Led Headlight Install - 5Th Gen

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I have been thinking about upgrading the headlights on my bike for a little while, among other things, and I had been searching about doing an HID upgrade. One of the drawbacks I can gather from using an HID upgrade to the headlights is that the HID bulbs use the existing headlight reflector and, since the bulb shines out in all directions the lights tend to create a LOT of glare towards oncoming traffic. Considering that I have trouble with the glare myself, I did not want to install something that would cause other drivers difficulty. Hence I did not want to install an HID system without also going to the extra effort of installing the projectors as well. This involved removing the lens of the headlight, removing the existing reflector, installing the retro-fit projectors, and was arguably not exactly a plug and play installation. I don't mind doing all that extra work, but mainly I was concerned with running extra wiring for the headlights, and honestly the cost was a LOT higher after factoring in the cost of the projectors. One of the kits I looked at was nearly $300 US complete with the projectors.

After reading a number of posts and a few threads about the HID's causing excess glare to oncoming traffic and the extra wiring implications because of the ballasts and current draw on start-up, I started thinking about an LED option. There are a number of cars on the market now that have LED headlights so I was sure that there must be an aftermarket option available and after about an hour or so on Google, there were a great many options.

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-Universal-Car-Truck-H4-1800LM-50W-Cree-LED-HeadLight-Head-lamp-H-L-Beam-W-/141105877873?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item20da90d371&vxp=mtr


The kit came complete with 2 ballasts, 2 -25W Cree LED bulbs, cooling fans, and easy to follow instructions. The kit showed up in less than 5 days after ordering and was VERY securely wrapped. The best thing about this whole kit was that it was very much Plug-And-Play. You simply mount the ballasts, install the bulbs, and plug in to the existing headlight connectors. It was literally that simple. Another nice thing about the kit is that the LED bulbs actually draw less power than the factory bulbs (25W each with the high beams on) and even less than the HID bulbs. The HID bulbs draw only 35W each (depending on the kit) once up to operating temperature but draw considerable power on start up. The LED's draw 50W total with the high beams on, as compared to the factory bulbs which would draw 90W total (45W each) with the high beams on. Not that any of us have ever had issues with the wiring on our VFR's, Noooooooooo, NEVER that, so I thought why not, power consumption is about the same and I had a burnt out headlight I needed to change anyhow.

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For those who noticed the pen that is supporting the lights, DENTIQUE is my company. I do Paintless Dent Repair for a living and I wanted to support the lights somehow so that they sat level, side by side, for the pictures and the pen just happened to be the proper height. No free advertising was intended and since very few of the members of this board reside near me I doubt that any financial gains shall result from the picture. LOL. My BAD.......... :unsure:
And now for the HOW TO part of the thread. :cheerleader:

Step One

First off you need to remove the upper cowl. Since I have already done a How-To description on removal of the 5th gen's upper cowl, here is a link to the thread on how to complete this part of the process.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/76765-how-to-upper-cowl-removal-on-5th-gen/#entry925804

Step Two

Once you have the upper cowl off the bike and a pile of parts on the floor you will need to go have a rest and grab yourself a beverage of some sort. This can be thirsty work and we don't want anyone to become dehydrated during the process of installing farkles on their motorcycle.

Removing the headlight is as easy as removing the four screws that attach the headlight to the back of the upper cowl. Remove the headlight from the cowl and find some place safe to set the cowl so it does not get stepped on, dropped, bashed, scratched, or otherwise damaged.

Step Three

You need to remove the existing bulbs from the headlight housing. Remove the big rubber gasket on each side of the headlight and you will see the bulbs are held in place with spring clips. Release the retainer clip swing it open and remove the bulb.


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Step Four

As you can see from the pictures, and you may have already discovered from previous headlight replacements, the factory bulbs (and the headlight housing) have positioning tabs that are set in different locations than a standard H4 bulb. The same thing can be said for the Cree LED bulbs. This leaves you with an interesting choice. You can either remove the two lower tabs (the narrower ones) tabs on your new $90 LED bulbs and let them sit in the housing, or you can install the bulbs using retainer rings. When I purchased my bike, it already had a set of retainer rings so I removed the tabs from the Cree bulbs and inserted the bulbs in to the housing as per usual. SEE, I told you this kit was simple to install. (I may have voided the warranty on the bulbs mind you as they are now, quote un-quote, modified). :warranty:

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Step Five

Pass the LED bulb wiring through the center of the large rubber gasket and then re-install the gasket on the back of the housing. So far, not much different than installing a regular H4 bulb, RIGHT, well, here's is where it changes. Now that you have the bulb installed and the wiring for the bulb hanging out in mid air, you have to install the cooling fan. This part can be a bit tricky to accomplish as the big rubber gasket sticks out above the bottom of the bulb. I found the easiest way to get this to work was to hold the bulb power wire and push it down against the gasket on one side of the bulb and center the fan on the threaded bolt sticking out on the base of the bulb and CAREFULLY screw the fan base on. The metal on the fan base is not exactly thick so be careful not to cross thread it when you screw it in place. This was probably the most annoying part of the install and it took more than a couple tries to get the threads started whilst holding the gasket and the wiring for the bulb out of the way.

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Eventually I came out victorious, as will you, and now you should have something resembling this finished product.

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Step Six

Now you have to figure out where to install the ballasts that provide the power to the LED bulbs and the cooling fans. The ballasts are not overly large but they do need to mounted securely, and let's face it, motorcycles are not known for there vast quantities of FLAT surface areas in behind the fairings. The length of the wiring for the bulbs is about 10" long in total from the ballast to the rear of the bulb so there is a reasonable amount of wire to find a location and I chose to mount the ballasts to the side of the headlight housing for sake of ease, location and basically because it was the largest FLAT spot I could come up with.

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I attached a couple of squares of coroplast to each side of the headlight housing with 3M rubberized moulding adhesive tape. This is the same kind of double sided tape that car manufacturers use to adhere mouldings and emblems to vehicles so it is quite strong and flexible. I used the coroplast to space the ballasts away from the housing a bit to make the ballast clear the edge to headlight housing. I also thought that if the ballasts were to get warm (or HOT) that it would provide an air gap on all sides of the ballast. As you may notice from the pictures I have installed the ballast at a slight angle compared to the coroplast. At first I installed the ballasts square to the rear face of the headlight housing and then installed the fairings only to discover that the ballast on the left side of the headlight interfered with the main wiring harness loom on the back of the gauge cluster. DAMN, that was a PIA, especially after I had done such a tidy job of measuring the coroplast squares, lining up the ballasts to make sure they looked almost like they belonged there, and installing the fairing. For some reason the left side of the fairing protested lining up properly when I went to install the upper cowl, and after a little searching with the flashlight I discovered why. So I peeled the ballasts back off the coroplast and re-installed them on a bit of an angle, so that everything had it's own personal HAPPY SPACE. It doesn't look as nice as the first time I installed the ballasts but at least everything clears and the wiring harness doesn't rub on the edge of the ballast.

Step Seven

Now that you have everything installed you are ready to re-install the headlight in the upper cowl. With the ballast on the side of the headlight and a bunch of excess wiring hanging out on the back of the headlight housing, I thought Uh-Oh, what to do with the bulb wiring and the cooling fan wiring as I did not want them to get caught up on anything either during or after the install. I discovered that the there was a space between the fairing and the post that the headlight attaches to so I ran the bulb and cooling fan wires behind the headlight housing mounting flange and that used up the excess wiring length and made everything look a bit more, well. tidy. The ballast power connectors that plug in to the factory wiring harness for the headlights do not have to be run in the same place as the bulb and cooling fan wiring and just hang as shown in the picture.


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Step Eight

Once everything is buttoned up on the back of the headlight housing you can re-install the upper cowl on the front of the bike. Be sure to check that none of the wiring is obstructed or pinched, and that none of the new parts interferes with anything else on your bike. The only thing on my bike that is not factory on the upper cowl is the LCD volt meter installed on my gauge bezel, but if you have any other parts installed on your bike you may need to check clearances here and alter the installation accordingly. I ran the factory wiring for the headlight connectors behind the black plastic shield that frames the inside area behind the front wheel. The connectors sit just behind the hole in the upper cowl for the factory turn signal openings and are easy to connect after everything is installed.

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Now that you have everything installed, you can test the LED headlights to make sure everything is working. Unlike me, if you have removed the battery from your bike for winter storage, don't forget to re-install the battery before you turn the key on to check if the new lights work. I can guarantee that if the battery is not installed, the lights, they WILL NOT WORK.

Ok, now that the battery has been re-installed, the lights do indeed come on, and MAN are they ever bright. The ratings for the bulbs are very similar to HID headlights as far as brightness. The Cree LED bulbs are rated for 1800 Lumens (very similar to the light output of car HID headlights in say, Mercedes Benz and Lexus automobiles) and the color temperature of the bulbs is 5000 K (compared to standard car HID's at 4300 K).

When the low beams of the Cree LED headlights are engaged the LED closest to the upper part of the housing illuminates and reflects off the upper part of the reflector only so there is very little glare created as most of the light is reflected down at the road. Here is a comparison of the stock lights versus the Cree LED lights with the low beams engaged. Below is a picture of the bike from the front with the Low Beam only engaged.

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Standard H4 Bulb - Low Beam Only

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Cree LED Bulb - Low Beam Only

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When the High Beams are switched on both LED's on the Cree Bulbs illuminate and the light shines off the top and bottom part of the reflector housing. The diodes on the Cree bulb are also spaced differently on the bulb itself so that the light emitted from the diodes hits a different spot on the reflector depending on whether the high or low beams are turned on. Below is a shot from the front of the bike with the High Beams engaged.

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Standard H4 Bulb - High Beams

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Cree LED Bulb - High Beams

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Here are the pictures of the bike sitting in the driveway with the new Cree LED Headlights. For comparison sake I have placed my wife's 96 VFR750 right beside my 2000 VFR800 so that you can get an idea as to the difference between a stock bulb and the new Cree LED's beam spread and brightness. The headlights on both bikes are sitting at approximately the same height and sitting with headlight perfectly side by side. The distance from the front of the bikes in my driveway to the white Jeep on the opposite side of the street is approximately 80-90 ft. The ground is also a bit wet which may make the beams on both headlights appear a bit different.

Here is a picture from the front of the bikes with what the stock headlights look like with the LOW beams engaged.

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Standard H4 Bulb Low Beam Pattern (96 VFR750)

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Cree LED Bulb Low Beam Pattern (2000 VFR800)

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Here is a picture from the front of the bikes with what the stock headlights look like with the HIGH beams engaged.

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Standard H4 Bulb High Beam Pattern (96 VFR750)

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Cree LED Bulb High Beam Pattern (2000 VFR800)

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In an effort to make things a bit easier for those who have come to find this thread just recently (considering there now appears to be 20 some odd pages of information and opinions) I thought I would recap a few of the LED headlight supplier links that have been posted so far so that the newcomers don't have to go searching through all the posts. There is a large range of costs and warranties so there are numerous options to choose from.

Each of the kits have their merit but in terms of design, I think there are only two real different styles given the companies listed here. All the listings here sell a kit that is very similar in style and components with the exception of the Lifetime LED's. All the other manufacturers have a bulb (with separate and removable cooling fan assembly) and power supply (ballast), whereas it would appear the Lifetime kit has the bulb, cooling fan and heatsink all in one package (though it would appear that the cooling fan assembly is not removable which might make the installing the bulb more difficult ) and a separate power supply (ballast).


1. eBay seller wyfb that I linked to in the original post. Cost $79.95 ( 2 Year Warranty )
http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-Universal-Car-Truck-H4-1800LM-50W-Cree-LED-HeadLight-Head-lamp-H-L-Beam-W-/141105877873?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item20da90d371&vxp=mtr

2. VLEDS.com. Cost $119.99 (1 Year Warranty )
http://www.vleds.com/bulb/h4-cxa-2000lm.html

3. Electrical Connection.com. Cost $149.95 (1 Year Warranty )
http://www.electricalconnection.com/other-lighting/led-hl-h4.htm

4. eBay seller electradecenter (UK site for overseas buyers) Cost £47.56 (1 Year Warranty )
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281225023832?var=580265646215&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

5. Lifetime LED's. Cost $149.00 ( Lifetime Warranty )
http://www.lifetimeledlights.com/H49003-LED-headlights-_p_59.html

6. Ebay Seller dmihawk. Cost $79.98 US (No warranty listed that I could find)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/181269034356?item=181269034356&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME:L:OC:US:3160&vxp=mtr

Thanks for the info... and nice write up!

I have had this same mod under consideration for a while. I'm interested to read your on the road experience with the color, intensity, and night vision with these bulbs.

Excellent write up. There looks to be a distinct difference in the color - the LED's look whiter in the photos. You'll probably wear out the bike before the LED's.

Great writeup!

I definitely need better lighting.

Looks like a good alternative to Xeon projectors. Thanks for posting

@Rush2112

Though I can't say for certain with the bike as I yet, I can offer up this experience with my own vehicles I have had a couple Mazda cars in the past and currently own a Mazda 5. My current Mazda 5 has regular bulbs with a projector headlight (non HID) and they are about as bright as my wife's 96 VFR as shown in the pictures. The only difference is that with the projectors the beam focus on my Mazda is much better with more light thrown where it is directed and not a lot of, for lack of a better term, ambient lighting of the road surface. The vehicle I owned previous to my Mazda 5 was a Mazda 6 sedan and it had projector style HID headlights. The HID's are definitely brighter, and with the color being whiter seems to give better natural contrast to whatever the lights happen to be lighting up. The HID's also being closer to white light also seemed better for showing up lane markings, especially when the road surface is wet. The whiter light seems to penetrate the water better and reflect off the lane markings. Now I am no physics expert or lighting design expert but this is my own take on the benefits of the HID's. The LED's have the same color temperature at 5000 K as my Mazda 6's headlight but are brighter as far as output goes with 1800 lumens versus the Mazda's 1600 lumen output. Based on these numbers I think that the LED's will be as good or better than the HID's. Another benefit is that the LED system from Cree is basically plug and play and cost me $105 CDN including shipping so they are also a better value IMHO.

@Cogswell

Yes the LED's are definitely whiter and the pictures really don't do justice to the real difference. In person the lights are actually much brighter looking than the pictures tend to show. Also, since both bikes are sitting on the center stands, I think they beam pattern will actually spread a bit further. One nice thing about the LED beam patter is that since the low beam only reflects off the upper part of the reflector housing there is very little wasted light above the center line of the bulb. There is a lot more light spread on the ground especially off to the sides of the bike which should help when it comes to vision at the sides of the road. From the looks of it, there is also more light thrown to the right side of the bike than the left and this is likely due to the shape of the reflector. I would imagine that the beam pattern would be slightly different for bikes in other countries that drive on the opposite of the road to those in North America.

@socalnative and DUC2v4

I have ordered another set of the LED's for my wife's 96 VFR750 as well and I will post up with some photos of the difference with this bike as well. This is an upgrade worth every penny IMHO. The last time I purchased regular bulbs for my bike from WalMart (here in Canada are prices seem to be higher than most US stores) the Sylvania Silverstar 2-pack was $60 plus tax (12% extra here in BC), so for an extra $40 plus some fiddling around I should never have to replace a headlight again.

One other benefit to this modification that another site member has mentioned is that the modification is completely reversible should the need arise. If you were on vacation or a ride or something and one of the LED bulbs or one of the ballasts failed you could unplug the ballast, replace the LED bulb with a standard H4 bulb, plug in the factory harness connector and continue riding. When you got home you could check on ordering a new part and replace the parts at your leisure. No lost time riding.

Thanks go out to vfrcapn for bringing this particular point to my attention.

nothin like a little last min Xmas shopping for myself!

That's nice, the Install should pretty much be the same for 3rd and 4th gen bikes. A bit simpler than doing an HID mod, but the best thing is, finally a solution to the single bulb hi/lo beam problem that was not being solved by HID systems so far for 3rd to 5th gen bikes! :fing02: :fing02:

I think one does not have to take off the upper fairing and headlight bezzel from the bike to install that system. unless on had really big hands that can't get in the spaces behind the headlights.

I'm just wondering though, how reliable those timy little cooling fans would be, exposed to the elements..... :unsure:

Great job, is the Jeep color white or gold ?

Great, thorough and thoughtful write up!

As a 4th GEN owner I am awaiting your report on the install. Very nice write-up.

Thank you.

Thanks for the great write up. Does anyone know if these will be compatible with headlight modulators?

TIA,

Roger

Beck

That's nice, the Install should pretty much be the same for 3rd and 4th gen bikes. A bit simpler than doing an HID mod, but the best thing is, finally a solution to the single bulb hi/lo beam problem that was not being solved by HID systems so far for 3rd to 5th gen bikes! :fing02: :fing02:

I think one does not have to take off the upper fairing and headlight bezzel from the bike to install that system. unless on had really big hands that can't get in the spaces behind the headlights.

I'm just wondering though, how reliable those timy little cooling fans would be, exposed to the elements..... :unsure:

Hey Beck

The longevity of the cooling fans may prove to be a bit of an issue in the long run and their main purpose is to cool the heat sink on the back of the bulb. Since the heat sink on the bulb is actually open to the outside air I'm fairly certain that even if the cooling fans failed the bulbs would not overheat. I will keep an eye on them just the same and report back as to their longevity.

As for not removing the upper cowl and headlight assembly, even with really small hands, you could certainly install the bulbs without removing the fairing and bulbs but I seriously doubt you could get the ballasts installed without at least the upper cowl being removed. There is not a lot of room in behind the fairings as it is and the ballasts are about 2.5" x 3.5" x 1/2" thick so once they are installed I can not fit my fingers between the edge of the ballast and the inside of the outer fairing (at least on the fifth gen) so I would suggest doing with at least the upper cowl removed. Not to mention getting the two sided adhesive tape in there without getting dirt or grit on the tape as if you were to install the adhesive tape on the headlight housing while it was installed you would likely not be able to peel the adhesive protective cover on the other side of the tape with everything mounted on the bike. You would most certainly do a lot of cursing and swearing and get dirt or oil from your hands on the tape adhesive decreasing its ability to fasten the ballasts to it. The surface that you attach the tape to should also be cleaned first with rubbing alcohol to remove any oily residue before applying the tape. For the amount of time it takes to remove the upper cowl, it is well worth the time spent just to give yourself the room to maneuver everything. You could definitely do the install without removing the headlight from the upper cowl but routing the wires as I have done in this install would be more challenging. The install may be different on say a 3rd or 4th gen bike as the locations for installing the ballasts may be more numerous and thus may not require removing the fairing. If you could install the ballasts on the underside of the headlight housing (for example) then Yes, it could be done with the fairing installed. The 5th gen however does not leave enough room between the bottom of the headlight housing and the inside edge of the lower portion of the upper cowl.

If you can get it installed without removing the upper cowl it would certainly take very little time to complete the install. If you decide to try it let me know how it works.

Switchblade

Great job, is the Jeep color white or gold ?

Hey Swithblade

The Jeep in the picture is actually a metallic white and it was covered in a bit of road spray as the roads the day I took the pictures were wet and dirty during the day. As a result I think the Jeep's color takes on a slightly goldish hue with the standard bulbs shining on it and a slightly bluish hue with the LED's. The color of the LED bulbs is slightly bluish much like the HID's on most cars.

I am impressed. Summertime will tell about the heat they generate .

rangemaster

As a 4th GEN owner I am awaiting your report on the install. Very nice write-up.

