Regulator Rectifier Issues

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

007

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

You got me there a minute, I was thinking "holy shit, an 8th with R/R problems already?"

- Honda has a habit of contracting for a bazzion of a part on a bike and running it for years and years. I think this may be the case in point on VFRs. So the older style shunt was under contract and Honda being cheap was determined to use them all....

-- Anyhoo, my understanding is that the CBRs have been converted to MOSFET R/Rs and I would think Honda got the message on the old design and the new one for the 8th should be a Mosfet design too.

Anybody with a new 8th look to see the part number on the R/R?

The 6th gen RR's rarely fail on their own, I think most of the replacement stems from not understanding the 5th gen and below had much more real RR issues,( that reality) just transferred over via paranoia , all vfr talk tends to meld together amongst models. IMO most go after the RR first on the 6th gen, but that's usually not where the issue lays.

007

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

Free cookie .

:pinocchio:

I would be shocked, stunned, flabbergasted, astonished AND astounded if the Gen 8 has the same R/R problems.

spud786

The 6th gen RR's rarely fail on their own, I think most of the replacement stems from not understanding the 5th gen and below had much more real RR issues,( that reality) just transferred over via paranoia , all vfr talk tends to meld together amongst models. IMO most go after the RR first on the 6th gen, but that's usually not where the issue lays.

This.

It's usually the stator that goes first on the late model 800s the R/R is just an innocent victim.

MBrane

spud786

The 6th gen RR's rarely fail on their own, I think most of the replacement stems from not understanding the 5th gen and below had much more real RR issues,( that reality) just transferred over via paranoia , all vfr talk tends to meld together amongst models. IMO most go after the RR first on the 6th gen, but that's usually not where the issue lays.

This.

It's usually the stator that goes first on the late model 800s the R/R is just an innocent victim.

Let me rephrase the question: have the electrical issues been improved on the 8th gen? Were they better on the 7th gen? I realize it was very much a different animal, so may not apply to 8th gen technology that is more in line with previous VFR heritage.

Ashok

I would be shocked, stunned, flabbergasted, astonished AND astounded if the Gen 8 has the same R/R problems.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mello dude

007

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

You got me there a minute, I was thinking "holy shit, an 8th with R/R problems already?"

- Honda has a habit of contracting for a bazzion of a part on a bike and running it for years and years. I think this may be the case in point on VFRs. So the older style shunt was under contract and Honda being cheap was determined to use them all....

-- Anyhoo, my understanding is that the CBRs have been converted to MOSFET R/Rs and I would think Honda got the message on the old design and the new one for the 8th should be a Mosfet design too.

Anybody with a new 8th look to see the part number on the R/R?

From the parts fiche . . .

31600-MJM-D11

7th gen (2010) 31600-MGE-641

6th gen (2009) 31600-MCW-D61

8th gen can be found on Hondaparts-direct.com - maybe others by now too.

007

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

the 1st thing i do with EVERY honda i get is beef up the charging and ground wires.

doesnt matter if its 30 years old or band new.

i just did my pals new cbr1000rr before it was even out of the dealership. :fing02:

Cogswell

mello dude

007

Anybody had any issues yet? I am highly considering a Gen 8 in the future, but don't want to be among the hordes of VFR riders who enjoy bulletproof reliability while standing by the side of the road waiting on a tow truck. One would think this issue is fixed in Gen 8? I will offer a free cookie at TMAC next year to any Gen 8 rider whose RR goes out .

You got me there a minute, I was thinking "holy shit, an 8th with R/R problems already?"

- Honda has a habit of contracting for a bazzion of a part on a bike and running it for years and years. I think this may be the case in point on VFRs. So the older style shunt was under contract and Honda being cheap was determined to use them all....

-- Anyhoo, my understanding is that the CBRs have been converted to MOSFET R/Rs and I would think Honda got the message on the old design and the new one for the 8th should be a Mosfet design too.

Anybody with a new 8th look to see the part number on the R/R?

From the parts fiche . . .

31600-MJM-D11

7th gen (2010) 31600-MGE-641

6th gen (2009) 31600-MCW-D61

8th gen can be found on Hondaparts-direct.com - maybe others by now too.

Less watts I assume ...

MBrane

spud786

The 6th gen RR's rarely fail on their own, I think most of the replacement stems from not understanding the 5th gen and below had much more real RR issues,( that reality) just transferred over via paranoia , all vfr talk tends to meld together amongst models. IMO most go after the RR first on the 6th gen, but that's usually not where the issue lays.

This.

It's usually the stator that goes first on the late model 800s the R/R is just an innocent victim.

