Bike died Saturday (electrical)

My bike (a 2000 VRF) died on Saturday. I was on a spirited ride, with a group, up in the mountains. We stopped at a fork in the road to let everyone catch up, and because my engine was hot (gauge showed 234 degrees - it was a warm morning), I cut the engine but left the ignition switch on to let the fan keep running. When I came back to the bike 5 minutes later, everything was dead. No lights, no fan, no display, no clock. Nobody had any tools, so we had to resort to very basic checks. We checked the connections we could, and found nothing loose, so I got a couple guys to help me try and bump start the bike. No dice. It was very much dead.

So, I called my dad, who brought his trailer up, and we got the bike to his shop, where we started diagnostics. The voltmeter reading from the battery was 2.5 V - either the battery was defective (it's a Ballistic 8-cell lithium ion battery I bought new in November), or there was something wrong with the charging system. We put the battery on a charger for a few minutes, and it then had no problems started the bike - several times, in fact. But, with the bike not running, it was only showing 12.2 V, and with it running, it only went up to about 12.6 V (12.8 when revved). So we figured there was something wrong with the charging system.

I bought the bike used, and the previous owner had had some electrical problems. Here's what he says he did:

I installed the wiring harness, voltage regulator/rectifier, voltage gauge and motorcycle 12 volt supply my self. I was on my way to Santa Barbara whenmy motorcycle started sputtering. I was able to get off to a gas station that had a garage and for 5 bucks they recharged my battery and I was able to start up and go again. I noticed that my light was dim as I got into Santa Barbara so I put it on a charger while I stayed there for the weekend. Then on Sunday the same thing happened on the way home. After doing some research I found out that these years had electrical problems due to the wiringharness being to thin of a gauge between the battery, alternator and voltage regulator/rectifier so I added a parallel harness made by Joshua at Wiremybike.com along with a new voltage r/r, new volt gauge, and 12 volt adapter so I could charge my phone on the run. I have never had a problem since.

Here's what I saw once I removed the seat and the rear cowl:

[image: Posted Image]

[image: Posted Image]

[image: Posted Image]

It looks to me like he put the VFRness bundle (link) on the bike, but can someone verify that the regulator/rectifier is upgraded from stock? I don't know what the OEM one looks like.

You'll also notice that on the side, there are 3 electrical connectors instead of 2 (the service manual shows 2, one which is white, and the other which is black). Can anyone tell me what the 3 different connectors are for?

Anyhow, you'll notice, if you look at the connector on the bottom left in the 3rd picture, that one of the yellow wires looks discolored? That was the first bad sign. We had to pry the connector apart, and were greeted with this sight:

[image: Posted Image]

You can see all of the corrosion, and the discoloration of the plastic - it had gotten so hot that the plastic of the connector, and some of the insulation on the wires, had melted off.

We then looked at the connector on the far right, and saw this:

[image: Posted Image]

Yay! More corrosion and melted components! The good news is that the wires from the alternator look good, and tested okay, which means the alternator coils are still fine. The bad news is that, even the thicker wires got so hot that they melted stuff.

So...what do we have here? It's looking like, at the very least, I'm going to have to replace the connectors, but at this point, I have no idea if the r/r is still any good. The service manual has instructions for testing it, but if it's not stock, and with the "upgraded" wiring, I'm thinking those instructions won't be very helpful. Can you tell me how to check the r/r? What should my next steps be?

Thanks.

Mate if your Lithium (technically it's Lithium Iron Phosphate) battery actually got dragged down to 2.5 volts you need to throw it out. Once you go down below 6 volts across 4 cells (your battery is a 4S2P so the other 4 cells are just for capacity not voltage) the cells are considered chemically damaged. The biggest problem is a change in capacity and amp delivery capabilities.

Basically what will happen now is that one or more cells will discharge before the others and then further damage themselves as those cells drop below their nominal voltage.

You really need a voltage monitor to detect this failure in advance.

-- The R/R looks like a Ricks, not an OEM..(Somebody please confirm) ---

- Before you can even begin to trouble shoot, you need to get busy and repair/replace all the burnt connections. Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade. - I dont know if your using any of the power outlet stuff, but my instinct is strip it back bare bones and start over. Simple, neat, clean = reliability.

I can't tell if that's thermal paste around your R/R or something else. I'd pull the R/R and take a look at the back side also.