Thank you.

I will definitely post up some photos once I get the lights installed in my wife's 96 VFR. The bulbs should be in just after New Years I would imagine. There will be one difference with my wife's bike as hers does not have the retainer rings and instead of installing the rings I am going to modify the headlight housing to accept a regular H4 bulb. On my last bike, a 97 VFR, I moved the location of the bulb retaining clip so that you can install a regular bulb or one of the Honda bulbs.

Here is a link to the information on the modification of the 4th gen's headlight housing. For those interested in this mod, it is really quite easy but will not work on the 5th gen housing as their is no secondary location to mount the bulb retainer clip. I know this as I attempted to figure this out with my bike. Sorry all.

http://webpages.charter.net/bpeloquin/H4mod.html

If you wish to purchase a set of the headlight retainer rings instead here is a link to a website where you should be able to purchase the shims.

http://www.casporttouring.com/cst/motorcycle/Honda_VFR/17120.html

vfracer750

Thanks for the great write up. Does anyone know if these will be compatible with headlight modulators?

TIA,

Roger

My gut feeling on this would be NO. Most LED's do not work well in a situation where they are being forced to turn off and on frequently. They may well work in conjunction with a headlight modulator but it may shorten the life span of the bulbs and/or ballasts. As example, when I was looking to add a set of LED's to my wife's 98 Tahoe I talked with a person at www.vleds.com in regards to a kit for her truck. The guy I talked with said that the GM's daytime running light uses a pulsed voltage on the daytime running light circuit to dim the high beams for the DRL's. He mentioned that this would kill the LED bulbs in a very short time. Now this pulsed voltage is approx 60 times per second so it would be flashing the bulb much, much faster than a headlight modulator so it might not be an issue.

Granted the life span of the LED's in the kit is supposed to be something like 30,000 hours so.................. half that would still work out to something like 3 years if you left the headlight on continuously for that long. :smile2:

Cree LED Bulb - Battery load test

Having a little free time this afternoon I decided to try a load test of sorts on the battery. The main reason for the test is two fold.

1. I wanted to find out how warm the heat sinks on the LED would get over time
2. I wanted to determine how much voltage was being used. Since LED's are supposed to draw less amperage I was curious as to there draw.

Here are a few of the test parameters. The battery was fully charged and had been on a battery tender for the last couple weeks.

1. Battery voltage at rest with the key off was 13.1 VDC and 100% charge according to the battery charger/tender
2. Temperature of garage was 12*C or 53*F
3. Battery voltage at rest according to Digital Multimeter 13.0 VDC taken across battery terminals

All remaining voltage readings are taken directly across the terminals at the battery.

Bike information is 2000 VFR800 with LED lights for the tach, speedo, and LCD display reading and Cree LED Headlights (rated 25W per bulb on high for 50W total draw). All other lights on the bike are standard bulbs that came with the bike from the factory.

Battery voltage at beginning of test - 12.2 VDC (Key in on position with high beams and all running lights on) with voltage taken across terminals.

Voltage reading at 10 minutes - 12.11 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch there is no discernable difference in temperature.

Voltage reading at 15 minutes - 12.06 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch there is no discernable difference in temperature.

Voltage reading at 20 minutes - 12.01 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch there is barely a change in temperature (maybe a couple degrees fahrenheit)

Voltage reading at 25 minutes - 11.94 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch it is a tiny bit warmer than at start of test (maybe 5 degrees fahrenheit)

Voltage reading at 30 minutes - 11.88 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch there is no discernable difference from the 25 minute mark.

Voltage reading at 35 minutes - 11.84 VDC - Testing the bulb heat sink by touch there is no discernable difference from the 25 minute mark.


Not wanting to drain the battery completely I stopped testing at 35 minutes and turned off the key. I let the battery rest for about 5 minutes and then tested the battery voltage again across the terminals and got a reading of 12.31 VDC

I then plugged the battery back in to the battery charger tender and the reading was 12.4 VDC and the charger indicator showed the battery to be at 74%


If I were to draw a conclusion from this test it would be that the LED headlights draw very little current compared to the stock bulbs. I say this because I accidentally left the lights on (low beam) on my bike a few months ago and when I noticed that I had left the key on about 30 minutes later the lights were barely a dim flicker and the battery was down to 15% according to the battery charger when I plugged it in. The LED's by comparison lost absolutely no apparent brightness. They were as bright at the end of the test as they were when I started. Gotta like that.

The second conclusion I would draw from the test is that though the Cree LED bulb's do have a heat sink with a fan on them, the actual temperature of the base of the bulb (the plate the fan attaches to which screws to the heat sink on the end of the bulb itself) barely became warm to the touch (and I mean barely warm). As a result I would imagine that, if for some reason the cooling fans failed, the airflow caused by the bikes movement should be enough to keep the bulbs from over-heating. The other thing I have noticed in the past is that the actual face of the headlight with the stock bulbs would get warm or even somewhat hot to the touch after a ride of say 100 KM's. After 35 minutes of continuous operation at a standstill in the garage (granted it was only 12*C) the face of the headlight was almost the same temperature as the surrounding fairing parts.

Hope all of you in VFR land find this information useful. It gives me a bit of peace of mind concerning things like the bulb operating temperature and current draw. Also the ballasts did not change temperature and remained cool to the touch.

Ok so whats the the little fans for. I guess the ambient temp was not high enough for fan activation . And maybe because the supply voltage was less then 12 Vdc it did not cause the LED's to produce maximum output .

When I first started the lights were at max output as best I can tell with the battery at 12.2 VDC and they were still just as bright when I shut the ignition off 35 minutes later. The fans were running the whole time but even at that, there was not a lot of heat being produced. From what I have read about LED's they will produce continuous light output right up until the time the voltage drops below their designed level and then they go out. The actual battery was still at a voltage of above 12 V at the end of the test as when I turned the ignition key off again the voltage went back up to 12.33 volts and after resting it went up a bit higher, so I'm not sure if the actual voltage of the battery dropped below the threshold level of the LED's.

I have a question about the pattern they produce. it looks from the photos like they make a much wider spread on the "hi" setting than the standard lights. This would make sense given your mentioning that both elements run when you switch to high beams. So If I understand your write up correctly, on low beams its just one LED per "bulb" illuminated, and when you flip to high beams both are iluminated. does this produce a larger pattern in the actual lighting or is it a trick of the camera?

If these things work how I think they do its the fix ive been looking for on both my VFR and my girls Miata, eagerly awaiting your reply

PhotoOp

I have a question about the pattern they produce. it looks from the photos like they make a much wider spread on the "hi" setting than the standard lights. This would make sense given your mentioning that both elements run when you switch to high beams. So If I understand your write up correctly, on low beams its just one LED per "bulb" illuminated, and when you flip to high beams both are iluminated. does this produce a larger pattern in the actual lighting or is it a trick of the camera?

If these things work how I think they do its the fix ive been looking for on both my VFR and my girls Miata, eagerly awaiting your reply

Hey PhotoOp

Your assumption is correct. On the low beam setting, only the upper diode only on each bulb is illuminated and on high both diodes are turned on. The beam pattern on both low beam and high beam is slightly wider on both high and low beam settings. Part of the reason for this is that t I think the LED has a more diffuse beam. Sort of like an LED flashlight does not have a really focused beam like a traditional filament bulb in a flashlight. When you shine a regular filament bulb flashlight at a wall it usually shows a distinct circular pattern on the wall. When you shine an LED flashlight at the wall from the same distance the beam produces a slightly more diffuse pattern on the wall and the edges of the beam are not as sharp. Same thing occurs with LED headlight with one exception. The LED's light is a bit more focused because the light is being bounced off a reflector. There is a bit more spread to the sides of the bike and a lot more is reflected to the ground directly in front of the bike than the standard halogen bulb. Not sure if that describes it well enough but I hope you get the idea and that I have answered your question.

When you engage the high beams, the bottom diode illuminates as well as the top one and then reflects light off the bottom part of the reflector in addition the upper part. This casts more light forward and above the centreline of the bulb and since the output of the LED bulb is 1800 lumens versus the standard halogen bulbs output of roughly 800 lumens the bulb is definitely brighter. Since the light emitted is closer to natural daylight in color (the LED is more bluish white whereas the standard bulb is more yellowish) there is a greater level of color contrast in what the bulb is illuminating. At least this is how I interpret the difference. Again since the LED light is produced in a slightly more diffuse pattern from the diode the beam spread is a bit wider with the high beams as well. The difference is much more prevalent in real life than what the pictures actually show. I think part of the difference is that the camera can not show the total amount of light emitted as the camera sensors gauge the ambient light versus the light in the picture and only shows the difference.

I hope I have explained it well enough and if you have any more questions I'm happy to answer them if possible.

For those who are interested, here is an interesting article comparing standard halogen lighting systems vs. High Intensity Discharge (HID) lighting systems vs. LED lighting systems in modern automobiles.

http://ijdmtoy.hubpages.com/hub/The-Difference-between-HID-LED-and-Incandescent-Lamps

It helps to explain some of the differences in the automotive lighting systems. The basic just of the article is that HID and LED lighting systems are more efficient at turning energy into visible light with less energy wasted as heat. LED's seem to be the most efficient at turning energy into light but the LED's can in some cases be considered more expensive.

zoomzoom

When I first started the lights were at max output as best I can tell with the battery at 12.2 VDC and they were still just as bright when I shut the ignition off 35 minutes later. The fans were running the whole time but even at that, there was not a lot of heat being produced. From what I have read about LED's they will produce continuous light output right up until the time the voltage drops below their designed level and then they go out. The actual battery was still at a voltage of above 12 V at the end of the test as when I turned the ignition key off again the voltage went back up to 12.33 volts and after resting it went up a bit higher, so I'm not sure if the actual voltage of the battery dropped below the threshold level of the LED's.

The info about LED's here is accurate. Light Emitting Diodes effectively switch on at a specific voltage. If that voltage is 10V, they should be as bright at 10V as they would at 12V, or 13, or . . . . Now at a certain point, excessive voltage will burn out the diode, but I would expect that to be at least the 20V range, at which case your fuqued for a variety of reasons.

zoomzoom

When I first started the lights were at max output as best I can tell with the battery at 12.2 VDC and they were still just as bright when I shut the ignition off 35 minutes later. The fans were running the whole time but even at that, there was not a lot of heat being produced. From what I have read about LED's they will produce continuous light output right up until the time the voltage drops below their designed level and then they go out. The actual battery was still at a voltage of above 12 V at the end of the test as when I turned the ignition key off again the voltage went back up to 12.33 volts and after resting it went up a bit higher, so I'm not sure if the actual voltage of the battery dropped below the threshold level of the LED's.

Fans run all the time 10-4 ...

zoomzoom

[image: post-25028-0-53672000-1387656344.jpg]

I have been thinking about upgrading the headlights on my bike for a little while, among other things, and I had been searching about doing an HID upgrade. One of the drawbacks I can gather from using an HID upgrade to the headlights is that the HID bulbs use the existing headlight reflector and, since the bulb shines out in all directions the lights tend to create a LOT of glare towards oncoming traffic. Considering that I have trouble with the glare myself, I did not want to install something that would cause other drivers difficulty. Hence I did not want to install an HID system without also going to the extra effort of installing the projectors as well. This involved removing the lens of the headlight, removing the existing reflector, installing the retro-fit projectors, and was arguably not exactly a plug and play installation. I don't mind doing all that extra work, but mainly I was concerned with running extra wiring for the headlights, and honestly the cost was a LOT higher after factoring in the cost of the projectors. One of the kits I looked at was nearly $300 US complete with the projectors.

After reading a number of posts and a few threads about the HID's causing excess glare to oncoming traffic and the extra wiring implications because of the ballasts and current draw on start-up, I started thinking about an LED option. There are a number of cars on the market now that have LED headlights so I was sure that there must be an aftermarket option available and after about an hour or so on Google, there were a great many options.

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I don't think Cree, Inc. (4600 Silicon Drive, Durham, North Carolina 27703 USA, Tel: +1 919-313-5300, US toll-free: 800-533-2583 Fax: +1 919-313-5558) actually manufactured the LED headlight kit you just installed... So if buying "genuine Cree" was important to you, you have probably been ripped off. (Did your package originate in the USA? I've had eBay sellers claiming to be based in the USA who strangely shipped to me from China...)

Now, as for the LED "bulbs" themselves, they look to be of decent quality from the pics. However, you have to wonder if the LED chips they've used were actually manufactured by Cree, given that you now know that the seller/manufacturer most likely lied about the manufacturer of the kit and simply applied Cree's trademark all over the box. Perhaps "genuine Cree LEDs" is the new "genuine Bosch ballast" or "genuine Philip HID Converion Kit"? Cree LED chips are fairly common, so it is possible that they are genuine, but it's impossible to say for sure. I mean, you can buy fake micro-SD memory cards from China these days--fake stuff is endemic, so your only real defence against fake certain types of products is to only buy from a reputable manufacturer (and no, eBay is not a sure sign of a reputable supply chain...)

Finally, I'm impressed that you've recognised that there is a problem with HID conversion kits, in that the lobbing of an HID bulb into a reflector headlamp is a virtual guarantee of unacceptable and dangerous levels of glare, due to the major differences between the dimensions of an incandescant filament and an HID capsule. However, just looking at the LED you can see that the shape of the LED emitter is even more incompatible than an HID capsule! I think the only thing that is keeping these LEDs from being worse, glare-wise, than an HID conversion kit is that the LED's output is so much lower than HID. Look at your "low-beam" photo. Everything above the original H4 "cut-off" will be seen as glare by oncoming drivers. The LEDs bleed light above the cut-off because you have fit a light source with a different shape into the OEM reflector. (And then you spaced it out of position by 1-2mm using those shims.)

HID conversion kits also shield the low beam, btw. The glare problem is not due to a total lack of shielding, it is because the unshielded part is simply incompatible with the OEM reflector--which is exactly the same problem you have with these LEDs.

Ciao,

The LED itself does look to be a Cree unit, but the bulb base and extra stuff definitely isn't. I agree with everything else JZH said though. At the end of the day, you've put in a slightly higher output light with a better color, but it's still working with a reflector base that wasn't designed to work with it. I think that honestly, it would've been better to put the money spent on those led bulbs toward a projector retrofit if you were looking to improve the headlights on the bike.

If your happy with them that's all that matter's.

I know I haven't done all of the technical research some of you have, but from the information I have read the LED bulb is designed, dimension wise, to place the LED in the same position as the filaments of a regular halogen bulb. From the beam pattern photos zoom-zoom provided it doesn't appear the light spreads significantly higher above the stock cutoff points for low and high beam. His tests weren't preformed at the exact same time and maybe even with the bike in a slightly different position. The cutoff still appears quite sharp, and I would think the headlight could be adjusted a touch lower if glare appeared to be a problem. The only significant differences I see, and would expect given the technical specifications is a brighter, whiter light, and a more "filled out" high beam below the cutoff because the low beam is active at the same time. Maybe I don't completely understand how easy it is for glare to become an issue with beam cut off points, but given the evidence here I don't see an issue personally....

But I could be wrong.

Too hard to tell absolutely without actually looking into oncoming lights on the road, but tend to agree with Andy...seems like additional "scatter" is only lower than OEM bulb, not higher where it would blind traffic. HID's OTOH are a different story. Almost all I have seen without specifically designed lens are terribly blinding with huge scatter...

apexandy

I know I haven't done all of the technical research some of you have, but from the information I have read the LED bulb is designed, dimension wise, to place the LED in the same position as the filaments of a regular halogen bulb. From the beam pattern photos zoom-zoom provided it doesn't appear the light spreads significantly higher above the stock cutoff points for low and high beam. His tests weren't preformed at the exact same time and maybe even with the bike in a slightly different position. The cutoff still appears quite sharp, and I would think the headlight could be adjusted a touch lower if glare appeared to be a problem. The only significant differences I see, and would expect given the technical specifications is a brighter, whiter light, and a more "filled out" high beam below the cutoff because the low beam is active at the same time. Maybe I don't completely understand how easy it is for glare to become an issue with beam cut off points, but given the evidence here I don't see an issue personally....

But I could be wrong.

It's actually very easy to tell. If you look at the low beam comparison on page one, the light is about an inch, maybe an inch and a half higher. That's on a garage door, what I'd think is probably 8 feet away, at the most. When I first put my bike back together, my headlights were aimed too high, about the same amount, and drivers would often flash high beams at me when I was riding at night. It doesn't take much to end up being blinding to approaching drivers down the road. And yes, you can adjust it down to try to prevent glare, but you're basically defeating the purpose of improving your headlights at that point, because now you're pointing your lights down because of excessive glare, rather than to actually aim them properly.

JZH

zoomzoom

[image: post-25028-0-53672000-1387656344.jpg]

I have been thinking about upgrading the headlights on my bike for a little while, among other things, and I had been searching about doing an HID upgrade. One of the drawbacks I can gather from using an HID upgrade to the headlights is that the HID bulbs use the existing headlight reflector and, since the bulb shines out in all directions the lights tend to create a LOT of glare towards oncoming traffic. Considering that I have trouble with the glare myself, I did not want to install something that would cause other drivers difficulty. Hence I did not want to install an HID system without also going to the extra effort of installing the projectors as well. This involved removing the lens of the headlight, removing the existing reflector, installing the retro-fit projectors, and was arguably not exactly a plug and play installation. I don't mind doing all that extra work, but mainly I was concerned with running extra wiring for the headlights, and honestly the cost was a LOT higher after factoring in the cost of the projectors. One of the kits I looked at was nearly $300 US complete with the projectors.

After reading a number of posts and a few threads about the HID's causing excess glare to oncoming traffic and the extra wiring implications because of the ballasts and current draw on start-up, I started thinking about an LED option. There are a number of cars on the market now that have LED headlights so I was sure that there must be an aftermarket option available and after about an hour or so on Google, there were a great many options.

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I don't think Cree, Inc. (4600 Silicon Drive, Durham, North Carolina 27703 USA, Tel: +1 919-313-5300, US toll-free: 800-533-2583 Fax: +1 919-313-5558) actually manufactured the LED headlight kit you just installed... So if buying "genuine Cree" was important to you, you have probably been ripped off. (Did your package originate in the USA? I've had eBay sellers claiming to be based in the USA who strangely shipped to me from China...)

Now, as for the LED "bulbs" themselves, they look to be of decent quality from the pics. However, you have to wonder if the LED chips they've used were actually manufactured by Cree, given that you now know that the seller/manufacturer most likely lied about the manufacturer of the kit and simply applied Cree's trademark all over the box. Perhaps "genuine Cree LEDs" is the new "genuine Bosch ballast" or "genuine Philip HID Converion Kit"? Cree LED chips are fairly common, so it is possible that they are genuine, but it's impossible to say for sure. I mean, you can buy fake micro-SD memory cards from China these days--fake stuff is endemic, so your only real defence against fake certain types of products is to only buy from a reputable manufacturer (and no, eBay is not a sure sign of a reputable supply chain...)

Finally, I'm impressed that you've recognised that there is a problem with HID conversion kits, in that the lobbing of an HID bulb into a reflector headlamp is a virtual guarantee of unacceptable and dangerous levels of glare, due to the major differences between the dimensions of an incandescant filament and an HID capsule. However, just looking at the LED you can see that the shape of the LED emitter is even more incompatible than an HID capsule! I think the only thing that is keeping these LEDs from being worse, glare-wise, than an HID conversion kit is that the LED's output is so much lower than HID. Look at your "low-beam" photo. Everything above the original H4 "cut-off" will be seen as glare by oncoming drivers. The LEDs bleed light above the cut-off because you have fit a light source with a different shape into the OEM reflector. (And then you spaced it out of position by 1-2mm using those shims.)