Do you know how the failed stator damages the R/R? I would think a failed stator stops making juice via either leg to leg or leg to ground short, or leg open. Is it the resultant remaining phase imbalance that kills the R/R. Just curious.

Ive had stators fail on various bikes, but ive never had a rr fail yet, even though they say one can take out the other. But its also known, that you cant truly test an RR without a good working stator.

The 6th gen RR is a definite improvement over previous models. No failures on mine. Stators last average of 50k miles as a consumable item. Then there are a few connectors that over time will corrode and fail if left unattended. I had no problems for 5 years and 50k miles. Fixed the problems and was still good 40k miles later.

I now read significantly more about 6th gen electrical woes since the bikes have aged. If Honda did not improve the 8th gen electrics we likely will not know for another 5 years.

Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability. I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems. Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.

Bad Boy

Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability. I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems. Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.

Surely this only holds true if the owner rides around on high beam 24/7. Who would do that?

dfh

Bad Boy

Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability. I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems. Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.

Surely this only holds true if the owner rides around on high beam 24/7. Who would do that?

I think its the opposite, people that use less of the voltage supply can have more issue, Hid's and led replacements of incandesant bulbs, have to dissipate more of the excess supply.

spud786

dfh

Bad Boy

Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability. I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems. Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.

Surely this only holds true if the owner rides around on high beam 24/7. Who would do that?

I think its the opposite, people that use less of the voltage supply can have more issue, Hid's and led replacements of incandesant bulbs, have to dissipate more of the excess supply.

I was thinking the same, at least for the RR. Less output from the stator being used up by the bike's lighting system = more surplus energy the RR need to transformation into heat that needs to be dissapated......

Yeah I have no factual data on the matter, but I run electrics and devices and it doesn't seem to have a negative effect my stator life. But a stator that's not putting out a strong voltage may cause higher amperage draw, that could be an issue with wiring, but Im not an electrical engineer.

If you pinch the female end of the connectors down, NOT all the way but enough for it to snugly hold the male connectors, it will alleviate most of the overheating contact issues associated with the stator & R/R.

TNRabbit

If you pinch the female end of the connectors down, NOT all the way but enough for it to snugly hold the male connectors, it will alleviate most of the overheating contact issues associated with the stator & R/R.

yes.. MOST... for a while.. so like i said.. i chop that crap off and hard wire . the 1st thing i do with EVERY honda i get is beef up the charging and ground wires.

doesnt matter if its 30 years old or band new.

i just did my pals new cbr1000rr before it was even out of the dealership. :fing02:

BCmcrider

MBrane

spud786

The 6th gen RR's rarely fail on their own, I think most of the replacement stems from not understanding the 5th gen and below had much more real RR issues,( that reality) just transferred over via paranoia , all vfr talk tends to meld together amongst models. IMO most go after the RR first on the 6th gen, but that's usually not where the issue lays.

This.

It's usually the stator that goes first on the late model 800s the R/R is just an innocent victim.

Do you know how the failed stator damages the R/R? I would think a failed stator stops making juice via either leg to leg or leg to ground short, or leg open. Is it the resultant remaining phase imbalance that kills the R/R. Just curious.

As the insulation on stator windings breaks down due to heat cycles they short against one another, and the stator will put out lower voltage/more current. It is the extra current that will fry the R/R, and the battery if the condition isn't corrected for an extended period.

Of course it doesn't always happen that way, but enough to be common. A lot depends on the overall condition of the charging system as a whole, and how it's used/maintained by the rider.

My 6th gen has just fried its second stator in 3 years, so it's on its way. No guarantee the new one won't either, I suppose.

fatshoutybloke

My 6th gen has just fried its second stator in 3 years, so it's on its way. No guarantee the new one won't either, I suppose.

How many miles on the original?

Was the second unit OEM, aftermarket or a rewind?

How many miles on the second unit?

Beck

spud786

dfh

Bad Boy

Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability. I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems. Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.

Surely this only holds true if the owner rides around on high beam 24/7. Who would do that?

I think its the opposite, people that use less of the voltage supply can have more issue, Hid's and led replacements of incandesant bulbs, have to dissipate more of the excess supply.

I was thinking the same, at least for the RR. Less output from the stator being used up by the bike's lighting system = more surplus energy the RR need to transformation into heat that needs to be dissapated......

The 6th gen has to produce enough power to run all 4 headlights and fan at all times but rarely needs to so there is a lot of surplus power that is shunted to heating up the R/R. This also can heat up the stator. The lower draw of 8th gen headlights mean the system can be designed with less need for surplus power and excess heat.

