thread he was running 85 mph on the freeway in 100+ degree heat with 33F / 36 R tire pressures. Those pressures sound pretty low to me - I don't have an FZ6 manual but both my vfr and 600rr manuals call for 36/42 so I'd assume the Yamaha would be similar. So it sounds to me like they were underinflated given the conditions. Pretty scary results, nonetheless, if the story is true.
Browsing the Michelin PR3 facebook page I noticed one person requested a recommended tire pressure for a 2007 FZ6. Michelin responded with 33.5 psi front and 42 psi rear, so he was pretty low on the rear if he kept it at 36 psi.
I also think his claim of just under 10k on the tires is BS. There is alot of tread left in those pics for there to be 10k on them. I don't recall hear very many peopl break the 10k mark on the PR2's and I can't imagine the PR3's life is going to that much greater than the PR2. The most I've ever heard anyone get on a sport touring rear tire is 14k that my buddy got on a Metzler Z6 rear tire.
The fact that the guy admits to a 130mph crash in a Mustang on the highway tells me he's probably not very bright and a risk taker.
[image: View Post]Spike, on 27 June 2011 - 10:04 PM, said:
I'm not a big tire expert, but that rear looks like it participated in a very long, power brake, smokey burnout.
I thought the same thing. It could just be a weird light angle on the tires or something but the center of my tires is a nice matte black due to normal contact with the rough surface of the asphalt. That guy's rear tire center looks shiny and smooth like it's been doing burn outs.
Why Would I go to Spacebook or Myface to get tire pressure recommendations? Whats wrong with the owners manual???
I mean just lookit all the dang warning stickers all over the bike! The tire pressures are clearly posted!!
And yes, 33/36 sounds low to me. On the track, with slicks, and taking into account track temps plus cold/hot tire pressures, maybe that might work for some bike on some track on some day, but your typical street pressures with street tires are generally higher. Plus it makes your bike steer heavier, which kinda sucks.
interesting, whilst I havent read the thread it question I'll make a comment about distances on tyres
I'm on my first set of michelins previously I've been running dunlop roadsmarts;
I've have a pilot power 2ct on the front which has given me 6k klm and is ready for a change and a pilot road 2ct on the rear which is still going strong at 6k klm
tyre wear is so much about four factors
1. tyre pressure
2. road conditions
3. temperature
4. that black thing on the right hand side of the bike
with the dunlops I would get 10K klm out of the rear with the front being well and truly shagged so i'm interested to see how many klm's I get out of the rear
i've purposely put a sports tyre on the front because I wanted the extra grip and at only $95 from jakewilson.com its still far far cheaper to get two fronts for one rear using that website than getting tyres here in australia; a set would cost well over $550 were as online I can get a set delivered for $300
go jakewilson.com and the mighty aussie dollar :thumbsup
[image: View Post]avartie, on 29 June 2011 - 06:26 AM, said:
interesting, whilst I havent read the thread it question I'll make a comment about distances on tyres
I'm on my first set of michelins previously I've been running dunlop roadsmarts;
I've have a pilot power 2ct on the front which has given me 6k klm and is ready for a change and a pilot road 2ct on the rear which is still going strong at 6k klm
tyre wear is so much about four factors
1. tyre pressure
2. road conditions
3. temperature
4. that black thing on the right hand side of the bike
with the dunlops I would get 10K klm out of the rear with the front being well and truly shagged so i'm interested to see how many klm's I get out of the rear
i've purposely put a sports tyre on the front because I wanted the extra grip and at only $95 from jakewilson.com its still far far cheaper to get two fronts for one rear using that website than getting tyres here in australia; a set would cost well over $550 were as online I can get a set delivered for $300
go jakewilson.com and the mighty aussie dollar :thumbsup
So do you fit them yourself, and what about balancing?
How long does postage take?
I'm thinking of going that way. We get ripped off here it seems.
interesting, whilst I havent read the thread it question I'll make a comment about distances on tyres
I'm on my first set of michelins previously I've been running dunlop roadsmarts; I've have a pilot power 2ct on the front which has given me 6k klm and is ready for a change and a pilot road 2ct on the rear which is still going strong at 6k klm
tyre wear is so much about four factors 1. tyre pressure 2. road conditions 3. temperature 4. that black thing on the right hand side of the bike
with the dunlops I would get 10K klm out of the rear with the front being well and truly shagged so i'm interested to see how many klm's I get out of the rear i've purposely put a sports tyre on the front because I wanted the extra grip and at only $95 from jakewilson.com its still far far cheaper to get two fronts for one rear using that website than getting tyres here in australia; a set would cost well over $550 were as online I can get a set delivered for $300
go jakewilson.com and the mighty aussie dollar :thumbsup
So do you fit them yourself, and what about balancing? How long does postage take? I'm thinking of going that way. We get ripped off here it seems.
delivery takes around 3 - 4 days and I go to a bike mechanic to get them fitted & balanced which costs between $50 - $80 depending on time spent
so it could cost up to $380 for a set of tyres bought and fitted still a great value when you consider a rear costs that much itself
I have been using Michelin's almost completely faithfully with the exception of a couple fantastic deals that I got with another manufacturer and I normally regretted it. Just last week I removed the stockers from the bike and put on a set of the new Pilot Road 3 and I couldn't be much happier.
Before each ride I visually inspect all external moving parts of the bike including tire tread and pressure. Reading the post from the guy, I'm suspecting an I-D-10-T error on his part that he either did wrong on or off the road which could include inproper pressures. As far as pressures, I try to stick somewhat close to factory specs but with all tires being different, the perfect operating pressures will also vary. So far I'm running -2psi on the front and haven't touched the rear yet. My race tires get 30psi front and 24psi rear as recommended by the Michelin tire man.
I too will be searching all forums here and far for more info regarding this particular problem but I still believe that since the tires have been out for a few months already, we would have seen more info about failures from others if it were a manufacturing defect.
jiminey Christmas, that forum is messssed up. The went off the rails and started flaming each other on the 3rd page. AND there are 7 nonsensical pages to follow.
jiminey Christmas, that forum is messssed up. The went off the rails and started flaming each other on the 3rd page. AND there are 7 nonsensical pages to follow.
jiminey Christmas, that forum is messssed up. The went off the rails and started flaming each other on the 3rd page. AND there are 7 nonsensical pages to follow.
Jeeze ........I feel like F.Scott Fitzgerald now.
You think thats bad, check out a Blackberry or iPhone forum, your head will just explode, trying to find anything useful...