HID conversion kits also shield the low beam, btw. The glare problem is not due to a total lack of shielding, it is because the unshielded part is simply incompatible with the OEM reflector--which is exactly the same problem you have with these LEDs.

Ciao,

Hey JZH

In all honesty I can't completely disagree with any of your points but I feel I should offer up this information.

1st. The company I purchased the Cree Kit from is located in, and the kit was shipped from San Diego, California. One of the reasons I chose to purchase a kit from a US supplier (or importer perhaps, don't know) was because the shipping costs from the US to Canada were far lower and much quicker. Does this mean that the kit or any part of it was actually manufactured by Cree Inc. NO. As a consumer there can be no doubt that much of what we purchase was manufactured in another country or outsourced to another company by a local manufacturer. The fact of the matter is that the kit was sold by an American Firm and they are the ones who are standing by the 2 year warranty that was supplied with the kit when it was purchased, and they are the ones to whom I am to return the parts for warranty purposes should the need arise. I was not solely looking to purchase "Cree" products, more that I was interested in the kit itself as a whole. The actual bulb and chips on the bulb have the name Cree laser etched in to the surface of the parts so I think it MIGHT be fairly safe to say that the parts are indeed made by Cree Ind. The rest of the kit may not contain parts made by Cree Industries but they are certainly compatible with the product I purchased and the kit performs as intended.

2nd. I agree that there is the potential for excess glare coming from the bulbs due to the fact that, as you have said the bulbs are not perfectly compatible with the OEM reflector. In a perfect world, everything would work as intended and no modifications would be required. That being said I will adjust the headlights accordingly should the need arise if excessive glare becomes an issue and many people start flashing their high beams at me in disgust. Were I to install an HID system in the headlight housing without installing a projector to focus the beam the excessive glare caused by light being reflected off the ENTIRE stock reflector housing would most certainly be an issue for oncoming traffic. This is one of the reasons I decided that the LED bulb might be the better option as since only the upper diode is illuminated with the use of the low beam the only portion of the reflector being used (for the most part) is the area ABOVE the centerline of the LED bulb. This light is then reflected more down and forward to the road surface. With the bulbs placed side by side one of the things I looked at before install was the position of the center line of the filament in the stock halogen bulb vs. and both the high and low beam portion of the filament appear to be directly in line with the center line of the LED diodes. Is the cutoff line of the LED bulb as sharp as the stock halogen NO, but it is awfully damn close. The great deal of the light from the reflector is being direct down at the road surface directly in front of the bike to a distance of approx 40-50 feet due to the nature of the fact that LED's tend to produce light in a more directional fashion than a traditional filament style bulb. Pictures do not always due justice to how things look in real life and thus a bit of objectivity need be applied when looking at the pictures. An LED upgrade such as the one I have done is not perfect in all situations and may not be to everyone's liking but then what in life does work perfectly all the time and in all situations.

As for the kit, I am happy with the results so far and feel the money was well spent. I do not wish to go to the effort of purchasing an HID projector, nor do I really wish to crack open the stock headlight housing so they can be installed. By far, the majority of my riding is during daylight hours and what little evening riding I do, will be safer being that I will be able to see a bit better when riding on dark roads. The HID's without a reflector IMHO would be far more offensive to the vision of the oncoming traffic. The other main point I would like to make is that this particular kit is 100% EASILY reversible. Disconnect the factory harness, remove the bulbs and ballasts, and re-install some factory H4 halogen style bulbs. If the money turns out to be wasted then so be it, that will be on me, and no one else.

:beer:

I saw nothing in the Ebay posting that says this is completely made by CREE. Per the listing:

"...our lamp adopts genuine CREE LED CHIP..."

That tells me the kit isn't 100% CREE, but the important part, the lamp, is.

Looks good, and makes me kind of envious. :beer:

zoomzoom

JZH

zoomzoom

[image: post-25028-0-53672000-1387656344.jpg]

I have been thinking about upgrading the headlights on my bike for a little while, among other things, and I had been searching about doing an HID upgrade. One of the drawbacks I can gather from using an HID upgrade to the headlights is that the HID bulbs use the existing headlight reflector and, since the bulb shines out in all directions the lights tend to create a LOT of glare towards oncoming traffic. Considering that I have trouble with the glare myself, I did not want to install something that would cause other drivers difficulty. Hence I did not want to install an HID system without also going to the extra effort of installing the projectors as well. This involved removing the lens of the headlight, removing the existing reflector, installing the retro-fit projectors, and was arguably not exactly a plug and play installation. I don't mind doing all that extra work, but mainly I was concerned with running extra wiring for the headlights, and honestly the cost was a LOT higher after factoring in the cost of the projectors. One of the kits I looked at was nearly $300 US complete with the projectors.

After reading a number of posts and a few threads about the HID's causing excess glare to oncoming traffic and the extra wiring implications because of the ballasts and current draw on start-up, I started thinking about an LED option. There are a number of cars on the market now that have LED headlights so I was sure that there must be an aftermarket option available and after about an hour or so on Google, there were a great many options.

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I don't think Cree, Inc. (4600 Silicon Drive, Durham, North Carolina 27703 USA, Tel: +1 919-313-5300, US toll-free: 800-533-2583 Fax: +1 919-313-5558) actually manufactured the LED headlight kit you just installed... So if buying "genuine Cree" was important to you, you have probably been ripped off. (Did your package originate in the USA? I've had eBay sellers claiming to be based in the USA who strangely shipped to me from China...)

Now, as for the LED "bulbs" themselves, they look to be of decent quality from the pics. However, you have to wonder if the LED chips they've used were actually manufactured by Cree, given that you now know that the seller/manufacturer most likely lied about the manufacturer of the kit and simply applied Cree's trademark all over the box. Perhaps "genuine Cree LEDs" is the new "genuine Bosch ballast" or "genuine Philip HID Converion Kit"? Cree LED chips are fairly common, so it is possible that they are genuine, but it's impossible to say for sure. I mean, you can buy fake micro-SD memory cards from China these days--fake stuff is endemic, so your only real defence against fake certain types of products is to only buy from a reputable manufacturer (and no, eBay is not a sure sign of a reputable supply chain...)

Finally, I'm impressed that you've recognised that there is a problem with HID conversion kits, in that the lobbing of an HID bulb into a reflector headlamp is a virtual guarantee of unacceptable and dangerous levels of glare, due to the major differences between the dimensions of an incandescant filament and an HID capsule. However, just looking at the LED you can see that the shape of the LED emitter is even more incompatible than an HID capsule! I think the only thing that is keeping these LEDs from being worse, glare-wise, than an HID conversion kit is that the LED's output is so much lower than HID. Look at your "low-beam" photo. Everything above the original H4 "cut-off" will be seen as glare by oncoming drivers. The LEDs bleed light above the cut-off because you have fit a light source with a different shape into the OEM reflector. (And then you spaced it out of position by 1-2mm using those shims.)

HID conversion kits also shield the low beam, btw. The glare problem is not due to a total lack of shielding, it is because the unshielded part is simply incompatible with the OEM reflector--which is exactly the same problem you have with these LEDs.

Ciao,

Hey JZH

In all honesty I can't completely disagree with any of your points but I feel I should offer up this information.

1st. The company I purchased the Cree Kit from is located in, and the kit was shipped from San Diego, California. One of the reasons I chose to purchase a kit from a US supplier (or importer perhaps, don't know) was because the shipping costs from the US to Canada were far lower and much quicker. Does this mean that the kit or any part of it was actually manufactured by Cree Inc. NO. As a consumer there can be no doubt that much of what we purchase was manufactured in another country or outsourced to another company by a local manufacturer. The fact of the matter is that the kit was sold by an American Firm and they are the ones who are standing by the 2 year warranty that was supplied with the kit when it was purchased, and they are the ones to whom I am to return the parts for warranty purposes should the need arise. I was not solely looking to purchase "Cree" products, more that I was interested in the kit itself as a whole. The actual bulb and chips on the bulb have the name Cree laser etched in to the surface of the parts so I think it MIGHT be fairly safe to say that the parts are indeed made by Cree Ind. The rest of the kit may not contain parts made by Cree Industries but they are certainly compatible with the product I purchased and the kit performs as intended.

2nd. I agree that there is the potential for excess glare coming from the bulbs due to the fact that, as you have said the bulbs are not perfectly compatible with the OEM reflector. In a perfect world, everything would work as intended and no modifications would be required. That being said I will adjust the headlights accordingly should the need arise if excessive glare becomes an issue and many people start flashing their high beams at me in disgust. Were I to install an HID system in the headlight housing without installing a projector to focus the beam the excessive glare caused by light being reflected off the ENTIRE stock reflector housing would most certainly be an issue for oncoming traffic. This is one of the reasons I decided that the LED bulb might be the better option as since only the upper diode is illuminated with the use of the low beam the only portion of the reflector being used (for the most part) is the area ABOVE the centerline of the LED bulb. This light is then reflected more down and forward to the road surface. With the bulbs placed side by side one of the things I looked at before install was the position of the center line of the filament in the stock halogen bulb vs. and both the high and low beam portion of the filament appear to be directly in line with the center line of the LED diodes. Is the cutoff line of the LED bulb as sharp as the stock halogen NO, but it is awfully damn close. The great deal of the light from the reflector is being direct down at the road surface directly in front of the bike to a distance of approx 40-50 feet due to the nature of the fact that LED's tend to produce light in a more directional fashion than a traditional filament style bulb. Pictures do not always due justice to how things look in real life and thus a bit of objectivity need be applied when looking at the pictures. An LED upgrade such as the one I have done is not perfect in all situations and may not be to everyone's liking but then what in life does work perfectly all the time and in all situations.

As for the kit, I am happy with the results so far and feel the money was well spent. I do not wish to go to the effort of purchasing an HID projector, nor do I really wish to crack open the stock headlight housing so they can be installed. By far, the majority of my riding is during daylight hours and what little evening riding I do, will be safer being that I will be able to see a bit better when riding on dark roads. The HID's without a reflector IMHO would be far more offensive to the vision of the oncoming traffic. The other main point I would like to make is that this particular kit is 100% EASILY reversible. Disconnect the factory harness, remove the bulbs and ballasts, and re-install some factory H4 halogen style bulbs. If the money turns out to be wasted then so be it, that will be on me, and no one else.

It's always difficult to tell someone they've bought a pig in a poke, but you're taking it well!

1. It doesn't matter too much where it came from; such kits are illegal to sell for use on the roads of the United States (and presumably, Canada), because they, like HID kits, are not OEM replacements. Yours may have come to you via San Diego, but it was almost certainly made in China. I mention the illegality issue because companies engaged in such businesses usually get served with cease and desist orders by the federal government sooner or later, so if you're really expecting them to be there in two years, well, I wouldn't. It would be very foolish of you to believe that the branding of this kit in any way implies the actual origin of its components. Send Cree an email if you don't believe me. I lived in Hong Kong quite recently, and I can assure you that the Chinese entrepreneurial spirit is not even slightly diminished by the forging of hologram "security features", much less a simple laser etching or two.

2. You have misunderstood how HID conversion kits work. I have installed them (and subsequently removed them) and they do indeed shield the "low beam" from the reflector. If the light were reflecting off the entire reflector, that would be almost the same as the "high beam", so all of the alleged H4 HID conversions have some way of shielding the reflector on low beam. All HID conversion kits also attempt to position the HID capsule in approximately the same position as the incandescent filament in an H4 halogen bulb. But the HID source of light, and the LED source of light are completely different shapes than the incandescent filament, so as you say, the result ain't gonna be perfect...

[EDIT: I just noticed that the LED chips supposedly used in this kit only have a 125-deg viewing angle, so right off the bat you're missing 55-deg the reflector was designed for. Not sure if that is significant in the real world, but it does show that they're not trying very hard to make this kit truly compatible...]

In fact, the main reason why HID conversion kits produce so much glare is down to the dissimilar shape of the source of light, compared with the incandescent filament in an H4 halogen bulb. The resulting cut-off on your LED conversion does look fairly even (I've seen HIDs all over the place), but it's still well above the OEM cut-off, and that's just on a garage door less than 10 feet away. That glare is only going to get worse for other people the further away they are from your bike.

The saving grace in this is that your LEDs appear to be so much dimmer than HIDs, that the glare may never become much of a problem for other road users. At least, I hope so!

Ciao,

91talon

I saw nothing in the Ebay posting that says this is completely made by CREE. Per the listing:

"...our lamp adopts genuine CREE LED CHIP..."

That tells me the kit isn't 100% CREE, but the important part, the lamp, is.

Looks good, and makes me kind of envious. :beer:

So, if I toss in one part (allegedly) made by Honda, I can sell any 'ol Chinese motorcycle as a "Honda"? Sorry, it doesn't work that way. This box is carrying the "Cree" trademark, which means the manufacturer and seller is "passing off" their product as one made by another company (indeed, zoomzoom bought it, in part, for that very reason). Assuming Cree did not make the kit, that's fraud.

And yet you still believe that they're telling the truth about the origin of the components they've included in their kit? Why?

Ciao,

Since it would appear that my use of the word CREE in the title of my headlight upgrade has offended some viewers, I have changed the title of the thread to read, "LED Headlight Upgrade"

If anyone should wish to use the kit that I purchased, please beware that kit may not be exactly as advertised, according to some.

NOTE: The LED bulbs do indeed function as per their intended purpose. The ballasts do indeed provide power to the bulbs, and the fans do indeed go round and round and provide cooling air to the heat sinks on the bulbs. Since I am apparently a dumb, back country yutz, who understands nothing about advertising or manufacturing principles, I can not say that the kit was actually manufactured by the company named on the box. I CAN however offer that the kit performs as intended and provides far brighter lighting than the stock headlights and whether they are brighter or not I will leave that up to you to decide.

Please be aware that I DO NOT, HAVE NOT, nor will I in the future be employed by Cree Inc., nor have I in any way been paid to place this "How To Install" on VFRD. I merely found a kit that interested me, that I thought would provide more light than my current headlights and that it was tremendously easy to install AND relatively inexpensive. Also I thought that this information was worthy of sharing with the members of VFRD and possibly anyone else who might think to share this thread with others that they know.

There, I do believe that I have now covered most, if not all the bases.

Merry Christmas to all and the hopes for a Happy New Year.

JZH

[EDIT: I just noticed that the LED chips supposedly used in this kit only have a 125-deg viewing angle, so right off the bat you're missing 55-deg the reflector was designed for. Not sure if that is significant in the real world, but it does show that they're not trying very hard to make this kit truly compatible...]

125-deg emitted angle from a LED is a wide angle LED, many incandescent headlight bulbs have a silvered tip so the light does not transmit straight out the front but rather must be reflected and focused off the parabolic mirror, that in conjunction with the metal base of the bulb probably blocks close to the "missing" 55 degrees if not more, as far as the horizontal spread of light if the "missing" 55 degrees was effecting the beam it would be more narrow side to side and I don't see that in the images ...

Many LEDs are much more focused, like 35 degrees of emitted light, 125 degrees is actually a lot for a LED

zoomzoom

Since it would appear that my use of the word CREE in the title of my headlight upgrade has offended some viewers, I have changed the title of the thread to read, "LED Headlight Upgrade"

If anyone should wish to use the kit that I purchased, please beware that kit may not be exactly as advertised, according to some.

NOTE: The LED bulbs do indeed function as per their intended purpose. The ballasts do indeed provide power to the bulbs, and the fans do indeed go round and round and provide cooling air to the heat sinks on the bulbs. Since I am apparently a dumb, back country yutz, who understands nothing about advertising or manufacturing principles, I can not say that the kit was actually manufactured by the company named on the box. I CAN however offer that the kit performs as intended and provides far brighter lighting than the stock headlights and whether they are brighter or not I will leave that up to you to decide.

Please be aware that I DO NOT, HAVE NOT, nor will I in the future be employed by Cree Inc., nor have I in any way been paid to place this "How To Install" on VFRD. I merely found a kit that interested me, that I thought would provide more light than my current headlights and that it was tremendously easy to install AND relatively inexpensive. Also I thought that this information was worthy of sharing with the members of VFRD and possibly anyone else who might think to share this thread with others that they know.

There, I do believe that I have now covered most, if not all the bases.

Merry Christmas to all and the hopes for a Happy New Year.

Your killin me . I like the logic .

:fing02:

Switchblade

zoomzoom

Since it would appear that my use of the word CREE in the title of my headlight upgrade has offended some viewers, I have changed the title of the thread to read, "LED Headlight Upgrade"

If anyone should wish to use the kit that I purchased, please beware that kit may not be exactly as advertised, according to some.

NOTE: The LED bulbs do indeed function as per their intended purpose. The ballasts do indeed provide power to the bulbs, and the fans do indeed go round and round and provide cooling air to the heat sinks on the bulbs. Since I am apparently a dumb, back country yutz, who understands nothing about advertising or manufacturing principles, I can not say that the kit was actually manufactured by the company named on the box. I CAN however offer that the kit performs as intended and provides far brighter lighting than the stock headlights and whether they are brighter or not I will leave that up to you to decide.

Please be aware that I DO NOT, HAVE NOT, nor will I in the future be employed by Cree Inc., nor have I in any way been paid to place this "How To Install" on VFRD. I merely found a kit that interested me, that I thought would provide more light than my current headlights and that it was tremendously easy to install AND relatively inexpensive. Also I thought that this information was worthy of sharing with the members of VFRD and possibly anyone else who might think to share this thread with others that they know.

There, I do believe that I have now covered most, if not all the bases.

Merry Christmas to all and the hopes for a Happy New Year.

Your killin me . I like the logic .

:fing02:

Agreed. AND, I still want to try 'em out in my '97.

JZH

This box is carrying the "Cree" trademark, which means the manufacturer and seller is "passing off" their product as one made by another company

These lights use these Cree LEDs. The drivers, or ballasts as the OP calls them, are not made by Cree as Cree does not make drivers. These Cree high power LEDs are also very popular in bicycle lights as they are very bright and relatively energy efficient. You see tons of low cost (<$100) lights that are advertised as using Cree LEDs where the more posh/expensive bicycle lights like Lupine (some over $1000) only mention using Cree LEDs on their website and in the manual that comes with the light.

One thing I noticed about the pictures of the beam patterns is that the LEDs seem to cast a lot of light onto the road surface directly in front of the bike. This is a problem with HID conversions as well that nobody seems to mention. You are blinding yourself by brightly lighting up areas very close that do not matter at the expense of those farther ahead that do.

Granted the pictures are a poor representation of what you actually see in real life. I appreciate the post, the work, and the reporting. I think the jury is still out on wether this is actually an upgrade to the stock H4s. It certainly looks better than the typical Chinese HID crap.

I don't see how Cree is offensive, unless you're a free Jaffa. A free HID kit if you get that reference.

I ordered a set so we'll see. They only claim on the eBay page to using Cree chips, nothing else. Maybe they're fakes, maybe not. I wouldn't know. The "company" is the eBay seller, who sells all sorts of cheap imported junk, but they've been doing it on eBay for 12 years. So I expect they'll be around in 2 years to give a refund if really necessary.