Geez that looks familiar....

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

That does look like a Rick's R/R, but the 2 that I've bought (for 2 different bikes) have been black. Both are still working fine.

Like was mentioned above you need to start with known good components. I also advise crimping, and zip-tieing all the connectors so they can't become loose from vibration, and heat cycles. Some even hard-wire where the stock connectors go. Makes it a bit more labor intensive if you have to take things apart, but it eliminates a lot of potential problems. Having 2 VFRs I have done it both ways, and both bikes are now trouble-free.

Mate if your Lithium (technically it's Lithium Iron Phosphate) battery actually got dragged down to 2.5 volts you need to throw it out. Once you go down below 6 volts across 4 cells (your battery is a 4S2P so the other 4 cells are just for capacity not voltage) the cells are considered chemically damaged. The biggest problem is a change in capacity and amp delivery capabilities.

Basically what will happen now is that one or more cells will discharge before the others and then further damage themselves as those cells drop below their nominal voltage.

You really need a voltage monitor to detect this failure in advance.

Hmmm, I wondered if I had done any permanent damage to the battery by discharging it so completely. I'm not familiar with lithium batteries in bikes, but I know that lithium batteries in electronics really don't like deep discharges, generally.

The battery has a 5-year warranty. What do I need to do to convince the shop I bought it at that it should be replaced?

Can you point me to any information about how these batteries do in bikes? I've heard that their current delivery characteristics are quite different from those of traditional batteries, but don't know any more than that.

Before you can even begin to trouble shoot, you need to get busy and repair/replace all the burnt connections. Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade. - I dont know if your using any of the power outlet stuff, but my instinct is strip it back bare bones and start over. Simple, neat, clean = reliability.

I rode the bike 2500 to/from Colorado 3 weeks ago, and used the power outlet to charge my phone while I was on the road. It was quite helpful, actually. For my daily commute, I rarely use it, though the previous owner gave me a trickle charger that plugs into the outlet.

Seeing you talk about simple, neat, and clean reminds me of the first time I took the bike into the shop after buying it. The mechanics pulled open the seat, took one look at the mess of cables, and told me they weren't going to be able to do anything to check the electrical system, as they had no idea how it had been altered.

The other thing the previous owner did was to put a voltmeter on the bike - it's mounted in the left fairing, underneath the windshield. I wondered about how well he had installed everything, as I found that the power outlet only supplied about 6 V - the ground cable wasn't actually attached to ground, which I had to fix. I'm wondering if in "fixing" that issue, I caused other issues?

So maybe I do need to strip it all down to stock stuff, fix the broken wires/connectors, and then go from there...

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

Yep, I figure that's exactly what happened. I've seen posts about wiring heating up and melting, and I've seen posts about the r/r going south, but I didn't know if the two issues are related, and if so, how. If my wiring melted, I want to know if I should be worried about the r/r as well.

Like was mentioned above you need to start with known good components. I also advise crimping, and zip-tieing all the connectors so they can't become loose from vibration, and heat cycles. Some even hard-wire where the stock connectors go. Makes it a bit more labor intensive if you have to take things apart, but it eliminates a lot of potential problems. Having 2 VFRs I have done it both ways, and both bikes are now trouble-free.

Thanks for the advice! My dad, who also looked at the bike, wondered whether we should coat everything with thermal paste once we get it back together again.

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

My personal pet theory is similar to yours, but starts with corrosion, rather than vibration. Most automotive connectors are sealed these days, but VFR reg/rec connectors are only protected by a loose vinyl boot. I replace mine with Delphi Metri-Pack connectors, like these. Of course, I have no proof and will never have any, but I am reasonably confident that my upgraded connectors will never end up fried... :smile:

Ciao,

^^^^^^^ +1 for the Metri-Pack connectors. The 630s are rated 46 amps. -- PCS is a good vendor for this too.

The first step is to go with a known good battery -- check the list below -

I haven't had the battery tested under load, but I'm 90% sure that it's a good battery. It's only 8 months old, and has a 16 Ah capacity - the bike only needs 12, so there's plenty of reserve.

--- With voltmeter at battery get voltages -- idle volts? 5000 rpm volts? What’s the numbers? Should be in 13ish min idle and in 14s at revs.