The '02 VFR had a recall to up the output of the original design stator because too many people were running high beams during the day and battery could go dead if the fan came on for a long time as in stuck in traffic. Upping the output of the stator may have added to the over heating and reliability problems some are experiencing now. Upping the output on a balanced electrical system design is not likely good for the balance of the system.

CornerCarver

fatshoutybloke

My 6th gen has just fried its second stator in 3 years, so it's on its way. No guarantee the new one won't either, I suppose.

How many miles on the original? 24,782

Was the second unit OEM, aftermarket or a rewind? Rewind, I think

How many miles on the second unit? 42,995

 
Running 4 halogen bulbs on the 6th gen had certainly upped the amps and exposed wiring vulnerability.  I would expect the 8th gen LED headlamps lower amps will reduce wiring problems.  Hopefully the lower power draw will mean a cooler longer lasting stator and less over stressed connectors.  

 
Surely this only holds true if the owner rides around on high beam 24/7. Who would do that?
 

I think its the opposite, people that use less of the voltage supply can have more issue, Hid's and led replacements of incandesant bulbs, have to dissipate more of the excess supply.

I was thinking the same, at least for the RR. Less output from the stator being used up by the bike's lighting system = more surplus energy the RR need to transformation into heat that needs to be dissapated......

The 6th gen has to produce enough power to run all 4 headlights and fan at all times but rarely needs to so there is a lot of surplus power that is shunted to heating up the R/R.  This also can heat up the stator.   The lower draw of 8th gen headlights mean the system can be designed with less need for surplus power and excess heat.

The '02 VFR had a recall to up the output of the original design stator because too many people were running high beams during the day and battery could go dead if the fan came on for a long time as in stuck in traffic.  Upping the output of the stator may have added to the over heating and reliability problems some are experiencing now.  Upping the output on a balanced electrical system design is not likely good for the balance of the system.

Fry your electrics by habitually run round on high beams during the day or in traffic at night & you get what you deserve. Can't see Honda upping the stator output to facilitate such anti-social (and in most markets illegal) behaviour, but I can see them upping the output to facilitate those owners who found running additional electrical accessories like GPS, heated grips  & electric vests marginal power wise. The VFR800 is after all a sport-touring mount but the Big H when designing the 6th Gen may well have misunderstood what electrical demands touring owners would place on their bikes.  

For all this talk of the LED lights lowering power draw from the 6th gen remember the 8th gen now comes for the first time with standard heated grips so I think the wrong tree is being barked up here with total draw unlikely to be no lower than the 6th gen bikes. Does anybody actually have hard figures on the comparative outputs of the 6th & 8th gen stators? Even if the outputs are the same you can bet Honda looked at the cause of all warranty claims for the 6th gen and redesigned the loom to save wasting money on repairs.    

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11AH  battery      Hmmmm   ...

Hi All.

The Reg/Rect unit on the 2014 VFR800F is a very different beasty to what we have seen in the past. Although the Stator is the same as previous models, the new RR is completely different, hopefully this type of RR might save some of the Stator burn ups that have been so common - time will tell.

Cheers.

Grum.

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Hi All.

The Reg/Rect unit on the 2014 VFR800F is a very different beasty to what we have seen in the past. Although the Stator is the same as previous models, the new RR is completely different, hopefully this type of RR might save some of the Stator burn ups that have been so common - time will tell.

Cheers.

Grum.

[image: attachicon.gif]VFR800F_2014_RR001.jpg

Looks  like   a  future  mod  for  the 6th gen to 8th gen R\R.

I think I'd rather have a loud exhaust over bright headlights that can distract and dazzle oncoming traffic into not seeing the idiot pedestrian walking out from behind a van whilst checking their Facebook profile. I'm sure I don't need to point out that DTRLs don't have any focus to them but headlights do. Hence why nothing bad was said about having headlights on dip during the day for bikes, not sure if modern tech allows for the use of DTRLs when it gets dark, after markets are obviously different, I think DTRLs need to be focusable though. There was nothing wrong with running side lights anyway. No bad experiences with load pipes but plenty with poorly adjusted headlights and miss-use of fog lights also, parking on the wrong side of the road with your headlights on (an offence in Australia I believe). On a side note, does anyone know what the actual wattage and make of the led headlight is? I assume it's a cree of some sort.

The first automobile DRLs were indeed just regular headlamps ("on dip") and did indeed cause a fury, at least here in the 'States.  Same as bike headlamps basically.  In fact bikes could have been thought of as more of a problem relatively speaking because they are mounted higher.