As far as the current H4 set up being perfect? Is that because it has the Honda name on it, they made it perfect? Like the exhaust, front ends, shocks, seats, electrical system, windscreen, ECU programming, etc? So we've all already ruined our 'perfect' bikes by changing all those things, what's one more mistake?

The new VFR has LED headlights, I'm sure designed for the bulb, and I'll bet JZH ends up being the first to retro fit the lens from that bike to the 5G. That's a thread I'm looking forward to reading so get to work on it! :smile:

All good points .

vfrcapn

I don't see how Cree is offensive, unless you're a free Jaffa. A free HID kit if you get that reference.

I'll PM you my shipping details. LOL

[image: post-25786-0-91658200-1387944321.jpg]

Rush2112

JZH

[EDIT: I just noticed that the LED chips supposedly used in this kit only have a 125-deg viewing angle, so right off the bat you're missing 55-deg the reflector was designed for. Not sure if that is significant in the real world, but it does show that they're not trying very hard to make this kit truly compatible...]

125-deg emitted angle from a LED is a wide angle LED, many incandescent headlight bulbs have a silvered tip so the light does not transmit straight out the front but rather must be reflected and focused off the parabolic mirror, that in conjunction with the metal base of the bulb probably blocks close to the "missing" 55 degrees if not more, as far as the horizontal spread of light if the "missing" 55 degrees was effecting the beam it would be more narrow side to side and I don't see that in the images ...

Many LEDs are much more focused, like 35 degrees of emitted light, 125 degrees is actually a lot for a LED

Oh, I agree, 125 degrees is very wide for an LED. But you're missing the significance of the difference. Have a look at an H4 bulb.

The "low-beam" LEDs are pointed up, not forward, so there is no relevant comparison to halogen bulbs with a silvered tip. H4 bulbs have shielded low beam filaments (with the shield on the bottom), which allows 180 degrees of light to hit the reflector--the entire upper half of the reflector. These LEDs only allow 125 degrees of light to hit the upper half of the reflector. Certainly, the missing light is probably only the side-to-side illumination, which is not as important as the main part of the beam, but the only reason it is missing is because the Chinese developers of these bulbs could not find a more suitable light source, but went ahead with the design anyway.

I defer to the more experienced IP lawyers on this site, but if third party manufacturers are allowed by Intel or AMD to use their trademarks, then they will have written licenses reflecting those arrangements. If you honestly think that is what is happening here, I think I still have that bridge for sale... :wacko:

Ciao,

vfrcapn

The new VFR has LED headlights, I'm sure designed for the bulb, and I'll bet JZH ends up being the first to retro fit the lens from that bike to the 5G. That's a thread I'm looking forward to reading so get to work on it! :smile:

Hmmm... I shall let you know about that! The "8th-gen" is expected to be in the dealers here in the spring, and I do intend to give the bike a close look (if not a test ride), and as we all know, if it has a Honda part number, it can be ordered...

Ciao,

vfrcapn

I don't see how Cree is offensive, unless you're a free Jaffa. A free HID kit if you get that reference.

YOU SIR MADE MY DAY :beer:

91talon

vfrcapn

I don't see how Cree is offensive, unless you're a free Jaffa. A free HID kit if you get that reference.

I'll PM you my shipping details. LOL

Got it ..

http://www.zianet.com/jsager/sg-gods.html

• [image: New_30W_Motorcycle_Bike_Lamp_Slim_LED_Bu] 8 New 30W Motorcycle Bike Lamp Slim LED Bulb White 1600LM.

Interesting alternative. Not sure what the actual connector looks like for the bulb but it might work. The add says it has bi-xenon intensity so I would have to assume that it somehow changes the light output by altering the power going to the bulb. Being a three sided bulb it would not be able to simply turn off one LED to become a low vs, high beam operation like the kit I used. If they are 125 degree LED's though it should be able to use the entire reflector since there would only be 120 degrees between each diode. Maybe I'll order one just to try it for shits and giggles. LOL

Considering that winter has befallen my home town and weather shall not be overly conducive to riding for a little while I shall not be able to really test out the new lights for a while to come. When I took the photos with two bikes side by side the weather was about -15*C and thus not very good for riding. That being said I did take my bike for a spin a little while later in the early evening after it warmed up a bit and the lights did make a WORLD of difference. A lot more light is cast ahead of the bike, including a fair bit more on the ground directly ahead of the bike. The area in front from about the tire to 4 feet ahead there is more light than I ever remember there being. The extra light here is not annoying at all and I really quite like it. The area from about 5 ft to say 30 feet is filled out nicely and there is definitely more, and brighter light than ever before. There also appears to be a lot more light to the sides of the road (contrary to theory that the LED's only have a 125 degree spread and that I will be missing 55 degrees of light to the side, must be extra diffusion off the reflector) and since the light is whiter, I find the color contrast makes objects being illuminated to be much easier to see. Not really sure how to describe this, sort of something one must see to understand. If you have ever driven a car with HID headlights, or one of the new models with LED headlights you may understand but everything the headlights illuminate just seem easier to see.

This is all after only a short (maybe 30 km's) 20 minute ride. In the whole time, I had not one high beam flash, and not one person ahead of me was seen to be dimming their rear view mirror, and I paid close attention to this as with most vehicles without tinted window it is relatively easy to see someone adjust the mirror. I also paid close attention to the where the light beam was being cast on the vehicle directly ahead of me, and how far the headlights of the cars beside me cast their headlight beams. From fairly quick first impressions on the road, the amount of light being cast is fairly similar to a current body style BMW M3 hard top convertible, as I was riding beside one down the highway for a short period.

One thing I never mentioned in my original post is that the garage shots were done on different days, and the LED headlight photos were done with the bike about 2 feet further away from the door as I had to move the bike back to get to the power panel in the garage when a circuit breaker tripped. This would likely account for the main difference in the height of the cut off line. Apparently I had a few too many Christmas lights plugged into the outlet on the front of the house. Oops, my bad.

A lot of people in my home town of Kelowna are in the over 65 year range and most of the seniors are VERY quick to flash their high beams at you if they protest your bright lights. There are also a LOT of younger guys in town that work in the oil patch and drive highly lifted, newer model 4x4's, and with their headlights being an extra 10 inches higher off the ground, they are glaringly bright even in stock form as they are nearly eye level when you are driving. As a result, most people are used to flashing their lights at you if you accidentally leave your high beams on when you come of the rural side roads that are unlit and head in to town where there are street lights. There is a guy living in the apartment block just a half block from my house with a 2005 VFR who has converted to full HID's and he says he is ALWAYS getting flashed. He said if it wasn't for the fact that the factory harness is now all chopped up he would go back to stock headlights.

When my wife came outside with me to flick the switches on the headlights from Low to High for me she made an interesting comment. She turned on her headlights (no comment) and when I turned on the new headlights on my bike her comment was "Shit, my headlights SUCK. You were planning on doing the same to my bike, right?" Naturally my response was the same any happily married man would make, "Why, Yes dear!!" LOL. Seriously though, my wife, who normally does not pay a huge amount of attention to adding farkles to her bike was definitely on board with a headlight upgrade. Even with stock bulbs in the headlights (Sylvania Silverstar H4 bulbs in both bikes by the way) she commented that the headlights on her bike were not quite as bright as the stock headlights on my bike. This may in part be due to the fact that the 5th gen has a completely clear headlight lens whereas the 4th gen is not totally clear.

Am I happy with them, YES, I would have to say overjoyed at this point. Hopefully biking season this year is not far away and I can provide some more comparisons, but for now, I will have to wait till winter ends. I have ordered a second kit for my wife's bike (96 VFR) and plan to retrofit her headlights as well. When I finished I will definitely post up some before and after photos and I will be sure to be more careful about leaving the bike in the same position so that there is a more accurate depiction of the difference.

Hope everyone has a great New Year and all the best.

I think you definitely pick the right LED distributor ....

Good write up. I would really like to do something with my CB1000R headlight. I got spoiled by my 6th gen VFR, which I believe to have excellent lighting. The ST1300 is great too...

Thanks for the write up. This seems to be an option worth considering.

zoomzoom

A lot of people in my home town of Kelowna are in the over 65 year range and most of the seniors are VERY quick to flash their high beams at you if they protest your bright lights.

Supernaturally quick really. It's kinda spooky

For those who would feel better ordering a kit from a reputable US based firm that has been around for more than a few years, here is a link to a different site that sells LED upgrade kits. For the most part the kit looks identical to the one I installed and cost is similar though slightly higher. Still looks like it uses Cree LED bulbs and cooling fans mounted in a similar way and with a very similar design.

Certainly worth looking at as another company to order a kit from. They also offer a number of other LED products that might be worth looking at.

http://www.vleds.com/bulb/h4-cxa-2000lm.html

At the time I started looking to upgrade my headlights I had considered the HID's from this company. At the time I was unaware that they sold LED kits. Always good to have a few different options when it comes to purchasing kits. Thanks to Apexandy as he reminded me about this particular company.

The eBay company got back to me a few days ago, apologizing profusely because they had apparently run out of stock on the kits after I bought one. They offered 1) an immediate refund, 2) wait 5-6 business days for them to get it back in stock and a small credit to their eBay store. They also posted a note on the eBay auction that delivery was being delayed 5-6 days. So I'll get it in next week, no big deal. Nice of them to get right on it and offer a couple of reasonable solutions. So I asked them if they were genuine Cree chips..

They are genuine Cree LED processors indeed and manufactured in Taiwan.
We offer a two-years warranty, if there is any problem,we will issue the exchange.
If you have any question,please contact us.

Whatever, I'm satisfied. :wink:

Very reasonable ...

I will be interested to hear your appraisal on the LED's vfrcapn. Let me know how it works out, and I hope you are as happy with them as I am.

I like it!!!

Thaks for going to so much trouble with so much detail and the write up and installation instructions and everything.

A friend and I are seriously looking at LED options for the VTEC (6th gen).

I'm glad you found the post helpful. I have received soooo much help from members of this forum that I felt it only fair to return the favour. Not being the MOST mechanically skilled individual (motor and major mechanical things are not my strongest suit) I do enjoy taking things apart and putting them back together. I likely won't be building a Street Fighter like Apexandy's any time soon, but minor upgrades are certainly up my alley.

Upgrades always begin with one person or a group of people seeing a need or desire for something different, and doing their best to either make it happen or make it better. The internet and forums like this one sure make it easier to share ideas and I'm happy to be able to share. Whenever I have a written a "How To" I always try to write it for the person, like me, who may have never attempted to perform such a task. I can remember the first time I tried taking the fairings off my 1985 Interceptor (VF1000F) and snapped a tab off because I had no idea how it went together. Live and learn is good, but knowing "How To" without the "Crack, Snap, Awwwwwe S#%^, What did I just break......." is just better. If I could save someone that utter pain and anguish and do something cool at the same time, THAT is just fantastic in my book. My dad always told me "You need to learn something new every day, otherwise life just gets boring."

My first upgrade I put a Vance & Hines header and rejet carbs on my Suzuki GS750. It ran like crap, tore it back down and recheck every thing nothing wrong. Looked inside the pipe and part of the packing was stuck inside the baffles .

I must submit. You Switch, are the better man.

However, I do recall having to drop the headliner in a Bentley Continental GTC a little while ago in order to repair the hail damage on the roof, hood,deck lid, fenders and quarter panels a little while ago. Scared the living crap out of me.

zoomzoom

I must submit. You Switch, are the better man.

However, I do recall having to drop the headliner in a Bentley Continental GTC a little while ago in order to repair the hail damage on the roof, hood,deck lid, fenders and quarter panels a little while ago. Scared the living crap out of me.

Na Just more experienced ..

Looks the same to me ...

zoomzoom

Considering that winter has befallen my home town and weather shall not be overly conducive to riding for a little while I shall not be able to really test out the new lights for a while to come. When I took the photos with two bikes side by side the weather was about -15*C and thus not very good for riding. That being said I did take my bike for a spin a little while later in the early evening after it warmed up a bit and the lights did make a WORLD of difference. A lot more light is cast ahead of the bike, including a fair bit more on the ground directly ahead of the bike. The area in front from about the tire to 4 feet ahead there is more light than I ever remember there being. The extra light here is not annoying at all and I really quite like it. The area from about 5 ft to say 30 feet is filled out nicely and there is definitely more, and brighter light than ever before. There also appears to be a lot more light to the sides of the road (contrary to theory that the LED's only have a 125 degree spread and that I will be missing 55 degrees of light to the side, must be extra diffusion off the reflector) and since the light is whiter, I find the color contrast makes objects being illuminated to be much easier to see. Not really sure how to describe this, sort of something one must see to understand. If you have ever driven a car with HID headlights, or one of the new models with LED headlights you may understand but everything the headlights illuminate just seem easier to see.

This is all after only a short (maybe 30 km's) 20 minute ride. In the whole time, I had not one high beam flash, and not one person ahead of me was seen to be dimming their rear view mirror, and I paid close attention to this as with most vehicles without tinted window it is relatively easy to see someone adjust the mirror. I also paid close attention to the where the light beam was being cast on the vehicle directly ahead of me, and how far the headlights of the cars beside me cast their headlight beams. From fairly quick first impressions on the road, the amount of light being cast is fairly similar to a current body style BMW M3 hard top convertible, as I was riding beside one down the highway for a short period.

One thing I never mentioned in my original post is that the garage shots were done on different days, and the LED headlight photos were done with the bike about 2 feet further away from the door as I had to move the bike back to get to the power panel in the garage when a circuit breaker tripped. This would likely account for the main difference in the height of the cut off line. Apparently I had a few too many Christmas lights plugged into the outlet on the front of the house. Oops, my bad.

A lot of people in my home town of Kelowna are in the over 65 year range and most of the seniors are VERY quick to flash their high beams at you if they protest your bright lights. There are also a LOT of younger guys in town that work in the oil patch and drive highly lifted, newer model 4x4's, and with their headlights being an extra 10 inches higher off the ground, they are glaringly bright even in stock form as they are nearly eye level when you are driving. As a result, most people are used to flashing their lights at you if you accidentally leave your high beams on when you come of the rural side roads that are unlit and head in to town where there are street lights. There is a guy living in the apartment block just a half block from my house with a 2005 VFR who has converted to full HID's and he says he is ALWAYS getting flashed. He said if it wasn't for the fact that the factory harness is now all chopped up he would go back to stock headlights.

When my wife came outside with me to flick the switches on the headlights from Low to High for me she made an interesting comment. She turned on her headlights (no comment) and when I turned on the new headlights on my bike her comment was "Shit, my headlights SUCK. You were planning on doing the same to my bike, right?" Naturally my response was the same any happily married man would make, "Why, Yes dear!!" LOL. Seriously though, my wife, who normally does not pay a huge amount of attention to adding farkles to her bike was definitely on board with a headlight upgrade. Even with stock bulbs in the headlights (Sylvania Silverstar H4 bulbs in both bikes by the way) she commented that the headlights on her bike were not quite as bright as the stock headlights on my bike. This may in part be due to the fact that the 5th gen has a completely clear headlight lens whereas the 4th gen is not totally clear.

Am I happy with them, YES, I would have to say overjoyed at this point. Hopefully biking season this year is not far away and I can provide some more comparisons, but for now, I will have to wait till winter ends. I have ordered a second kit for my wife's bike (96 VFR) and plan to retrofit her headlights as well. When I finished I will definitely post up some before and after photos and I will be sure to be more careful about leaving the bike in the same position so that there is a more accurate depiction of the difference.

Hope everyone has a great New Year and all the best.

And you get the award for being calm and cool in the face of rampant criticism from the not-here-to see-it, haven't actually-tried-it theorist. It is kind of like the French joke: "I see it works in practice, but does it really work in theory?"

One thing you'll find out is, you can never convince everyone you encounter in this or any other forum that a mod you are doing really works and is worth it, even if the evidence you might find from other forum members supports it and agrees with your results.

Just enjoy your mod and learn to ignore any what you think might be untowards/unjustified criticism you might encounter as in the end, you will be the best judge to determine whether the mod does improve your motorcycling experience....

Plenty vinegar pissers on the web..................

VFRD is not free from them, but there are by far not as many as I have seen on other forums

So they do not like my blue rimtape? I just ordered blue Bridgeports.... :goofy:

:cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

I'd still be interested to hear about the overspill with this mod. Is there a significant amount of light above the cut-off that would annoy/distract oncoming drivers/riders?

Also saw in the link to Sport-Touring.net above that some question the amount of light at distance from LED. Is this an issue?

Also, would this kit be useable in the UK/Europe with our higher wattage OEM bulbs?

Skids

I'd still be interested to hear about the overspill with this mod. Is there a significant amount of light above the cut-off that would annoy/distract oncoming drivers/riders?

Also saw in the link to Sport-Touring.net above that some question the amount of light at distance from LED. Is this an issue?

Also, would this kit be useable in the UK/Europe with our higher wattage OEM bulbs?

I can not say with 100% certainty that no one was annoyed by the new lights! only that I did not receive a single (please dim you lights) high beam flash from any other motorists while I went for the ride. Granted it was short, but for the most part I do not believe anyone was offended.

The amount of lumens projected at a distance from the light, of say 100 ft, as the other forum question posted, is not something I have tested. As I do not have a light meter I can not provide that information. That being said, I would have to compare the amount of light from my headlight versus the stock one on my wife's 96 VFR to do that comparison. I do have a friend who is a semi pro photographer and he likely has one so I will see if I can arrange some tests in this regard. Maybe I can do some side to side measures as well. Likely won't be for a little while yet though I am afraid.

As for the kit being useable in European bikes that use higher wattage bulbs? The only suggestion there that I can offer is for someone to try it out and see. If the LED bulbs are say 50 percent brighter than stock then that would mean they should perform better than a 90 W halogen bulb given that I am basing the findings on a 60/55 standard automotive H4 bulb. One of the he reports I read online stated that a standard halogen H4 bulb was rated at 500 or 800 lumens (can't remember which, sorry) and the LED bulbs are rated at 1800 lumens. Even using the higher number that would mean that the LED is more than 100% brighter.

I have read a number of posts with regard to the 6th gen bikes stating that the low beams on the 2002 and up VFR use an H4 bulb for the low beams but that only one filament is powered by the socket and the other has no connection to power the high beam filament of the H4 bulb. This would mean that on a 6th gen bike the lower LED (the high beam diode) would never function with this LED kit as there is no power connection available on the factory harness to power this part of the bulb. On the 3rd, 4th and 5th gen bikes the bulb is used as both the high and low beam so the kit should work on these generations without much trouble as far as power to the bulb is concerned.

Vfrcapn has mentioned that he has ordered and is going to install a kit on his 5th gen, so it will be interesting to hear his findings as well. I think his riding season is also much longer than mine so hopefully he may have some test results earlier than I will. Gawd I hope winter ends soooooon. I wanna ride my bike. :(

I got mine in the mail today. I don't know if it was mentioned but the eBay seller lowered the price $15 to $75. I emailed yesterday asking about a refund of the difference and shipping date, got both today - the lights and $15 refund. Stand up seller no doubt.

I hope to get this installed new years day and I'll be riding the rest of the week if I do, got to finish the rear brake line in the swingarm install first.

edit: Ok, now the price is $179.95. :wacko:

WTF!!! Just looked at them two days ago and they were on for $75. YIKES!!! Must be a typo. I would hope...........

Intresting. LED lights has rapidly become werry afficient, but as whit the HID lights, as the headlights are designed for halogen bulbs whit a werry spesific burn point, there will always be some degre of light going not where its supose to, like in the eyes of agains comming traffic. The only bright whit that is you will be more easylly noticed during daylight by other traffic, and that is not a bad thing as long you dont get a ticket, as they are illegal.