-Idle voltage: 12.6 V
-voltage @ 5000 rpm: 12.8 V

- Check stator - 1. Pull connector apart. Set meter to resistance. Check pin to pin, 3 yellow wires, A to B, B to C, C to A. What’s the numbers? 3 separate readings --Should be less than 1.0 ohms.

All three connections are between 0.8 & 1.0 ohms.

- 2. Check continuity from each A,B,C pin to ground, -- -should be infinity - nada nothing. no continuity. -- 3 separate checks .

Need to do this.

- 3. Crank it back up. Do another pin to pin thing, but set meter on AC volts. idle and 5000 rpms. What's da numbers? Should start 15 -20ish and climb 50ish and more. Again – 3 readings

I tested ONLY at idle, but with the yellow wires coming from the alternator both connected and disconnected from the R/R.

-Connected @ idle: 2 combinations show ~12 V; the third shows ~6 V.
-Disconnected @ idle: all 3 combinations show ~21 V.

- Repeat hot.

Haven't done this.
Edited by phendric, 02 July 2012 - 11:30 PM.

thats a OEM R/R, all of the rick's have a triangle type head and are most of the time black

I'm gonna replace connectors this morning, and see where that gets me.

thats a OEM R/R, all of the rick's have a triangle type head and are most of the time black

Shoot. I guess that increases the chances that the R/R went south, doesn't it?

So this voltmeter on the bike never showed under 12 volts while running? Is this an idiot light or a true meter?
I have a datel on mine and if I dont see 14.3 going down the road then I know I have an issue.

thats a OEM R/R, all of the rick's have a triangle type head and are most of the time black

Shoot. I guess that increases the chances that the R/R went south, doesn't it?

OEM R/R on left side of pic - I'm just not sure whether yours is a Ricks or Electrosport or whoever, but its def aftermarket.
[image: Posted Image]

So this voltmeter on the bike never showed under 12 volts while running? Is this an idiot light or a true meter?
I have a datel on mine and if I dont see 14.3 going down the road then I know I have an issue.

It didn't show less than 12 volts, that I saw. I didn't look at it that often, though, and it was cranking the bike just fine, no problems at all. When it finally went, it went very suddenly.

Update - I got all the burnt out stuff out and replaced with good wire and good connectors, and the voltage on the battery is still only 12.5 V with the engine running and revved. So, it's looking like the R/R went south.

Does anyone know of a dealer/shop in Los Angeles that could test the R/R to confirm failure? Anywhere I could go to pick up a new one?

Well, looks like you gotta do…. “The Drill.”
-- This happens so often I save it on a word doc and cut and paste it for when it comes up. -- go for it.......

The first step is to go with a known good battery -- check the list below -

Then---Go through this starting point quick list. You will need a multimeter too.
Steps:
- Recharge battery overnite - then to take it to Autozone or similar to load test. -- Good? Bad? – An iffy battery can fake you out and act like a bad R/R. Buy new if needed.
- With good battery fire it up, warm up for a minute or two.
These are R/R quick checks---
--- With voltmeter at battery get voltages -- idle volts? 5000 rpm volts? What’s the numbers? Should be in 13ish min idle and in 14s at revs.
- Check stator
- 1. Pull connector apart. Set meter to resistance. Check pin to pin, 3 yellow wires, A to B, B to C, C to A. What’s the numbers? 3 separate readings --Should be less than 1.0 ohms.
- 2. Check continuity from each A,B,C pin to ground, -- -should be infinity - nada nothing. no continuity. -- 3 separate checks .
- 3. Crank it back up. Do another pin to pin thing, but set meter on AC volts. idle and 5000 rpms. What's da numbers? Should start 15 -20ish and climb 50ish and more. Again – 3 readings
- Repeat hot.
This quick list will catch the obvious stuff, but if you need to dig deeper check this chart.
http://www.electrosport.com/media/pdf/fault-finding-diagram.pdf


Do your tests and tell us the numbers - we'll help from there.

So this voltmeter on the bike never showed under 12 volts while running? Is this an idiot light or a true meter?
I have a datel on mine and if I dont see 14.3 going down the road then I know I have an issue.

It didn't show less than 12 volts, that I saw. I didn't look at it that often, though, and it was cranking the bike just fine, no problems at all. When it finally went, it went very suddenly.

If I'm running under 13V I am starting to get conserned.

