I just got back from a 2800 km ride through the Appalachians during which I picked up a nail or similar. It's in the centre of the tire, about the diameter of a bicycle spoke. It wasn't leaking until I messed with it now the tire is loosing about one psi per day. The tire was new at the beginning of the trip (Bridgestone T-31) and the puncture happened half way through a seven day ride.
I took it to my local bike shop and the mechanic said that he no longer repairs tires and that no one will anymore. Liability issues.
Call around. There is probably a shop nearby who will plug it properly. Look for an independent moto garage. The mushroom plugs (plugged from inside the tire) are better than the twisted rope type, in my opinion. I have ridden plugged tires for thousands of miles, and would not hesitate to do it again.
Got one of these, and some gas bottles to pump the tire up along with a hi pressure hand pump. Haven't had to use the tool on my bike yet BUT used it to repair a mates car tire and it worked well. Simple to use, compact and works well.
I've heard that it's not advisable to ride on a plugged motorcycle tire if the plug is the twisted rope type applied from the outside. If you must use that style in an emergency, the tire should be replaced as soon as possible.
The mushroom type from the inside is what I was hoping the shop would do for me.
The same thing happened to me during the last SumSum in Montrose. I plugged it with a twisted rope type and road it directly to the sponsors bike shop and had a new set of tires installed. Thanks to MotorMike who had ordered a set to be delivered during the meet-up but did not need them.
I'd never trust a repaired tire. Too Much At Stake.
THE CHOICE
The choice is yours but I'd start plugging because there is mounting
evidence that plugged tires work and are safe... I have yet to note
anyone armed with first hand knowledge to the contrary...
REPAIRS
Minor tire repair is limited to an area of three quarters of the
normal section width. The maximum diameter of penetration damage
and/or cracking at the base of the injury should be no greater than
3mm. The repair patches must not overlap.
For permanent repair,it is only recommended that small punctures
restricted to the tread area be repaired, using a rope type plug. The
current condition of a tire is important in determining whether a tire
is suitable for repair. Some damage limits include: if the tire has
reached its minimum tread depth as indicated by the TWI (tire wear
indicator); ply separation, separation of inner liner and or cutting
of ply cords by penetrating object; brittle or cracked rubber caused
by exhaust heat; broken or bent bead wire, damaged bead zone; damage
caused by under-inflation; softening or swelling of rubber due to oil
or chemical attack; punctures too close together; damage or previous
repair of a puncture outside of area specified for suitable repair. [image: 300607829_6ab1a4c4fc_o.jpg]
MY EXPERIENCES
My screwed Rennsport... boo hoo... [image: 496520122_af50b796c5_o.jpg]
My plugged Rennsport that covered 2K miles and not in moderation
either... it's seen over a 140 mph more than once... [image: 1367272260_7813226a08_o.jpg]
Inside the Rennsport for proof that the rope type plugs stay intact
whereas my mushroom type plug started to come unstuck
[image: 1367272268_68c4474380_o.jpg]
You can see by the diagram that Safety Seal plugs that are installed
properly establish an mushroom shape inside the carcass that holds
fast under pressure... you'd have more luck pushing the plug inside
carcass than you'll ever have it pop out under pressure... [image: gallery_3131_51_10376.jpg]
I don't recommend the inside mushroom type plugs because they can become unstuck... [image: attachment.php?attachmentid=481999&stc=1]
Technically speaking the inside patch is solely dependent on a bond
between a plug company's material and the tire manufacture's rubber
compound... thats a crap shoot the two chemical compounds are
compatible enough to hold a bond when the rubber is stationary and at
room temperature... but tires are elastic bodies that flex from
completely round to completely flat at every rotation... every
rotation builds heat that works against that bond... every rotation
flexes that mushroom patch from round to flat that works against that
bond.... so we have heat coupled with flex working against the two
competing chemical bonds from being as consistence as a self
vulcanizing rope plug installed from the outside...