I found it interesting and odd at the last 24 Hours of LeMan the Audi's had massive and massively bright LED headlight arrays that the commentators said had their own cooling fans. I thought that was one the benefits of LEDs, not heating up like incandescent bulbs. Maybe they meant for the electronics? I'm certainly no expert. All I know is the last time I rode my VFR at night on an unlighted road my headlights were pointed so far down as to be near useless.

Zoomzoom, did you notice and higher readings on your voltmeter while riding with the LEDs? (I thought your earlier post said you had one installed?) that's my main interest in this, lower power draw. Or do the fans negate that?

Nice job vfrcapn. Had to get your $15, now he jacked the price to make it up! :D

Oh well, I suspect he just lost a handful of buyers from here. I was seriously thinking about one, and probably another if I liked it.

KPerham

Nice job vfrcapn. Had to get your $15, now he jacked the price to make it up! :D

Oh well, I suspect he just lost a handful of buyers from here. I was seriously thinking about one, and probably another if I liked it.

Damit I was hoping to install LED's and fork brace. Brighter and better handling ...

KPerham

I found it interesting and odd at the last 24 Hours of LeMan the Audi's had massive and massively bright LED headlight arrays that the commentators said had their own cooling fans. I thought that was one the benefits of LEDs, not heating up like incandescent bulbs. Maybe they meant for the electronics? I'm certainly no expert. All I know is the last time I rode my VFR at night on an unlighted road my headlights were pointed so far down as to be near useless.

Zoomzoom, did you notice and higher readings on your voltmeter while riding with the LEDs? (I thought your earlier post said you had one installed?) that's my main interest in this, lower power draw. Or do the fans negate that?

There were a number of other sellers on eBay that showed similar kits for the H4 lights, and some were less than what I paid, but most were shipped from Hong Kong or China and the shipping offset the lower cost. As I mentioned in an an earlier post their is the guys at VLEDS in the US that have a kit that looks nearly identical and though before it was more expensive, it is now $60 cheaper. Have a look at this company if you're still interested.

http://www.vleds.com/bulb/h4-cxa-2000lm.html

I was just curious about the voltage because I've test ridden my bike without remembering to plug in the headlight(s) after some minor work and wondered why the voltage was higher than normal.

I'm not one to leave my key on with the engine off, but I know some that do... _coughMiniCarvercough... :unsure:

I wish I had caught the $75 sale! Got a bunch of other stuff to pay for first, that's why I was waiting... :mad:

I was doing some work to my bike when I accidentally left the lights on. That would be one issue with having your 6 year old helping you with stuff. Their attention span is smaller and they move on from one thing t.o another. I was moving the bike around in the garage as I was having at intermittent horn failure issue (turned out to be a bad connection in behind the fairing) and I had left the key on to test the horn. My son asked me to pull his pedal bike out of the garage to show me how well he could ride, then my daughter wanted her bike, my wife called me for something and I completely forgot the bike was on until I came back out about a half hour later and wondered why the lights were on, then I clued in DOH, "What a dumb ass, I forgot to turn off the key."

Note to Self. Beware the six year old offering assistance, he is a great help, but he can be distracting at times. Gotta love him though as he IS a great little helper. Not to mention an "Always Willing" biking partner. :)

I was interested in this topic also, and in looking around, see that the DOT specs for an H4/9003/HB2 bulb is 1580 lumens. It seems that the visible light power output of the LED you installed is the same as a stock H4, but with a very narrow color wavelength, making the apparent brightness better, which is what you were after in the first place.

There are offerings of higher power LED's I saw, up to 3200 lumens (lumens being the power, or wattage, of visible light emitted), if you want more light.

The wattage consumed by the device to emit that much light is lots less for LED's than filaments of any kind, yet if you go up in light power, you will need more current, but still significantly less than halogen filament bulbs as are stock. LED's are about 15% efficient, meaning 85% of power applied is lost as heat (therefore the heat sink and fan, to prevent overheat damage to the LED).

Standard halogens emit 5% of power applied as light, and get quite hot, but it doesn't hurt them.

There is an issue of reflector design and the size of the light "point" of an LED, and how that point aims and spreads through the parabolic reflector of a stock lens. The LED light emitter is much large than the precise filament of an H4, and will bounce more stray rays outside the reflector and lens envelope's design.

Only by installing and observing for yourself can you judge scatter and glare. One would have to set up a bike with a rider posed at normal riding position and go away far enough to see what other drivers see facing you. Ideally, by sitting in a car as though meeting you on the road.

I would be interested in how you perceive the oncoming cage driver's view. Thank you for making a nice post of the install and for all the trouble you went to in making it available on this forum.

I thank you for your interest in the topic JETS and I certainly value all points of view and opinions. As I mentioned in an earlier post I did notice a vast improvement in lighting quality. As you mention this is MY perception and I certainly hope to not offend drivers coming toward me, though as posted earlier when I did my first test ride, I received no high beam flashes from oncoming drivers. This does not necessarily mean that I did not offend anyone, merely that I received no apparent distaste. Hopefully this will remain.

When I started down the road of this particular mod, I weighed many pros and cons with regard to my decision between HID's (with projectors and I would not go this route without them) and my eventual choice of the LED's. As you mentioned the LED's are more efficient at producing light than incandescent style bulbs and they do produce heat which can cause failure of the electronics. Honestly I was expecting that the bulb after a half hour of running on high (max current) beams would have produced much more heat given that the only airflow was provided by the cooling fans. The fans really don't feel as though they could move a lot of air. Another benefit I think for the LED is that they are more resistant to damage caused by vibration. I have owned a number of vehicles over the years that have used H4, H7 and H11 style bulbs, and all seemed to fail long before their projected lifespans. My cars (Mazda's) all seemed to go through the bulbs like wart for some reason and the service department at the dealership mentioned that they had received a number of complaints about bulb life (or indeed lack thereof) and mainly with the fog light bulb which was mounted to the front bumper. Hopefully the LED will last far longer as not only are they supposed to have a longer life, but they are more resistant to vibration and let's face it, bikes do vibrate, and likely a bit more than a car in this case.

The LED does have a more directional light beam than a traditional halogen but this may help somewhat with the effect of scatter. The reflector is most certainly designed for use with a halogen bulb and I in no way disagree that the reflector is not designed for use with the LED in mind but I think the decreased light intensity to the sides of the diode vs. a standard halogen which emits a consistent amount of light all around the filament, may help serve to limit the overall intensity of the light emitted side to side. When looking at the design of the reflector inside the 5th gen housing I have noticed that the actual reflector disappears behind a black plastic trim piece on both top and bottom of the reflector and I think this is part helps contribute to the cutoff of the beam. Is it as sharp as the standard halogen bulb, perhaps not, but it is fairly close. I have looked at the beam spread of an aftermarket HID conversion and the excess bleed off the reflector to all sides is far greater than that of the LED. I have stood in front of the bike and placed myself at the height I would normally sit at in my car and the headlights are brighter but not glaringly so. In truth I needed to sit down to the point where my eye was nearly level with the bulb before it became to bright if you will.

All in all, I think the mod will prove useful and helpful. If there is an issue and I receive a great deal of negative feed back then I will re-evaluate it at that time. For now though I believe it to be a good addition and since the majority of my riding will be during the daytime, a little extra light to help people notice I am there, can not really be a bad thing. In my opinion of course.

May I suggest that you get a friend to ride the bike towards you, at night, whilst you sit in your car. As long as your mate is of a similar weight to you, there should be little/ no difference. That way, you can make a personal judgement on the amount of overspill. Whilst yr at it, you could ask them to accelerate from standstill towards you to see if that's worse than standard.

Of course, you would need a similar, stock bike to compare against.

Just a thought.

HNY everyone.

Yesterday I contacted the ebay seller that zoomzoom and vfrcapn bought from and asked why the price went up so dramatically. I also mentioned that they likely lost several sales on the forum due to the increase. I got a reply that basically said that they were low on stock and would go back to the original price when they had bought more stock.

So there ya go, if you're interested in buying from that seller just wait a bit and keep your eyes on them. If not, there are a couple other options. One already posted here, and some others on ebay with (claimed) USA mailing addresses.

JETS

The LED light emitter is much large than the precise filament of an H4

Say what? :biggrin:

[image: gallery_5310_4809_206655.jpg]

This is what I once found when replacing halogen bulbs.The one on the left exceeds H4 dimension tolerances by quite a margin.

Whoah, the QC guy was asleep at the switch.

Skids

May I suggest that you get a friend to ride the bike towards you, at night, whilst you sit in your car. As long as your mate is of a similar weight to you, there should be little/ no difference. That way, you can make a personal judgement on the amount of overspill. Whilst yr at it, you could ask them to accelerate from standstill towards you to see if that's worse than standard.

Okay… I'll do it. Not my fault if the front wheel happens to leave the pavement :wheel:

And it also angled ... The one on the left .

That would definitely be blinding!

KPerham

Yesterday I contacted the ebay seller that zoomzoom and vfrcapn bought from and asked why the price went up so dramatically. I also mentioned that they likely lost several sales on the forum due to the increase. I got a reply that basically said that they were low on stock and would go back to the original price when they had bought more stock.

So there ya go, if you're interested in buying from that seller just wait a bit and keep your eyes on them. If not, there are a couple other options. One already posted here, and some others on ebay with (claimed) USA mailing addresses.

I contacted the eBay seller yesterday as well and basically got the same reply. He mentioned that in order to keep the listing spot they increased the price until the inventory issue was solved. I also tried to get them to give VFRD and VFRW forum members a discount on the old purchase price. I have yet to receive a reply to that particular email and I will post up with a response should I receive one.

apexandy

Skids

May I suggest that you get a friend to ride the bike towards you, at night, whilst you sit in your car. As long as your mate is of a similar weight to you, there should be little/ no difference. That way, you can make a personal judgement on the amount of overspill. Whilst yr at it, you could ask them to accelerate from standstill towards you to see if that's worse than standard.

Okay… I'll do it. Not my fault if the front wheel happens to leave the pavement :wheel:

Okay, okay, if you really wanna ride my bike that bad Apex you are certainly welcome. Of course does this mean I get to try yours????? OOOOOOOOOOOhhhhhh, pretty please, with sugar on it and everything. LOL

Great thread as I have looked at light mods for my VFR as well. Thanks ZZ!

A couple of years ago I was climbing in the dark the incredible grade going west out of Borrego Springs on a Winter Ride (San Diego Winter haha). After we stopped at the top a couple of other riders were talking about the dead deer in the road. What ..............I never saw it. I immediately bought some higher wattage H4 bulbs but never installed them as I was waiting for one of my OEMs to fail and frankly was a touch worried about overloading my electrical system.

Thereafter I took my Wing (4 H7s with huge reflectors plus driving lights) when riding at night to include some winter commuting. This lighting proved invaluable on several long winter tours, especially when pushing late in the day for big miles in the saddle.

[image: med_gallery_2144_2760_540475.jpg]

ZZ's thread started me seriously thinking again about upgrading my 5th gen lighting.

I went to an old favorite electrics/lighting website.............and lo and behold they have LED upgrade kits for both the VFR (generic) and Wing plus their LED setups for add-on driving lights. I have had very good luck with these folks before and run several different lighting products and gage kits from them.

http://www.electricalconnection.com/category_breakdown_led_hl.htm

Thanks again .....these guys along with several other vendors already listed gives us more options to upgrade.

Thanks for the reply BonusVFR. Sweet looking Wing by the way. I think if I had the choice to ride in cooler weather I would always take the wing, if for any other reason than it has more wind protection so at least you would stay warmer. Thanks for posting up the link to yet another supplier. The more the merrier. I have noticed that the supplier on eBay that I used has recently increased his price by a huge margin. After sending him an email asking about the huge increase he replied saying that the price will go back down again once he sorts out an inventory issue.

I have received a private message from another site member here that did an install on a 4th gen and his comments were very positive. If he doesn't wish to post his comments I have asked his permission to post up his findings but I will have to wait before doing so.

One thing to mention would be that another member doing an install on his 5th gen noticed that when he went to install one of the bulbs he noticed that the retainer ring on the bulb that positions the bulb in the housing was mounted incorrectly. The bulb was thus turned 180 degrees and this would cause the incorrect LED to light up when the low beams are engaged once installed. The diode on the LED bulbs that is closest to the end of the bulb (furthest from the cooling fan) should be facing up once installed (and should be centered on the large positioning tab) so that when you have the low beams engaged the bulb should reflect off the upper part of the reflector. The retainer ring is attached to the bulb with small screws and can be turned around apparently but you may need to drill a couple small holes as the screw holes are offset from the center line of bulb.

zoomzoom

I have noticed that the supplier on eBay that I used has recently increased his price by a huge margin. After sending him an email asking about the huge increase he replied saying that the price will go back down again once he sorts out an inventory issue.

They are back down to $79.95 today. Just FYI. :-)

:cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

Well, got out for a short ride in town and I'm happy with the performance of these. Instant on, high beams too. The low beams are a noticeable improvement over stock but the high beams seem to be an enormous increase, pleasantly surprised at how much light they put out. The rear on my bike is raised and the front lowered pretty significantly, I've been putting off adjusting the headlight aim for a long time, that would definitely help the low beams throw a little more light out away from the bike.

The issue with the incorrect bulb only took a few minutes to fix with a drill bit, the correct LED lit up, it was just point down instead of up.

Overall a very good deal for the price at $80, thanks ZZ!

The other member that I had mentioned performed the install on his 4th gen has given me permission to post his findings and comments. Here are the results from his installation and what his opinions of the LED headlights. Below is his first set of comments.

Hi, I had purchased that same light system about the time you first posted your write-up, which was very informative.
I finally got around to installing it and have commuted a few days to work.
So far I'm impressed by the amount of light and the added brightness. I'm sure it is more "annoying" or brighter to oncoming cars, but not blindingly like most aftermarket HID kits.
With there being almost no moon now I'm hoping to get a few darker rides up into the hill areas around my home to really see the difference the LEDs make. I usually try not to ride at night if at all possible, but as it's dark when I leave for work and then dark by 6pm it's not really possible.
Thanks for your timely writeup and I'll keep you informed on how I like the system on my 4th gen vfr.
I do need to adjust the lights, as I really haven't messed with the headlight alignment much. Also as I had the entire from cowling/fairing off it seems to be sitting slightly lower than before.

After reading the above message I had a couple of questions regarding the comment on brightness and glare and this was his response.

I might not have stated what I meant correctly. I don't think the added brightness is annoying to oncoming traffic at all. NO one has flashed me and when I was behind cars I never saw anyone flip their rear view mirrors. So I doubt it's "too bright" or there is a lot of stray light blinding others.

My headlight and top fairing seems to be slightly downward from where it was. I did see the alignment posts and got them lined up. I'll have a look to see if the grommets are still in there though. Thanks for the tips.

As for where I placed the ballasts, I just stuck them onto the sides of the light housing, much like you did. I looked at the areas available and I liked it. But I should have trial fit them again after I had decided I wanted them there because I put them too far back and they almost interfere with other things on the bike in that area. I may move them onto the "back" of the fairing, near the lights. The wires will still reach the stock connector and the fan and led.

I'm not one to take step by step pictures and properly document my progress. But I will take some pictures of the on the road light. But as you probably know pictures really don't show the difference in light output.

I really like how the reflective distance is considerably longer and I can see much further ahead and things show up much quicker. The light pattern is definitely different, I'm not sure if it's good or bad, but it definitely casts more light in front of you.

It would appear that this member was also happy with the results from installing the LED kit on his 4th gen so it is good to know that the mod can also be helpful on the 4th gen bikes as well. If anyone else has any comments after doing an install, please post them up. The more information and opinions we can gather the better we can gauge the benefits of the upgrade.

Thanks to everyone for all the support and comments and let's keep the information coming.

vfrcapn

Well, got out for a short ride in town and I'm happy with the performance of these. Instant on, high beams too. The low beams are a noticeable improvement over stock but the high beams seem to be an enormous increase, pleasantly surprised at how much light they put out. The rear on my bike is raised and the front lowered pretty significantly, I've been putting off adjusting the headlight aim for a long time, that would definitely help the low beams throw a little more light out away from the bike.

The issue with the incorrect bulb only took a few minutes to fix with a drill bit, the correct LED lit up, it was just point down instead of up.

Overall a very good deal for the price at $80, thanks ZZ! 

wagzhp

vfrcapn

Well, got out for a short ride in town and I'm happy with the performance of these. Instant on, high beams too. The low beams are a noticeable improvement over stock but the high beams seem to be an enormous increase, pleasantly surprised at how much light they put out. The rear on my bike is raised and the front lowered pretty significantly, I've been putting off adjusting the headlight aim for a long time, that would definitely help the low beams throw a little more light out away from the bike.

The issue with the incorrect bulb only took a few minutes to fix with a drill bit, the correct LED lit up, it was just point down instead of up.

Overall a very good deal for the price at $80, thanks ZZ!

Does this mean your lights are brighter than mine now? We need to get together for another ride soon.

Based on our last ride, I hope so. I thought I was using candle power compared to yours.

Record warm temps, let's go ride!

As I do most of my winter commute in the dark, I am very interested in this thread for my 5th Gen (H4 bulbs).

I'd rather not have to pay international shipping to the UK from the linked US suppliers, nor run the risk of additional customs import charges but how do I tell if the ones on sale over here are direct replacements for halogen, with the LED emitters in the correct places?

I am curious why you folks have decided to go with LED lights to increase output instead of adding additional lights? Are you looking to lower electrical load? Keep stock look? Bling factor?

zz thanks. I'm having issues pasting anything on here, so no url I'm afraid. The ads I've seen quote the same info as your link so I'm guessing it's a generic ad for a range of bulbs as the type of bulb is selectable.

I'll try Firefox.

Aha, Google Chrome works.

Here's where I'm looking.

Hey Skids

According to the link you provided it looks to be a very similar kit to the one I ordered.  At the top of the eBay listing page you provided the link for, just above the "BUY IT NOW" tab on the listing it shows: 

Item Condition:  New

Socket:  (Selection Box) : H4

Quantity:  (Selection Box) : 1

In the SOCKET selection box, just click on the style of light you want.  When I looked at the link it gives you a large selection of choices.  Pick the H4 if that is what you are purchasing (or another style if you are ordering something else)

See Picture below.  PLEASE don't take offense with the nature of the post as NONE is or was intended.  Sometimes it can be really hard to say in words what you can easily show in a picture.  Hope this clarifies.  The eBay seller I used only had a listing for the H4 style bulb on his eBay page (though others may have been available) whereas yours appears to offer a bulb selection box on his listing.  Other than that I think the kit will look approx the same as the one I posted the install as far as the overall looks of the bulb is concerned.  

[image: photo (60).jpg]

zz thanks. I'm having issues pasting anything on here, so no url I'm afraid. The ads I've seen quote the same info as your link so I'm guessing it's a generic ad for a range of bulbs as the type of bulb is selectable.

I'll try Firefox.

Aha, Google Chrome works.

Here's where I'm looking.

You are probably using IE as your web browser and need to click the "compatibility" button to return the quote function...

http://www.vfrdiscus...h-update-to-ie/

Sorry CC, didn't work.

zz - no offence taken. I know what H4, H7 etc mean, it was all the other stuff I wasn't sure about.