Today, Zommy, RollinAgain, and I replaced my stator, and r/r. I am at 29899 miles.The stator was good and fried. It is a wonder I rode as long as I did this last month.

Attached Images

• [image: Stator.jpg]

I tested ONLY at idle, but with the yellow wires coming from the alternator both connected and disconnected from the R/R.

-Connected @ idle: 2 combinations show ~12 V; the third shows ~6 V.
-Disconnected @ idle: all 3 combinations show ~21 V.

---------------------------------------------------
Was your meter set to AC volts? Test is with R/R disconnected 21 vac at idle is ok, need to test at revs say 5- 6k.

Mileage on bike?

Was your meter set to AC volts? Test is with R/R disconnected 21 vac at idle is ok, need to test at revs say 5- 6k.

Mileage on bike?

Yes, meter was AC Volts. Will test at 5-6k revs. Bike is on battery tender tonight.

Current mileage - 73,xxx miles. I bought it with 62,xxx miles on it, in November.

^^^^ Cool - warm it up good for the test and do the A,B,C pins to ground continuity tests too.

Just a quick update - I used a digital multimeter with a diode tester on it to test the various leads of the R/R, and several showed shorts that shouldn't have been there - I used the following instructions, from one of the Triumph sites:

Unplug both input & output plugs from R/R;
With your meter set to read resistance (use a diode test if the your multi-meter has one), test from each pin of the three pin plug, to both the red & black wired pins of the 4-pin plug; NONE of these should read short circuit (zero resistance); depending which way you bias the test leads, you may get some reading (from the forward bias of the component) but it must absolutely not be a short. If you see a short on any of these readings the R/R is defective.

So it's definitely the R/R that went south. I'm supposed to be going on two rides in the next couple of days, but none of the local Honda dealers have OEM R/Rs in stock, and I couldn't really wait for someone to ship one to me. So I went to the closest dealer to me, and got an R/R for a 2009 ZX-14. The R/R uses MOSFET technology, which means it uses much less power, and therefore, runs cooler. I replaced all of the burnt connectors with connectors that I soldered to the wires, and then covered everything with dielectric grease before taping it up. Later, I'll go and replace the tape with shrink tubing, but I didn't have any of that on hand at the time.

And I'm back in business. The bike immediately fired up, like she was eager for some action. Battery voltage is just under 14V when running, and just over 14V when revved, so it looks like we're in business again.

I told my dad that I wanted to learn how to wrench my own bikes. The school of hard experience is teaching me just that. I learned lots of good stuff, but I hope I don't have to go through this process again.
Edited by phendric, 03 July 2012 - 09:31 PM.

I hope I don't have to go through this process again.

Yep, the first time you go through stuff like this it sucks. But then you get familiar with it, and then you get good at it!

Today, Zommy, RollinAgain, and I replaced my stator, and r/r. I am at 29899 miles.The stator was good and fried. It is a wonder I rode as long as I did this last month.

I hope you're basing your conclusion on having tested the stator with a multimeter, rather than just based on its appearance, because they all look like that--due to one side being continually immersed in engine oil. In other words, they can look like that and still work fine. However, when the windings are actually charred, you don't need to do the tests...

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

My personal pet theory is similar to yours, but starts with corrosion, rather than vibration. Most automotive connectors are sealed these days, but VFR reg/rec connectors are only protected by a loose vinyl boot. I replace mine with Delphi Metri-Pack connectors, like these. Of course, I have no proof and will never have any, but I am reasonably confident that my upgraded connectors will never end up fried... :smile:

I've had nearly new connectors melt down with no chance of corrosion hence the hard-wired stator connector on the GF's bike.

In that case, you've proven that the problem on the GF's bike was not related to the connectors at all--"nearly new" connectors would not have been "loose" any more than they would have been corroded... My pet theory WILL fight to the death! :tongue:

Ciao,

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

My personal pet theory is similar to yours, but starts with corrosion, rather than vibration. Most automotive connectors are sealed these days, but VFR reg/rec connectors are only protected by a loose vinyl boot. I replace mine with Delphi Metri-Pack connectors, like these. Of course, I have no proof and will never have any, but I am reasonably confident that my upgraded connectors will never end up fried... :smile:

Ciao,

I've had nearly new connectors melt down with no chance of corrosion hence the hard-wired stator connector on the GF's bike.