Staying stuck and holding air is all you can ask for in a plug
installed by the masses... [image: 1367272268_68c4474380_o.jpg]
I’ve used both interior and exterior plugs with no trouble. Exterior rope plug cause I found a quarter inch Phillips bit stick in my tire at Seb’s Fall meet on the morning of a 1000 mile ride home. Made it home and left it in until the tire was worn out. It did take a little more vigilance with checking tire pressure but it’s not going to fail catastrophically.
Before I was changing my own tires I would take my Nighthawk to a little independent shop. I jokingly accused them of installing a magnet inside every time they put a new one on because it seemed like I would get a flat within a couple weeks. So I’d take it back and get a plug that would last until the tire was worn out. (Maybe 2 or 3 times it happened)
I've used the sticky rope plugs twice recently and not had one fail in subsequent use. For my last puncture (tyre 1000km old) I took it back to the shop and got them to fit an internal mushroom patch, I feel better about the integrity of those over the long term but don't have any evidence to say the sticky rope would fail. I think Buzzner is quite right that they won't fail catastrophically in any case.
If the hole is not in the sidewall, I'll pay to have the tire shipped to me and take it off your hands.that way you dont have to pay the disposal fee at the stealer...see I'm saving you money!
Thanks for the offer gr8vfr. It's about a 20 hour ride to your place for me so I'm going to pass.
As can be seen, the puncture is quite small and I'm currently only loosing about 0.5psi per day. The Canadian dime used for scale is the same size as an American dime. The value however is unfortunately the same as an American 7.5 cent piece 😞
I'm just living with it for now but I'm sure I should be removing it and plugging the hole. A plug will be much larger than the existing hole but I guess that would make for a good seal.
Thanks for the offer gr8vfr. It's about a 20 hour ride to your place for me so I'm going to pass.
As can be seen, the puncture is quite small and I'm currently only loosing about 0.5psi per day. The Canadian dime used for scale is the same size as an American dime. The value however is unfortunately the same as an American 7.5 cent piece 😞
I'm just living with it for now but I'm sure I should be removing it and plugging the hole. A plug will be much larger than the existing hole but I guess that would make for a good seal.
[image: IMG_7699.JPG]
[image: IMG_7700.JPG]
You need to plug that with sticky rope, inside mushroom patch et al ... you never know when it will let loose and you're riding down the road on a flat tire...THAT is a safety hazard...MUCH more so than a plugged tire.
I will. I'll get some sticky rope. Up until my original post, I was under the impression that stuff was a last resort. Sounds like it's the way to go here. Simplest, least expensive and recommended.
The BEST is the Nealey Tire Repair Kit from a little family run place in Iowa. Been using them for years. My current rear tire (anybody ever have a puncture on the front!?) has over 2000 miles on it with a Nealey plug in it. No leaks, never had a problem with one. About 12 bucks for the small kit.
The BEST is the Nealey Tire Repair Kit from a little family run place in Iowa. Been using them for years. My current rear tire (anybody ever have a puncture on the front!?) has over 2000 miles on it with a Nealey plug in it. No leaks, never had a problem with one. About 12 bucks for the small kit.
I was told a theory one that the front tire lines up the object to then spear into the rear tire. I can’t recall a front flat.
My current rear tire (anybody ever have a puncture on the front!?)
In 50 years worth of riding my front has suffered punctures but the majority have been the rear... my theory is the bigger the contact patch the more chance of finding stuff...
I will. I'll get some sticky rope. Up until my original post, I was under the impression that stuff was a last resort. Sounds like it's the way to go here. Simplest, least expensive and recommended.
Self vulcanizing ropes are in whereas inside mushroom plugs are out...
rope stays stuck even if I allow my customers to install it themselves...
Technically speaking the mushroom patch are solely dependent on a bond
between a plug company's material and the tire manufacture's rubber
compound... thats a crap shoot the two chemical compounds are
compatible enough to hold a bond when the rubber is stationary and at
room temperature... but tires are elastic bodies that flex from
completely round to completely flat at every rotation... every
rotation builds heat that works against that bond... every rotation
flexes that mushroom patch from round to flat that works against that
bond.... so we have heat coupled with flex working against the two
competing chemical bonds from being as consistence as a self
vulcanizing rope plug installed from the outside...