For £48 and free delivery with a good rep, I think the one I linked to is worth a try.

zz - no offence taken. I know what H4, H7 etc mean, it was all the other stuff I wasn't sure about.

For £48 and free delivery with a good rep, I think the one I linked to is worth a try.

So glad you weren't offended.  While I was typing I was racking my brain trying to determine how to type what I meant without sounding offensive or condescending.  Sometimes I hate the internet for that.  You just can't hear my tone of voice through this darned thing.  LOL

For that cost and free delivery, you bet.  I'm not sure what British Pounds works out to in Canadian dollars or US dollars but I bet it is pretty close.  The free shipping would change my price for the kit considerably though.  

Let me know how everything works out.  A few others have posted back or messaged me directly now and so far all the comments appear to be very positive.  That in itself makes me glad I did a write up.  :)

zz - no offence taken. I know what H4, H7 etc mean, it was all the other stuff I wasn't sure about.

For £48 and free delivery with a good rep, I think the one I linked to is worth a try.

So glad you weren't offended.  While I was typing I was racking my brain trying to determine how to type what I meant without sounding offensive or condescending.  Sometimes I hate the internet for that.  You just can't hear my tone of voice through this darned thing.  LOL

For that cost and free delivery, you bet.  I'm not sure what British Pounds works out to in Canadian dollars or US dollars but I bet it is pretty close.  The free shipping would change my price for the kit considerably though.  

Let me know how everything works out.  A few others have posted back or messaged me directly now and so far all the comments appear to be very positive.  That in itself makes me glad I did a write up.  :)

 They will have to perform quite well, I have Osram Nightbreakers fitted and they are pretty good.

Delivery should take about 3 weeks but I'm away most of Feb so not sure when I'll be able to fit them but I'll post when it's done.

£48 = ~Can$84

I went to an old favorite electrics/lighting website.............and lo and behold they have LED upgrade kits for both the VFR (generic) and Wing plus their LED setups for add-on driving lights.  I have had very good luck with these folks before and run several different lighting products and gage kits from them.

http://www.electrica...down_led_hl.htm

Thanks again .....these guys along with several other vendors already listed gives us more options to upgrade.

Electrical Connection (above link) was written up by Motor Cyclist Mag in Feb2014 (pg 60) GEAR section Best of AIMExpo... for, wait for it....

25-watt double-sided CREE LED Headlight bulbs!!!

Good find.  I have had success with their products so this just confirms what my experience has been.  This outfit has been selling a variety of LED kits for a number of years so this is another LED product that has been probably well thought out.  Thanks.

Gonna  have  to   have  better  brakes  ....

Mkay, just got around to sticking one of these in tonight. I did the left side and kept the right side stock for a first try so I could make an on the bike comparison.

first up, install. I have pretty slender flexible hands (former professional wrench) and I had no problem doing the whole install with the headlight in the bike. I have temporarily ziptied the ballast onto the wire harness mount in the left fairing instead of attaching it to the headlight, I did remove the side fairing to access that space. It is pretty easy to get everything to fit into the bike, and the wires all had plenty of slack to reach. I was able to stretch the rubber rain covers over the back of the LED bulbs without too much trouble. I had purchased a set of the H4 adapter rings ages ago but couldn't find them now that I need them, So I just trimmed the tabs on the LED bulbs to fit properly. They seat securely and the spring clips fall in the right place on the basses. So far all lovely.

Fired them up for a test and they kept doing this weird thing where the brightness would start out really high then drop maybe 20%. Tried it with the bike running and same result. Figured it must be a LED thing and moved on. Mounted up the tiny little fans and attached all the wiring once I had my routing picked out, slipped the fairing back on and went for a ride. Now the funny power drop has gone away. It occurs to me now that maybe the system reduces power when the fans arent hooked up to protect itself, just a thought, havent tested it. Also, man these fans are tiny!

So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. The pattern is a bit more difuse, with a little more scatter above the cutoff, but its not bad really. The pattern is both wider on the low beam, and way way fuller on high beam. I live at the base of two terrific unlit mountain roads, so I have a pretty solid test for light pattern, just head up the road and see if I can see in the corners. In this respect these lights have a significant advantage for me. low beam pattern in the LED left light was wider than in the still stock right light, so I could see in lovely white light while turning left and not so much when turning right. The other super nice thing. When you hit the high beam, you get the wide low beam pattern, AND the long range high beam pattern, not the normal switch off of the stock lights. 

So I like it, your millage may vary, its not a magic solution for night ridding but it can be part of a well rounded package. I still think I need more flood light to be comfortable at speed in the dark. And for the price its a pretty cheap thing to try out. I don't really want to wade into the scatter discussion, but we are inundated with GSXRs with bad HID kits where I live, and this looks nothing remotely like that on the road. So not as perfect as the factory setup for oncoming traffic, but certainly not fiery death levels of glare either. Its a compromise I can live with, you will have to make that call for yourself. 

You  did  what  ????   Your  just  mean  ....

:goofy:

Just for giggles, I sent an Email to CREE, and supplied them a few Ebay links for these sort of LED conversion kits, and asked if they were aware of the presence of these kits in the marketplace, likely all originating from China, even if the seller is located in the USA.

I also inquired if they were genuine CREE LED chips, or some sort of knockoffs.

Will post up the response I get as soon as possible. Just for info's sake.

You had to wait until after we'd bought the damned things, didn't you! :tongue2:

Mkay, just got around to sticking one of these in tonight. I did the left side and kept the right side stock for a first try so I could make an on the bike comparison.

first up, install. I have pretty slender flexible hands (former professional wrench) and I had no problem doing the whole install with the headlight in the bike. I have temporarily ziptied the ballast onto the wire harness mount in the left fairing instead of attaching it to the headlight, I did remove the side fairing to access that space. It is pretty easy to get everything to fit into the bike, and the wires all had plenty of slack to reach. I was able to stretch the rubber rain covers over the back of the LED bulbs without too much trouble. I had purchased a set of the H4 adapter rings ages ago but couldn't find them now that I need them, So I just trimmed the tabs on the LED bulbs to fit properly. They seat securely and the spring clips fall in the right place on the basses. So far all lovely.

Fired them up for a test and they kept doing this weird thing where the brightness would start out really high then drop maybe 20%. Tried it with the bike running and same result. Figured it must be a LED thing and moved on. Mounted up the tiny little fans and attached all the wiring once I had my routing picked out, slipped the fairing back on and went for a ride. Now the funny power drop has gone away. It occurs to me now that maybe the system reduces power when the fans arent hooked up to protect itself, just a thought, havent tested it. Also, man these fans are tiny!

So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. The pattern is a bit more difuse, with a little more scatter above the cutoff, but its not bad really. The pattern is both wider on the low beam, and way way fuller on high beam. I live at the base of two terrific unlit mountain roads, so I have a pretty solid test for light pattern, just head up the road and see if I can see in the corners. In this respect these lights have a significant advantage for me. low beam pattern in the LED left light was wider than in the still stock right light, so I could see in lovely white light while turning left and not so much when turning right. The other super nice thing. When you hit the high beam, you get the wide low beam pattern, AND the long range high beam pattern, not the normal switch off of the stock lights. 

So I like it, your millage may vary, its not a magic solution for night ridding but it can be part of a well rounded package. I still think I need more flood light to be comfortable at speed in the dark. And for the price its a pretty cheap thing to try out. I don't really want to wade into the scatter discussion, but we are inundated with GSXRs with bad HID kits where I live, and this looks nothing remotely like that on the road. So not as perfect as the factory setup for oncoming traffic, but certainly not fiery death levels of glare either. Its a compromise I can live with, you will have to make that call for yourself. 

PhotoOp, thanks for that write-up.

I've highlighted the icing on the cake for me. One of the few things I dislike about the 5th Gen is that the low beam turns off when high beam is selected. I understand why this is, but compared to my 6th Gen where, with H7 bulbs, all 4 bulbs are on with high beam selected, the difference is huge.

I may consider fitting 2 sets of H7 LEDs to my 6th Gen.....depends how they work on my 5th Gen.

Mkay, just got around to sticking one of these in tonight. I did the left side and kept the right side stock for a first try so I could make an on the bike comparison.
 
first up, install. I have pretty slender flexible hands (former professional wrench) and I had no problem doing the whole install with the headlight in the bike. I have temporarily ziptied the ballast onto the wire harness mount in the left fairing instead of attaching it to the headlight, I did remove the side fairing to access that space. It is pretty easy to get everything to fit into the bike, and the wires all had plenty of slack to reach. I was able to stretch the rubber rain covers over the back of the LED bulbs without too much trouble. I had purchased a set of the H4 adapter rings ages ago but couldn't find them now that I need them, So I just trimmed the tabs on the LED bulbs to fit properly. They seat securely and the spring clips fall in the right place on the basses. So far all lovely.
 
Fired them up for a test and they kept doing this weird thing where the brightness would start out really high then drop maybe 20%. Tried it with the bike running and same result. Figured it must be a LED thing and moved on. Mounted up the tiny little fans and attached all the wiring once I had my routing picked out, slipped the fairing back on and went for a ride. Now the funny power drop has gone away. It occurs to me now that maybe the system reduces power when the fans arent hooked up to protect itself, just a thought, havent tested it. Also, man these fans are tiny!
 
So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. The pattern is a bit more difuse, with a little more scatter above the cutoff, but its not bad really. The pattern is both wider on the low beam, and way way fuller on high beam. I live at the base of two terrific unlit mountain roads, so I have a pretty solid test for light pattern, just head up the road and see if I can see in the corners. In this respect these lights have a significant advantage for me. low beam pattern in the LED left light was wider than in the still stock right light, so I could see in lovely white light while turning left and not so much when turning right. The other super nice thing. When you hit the high beam, you get the wide low beam pattern, AND the long range high beam pattern, not the normal switch off of the stock lights. 
 
So I like it, your millage may vary, its not a magic solution for night ridding but it can be part of a well rounded package. I still think I need more flood light to be comfortable at speed in the dark. And for the price its a pretty cheap thing to try out. I don't really want to wade into the scatter discussion, but we are inundated with GSXRs with bad HID kits where I live, and this looks nothing remotely like that on the road. So not as perfect as the factory setup for oncoming traffic, but certainly not fiery death levels of glare either. Its a compromise I can live with, you will have to make that call for yourself.

Mr. McKinnon,

Thank you for submitting your questions to us regarding this matter. Your observation is spot on and we are unable to verify whether the units actually use genuine Cree LED chips. Cree sells many LED’s through distribution who sell to companies, that most likely aren’t selling their products on ebay. With that said, I also cannot confirm 100% that they aren’t genuine unless the product was thoroughly reviewed.

Cree’s legal department is well aware of the issues that similar listings are causing consumers and is trying to fight as many of these instances as they can. My best recommendation for you would be to try to contact the actual manufacturer of the product you are looking to buy and gather as much information as possible in order to make a well informed decision. I also will forward the below information on to our legal team so they can add this to their list of items/companies to check up on.

Good luck in your search and thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Thanks and Regards,

Jeff Martin
Customer Service Representative - Product Returns
919-407-5983
Email: Jeff_Martin@Cree.com

Mr. McKinnon,

Thank you for submitting your questions to us regarding this matter. Your observation is spot on and we are unable to verify whether the units actually use genuine Cree LED chips. Cree sells many LED’s through distribution who sell to companies, that most likely aren’t selling their products on ebay. With that said, I also cannot confirm 100% that they aren’t genuine unless the product was thoroughly reviewed.

Cree’s legal department is well aware of the issues that similar listings are causing consumers and is trying to fight as many of these instances as they can. My best recommendation for you would be to try to contact the actual manufacturer of the product you are looking to buy and gather as much information as possible in order to make a well informed decision. I also will forward the below information on to our legal team so they can add this to their list of items/companies to check up on.

Good luck in your search and thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Thanks and Regards,

Jeff Martin
Customer Service Representative - Product Returns
919-407-5983
Email: Jeff_Martin@Cree.com

Troublemaker!

It was always obvious to me that Cree did not make the kit, or the bulbs, as claimed by the seller.  Quick-buck artists are always trying to piggyback off of the hard work and success of reputable companies like Cree, Philips, Bosch and the like.  I guess if it's cheap enough, people will buy it anyway...

Ciao,

Mr. McKinnon,

Thank you for submitting your questions to us regarding this matter. Your observation is spot on and we are unable to verify whether the units actually use genuine Cree LED chips. Cree sells many LED’s through distribution who sell to companies, that most likely aren’t selling their products on ebay. With that said, I also cannot confirm 100% that they aren’t genuine unless the product was thoroughly reviewed.

Cree’s legal department is well aware of the issues that similar listings are causing consumers and is trying to fight as many of these instances as they can. My best recommendation for you would be to try to contact the actual manufacturer of the product you are looking to buy and gather as much information as possible in order to make a well informed decision. I also will forward the below information on to our legal team so they can add this to their list of items/companies to check up on.

Good luck in your search and thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Thanks and Regards,

Jeff Martin
Customer Service Representative - Product Returns
919-407-5983
Email: Jeff_Martin@Cree.com

Troublemaker!

It was always obvious to me that Cree did not make the kit, or the bulbs, as claimed by the seller.  Quick-buck artists are always trying to piggyback off of the hard work and success of reputable companies like Cree, Philips, Bosch and the like.  I guess if it's cheap enough, people will buy it anyway...

Ciao,

As was mentioned by the representative from Cree, HE clearly CAN NOT say with 100% certainty that the bulbs and/or LED diodes were or were not made by CREE.  LOOK at the highlighted portion of the email.  Jeff Martin did mention that he would pass the matter on to his legal for verification.  If the parts were not made by Cree and there is a patent infringement issue then it is up to the legal department at Cree to do something about it.  What does this mean for those of us who purchased the product linked to in my original post, well, maybe the warranty will not be upheld by the manufacturer in question or supplier who sold them in the first place.  Mind you, removing the tabs from the bulb so that they fit in our headlight housings will likely do that anyhow.  

The whole Cree issue and who made the kit aside, the kit and/or kits on the market, have proven to provide adequate illumination and indeed better illumination than the stock halogen bulbs, according to the opinions of those who have installed them on their bikes.  I think it safe to say now, that with more people other than just myself having installed a kit in their bikes, and having found comparative results, the actual manufactures of the parts in the kit is a mute point.  There are numerous links to other manufacturers now that sell kits with very similar looking bulbs, so can you say with 100% certainty that NONE of these manufacturers are indeed using Cree products in the manufacture of their products?  Be careful how you answer that, as it could be considered slanderous.  Can I say that the company I chose to purchase my kit from uses Cree LED's in the manufacture of their product, NO.  Can I say that none of the companies mentioned in this thread use the Cree LED's in the manufacture of their products, NO.      

Speaking strictly for myself, I purchased the kit in an effort to increase the effect the headlights on MY motorcycle and to make it easier to see in the dark.  The LED headlight kit has done exactly that.  If you disagree that the LED's do not provide better illumination than stock bulbs once installed on YOUR bike, for whatever reason, feel free to post up your findings on the thread.  My original reason for creating this thread was to highlight that I installed a headlight replacement kit on MY VFR800, and that I was impressed with the results.  As I have seen and benefited from many a useful post on this site, I thought I would share my findings.  

I don't see where Cree makes auto headlights, so we're just discussing the chips. A quick check shows you can buy these, genuine Cree CXA1512 chips, in bulk for $7/ea. At 4 per kit that's $24. I don't see the profit, you're not going to sell millions.

These chips were just announced 9/18/13 by Cree and announced as available in large quantity. Is it a reach that they flooded the market and a bunch of companies are now creating auto bulbs with the chips to make a quick yen or two? 

Anyway, after an hour or two, one of the fans on mine sounds like it's about to blow a bearing. I'm debating if I should just disconnect it or go through the trouble of asking the seller to replace it.

That brings up an interesting question, if the fans die, do we bother replacing them or just figure out a way to trick the ballast into keeping the lights at full power? I feel like there is pretty solid airflow around there already, fans may not be needed. I kind of wonder if the fans are effective at all, seeing as the rubber rain covers are so close to the base of the fans.

At the current temps I'm riding in, 35-55F, I can't see how the fans are doing much. Maybe in the middle of summer when it's 100F.

Hey guys who have installed them, quick question: Are they blue looking? I really hate seeing blue headlights, and I don't want any...

Kevin  some pic's(night time)  on the first post ..

So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. 

This is where I started getting some concern... (I added the emphasis)

Perhaps the choice of words wasn't quite right? In any case, thanks Mohawk for the reassurance.

Do we think that Electrical Connection has purchased genuine Cree chips? Nearly double the price, though.

So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. 

This is where I started getting some concern... (I added the emphasis)

Perhaps the choice of words wasn't quite right? In any case, thanks Mohawk for the reassurance.

Do we think that Electrical Connection has purchased genuine Cree chips? Double the price, though.

Write them and ask...

Hey guys who have installed them, quick question: Are they blue looking? I really hate seeing blue headlights, and I don't want any...

Not really blue as Mohawk mentioned.  I have noticed the color temperature of some of the kits varies from 4300K - 6000K.  I believe that 4300 K is about as close to natural daylight as you can get.  The 5000K bulbs I installed in my bike have a very white looking light with almost no bluish hue at all.  I think the 6000K bulbs might have a slightly bluish hue, but it would be very slight and fairly close to the light color of HID factory headlights on many vehicles.  I found this color temperature scale on the net and it relates specifically to vehicle headlight color temperature samples.  Might help give you an idea as to the color of the bulbs.  From what I understand the color of natural daylight is approx 4800K.

[image: light color temperature scale.jpg]

Here's a set that might be worth the extra dough:

http://www.lifetimel...ghts-_p_59.html

Lifetime warranty!

Claim a higher lumen output than both the ebay and Electrical Connection options.

Here's a set that might be worth the extra dough:

http://www.lifetimel...ghts-_p_59.html

Lifetime warranty!

Claim a higher lumen output than both the ebay and Electrical Connection options.

Did you order them yet? :cool:   

So now for the ride review. I dont think its any brighter than a fresh set of Stanley's would be, but it is a nicer color. I've never been a fan of the yellow light cast by incandescent lights so the bluer, more sunlight like color of the LEDs is a huge plus for me. 

This is where I started getting some concern... (I added the emphasis)

Perhaps the choice of words wasn't quite right? In any case, thanks Mohawk for the reassurance.

Do we think that Electrical Connection has purchased genuine Cree chips? Nearly double the price, though.

Just give Electrical Connection a call and ask them. 

They have been around for years and have posted in the past how their designs have been ripped off by others using inferior parts etc. Based on my experience with their products, I would not hesitate to buy from them. 

Here's a set that might be worth the extra dough:

http://www.lifetimel...ghts-_p_59.html

Lifetime warranty!

Claim a higher lumen output than both the ebay and Electrical Connection options.

Did you order them yet? :cool:   

No, I spent a lot of money this month...

I have no gripe with EC, but it seems unlikely a small shop in Knoxville pioneered the H4 LED. I don't think anybody copied anybody, but it's just the way they are built. In fact, the link I posted seems to be the most original of any kits I've seen for sale. Looks to be an all in one design without any hand cut PVC as spacer. Seems a bit DIY, IMO.

Looks to be an all in one design.  

If there is room, the all in one design sure would be nice. :beer:

Looks to be an all in one design.  