To me the difference between loud pipes and bright lights is that the bright lights aren't so invasive.  If someone with bright lights cruises by, nobody misses a teacher's sentence or has to ask a friend to repeat themselves.  Nobody has to rewind their TV program.  Nobody is awakened from their sleep.  Nobody's concentration is shattered.  Nobody gets aggravated mid-shtup.  :wink:     As a result, nobody is writing their elected officials and trying to ban motorcycles and pass all kinds of new laws because of the bright lights.  But the loud pipes, holy crap, the trouble they cause, because it is so invasive.

As for the headlamp chips, I think we're gonna have to wait for someone to disassemble their headlamp unit to discover what Honda is using.

Given the cost to replace those units, I think it would be nice of Honda would make schematic diagrams available for if and when individual parts fail.  It's bad enough already, this country treating $1000 parts as entirely replaceable and not serviceable.  When I go to Asia I see people repairing $20 CDROM drives.

I'm just poking back through the thread a little bit...

About anti-social, there was a day here in the 'States when motorcycle headlights were only used at night.  Then the bureaucrats decided we should run headlights full-time to give us a safety advantage and headlight switches soon disappeared.  A little over a decade afterward, car manufacturers started thinking DRLs were a lovely idea.  Good-bye safety advantage.  The amusing part is that headlight glare has been a subject of much disagreement in DOT and NHTSA with regards to DRLs but they never gave a crap about any of that when they decided motorcycles needed to run headlamps full-time.

And frankly you don't have to head "I never saw you" too many times to decide that anti-social beats injured, crippled or dead, hands-down.  Think of the high-beams as the quiet answer to the "loud pipes save lives crowd".  Which do you think is less anti-social?  ;-)

Setting aside the antisocial bit for a second, try this little experiment next time you are outside on a clear day with a small group of people. Shout out "A free beer/coffee/choc-bar for the first person who can show me where the sun is?"  What will happen is a laughable confused-chicken arm-flapping scramble to find that bright orb that lights our world. See it all the time in my work as a Film/TV cameraman, even with seasoned industry professionals with a vested interest in knowing the direction of the source of light.

Why? Because bright sunlight is quickly damaging to our eyes we are pre-programmed by instinct not to look at it. We behave the same way with any bright source of light. Once the brightness exceeds the dynamic range of our eyes it becomes glaring and we shy away from it or stop looking at it.  So you can see how running hi-beams on headlights in traffic is counterproductive if the intent is to avoid those awful "didnt see you" scenarios. 

But wait, there is more! We have evolved from carniverous fruit-eaters. We can thank our fruit eating ancestors for colour vision, but the meat eating side of the tree gave us our two eyes side by side on the front of our head, to use stereoscopic vision to track movement & a brain that responds to movement better than contrast. Often we hear of drivers pulling out of intersections apologising for not judging speed correctly. The best ways to help that lower life form called the motorist make less errors of judgement is to run a dipped headlight or two with nice big reflectors ( 5th & 6th gens are great in this regard) so you don't have glare causing folk to look away plus you do have a nice big area of reasonable brightness for their eyes & brains to track.... hopefully! 

Now I'm on a science roll loud pipes is a funny one as well.  We have stereo hearing. Two ears, one on each side of the head. So as long as the wavelength of a sound is shorter than the distance between our ears we can directionalise the source of the sound from the different aural imaging. So whats the magic pitch that matches the wavelength thats just a bit shorter than the distance between our ears? The human voice, specifically a womans voice. So when Mr Knuckle-Dragging in his pirate costume fits his Hardly- Dangerous with open exhausts to make that special sound like an elephant farting down a drainpipe at 110dB we certainly know he's around, but not where he is heading to & from. A two-stroke v-twin 250 like an Aprilia RS250 or a Japanese inline 4cylinder 400 you know damn where they are and where they are headed, even with stock pipes. Pitch is important for safety, excessive volume only gives a chubby to the cock on the bike. 

Back to being anti-social. Riding around with high-beam glaring into the eyes of oncoming motorists or into the mirrors of vehicles only compromises their vision & in times of poor visibility can make driving safely quite difficult, much like driving into the sun with a dirty visor. Not only that but it fucks people off big time, much in the same way as loud pipes. It may not effect you on the day, but if motorists over time get pissed off more & more with high beams in their eyes & loud pipes in their rattling their brains one day their response to such stimulus my be less than appropriate, with a poor outcome for the motorcyclist de jour. Thats why its not only an unsafe practice that wont save you any better as an individual from....  

And frankly you don't have to head "I never saw you" too many times to decide that anti-social beats injured, crippled or dead, hands-down.

 .... but may well effect other motorcyclists too. That in my book is the definition of antisocial.