Staying stuck and holding air is all you can ask for in a plug
installed by the masses... [image: 1367272268_68c4474380_o.jpg]
In 50 years worth of riding my front has suffered punctures but the majority have been the rear... my theory is the bigger the contact patch the more chance of finding stuff...
[image: ContactPatch3.JPG]
[image: ContactPatch2.JPG]
My theory is that an object lying flat on the road gets flicked up by the front tyre and can then embed in the rear. I got more punctures on rear bicycle tyres than fronts even though they are the same size.
I got a tire repair kit and pulled the object out of my tire. It looks like part of a pallet staple or similar. It's so narrow that the reaming tool and the tire repair needle will not fit into the hole. Unfortunately it looks like I should I try to enlarge the hole somehow. Recommendations?
I got a tire repair kit and pulled the object out of my tire. It looks like part of a pallet staple or similar. It's so narrow that the reaming tool and the tire repair needle will not fit into the hole. Unfortunately it looks like I should I try to enlarge the hole somehow. Recommendations?
[image: tire_staple.jpg]
When I did a repair on the road the punctureing object went in at an angle. And the puncture hole was much smaller that the rope plug. I had to ream the hole larger with the rough-edged screwdriver look-a-like in the top of the picture.
Good luck with your repair. Please post up your results.
That thing won't go in the hole. Mind you the tire was flat within less than a minute. I'm wondering if I should take a drill bit to it. Not that I want to mind you.😬
That thing won't go in the hole. Mind you the tire was flat within less than a minute. I'm wondering if I should take a drill bit to it. Not that I want to mind you.😬
I had to forcibly jam it in the hole effectively enlarging the punch hole. It took considerable elbow grease.
Extract the tools from their cheezey handles and then chuck them up in your cordless drill this will give you more power to ream the hole and more power the push the plug in... stand over the puncture at the 12 O Clock position so you push down with your whole body...
I a similar size nail puncture my rear tire last weekend. I have put 3 plugs but it’s still leaking air. I wonder if an internal plug is my only chance at this point to resurrect this tire?
I a similar size nail puncture my rear tire last weekend. I have put 3 plugs but it’s still leaking air. I wonder if an internal plug is my only chance at this point to resurrect this tire?
If I were in this situation I'd consider the tire burnt toast. Chalk the price pain up to the great feelings new tires can bring to your riding.
I a similar size nail puncture my rear tire last weekend. I have put 3 plugs but it’s still leaking air. I wonder if an internal plug is my only chance at this point to resurrect this tire?
The problem with an inside combi plug is finding a tire shop willing to take on the liability for such little profit...
Steps they risk of not getting it right and being sued if it things go wrong...
1) Remove wheel from bike...
2) Remove tire from wheel...
3) Break out the power tools and prepare carcass in accordance to
instructions and don't forget the special cleaner...
4). Apply glue to the reamer pushed through the hole after buffing/cleaning...
5) Insert combi plug and employ pliers to pull it through, employ pizza roller to press patch flat, trim excess...
6) Install tire on wheel and Rebalance the tire and wheel...
7)Install wheel on bike...
8)Inflate tire to proper PSI and leak check...
I'm afraid liability is a real problem for it holds back many a good people from helping...
consequently the task shifts back to DIY 3 step self vulcanizing rope to resurrect the tire...
1) Ream hole with tool provided in the kit...
2) Insert rope with tool provided in the kit and trim excess...
3) Inflate tire to proper PSI...
inside plug patch is the only "safe' way to repair.
I disagree... even when I "Clean, grind, clean, ream, glue, wait, glue,
wait, apply, seal, trim." a inside mushroom plug... there is
the problem of consistency that I can not guarantee it will stay
stuck... where as the self vulcanizing rope stays stuck even if I
allow the customer to install it themselves...
Technically speaking the inside patch is solely dependent on a bond
between a plug company's material and the tire manufacture's rubber
compound... thats a crap shoot the two chemical compounds are
compatible enough to hold a bond when the rubber is stationary and at
room temperature... but tires are elastic bodies designed to flex from
completely round to completely flat at every rotation... every
rotation builds heat that works against that bond... every rotation
flexes that mushroom patch from round to flat that works against that
bond.... so we have heat coupled with flex working against the two
competing chemical bonds from being as consistence as a self
vulcanizing rope plug installed from the outside...