If there is room, the all in one design sure would be nice. :beer:

Hard to tell, but I don't think it's much bigger than the others with the fan attached. Probably a good idea to get overall dimensions from the Lifetime LED folks and compare to the other kits already purchased. :beer:

Here's a set that might be worth the extra dough:

http://www.lifetimel...ghts-_p_59.html

Lifetime warranty!

Claim a higher lumen output than both the ebay and Electrical Connection options.

Did you order them yet? :cool:   

No, I spent a lot of money this month...

I have no gripe with EC, but it seems unlikely a small shop in Knoxville pioneered the H4 LED. I don't think anybody copied anybody, but it's just the way they are built. In fact, the link I posted seems to be the most original of any kits I've seen for sale. Looks to be an all in one design without any hand cut PVC as spacer. Seems a bit DIY, IMO.

Sure they  did  just  ask  me   .....   :pinocchio:

Sent this to Lifetime LED:

Hi,  There's been lots of talk on a motorcycle forum I frequent (VFR Discussion.com) about LED H4 kits out on the market these days. I found yours through a web search and a different car forum, and I like your design and of course the lifetime warranty.  Just curious about a few things: Can you give me the overall dimensions? Specifically how much of the unit is sticking out from the headlight shell? Honda bulbs aren't exactly H4, but with standard bulbs we just clip off or bend back the bottom two locating tabs and they fit fine with the spring clip holding it in place. Will this affect the warranty at all? Does your unit have a separate power regulator or ballast to mount outside the headlight shell? Looks like all the other kits are designed like that, but yours isn't pictured this way. 

Sent this to Lifetime LED:

Hi,  There's been lots of talk on a motorcycle forum I frequent (VFR Discussion.com) about LED H4 kits out on the market these days. I found yours through a web search and a different car forum, and I like your design and of course the lifetime warranty.  Just curious about a few things: Can you give me the overall dimensions? Specifically how much of the unit is sticking out from the headlight shell? Honda bulbs aren't exactly H4, but with standard bulbs we just clip off or bend back the bottom two locating tabs and they fit fine with the spring clip holding it in place. Will this affect the warranty at all? Does your unit have a separate power regulator or ballast to mount outside the headlight shell? Looks like all the other kits are designed like that, but yours isn't pictured this way. 

You forgot to ask if it is "Genuine Cree LED" and if their legal team can prove it...  JK :goofy:

Just wanted to clarify my descripton of color. Im a photographer and we describe color a little differently from other people. The standard lights are yellow, like school bus yellow, to my eyes. As we head towards whiter color we are moving towards blue onthe color spectrum, thus I described them as Bluer...

They are not blue, no one looking at them is going to think blue, and normal people (not weird photog bike people like me) would just call them white.

I havent done an actual color temp test on them (why mix biz and pleasure if you dont have to) but id guess in the 4300 to 4500 range. so pretty damn white. 

By the way put the other one in the other night and its even more amazing with 2. Mounted the right ballast to the inner fairing as well. Re did my alignments (the manual has the sweep adjustment a little weird BTW) and its fantastic at night now. Im actually looking forwards to coming home late this week.

Sent this to Lifetime LED:

Hi,  There's been lots of talk on a motorcycle forum I frequent (VFR Discussion.com) about LED H4 kits out on the market these days. I found yours through a web search and a different car forum, and I like your design and of course the lifetime warranty.  Just curious about a few things: Can you give me the overall dimensions? Specifically how much of the unit is sticking out from the headlight shell? Honda bulbs aren't exactly H4, but with standard bulbs we just clip off or bend back the bottom two locating tabs and they fit fine with the spring clip holding it in place. Will this affect the warranty at all? Does your unit have a separate power regulator or ballast to mount outside the headlight shell? Looks like all the other kits are designed like that, but yours isn't pictured this way. 

You forgot to ask if it is "Genuine Cree LED" and if their legal team can prove it...  JK :goofy:

I never saw any claims on the manufacturer of the LED... But I get your point.

Thanks PhotoOp, I just hate those stupid blue headlights, and I wanted to be sure.

Ah  flashlight is $240    bucks  ??

Email a friend

Review this item

Price

Your Price:   

$239.00

Availability:

In Stock

Sent this to Lifetime LED:

Hi,  There's been lots of talk on a motorcycle forum I frequent (VFR Discussion.com) about LED H4 kits out on the market these days. I found yours through a web search and a different car forum, and I like your design and of course the lifetime warranty.  Just curious about a few things: Can you give me the overall dimensions? Specifically how much of the unit is sticking out from the headlight shell? Honda bulbs aren't exactly H4, but with standard bulbs we just clip off or bend back the bottom two locating tabs and they fit fine with the spring clip holding it in place. Will this affect the warranty at all? Does your unit have a separate power regulator or ballast to mount outside the headlight shell? Looks like all the other kits are designed like that, but yours isn't pictured this way. 

Another question to ask might also be this.  On the other kits the cooling fan is removable and is installed on the bulb base after the rubber headlight seal is put on.  The Lifetime LED bulb looks as though it is all one unit which may make the rubber headlight seal difficult to install without modifying it in some way.

Might be tough to get the rubber over the fan, but I think it will stretch.

Here's their email reply:

I have attached the H13 dimesions, it is basicly the same for the H4.   There is a driver box that has to be mounted near the light, its small about credit card sized 3/16" thick.   Warranty is fine if you clip the tabs.

Might be tough to get the rubber over the fan, but I think it will stretch.

Here's their email reply:

I have attached the H13 dimesions, it is basicly the same for the H4.   There is a driver box that has to be mounted near the light, its small about credit card sized 3/16" thick.   Warranty is fine if you clip the tabs.

Brief, but to the point.  

Thanks for posting this… I have very little room behind my light and this will definitely tell me wether or not it would fit :) 

FYI I got mine from Formula-J87 on the bay.

Ordered  a  set   of  high  beams  ...

Since I had a spare set of bulbs that I had ordered for my wife's bike and have not yet installed them I thought I would take the time to measure it to see if there are any differences compared to the Lifetime LED bulb.  If anyone would like any other measurements I would be happy to take some.  As my caliper is not exactly digital the measurements to the center line of the diodes for the low and high beams may be a bit off, but you will get the idea.  

It would appear that the bulbs I purchased originally the measurements are smaller in overall dimension, but the distance from the bulb mounting retainer ring to the base of the fan are only 4 mm larger on the Lifetime LED bulb.  I would venture this won't cause much of an issue.  The fan assembly itself is about 11 mm wider,but again, I don't see that being a huge problem either.  

Please pardon the quick sketch, as I did not have a ruler handy.  LOL

[image: photo.JPG]

Add one more to the stack. These come in below the EC and LIfetime sets at $120. With the ubiquitous Cree chips they match the output of EC and the various ebay sets. 1 year warranty. I've used these guys before. I bought all my mini LED lights for my dash, and also my tail and turn signals (F/R) from them. Based on pictures, measurements look to be similar to zoomzoom's ebay set.

They are currently out of stock, however...

The  guy  on  Ebay  still  has  them .

http://www.ebay.com/...a90d371&vxp=mtr

Just got my eBay Cree's the other day and will be installing this weekend. I'll post how it works out for me. Anyone here do a tail light LED conversion? Details?

Nice job zoomzoom.

Yep, it did them all. Eventually I swapped for a Thurn clear tail light and front signals. The tail uses a flat board of LED's, no replacement bulb style LED's. (If you're interested-http://www.vfrdiscus...-light-5th-gen/)

Nice one zz. :fing02:

Install went by the book, no problems at all. Tested lights afterwards in the garage and they are indeed bright.
Thanks ZZ for the great post.
BTW what was the @Rush2112 ???
HUGE Rush fan.

Install went by the book, no problems at all. Tested lights afterwards in the garage and they are indeed bright.
Thanks ZZ for the great post.
BTW what was the @Rush2112 ???
HUGE Rush fan... YOU ARE NOT ALONE MY FRIEND!

Only in the last few days have I learned to use the "Multi-Quote" function of the website. What can I say, I'm SLOW and technologically illiterate at times. LOL. Like most adults nowadays, I think my 4 year old daughter knows more about computers than I do. :)

I think when I used the @Rush2112 earlier in the thread I was responding to another members question or comment.

Hey... I resemble that remark...

Install went by the book, no problems at all. Tested lights afterwards in the garage and they are indeed bright.
Thanks ZZ for the great post.
BTW what was the @Rush2112 ???
HUGE Rush fan.If anyone needs a pair H4 retaining rings I have a new set that I don't need. I bought a new pair not realizing I had put in retaining rings years ago and forgot about them. If you're interested I can email a picture, I paid $10 so I will sell them for the same in US and Canada shipped free.

Mr. McKinnon,

Thank you for submitting your questions to us regarding this matter. Your observation is spot on and we are unable to verify whether the units actually use genuine Cree LED chips. Cree sells many LED’s through distribution who sell to companies, that most likely aren’t selling their products on ebay. With that said, I also cannot confirm 100% that they aren’t genuine unless the product was thoroughly reviewed.

Cree’s legal department is well aware of the issues that similar listings are causing consumers and is trying to fight as many of these instances as they can. My best recommendation for you would be to try to contact the actual manufacturer of the product you are looking to buy and gather as much information as possible in order to make a well informed decision. I also will forward the below information on to our legal team so they can add this to their list of items/companies to check up on.

Good luck in your search and thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Thanks and Regards,

Jeff Martin
Customer Service Representative - Product Returns
919-407-5983
Email: Jeff_Martin@Cree.com

Troublemaker!

It was always obvious to me that Cree did not make the kit, or the bulbs, as claimed by the seller.  Quick-buck artists are always trying to piggyback off of the hard work and success of reputable companies like Cree, Philips, Bosch and the like.  I guess if it's cheap enough, people will buy it anyway...

Ciao,

As was mentioned by the representative from Cree, HE clearly CAN NOT say with 100% certainty that the bulbs and/or LED diodes were or were not made by CREE.  LOOK at the highlighted portion of the email.  Jeff Martin did mention that he would pass the matter on to his legal for verification.  If the parts were not made by Cree and there is a patent infringement issue then it is up to the legal department at Cree to do something about it.  What does this mean for those of us who purchased the product linked to in my original post, well, maybe the warranty will not be upheld by the manufacturer in question or supplier who sold them in the first place.  Mind you, removing the tabs from the bulb so that they fit in our headlight housings will likely do that anyhow.  

The whole Cree issue and who made the kit aside, the kit and/or kits on the market, have proven to provide adequate illumination and indeed better illumination than the stock halogen bulbs, according to the opinions of those who have installed them on their bikes.  I think it safe to say now, that with more people other than just myself having installed a kit in their bikes, and having found comparative results, the actual manufactures of the parts in the kit is a mute point.  There are numerous links to other manufacturers now that sell kits with very similar looking bulbs, so can you say with 100% certainty that NONE of these manufacturers are indeed using Cree products in the manufacture of their products?  Be careful how you answer that, as it could be considered slanderous.  Can I say that the company I chose to purchase my kit from uses Cree LED's in the manufacture of their product, NO.  Can I say that none of the companies mentioned in this thread use the Cree LED's in the manufacture of their products, NO.      

Speaking strictly for myself, I purchased the kit in an effort to increase the effect the headlights on MY motorcycle and to make it easier to see in the dark.  The LED headlight kit has done exactly that.  If you disagree that the LED's do not provide better illumination than stock bulbs once installed on YOUR bike, for whatever reason, feel free to post up your findings on the thread.  My original reason for creating this thread was to highlight that I installed a headlight replacement kit on MY VFR800, and that I was impressed with the results.  As I have seen and benefited from many a useful post on this site, I thought I would share my findings.  

I don't know what Rob said when he approached Cree with his concerns, but the Cree representative was only discussing the "genuine Cree LED chips", not the "units" holding them.  Was Rob's "observation" that Cree doesn't make LED bulb kits?  The Cree chips themselves are not particularly expensive, so they could very well be genuine.  But as I said before, it is highly unlikely that any of these kits are actually manufactured by Cree, nor the bulbs (units) used in them.  

Despite what you may think, plastering someone's registered trade mark all over your Chinese-manufactured product (even if it contains genuine Cree LED chips) is illegal, unless you have obtained a license to do so from the owner of the trademark.  That is because, as I have mentioned before (and your statements and those of others in this very thread demonstrate), doing so makes buyers falsely believe that Cree manufactured the kit or the bulbs.  To the extent they do believe that, and that deception caused them to buy the kit, they have been ripped off.  Would you have purchased this kit if you had known that the manufacturer/seller was deliberately trying to deceive you about its origins?  Perhaps at that price, it would not have mattered (it certainly didn't deter Mohawk).  :happy:

You mean libelous, by the way; slander refers to an oral statement--and there are many exceptions to both.  Suffice it to say, I'm not particularly worried about getting sued by fly-by-night illegal LED bulb sellers on eBay for raising legitimate questions about their products... 

Ciao,

:beatdeadhorse:   :beatdeadhorse:   :beatdeadhorse:   :beatdeadhorse:

Install went by the book, no problems at all. Tested lights afterwards in the garage and they are indeed bright.
Thanks ZZ for the great post.
BTW what was the @Rush2112 ???
HUGE Rush fan... YOU ARE NOT ALONE MY FRIEND!

Only in the last few days have I learned to use the "Multi-Quote" function of the website. What can I say, I'm SLOW and technologically illiterate at times. LOL. Like most adults nowadays, I think my 4 year old daughter knows more about computers than I do. :)
I think when I used the @Rush2112 earlier in the thread I was responding to another members question or comment.

 
Hey... I resemble that remark...

Illegal LED bulb sellers? What are they guilty of, mis-using the Cree name on the outside of the box? If they are in fact genuine Cree manufactured chips, why could they not state that on the outside of the packaging? No where on the eBay auction do they state these complete units are Cree made, they seem to go out of their way to write "Cree chips" in most instances, even using that phrase in the pictures. It is extremely clear to me what I'm buying, a Chinese made LED headlight kit that is using Cree chips/bulbs.

Instead of continuing to piss all over ZZ's effort, I think you made your point, how about starting a new thread to discuss this?

Illegal LED bulb sellers? What are they guilty of, mis-using the Cree name on the outside of the box? If they are in fact genuine Cree manufactured chips, why could they not state that on the outside of the packaging? No where on the eBay auction do they state these complete units are Cree made, they seem to go out of their way to write "Cree chips" in most instances, even using that phrase in the pictures. It is extremely clear to me what I'm buying, a Chinese made LED headlight kit that is using Cree chips/bulbs.

Instead of continuing to piss all over ZZ's effort, I think you made your point, how about starting a new thread to discuss this?

Zoomzoom's effort to document and describe this upgrade was certainly remarkable.  However, I don't think discussing it critically is in any way "pissing on it", but then I don't think happy clappy cheerleading and shutting down discussion has much objective value.  With all due respect, I think the most appropriate place to discuss potential problems with any kind of mod is in the thread introducing that mod.  

As for the substance of your comment, zoomzoom was clearly under the impression that Cree had manufactured not only the chips, but also the bulbs and, indeed, the entire kit:

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

I have already explained why using someone's trademark without permission is illegal, so if you don't think that's right, your quarrel is with the law, not me.  The fact is that many people will have believed the company's claims and acted accordingly.  Hopefully, the products they received will live up to the seller's claims, but there is no guarantee.  (They are pretty cheap, though.  Certainly cheaper than HID technology when it first became available.)

Secondly, these kit sellers are also "illegal" for the simple reason that their products are, for better or for worse, illegal to import or sell for use on the road in most developed countries.  That may not be justified, in the case of LEDs (as opposed to HIDs) based on their actual performance, but the fact is that no replacement for a DOT spec'd part is legal unless it meets all of the specs for that part, and these bulbs clearly do not.  Plenty of mods we do are illegal, of course, and I'm not necessarily opposed to such mods (er, several of my own bikes are seriously "non-stock"...), but the illegality problem means that there is little recourse if there are warranty issues, as the seller is unlikely to be in business for very long.  In addition, companies willing to blatantly violate the law and mislead customers are not really to be trusted when they make claims about product performance or warranty support.  In my view, anyone considering the early adoption of new (not to mention currently illegal) technology should be fully aware of all of the potential benefits--as well as drawbacks--from doing so.  Thanks for your comments.

Ciao,

Illegal LED bulb sellers? What are they guilty of, mis-using the Cree name on the outside of the box? If they are in fact genuine Cree manufactured chips, why could they not state that on the outside of the packaging? No where on the eBay auction do they state these complete units are Cree made, they seem to go out of their way to write "Cree chips" in most instances, even using that phrase in the pictures. It is extremely clear to me what I'm buying, a Chinese made LED headlight kit that is using Cree chips/bulbs.

Instead of continuing to piss all over ZZ's effort, I think you made your point, how about starting a new thread to discuss this?

Zoomzoom's effort to document and describe this upgrade was certainly remarkable.  However, I don't think discussing it critically is in any way "pissing on it", but then I don't think happy clappy cheerleading and shutting down discussion has much objective value.  With all due respect, I think the most appropriate place to discuss potential problems with any kind of mod is in the thread introducing that mod.  

As for the substance of your comment, zoomzoom was clearly under the impression that Cree had manufactured not only the chips, but also the bulbs and, indeed, the entire kit:

One company that came up frequently when searching LED's was a company called Cree. Apparently they manufacture some of the best and brightest LED's on the market and it just so happens that they manufacture LED lighting upgrade kits for cars, bikes, boats, RV's, etc, etc, etc. There were a number of sources that offered Cree LED Headlight kits but most seemed to be out of either China or Hong Kong and the shipping costs to Canada were a little expensive considering the overall cost of the kits. After a bit of searching I found a company in the US that sold a kit and it came with 2 year warranty, and the shipping was quite reasonable. Here is a link to the site that I purchased the kit from in case anyone else should be interested in trying it out.

I have already explained why using someone's trademark without permission is illegal, so if you don't think that's right, your quarrel is with the law, not me.  The fact is that many people will have believed the company's claims and acted accordingly.  Hopefully, the products they received will live up to the seller's claims, but there is no guarantee.  (They are pretty cheap, though.  Certainly cheaper than HID technology when it first became available.)

Secondly, these kit sellers are also "illegal" for the simple reason that their products are, for better or for worse, illegal to import or sell for use on the road in most developed countries.  That may not be justified, in the case of LEDs (as opposed to HIDs) based on their actual performance, but the fact is that no replacement for a DOT spec'd part is legal unless it meets all of the specs for that part, and these bulbs clearly do not.  Plenty of mods we do are illegal, of course, and I'm not necessarily opposed to such mods (er, several of my own bikes are seriously "non-stock"...), but the illegality problem means that there is little recourse if there are warranty issues, as the seller is unlikely to be in business for very long.  In addition, companies willing to blatantly violate the law and mislead customers are not really to be trusted when they make claims about product performance or warranty support.  In my view, anyone considering the early adoption of new (not to mention currently illegal) technology should be fully aware of all of the potential benefits--as well as drawbacks--from doing so.  Thanks for your comments.

Ciao,

I get the point you are making JZH and agree with you that whatever we do, we should do with open eyes and with the full facts where possible.

In this particular instance, if I can get a significant improvement to the safety of my bike, for a much smaller outlay than I would otherwise have to make, then I will risk the lack of comeback/after-sales service or warranty. I'll know more when mine arrive and I've had a chance to fit and test them.

The illegality thing is another issue IMO. We all (?) break the law when we exceed the speed limit and other things, so exercising judgement is something we must all do when riding. In the case of LED headlamp bulbs, they may turn out to be far more suitable than the frankly dangerously annoying HID headlamps installed in most new cars these days. In which case we may have blazed a trail for others to follow.