Today, Zommy, RollinAgain, and I replaced my stator, and r/r. I am at 29899 miles.The stator was good and fried. It is a wonder I rode as long as I did this last month.

I hope you're basing your conclusion on having tested the stator with a multimeter, rather than just based on its appearance, because they all look like that--due to one side being continually immersed in engine oil. In other words, they can look like that and still work fine. However, when the windings are actually charred, you don't need to do the tests...

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

My personal pet theory is similar to yours, but starts with corrosion, rather than vibration. Most automotive connectors are sealed these days, but VFR reg/rec connectors are only protected by a loose vinyl boot. I replace mine with Delphi Metri-Pack connectors, like these. Of course, I have no proof and will never have any, but I am reasonably confident that my upgraded connectors will never end up fried... :smile:

I've had nearly new connectors melt down with no chance of corrosion hence the hard-wired stator connector on the GF's bike.

In that case, you've proven that the problem on the GF's bike was not related to the connectors at all--"nearly new" connectors would not have been "loose" any more than they would have been corroded... My pet theory WILL fight to the death! :tongue:

Ciao,

OK then how else do you you explain connector meltdown with all new components ( stator, R/R, battery & wiring) just a few thousand miles (and a couple of months) after installation in a dry climate? Hitachi connectors are not known for their robust connection quality in a high current/heat/vibration environment. Nothing else has been changed, and the system has been working fine for quite a few thousand miles, and well over a year since. This is what led me to zip-tie all the connectors on my bike, and it's been fine as well. Process of elimination: the connectors are the weak link. Trying to extend the life of consumable components beyond their useful life simply aggravates the problem.

I love experiments, and so far this one is confirming my theory.

I agree it seems goofy to replace with the stock Hitachi melt-a-matic connectors on the stator, but going with the MetriPack, I think being fully sealed and high amp rating, have enuff cajones to quit worrying over the stator connector.

Today, Zommy, RollinAgain, and I replaced my stator, and r/r. I am at 29899 miles.The stator was good and fried. It is a wonder I rode as long as I did this last month.

I hope you're basing your conclusion on having tested the stator with a multimeter, rather than just based on its appearance, because they all look like that--due to one side being continually immersed in engine oil. In other words, they can look like that and still work fine. However, when the windings are actually charred, you don't need to do the tests...

Looks to me like the connectors got loose, which caused resistance in the contacts, which caused heat, which caused the connections to get worse, which created more heat, until you end up where you are now.

My personal pet theory is similar to yours, but starts with corrosion, rather than vibration. Most automotive connectors are sealed these days, but VFR reg/rec connectors are only protected by a loose vinyl boot. I replace mine with Delphi Metri-Pack connectors, like these. Of course, I have no proof and will never have any, but I am reasonably confident that my upgraded connectors will never end up fried... :smile:

I've had nearly new connectors melt down with no chance of corrosion hence the hard-wired stator connector on the GF's bike.

In that case, you've proven that the problem on the GF's bike was not related to the connectors at all--"nearly new" connectors would not have been "loose" any more than they would have been corroded... My pet theory WILL fight to the death! :tongue:

Ciao,

OK then how else do you you explain connector meltdown with all new components ( stator, R/R, battery & wiring) just a few thousand miles (and a couple of months) after installation in a dry climate? Hitachi connectors are not known for their robust connection quality in a high current/heat/vibration environment. Nothing else has been changed, and the system has been working fine for quite a few thousand miles, and well over a year since. This is what led me to zip-tie all the connectors on my bike, and it's been fine as well. Process of elimination: the connectors are the weak link. Trying to extend the life of consumable components beyond their useful life simply aggravates the problem.

I love experiments, and so far this one is confirming my theory.

I cannot explain that situation, but neither do I have all of the information necessary to do so. I agree that eliminating the connectors also eliminates any possibility of connector melt-down, but it isn't necessarily the most practical solution in the long run. If we ever hear of a Metri-Pak melt-down I will dutifully put down my theory...

Ciao,

No doubt the Metri-Pak connectors look like quality stuff. Next time I end up cutting wires I may install some myself. For now tying things down seems to be working.

Hi all, same kind of problem. Rode for about 20 minutes and the bike completely died except for the clock. Good thing I was just approaching an intersection so I was able to pull over quickly. Bike fired right back up, but it died about 4 more times while I was limping it home.

I've done all the multimeter tests and am getting good numbers.

I've swapped out stator's with one from my spare "parts" engine. What I've noticed is that the wires coming from the stator to the plastic connector get REALLY, REALLY hot. On the other end of the connector the wires going to the VFRness and stator are barely warm.

I've let the engine temp get up to 201 and I can barely touch the wires coming from the stator?

Do I need to upgrade the wiring from the stator? Does anyone make a wiring set for this?

The wiring and all connectors look good, no corrosion or heat damage (that I can see).

This is the only thing I can think of. I can take the bike for a ride up and down the street, but it dies in about 5 minutes.

HELP, I need to get this bike back to bullet-proof status.

YellowFuzz

YellowFuzz,

Have you identified why the bike is dying? Dead battery? Or why you're able to start it up again (even if it dies again 5 minutes later)? When you say all the multimeter readings look good, what did you check?

Hello,
The bike fires right up. Voltage is good. Yesterday, I was trying to do some more troubleshooting with it. I had it idling in the garage and the yellow wire bundle from the stator going to the R/R connector were so hot, I could only put my fingers on them for about 2 seconds. The wires on the other side of the connector were barely warm. No signs of melted insulation/connectors.
I've done all the multi-meter tests mentioned in this thread and all my numbers are spot-on.
A few weeks ago, I took the bike out just to go up and down the street to see if I could replicate the problem. I rode maybe a total of 200 yards and the engine/lights die. The clock stayed on. I put the bike into neutral, push the starter and it fires right back up. I was only about 100 feet from my driveway, so I got home okay.
The battery is less than a year old. I have the Rick's R/R and the VFRness on it. I'm really concerned about the heat of the wire bundle from the stator. I might just go ahead and buy a new stator and see if that fixes it.

Any thoughts/suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Hi all, same kind of problem. Rode for about 20 minutes and the bike completely died except for the clock. Good thing I was just approaching an intersection so I was able to pull over quickly. Bike fired right back up, but it died about 4 more times while I was limping it home.

I've done all the multimeter tests and am getting good numbers.

I've swapped out stator's with one from my spare "parts" engine. What I've noticed is that the wires coming from the stator to the plastic connector get REALLY, REALLY hot. On the other end of the connector the wires going to the VFRness and stator are barely warm.

I've let the engine temp get up to 201 and I can barely touch the wires coming from the stator?

Do I need to upgrade the wiring from the stator? Does anyone make a wiring set for this?

The wiring and all connectors look good, no corrosion or heat damage (that I can see).

This is the only thing I can think of. I can take the bike for a ride up and down the street, but it dies in about 5 minutes.

HELP, I need to get this bike back to bullet-proof status.

YellowFuzz

It's normal for the stator wires to get hot. Lotsa current passing through those especially if you have just started the bike, and it's pumping current back into the battery. Check your stator before you just replace it. The other problem could be any number of things, but I would start with checking the integrity of all the connections including the sidestand switch (hint). It's obviously not a battery issue if the bike will restart without resetting the dash.

Newbie here. Consider also that copper is an exceptional conductor of heat. The copper in the stator will be roughly the same temperature as the oil in the sump and that heat will be conducted up the copper cores of the wires exiting the stator. This will be why the wires are hot to touch near the stator but not further away from it.

Three cheers to Honda for creating a whole generation of amature electrical engineers. I love it!
I, too, share your affliction. My '98 came to me with a hard-wired stator-R/R circuit and a wire-my-bike mod with some other nonsense that used a relay and AWG10 wires to power a 10 amp circuit. I immediately removed all that crap and returned my system back to stock with a Ricks R/R, and connectors from Vintage Connections. The OE circuit works great, except for one thing,,,in four days and 400 miles, the stator-R/R connector was melted (still worked, but fused beyond the point of disassembly.) I replaced that stupid connector four times over the next two months before finally giving in and hard wiring the circuit with crimp connectors, solder, heat shrink, and wire lomb. I have about a year and 10,000 miles on my bike since that time with no problems; the wire lomb remains cool to the touch even after rides of several hours. Had I known at the time about the AMP connector, I probably would have tried it, but now that I have that genie in the bottle, I'm not going to chance letting him out again. Jeff J.