Staying stuck and holding air is all you can ask for in a plug
installed by the masses... [image: 1367272268_68c4474380_o.jpg]
Yeah, I’d be always worried about riding with patched up tire anyways.
For some riders tire plugs are unsafe... they would spend too much
attention on the plug and not enough on where they're going and what
they're are doing... it short it's a barrier for which only a new
tire can solve... so even thought they find the right words
to express their fear... I still respect their choice...
I think we all can agree that riding is all about over coming
barriers... whether psychological... (I feel like I'm going too fast)
to mechanical... (my rev limiter kicked in)...
I think we all can agree that riding is all about over coming
barriers... whether psychological... (I feel like I'm going too fast)
to mechanical... (my rev limiter kicked in)...
Amen to that; you can only ride as fast as you feel comfortable and confident. If there is a nagging doubt in the back of your mind that all is not well, it is better to address that than keep riding.
And thanks for the rational discussion about plugs vs internal patches. The photo of the expanded plug inside the tyre was a clincher for me, I confess the last puncture that I had caused me to visit my tyre vendor and get an internal mushroom installed.
I'm afraid liability is a real problem for it holds back many a good people from helping...
consequently the task shifts back to DIY 3 step self vulcanizing rope to resurrect the tire...
My local tire shop absolutely refused via phone call to repair a nearly new PR4 with a center-of-tread puncture several years ago. I wanted him to do it because they had repaired several car tires for me over the years with zero issues using a combination patch/plug. I took the tire off the wheel and went over anyway. The owner said, "I told you we won't do motorcycle tires." I replied, "This tire has less than 1,000 miles on it. It is getting repaired whether you do it or I do it. I would rather a professional do it." I continued, "Let's make this a cash transaction with no receipt and I was never here." In a huff, he said OK and repaired the tire while walking me through the steps. After he was done he refused my cash and reinforced, "You were never here." I put another 9,000 miles on that tire with zero issues.
I should really buy a box of Xtra Seal combis, a reamer, burnisher, solvent and cement but they would probably go stale before I needed another.
And thanks for the rational discussion about plugs vs internal patches. The photo of the expanded plug inside the tyre was a clincher for me, I confess the last puncture that I had caused me to visit my tyre vendor and get an internal mushroom installed.
Each to their own, but if you are stuck in a foreign country on a Sunday with a nail stuck out of your tire, all reservations about safe repair or not will disappear. Been there done that and now I carry a stop and go kit to do my own roadside repairs.
I plugged it with the string type and will give it a road test tomorrow. So far it's holding air just fine and I anticipate no further problems.
Because the hole was so small, I ran a 1/8 inch drill bit through and was only then able to get the rasping tool and the string inserting tool into the hole. I could hear some steel belts crunching / breaking as I did so and that didn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling.
If I were to do it over, I would have inserted more string into the hole as I ended up cutting about 3/4 of an inch off of the part left hanging (two bits at 3/8 each). That's after leaving a quarter inch to be worn off by the road as per instructions.
I've been mounting, balancing, and repaired many flats for 10 years now. Installed almost 1000 tires now. I've seen many tires that were repaired with the "sticky rope". When I asked the owner of the tire about the repair in the tire, many of them have said they picked up a nail while on a ride a few years ago and never had another problem with it so they left it in until the tread was worn down. The sticky rope works very good as long as it's fresh and has not been dried out. If you brought your tire to me to be fixed I'd remove the tire from the wheel and install the 2" diameter patch with the rubber stem pulled through the puncture. With a small puncture right in the middle of the tread I'd have no problem or reservations repairing this tire. I would advise you to watch the air pressure for a couple of weeks, daily checks to make sure the patch is doing it's job and the speed rating of the tire is no longer valid...take it easy on the tire, NO track days of course.
Regarding the Stop N Go "mushroom plugs" that are inserted from the outside and expand to a mushroom head on the inside, they are no good. I've heard reports on other forums they come out.
End of thread · 45 posts recoveredWayback Machine snapshot 25 Aug 2019