If I detect too much overspill from the fitment of the LED bulbs or get too many flashes from oncoming cage drivers, then I shall remove them and think myself lucky I didn't spend more. But let's continue with the open discussion and experiences with this mod.

On  the  6th gen  with  standard H4's  low  beams cager's  would  flash  there  high beams  at  me. Sometimes  it  just  the  fact that its a motorcycle ... 

On  the  6th gen  with  standard H4's  low  beams cager's  would  flash  there  high beams  at  me. Sometimes  it  just  the  fact that its a motorcycle ... 

Would your front wheel happen to be in the air during these moments?  :wheel:

Obviously the angle your headlights are pointing at is adjustable and should be adjusted appropriately according to your DOT or Roadworthy Cert rules (ITV in Spain)... the regulations are usually easy to find... internet, pone call, run your bike by a Roadworthy Station and check...  x height of the beam at y distance from the bike... etc.

There are a couple of screws or adjusters (according to model)... you could have the original bulbs and have the angle adjusted wrongly and have cagers flashing you all the time...

:rolleyes:

On  the  6th gen  with  standard H4's  low  beams cager's  would  flash  there  high beams  at  me. Sometimes  it  just  the  fact that its a motorcycle ... 

Would your front wheel happen to be in the air during these moments?  :wheel:

Not  that  time. I  put  the  HID's in and  got  less  high  beam  flashes  form  cagers

Kevin  got  yours  installed  yet ?

I'm  just  post holin ....

Post  number  5555  !!!!

Nope, had some other expenses come up this month. 

ZZ's previous assumption regarding LEDs inability to turn on and off is incorrect. It is possible that whatever is in the black box (current limiting resistor?) might, but the resistor alone would not be a problem. I worked for years for a company whose primary business was solid state lasers. We would have customers who required modulation at very high frequencies. SS lasers utilize diodes in a different fashion. For that matter fiber optic technology is based on modulating diodes. That was a rather dry reply, but I am also geared up for a LED headlight install, thanks.

ZZ's previous assumption regarding LEDs inability to turn on and off is incorrect. It is possible that whatever is in the black box (current limiting resistor?) might, but the resistor alone would not be a problem. I worked for years for a company whose primary business was solid state lasers. We would have customers who required modulation at very high frequencies. SS lasers utilize diodes in a different fashion. For that matter fiber optic technology is based on modulating diodes. That was a rather dry reply, but I am also geared up for a LED headlight install, thanks.

I'm still awaiting delivery of mine. 20-25 days was the quote and there is a chance it will get held back by customs.

Shame I got the timing wrong as the morning and evenings are getting lighter so I'll have to go out late specifically to test them now.

I was thinking about the large fan bases and trying to get the rubber covers over. Don't know if the 4G has them, I assume so. See how tough it is to slide them over before you install. If it won't work then maybe put the bulb through it first, then un-accordion them back over the fan base to give you enough room to engage the spring clip. Or maybe they do come apart?

Good luck with them! Still on my wish list... 

ZZ, I don't think it shortens their life at all. FIber optics use solid state lasers switching millions of times to transmits all of this info we are using right now. Diodes don't suffer from damage switching on and off like HID ballasts do. Their damage comes with heat. If I was going to do it right, I would add a thermal electric cooler. It is a techie solution to stabilizing the temp of the diode and keeping the power output as high as possible. LEDs without current stabilization and cooling will drop their output and life.

I was relieved when you found out that the lights weren't that warm. I will look at the kits you listed and read up on them. Thanks so much for heading us into a different lighting direction.

I did a conversion on my bike using HIDs. I did it right, split the headlight, custom brackets, projector installed, and very happy about the output. I lived in states that did not require inspections, so I did not worry about high beams, my lighting was great all the time. I went back to the stock lighting after moving to UT, and I bought another headlight. Your idea is a nice mix of technology and simplicity. One thing I learned in converting my BMW to HIDs way before anyone else was doing it was the placement of bulb in the reflector. Your bike has a nice light area around it. Does is reach far enough when you are moving fast? I may play with the placement of the bulb fore and aft, realizing I am limited. Right now I am beginning the process of machining a new triple clamp design, something I have not seen offered before. If I never mention it again, you know it is a fail :).

Perhaps not.....Lifetime LEds are quoting $130 to ship to the UK. 

I just noticed that they have some motorcycle specific options now.

Like this one:

https://www.lifetime...ycle_headlights

It doesn't look to have a fan, and the wiring is a DIY, but it's a bit less $...

I got an email reply from Lifetime today on these m/c specific bulbs. These are 1400/1800 LM, so about 2/3 of the regular H4 LED bulbs.

I just noticed that they have some motorcycle specific options now.

Like this one:

https://www.lifetime...ycle_headlights

It doesn't look to have a fan, and the wiring is a DIY, but it's a bit less $...

I got an email reply from Lifetime today on these m/c specific bulbs. These are 1400/1800 LM, so about 2/3 of the regular H4 LED bulbs.

The driver for the H4M is not built into the bulb housing but is already wired inline. They now come with the standard H4 connector.

From the website: Voltage Lumens: 1400LM for the low beam and 1800LM for the high beam

Why such low output? Is it because there is no driver? Seems a little pointless as a replacement bulb.

Yeah, standard H4s are the way to go IMO.

Yeah, standard H4s are the way to go IMO.

What about their new M/C bright bulb, 3200/3600 lumens. Too much?

Not doing much VFR riding these days, but got another 2k+ miles trip planed at the end of the month. Not every day use, but 4000+ miles of highway riding should be a decent test of the Lifetime led bulbs. Vibration, heat, cold, rain. Will keep you posted.

Mine will be here Thursday, planning to put them in over the weekend.

 
Mine will be here Thursday, planning to put them in over the weekend.

Is it difficult to adjust the headlights on a 5th gen? asking for a mate who's lights are set too high,thanks.

Thanks,I see that now,section 3-26 of the service manual,it must be a bit fiddly to reach the adjusters,is it done by screwdriver or do you turn the adjusters with your fingers?

I think I read adjusting the 6th gen headlights is a lot easier.

So I received the Lifetime LED kit. Very nice overall, much better than the original eBay special.

[image: led_kit_zpsec6d6860.jpg]

But just before installing I noticed this. Do auto bulbs have different left and right reflector positions?? Am I missing something or is this the same problem I had with the cheapo kit I originally bought - the ring has been mounted backwards??

[image: LEDs_zps82d0cd84.jpg]

Thanks ZZ, that was it. The twist lock is only intended to be one way but apparently they forced it on 180 off at the factory. 

Just a FYI, those "lifetime" LEDs or how ever many sellers are selling them are now available at Cycle gear under their speedmetal brand. If you want to check them out before buying. I'm happy with the light output didn't change anything around, just snapped off bottom two tabs so the ring would fit. Didn't remove the housing either, mounted the ballasts inside the front fairing. Time will tell, but feels like a quality built product.

On  Sale !!

http://www.cyclegear...-Conversion-Kit

I  have  a CycleGear store   close .

The deal isnt that great, as you only get one for that price. So two is comparable in price to the paired kits sold elsewhere. However they are stocked in store, so returning a dud should be cake if needed.

Lifetime LED sells their 2 bulb kit for $150, so this is a little cheaper.

yeah, but looks like they offer a supposed lifetime warranty.  I saw no such claims on the cycle gear packaging.  Probably the standard 30 days with receipt.

The deal isnt that great, as you only get one for that price. So two is comparable in price to the paired kits sold elsewhere. However they are stocked in store, so returning a dud should be cake if needed.

Lifetime LED sells their 2 bulb kit for $150, so this is a little cheaper.

The deal isnt that great, as you only get one for that price. So two is comparable in price to the paired kits sold elsewhere. However they are stocked in store, so returning a dud should be cake if needed.

Lifetime LED sells their 2 bulb kit for $150, so this is a little cheaper.

The deal isnt that great, as you only get one for that price. So two is comparable in price to the paired kits sold elsewhere. However they are stocked in store, so returning a dud should be cake if needed.

Lifetime LED sells their 2 bulb kit for $150, so this is a little cheaper.

I trust things are well with your kit so far Cap'n.

Everything is good. I need to spend some time aiming them, the Lifetime bulbs are pointed down a little too far for my preferences.

About the original kit I bought from the eBay seller wfyb, they have not responded to any emails requesting a refund. So, originally the bulbs were on backorder when I paid. A week or so later they offered a discount to their newly updated, lower pricing if I would continue to wait until they had stock. They refunded this $15 difference by cancelling the original transaction and "refunding" me through PayPal, only $15. To eBay it appears the whole transaction was cancelled, they say, so I have no recourse through them, try your bank or PayPal.

Not sure I'll ever get that $85 back, I'm going to try to go through PayPal next and file a dispute.

Good  luck  captain  with PayPal  ,  I  have  had  two  claims  over  false  purchases ,  got  about  50%  refund  in  both ,

I don't see three wire (High and Low beam in single unit) in the Cycle Gear link. Am I wrong?

Also, I didn't find the H4 pair I originally bought from Lifetime listed on their site.

H4's  only  hmmm  .

I don't see three wire (High and Low beam in single unit) in the Cycle Gear link. Am I wrong?
Also, I didn't find the H4 pair I originally bought from Lifetime listed on their site.

OK, I didn't see it on the CG link...

Hmm, looks like you can order right from china if you want to save 50%. Appear to be exact same bulbs and you get a pair for 70 bucks.

http://www.amazon.co.../dp/B00KBQWR5Y/

Good  luck  captain  with PayPal  ,  I  have  had  two  claims  over  false  purchases ,  got  about  50%  refund  in  both ,

Paypal has a 45 (or 90) day time limit so I'm sol on the $85. eBay seller won't return email or voicemails.

Hmm, looks like you can order right from china if you want to save 50%. Appear to be exact same bulbs and you get a pair for 70 bucks.

http://www.amazon.co.../dp/B00KBQWR5Y/

Anybody tried these yet?

I'm seeing 80w LEDs available. Pretty sure I installed high wattage headlights into my econobox as a teenager and fried some shit. Is it safe to install 80w LED headlights into the Viffer?

I'm seeing 80w LEDs available. Pretty sure I installed high wattage headlights into my econobox as a teenager and fried some shit. Is it safe to install 80w LED headlights into the Viffer?

Charging system on a VFR? Those are never anything but perfect... :P

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

I wonder if they are  water proof ?

https://www.youtube....nxvsZf6jAE#t=29

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Hmmmm. More expensive and WAY less light than the separate ballast model (which I have and love).

It's $150 for the pair vs $125 for your single.

Lifetime LED has a new one:
https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Full kit for what? The other link from digitallyhip is just a brighter version at $125 each. The link I put up is a newer version of what I originally bought last year. Looks like they don't require a separate driver box now.

It's $150 for the pair vs $125 for your single.

Nice catch! Sorry for the misinformation. But I still prefer brighter.

And I prefer not $250! :goofy:

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Nice! looks like a direct plug-in replacement.

The only question is whether or not there's room for the heatsink/fan component of the bulb behind the bulb housing.

A quick visual check makes me think you'd run into clearance issues for the brake hoses and wiring.

Full kit for what? The other link from digitallyhip is just a brighter version at $125 each. The link I put up is a newer version of what I originally bought last year. Looks like they don't require a separate driver box now.

 The whole assembly. I called them 2 weeks ago and was told the $150 was just replacement bulbs and needed the $250 set up to do a full conversion from H4 to H4 HID. That may have been wrong though as the $250 price tag is what put me off and I just left the working bulbs in for now. It would be great if the $150 kit worked though!

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Nice! looks like a direct plug-in replacement.

The only question is whether or not there's room for the heatsink/fan component of the bulb behind the bulb housing.

A quick visual check makes me think you'd run into clearance issues for the brake hoses and wiring.

I have a similar type, probably the same dimensions, and it fits fine. I think it's in a much earlier post the size of the housings I installed.

(Page 16)

Hey Razor, I'm still not clear on if we are talking about the same things here. These are just LED headlights, not a full HID.

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Nice! looks like a direct plug-in replacement.

The only question is whether or not there's room for the heatsink/fan component of the bulb behind the bulb housing.

A quick visual check makes me think you'd run into clearance issues for the brake hoses and wiring.

I have a similar type, probably the same dimensions, and it fits fine. I think it's in a much earlier post the size of the housings I installed.

(Page 16)

Hey Razor, I'm still not clear on if we are talking about the same things here. These are just LED headlights, not a full HID.

I may have gotten the new person at Lifetime LED, but I was told the $150 was replacement bulbs for the $250 setup and needed the $250 to do a conversion. I hope that's not right, but just what I was told. I opted not to order and wait. I will have to tear the assembly back apart after TMAC sometime as SuperBrightLED shorted me a single dash light (only got 4) and are sending me the last. If it is the $150 set I will order that and do it then too!

Kev, thank you very much for posting this though!

We'll talk this week! 

FWIW, I picked up a pair of headlight modules (the original style of this post), and one of the modules was stuck on high beam. Contacted the seller, and I'm getting a full refund and keeping the parts, so no loss. May take a look in the bad module, but I happen to have an old single-bulb bike that uses an H4. And I think I'll look for some reviews some more before my next purchase..

FWIW, I picked up a pair of headlight modules (the original style of this post), and one of the modules was stuck on high beam. Contacted the seller, and I'm getting a full refund and keeping the parts, so no loss. May take a look in the bad module, but I happen to have an old single-bulb bike that uses an H4. And I think I'll look for some reviews some more before my next purchase..

There have been a few members here and on VFRD that have had issues with the style of bulb I installed in my original post.  For the most part it seems that the issues have been with the power supplies and cooling fans.  I personally have had one issue with a computer fan sticking, then stopping, and causing one of the lights to dim to about 80% power (maybe) but, as soon as the fan comes back on the bulb brightens back up again.  I had ordered a second kit a fair while ago when the thread was first started so that I could change out the bulbs on my wife's bike and should I have any further issues I will replace the parts with the other kit until I run out of spare parts.  After that my plan would be to change out the bulbs completely and go with the Lifetime Bulbs as the build quality seems a bit higher and (until KevCarver posted the yesterday) seem to have the best reliability.  

Not to mention that as far as companies go, Lifetime LED's does offer a lifetime warranty with their kits, and because of the style of the bulb used, they appear to be much easier to install as compared with the ones I used originally which required a few terse words in order to get the rubber boots and fan assemblies to play nice together.  LOL

Just an FYi mine are still going strong after 18 months & 3500miles.

I have a spare set in the UK if anyone would like to make me an offer. They were used in my car for 12months, still working perfectly as intended, removed when I sold the car. £40 posted.

Lifetime LED has a new one:

https://www.lifetime...headlight_bulbs

Nice! looks like a direct plug-in replacement.

The only question is whether or not there's room for the heatsink/fan component of the bulb behind the bulb housing.

A quick visual check makes me think you'd run into clearance issues for the brake hoses and wiring.

I have a similar type, probably the same dimensions, and it fits fine. I think it's in a much earlier post the size of the housings I installed.

(Page 16)

Hey Razor, I'm still not clear on if we are talking about the same things here. These are just LED headlights, not a full HID.

I called Lifetime regarding the length question.
The gentlemen said that it is slightly longer.

He didn't have the exact specs handy and didn't have a metric ruler, but his measurement was 2.125 inches for the portion that is outside of the housing.

If exact, that is 54mm; 11mm longer than the previous model.

He also confirmed that unit is completely self-contained. No double-stick tape needed.

Kevin, do you recall how much clearance you have on your set up?

I'll be measuring space later today on mine.

Ok, I couldn't sleep, so I went out very early morning for a ride to test the headlights. Not overly impressed, I must say. They seem fine on low beam. Good pattern and brightness, but not at all an "upgrade" imo. I like the color, and they free up a bunch of power for heated gear in the winter, but I'm not sure the new units provide enough space inside the factory Honda dust covers to adequately cool themselves. Not sure why my original ones died (just one low beam, actually). Could have been overheating, could have been super bumpy-ass Wayah road.

High beams are pretty unimpressive. There is a slightly higher pattern, and the brightness increases, but not by much. They really miss the lower light source to bounce off the lower reflectors. Again, I have them installed in the ST1300 for testing. The ST stock headlight is one of the best, especially on high! Never been on a 6th Gen that has all 4 lit on high, but I bet it compares well.

With regards to power draw, I pulled into the garage turned off the bike, and plugged in the Battery Tender Jr. Then I remembered I wanted to look at the lights with shades on to see what was lit, so I turned it on and went to grab my shades. Only took a few seconds and I was able to look at them (also had the built in shade visor down on m helmet), then try high beams. By this time the BT Jr. was already flashing green. 

Overall, I'd say that the earlier design was better. I got some comments with them in the VFR that on low beams they were hard to see in day light. On high, they filled the entire lens and were pretty bright. These new ones definitely don't ever fill out the lower part of the lens. Not sure how conspicuous they are during the day, but they seem to function fine at night. If you are a night time commuter or tourer, not the lights for you...

On a side note, I noticed on the ST forum that one of the members installed some Cyclops 3800 lumen LEDs in his. He was instructed by the makers of them to drill a hole in the headlight shell for heat dissipation. The thought of drilling into my headlight shell doesn't excite me at all. No idea on price or warranty.

If you look at your pictures, you can see the issue, the old filament/LED on high has a larger area above the height of your fan in the corner, the LED/LED does not, so the high beam LEDs are not located in the proper place for your reflector !

Also, note that the new ones have three LEDs on the top and nothing on the bottom. The idea with the originals (and incandescents) is that the low beams are on top to hit the top of the reflector and shoot out straight and down. Then the highs are on the bottom to hit the bottom reflector and shoot out higher, as well as being brighter. At least that's my understanding of reflector housings.

:beer:

On a plus note, I now have mastered no fairing removal headlight replacement! Just swapped the LEDs from the ST back to the 5th Gen without removing any plastics.

Also, note that the new ones have three LEDs on the top and nothing on the bottom. The idea with the originals (and incandescents) is that the low beams are on top to hit the top of the reflector and shoot out straight and down. Then the highs are on the bottom to hit the bottom reflector and shoot out higher, as well as being brighter. At least that's my understanding of reflector housings.

:beer:

Yep, like this:

[image: H4.jpg]

With the LEDs only on the top there can be no high beam, so it's not very surprising that your choice is between bright and brighter low beams, only.  It's "little" things like this that make you wonder what the designers were thinking...

Ciao,

Especially considering the earlier design did have a LED on both sides.

I did about 315 miles today and it was pretty hot ambient. They survived! Had them on "high" all day.

Back from the dead!

I have recently been doing some dark road night time riding, and as luck would have it back to back with my '99 with Lifetime LED and a stock '00. 

I find the stock light really unappealing now that I'm used to the crisp lights of the LEDs. Even just seeing the turn signal dash lights do the normal incandescent fade in - fade out is annoying to me. 

Ironically, the Y2K had a headlight switch issue and would not give me low beams. Riding home yesterday on high beams, not one person flashed me and I didn't like the light output near as much as my '99 with LEDs. They are good on low, and even better on high when no one is around and no streetlights. The light output is nice crisp white, with essentially the same pattern as stock incandescents. Also not getting any flashers when I'm on low beam, so they must be ok to other drivers. 

If anyone is wondering what this old thread is about, well you have about 16 pages to check out!

Bottom line, I still like my Lifetime LED H4 replacements!  :cool: