I finally have some time to work in the garage and I have spent plenty of time collecting parts, so it's time to get the hands dirty and get something done. Last fall I picked up a '94 VFR750 for $200 from what I would classify as a world class crack house. No title or keys (I did check the VIN and it had not been reported as stolen). It had been wrecked, and probably flipped. The fairings were in pieces (and had a nasty black rattle can paint job). Plenty was broken, including the right clip on and right rear set. The front wheel doesn't sit straight in the forks. There is plenty of dirt and cat hair everywhere. The tank is dented to death. It does run... I was able to get it started before I began disassembly.
So, I bought it with the plan to completely disassemble and reassemble as a street fighter. I have made a lot of eBay purchases in preparation for getting it together and looking just like I want. Here's the list of purchases as I can remember from my desk at work:
Right rear set including brake master
Right clip on
Both sets of handlebar switches
CBR1000RR subframe (2, don't ask)
CBR1000RR Muffler
CBR1000RR Rear Fairing
CBR1000RR seats
After Market CBR1000RR taillight
Used Tank, red with nice paint and only a slight dent that will be covered by a tank protector sticker
Superbike bars and 2 sets of ATV risers (still deciding on clips ons or bars)
Hayabusa GSX 1300 R emission plate pair block-off
Cafe Racer Bar End mirrors
'96 frame, subframe, forks and front axle with title
Here's the plans I have so far: (not in order)
Install CBR1000RR subframe onto VFR frame (This is the part I am most concerned about, I can weld steel but not aluminum).
Have mid pipe custom bent for CBR1000RR muffler.
Install braided brakelines.
Transfer engine and swing arm to new ('96) frame
Clean everything, flush and replace all fluids
Replace valve cover gaskets
Figure out gauges and headlight
Create custom belly pan
Relocate or remove oil cooler (opinions please)
Replace tires
Finish De-Pairing
Here's some pics:
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I'm planning to get the engine out tonight and remove the swing arm to give everything a good cleaning. I ordered the Swingarm and Engine locknut tools from eBay. They don't have the offset, but hopefully I can figure out the correct torque for installation with an offset calc.
I would appreciate any tips or suggestions you guys have for me as I embark on this mission.
Ok, so I've made some progress... Hopefully will make some more as the evening rolls on.
The swingarm is off
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The large Allen socket at the end of the swingarm made me scratch my head for a bit. But I figured out that the subframe bolts could help me when used in conjunction with a 14mm wrench.
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So the swingarm is off, along with the headers, oil cooler and radiator. Now you can see how much dirt and oil is all over everywhere. I'm pretty confident that the oil leak is isolated to the valve covers.
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I think I am ready to drop the engine out of the frame... I hope.
I just noticed you didn't mention a front end. Any plans with that?
The plan for now is to use the '96 front end that came with the titled frame I bought as they are in good shape. I may respring and revalve if needed. Same with the rear shock... It's still TBD.
Well, the motor is out of the frame. I'm done for the night. Things went pretty much as planned... No real surprises so far. Just a lot of grease and grime. I have lots of degreaser for this project.
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My garage was quite clean before starting this project and the XR200R restoration. I probably need todo some garage cleaning before I dig much deeper into project land.
phew, that's awesome! I think I might have hit her up with the pressure washer and degreaser before disassembly....but I know the feeling you had....I love diving into a project like this!! Any pictures beforehand??
phew, that's awesome! I think I might have hit her up with the pressure washer and degreaser before disassembly....but I know the feeling you had....I love diving into a project like this!! Any pictures beforehand??
I had some before pics from when I bought it, which was a while ago, but they never made it off my phone and got lost.
The thought of cleaning it before disassembly made me nervous with the potential for water and junk to get where it didn't belong. I felt like I had a little more control of it this way... Of course, cleaning it first would have saved me the from the near permanent black fingernail outlines I have today.
Yes, these types of projects are WONDERFUL for the nail brush business....scrub brush business in this case. Been there, done that. Someone really didn't take good care of that poor ole girl did they?
The only plastic i've saved is the front fender and it's cracked. Most fairings were all brittle and cracked. The seat is decent, a little vinyl conditioner would probably do a lot for it. It's a Corbin Gunfighter I think.
I think I just scored a sweet deal on a full gasket set on eBay! I got it for about $140 shipped. I saw several top end only kits for over $200... hopefully this one isn't crap. I was going to just pick up the valve cover gaskets and those were going to be over $60 so I started looking at top end kits and couldn't find an answer as to what was in the kit. So, I figured $140 bucks for never needing to hunt down another gasket sounded pretty nice.
It's an ok price. If it's good quality it really doesn't matter though. It's not something you want to be doing again down the road.
Indeed!
I hadn't planned on doing the head gasket, but the kit comes with it so it may be worth doing just to make sure they're in good shape. Any thoughts on doing the head gasket just because? Is it overly difficult?
I know I want to take the clutch cover, the crankcase cover and the stator cover off and paint them, probably with crinkle paint. The cylinder covers will probably get a coat of that as well. So having all these gaskets will make it easy to do all that without having to source a gasket every time.
i've heard of some guys removing the oil cooler completely on fighters. i think hyofighter relocated his cooler to the side, check out his fighter build for some good ideas. Due to an incompetent driver in a parking lot i had my plastics removed by force (thankfully i wasn't on the bike when it happened). I ran my bike for a while without plastics and found that it ran much cooler (as you would expect). Cool enough where i would confidently say that an oil cooler isn't necessary if you don't have the plastics. My gauge would get maybe a quarter way above cold when riding. The only time i saw it get close to half way (normal when i had the plastics on) was in some very slow moving town traffic.
As far as street fighting goes, I've been prowling this forum and found some neat ideas you might want to consider. There is a thread here on COPs (coil on plugs). i am going to start looking in to this for my fighter project when i find the time. Also SEBSPEED makes this nice see-through clutch cover.
Thanks Matt! I appreciate your experience with the engine temp.
I have seen HYO's work and it is fantastic. I don't think I want to try fabbing my own oil cooler. I think I will probably just cut off the oil cooler pipes and connect them together at the bottom with a length of hose and some hose clamps.
I've been pretty active on the COP mod thread... I am hoping someone can make it work long term. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
I hadn't planned on doing the head gasket, but the kit comes with it so it may be worth doing just to make sure they're in good shape. Any thoughts on doing the head gasket just because? Is it overly difficult?
I know I want to take the clutch cover, the crankcase cover and the stator cover off and paint them, probably with crinkle paint. The cylinder covers will probably get a coat of that as well. So having all these gaskets will make it easy to do all that without having to source a gasket every time.
If you've gone this far, who needs a leak? Replacing the gaskets is fairly easy, just a lot of cleaning and scraping to get everything nice and shiny for the new gaskets to seat on.
If you have access to a sandblaster, that's what I did for all my covers that I painted with the crinkle paint. The rough surface really likes to take paint.
You can bake the covers a couple days after painting them (200'F for 1 hour), or install them on the bike and let engine heat cure the paint. It's really smelly though.
Keep in mind the crinkle paint is very slow drying, so if you can paint the parts and set them aside for a few days, so much the better.
If your going to remove the cooler and since you already have the engine out just block off the cooler ports and run a vf750c oil pump instead. They dont have a cooler loop.
If you have access to a sandblaster, that's what I did for all my covers that I painted with the crinkle paint. The rough surface really likes to take paint.
You can bake the covers a couple days after painting them (200'F for 1 hour), or install them on the bike and let engine heat cure the paint. It's really smelly though.
Keep in mind the crinkle paint is very slow drying, so if you can paint the parts and set them aside for a few days, so much the better.
I probably will pick up a small sandblaster from china freight..
Can you bake crinkle painted items in your house oven... Or is that grounds for the wifey to throw my stuff out on the lawn?
If your going to remove the cooler and since you already have the engine out just block off the cooler ports and run a vf750c oil pump instead. They dont have a cooler loop.
I just looked at eBay and it looks like I can get one of these for pretty cheap. Is this a direct bolt up solution? I'll do some searching and see what comes up. It would be awesome to eliminate the oil cooler all together.
I have yet to actually install the pump. The ngine is in mynstorage unit right now lol. I have, however, placed them side by side andnmeasured all pertinent dimensions and they are identical. The 750c uses our block with a little less machining done to it. Both feed pumps are dimensionally the same.
Yes, i will be doing this in conjunction with the sandwich cooler. I have pondered lowering the sprocket ratio on it so the oil pump (and coincidentally the water pump) spin faster so i dont have to try and find a damn rc30 pump for it but it might not even be necessary. There was concern with someone inwas speaking with that the vfr pump might not flow enough. Real life trials willprove or disprove this.
Got some cleaning done tonight. What a nasty mess!
This is looking a whole lot better... Not all the way clean but it's pretty impressive what some degreaser, some brake cleaner and some engine bright can do!
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The cylinder head covers looked like they were painted black before... Now they just need some sandblasting then a nice happy coat of crinkle paint.
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I had no idea the plastic guard between the disc and the sprocket was white!
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I found this when I was cleaning... It looks like the chain dug into the swingarm at some point. I'll have to look at it closely when input it back together.
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I loosened the clamps on all four carb boots and gave them a tug, but couldn't get them off. I'll have to do some searching for tip and tricks on getting them off. I am planning to pull the heads too, is it a problem to take the off with the heads?
My source was a local pArts shop lol. I donT know where they ordered them from tho.
Found em on eBay last night for about $50... They're new but hopefully they haven't been sitting on a shelf for the last 18 years.
mcrwt644
wow, what a difference!
Thanks! I'm pretty excited about the progress so far. The Engine Brite probably made the most difference... The problem was getting the motor out of the garage into the driveway so I could rinse it after spraying it down. That suckers heavy!
I checked Jamie Daugherty's instructions on removing the carbs found here:
His instructions are good, but prying the carbs out relies on the motor being in the frame and obviously mine is out. I'm planning to pull the heads just to give them a good look and swap out the gaskets with the new ones that are coming in my full gasket kit. So I guess I can pull the carbs when I am pulling out the heads.
Now that everything is clean, I can see that the clutch cover has been sealed with RTV crap... Is this standard? Seems like it could make a huge mess inside that could have undesirable results. I'm hoping there's a gasket for this so I don't have to mess with the goop.
Now that everything is clean, I can see that the clutch cover has been sealed with RTV crap... Is this standard? Seems like it could make a huge mess inside that could have undesirable results. I'm hoping there's a gasket for this so I don't have to mess with the goop.
+1. Also, if you go sans gasket you might have starter gear binding issues. Best way ive found to put them on is spray adhesive to one side so it stays on the cover and lightly grease the other side so it doesnt stick to the block (but will still seal)
I'll put rtv around certain areas (mostly around the mounting 'pin' holes) to help hold the gasket in place. Otherwise, put it on, and torque to spec in an X pattern. I personally do a 2 stage torque, but that's just me.
Ok, so I was perusing the service manual yesterday and came across the oil flow diagram. If I am reading this correctly it looks to me like simply blocking off the oil cooler lines shouldn't affect the oil flow through the rest of the engine. I marked the block on points on the diagram in orange... Am I totally off base here or is this is legitimate theory?
you cant just block them off. there is still a pump that will be turning in there, and whatever it pumps will be sent out of the relief valve. which is a really good way to heat up the oil. just swap the pump youll be better off.
From what it looks like, if you block off the oil cooler, you may get extra oil pressure to the rest of the system. That could be a good thing, but it could also be very bad.
From what it looks like, if you block off the oil cooler, you may get extra oil pressure to the rest of the system.
Good point...
nitrousva
That could be a good thing, but it could also be very bad.
Hard to be wrong when you take both sides! Good strategy :tongue:
I'm watching a VF750 pump on the eBay... we shall see. I am also planning to put a belly pan on this bike, so simply running a hose from the output to the input on the oil cooler loop would not be a huge deal for me as it will be covered. I wonder if I will run into over pressurization with that method as well... has anyone done either of these mods to the oil cooler? what was the result? :lurk:
From what it looks like, if you block off the oil cooler, you may get extra oil pressure to the rest of the system. That could be a good thing, but it could also be very bad.
False. The relief valve controls this and f anything would just be dumping out extra oil. But sincebthe cooler isnt looping back into the primary feed then that wont happen.
From what it looks like, if you block off the oil cooler, you may get extra oil pressure to the rest of the system. That could be a good thing, but it could also be very bad.
False. The relief valve controls this and f anything would just be dumping out extra oil. But sincebthe cooler isnt looping back into the primary feed then that wont happen.
So you're saying blocking of the cooler in and out should have no adverse affect on the pump or the oil distribution through the engine?
As far as the oil cooler is concerned, mine is just relocated low near the inlet and outlet. I did run across someone else with a very similar bike that just had the cooler bypassed. There was a U pipe that went straight (well, bent I guess since it's a U) from one side to the other. He said he'd been riding it that way every day for a year, in Florida. . .
Update time!!! Over the weekend I found time to get the carbs and the heads off.
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it Is absolutely amazing to me just how cool the motors are on the inside. It's also amazing that this motor has close to 70,000 miles on it and it is showing zero signs of wear. I have yet to check the valve clearance but the gears are still sharp and perfect... I'm in awe. A true testament to just how bulletproof these VFRs are.
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I may mor may not have forgotten which way to turn bolts to loosen them during the removal process... Righty loosey right? These little bolt removers from lowes, along with a carbide tipped masonry bit made very short work of getting the broken, grade 10 bolts out.
I'm thinking about throwing a coat of paint on the motor before starting to reassemble everything. I am probably going to go either cast aluminum silver or a nice black. Dupli-Color has an engine paint with ceramic in it and VHT has multiple engine enamel choices as well.
Who has painted their V-Four? What was the result and how did it last?
I painted mine with engine paint silver but i havnt ran it so its not been baked on. Ill probably soda blast it and repaint it with a two part epoxy based paint. The valve covers i painted black got all flakey and looked like ass.
I havnt installed it but it will work fine. Just block off the external cooler ports and leave out the little tubes that go to them. Vf750c and vfr = same engine block (casting and some machining at least), same oil pan, same pickup tube, same oil feed tube, same water pump, ect. You could theoreticlly use the vf750c sprocket cover and pushrod for a cable clutch conversion (but you lose the speedo pickup).
No they are cable. But the vf cover is all chrome and stupid looking. If someone were to dechrone it and possibly trim it down a bit it might look better on a vfr. Plus the cable holder bolts to either the block mount or the head i cant remember. But i think it has to be in between the engine and the frame. Ill hafta look at my buddys bike again to be sure.
Here's a 1995 VF750C sprocket cover that shows the cable attachment point, and looking at the pics of the inside of it, it would indeed be close to a bolt-on, you might even be able to add a hole to incorporate the speedo drive unit. Definitely worth further investigation.
When I first read about cable clutch conversions (done by Durbahn in Germany) I thought the same thing - the reason is that a cable clutch gives vastly superior feel over a hydraulic clutch. In addition you lose the extra weight of the hydraulic bits.
Durbahn's conversion kit for VFRs is beautifully made, but quite expensive.
Pump right now. standard tank. Its the white elephant.
With RC tanks costing the price of a small country. not too fussed... Am not trying to build an rc copy... no ty. More about using wot we got first.
New battery weights the same as the pump/filter give or take 30g so be nice to get rid. But thats coupled with tank at the moment.
Would drilling a breather hole in top of tank work for gravity fed? might consider chucking pump then..but i guess there may be tap or carb flooding issues?
I've been running gravity feed with the factory unmodified tank for some time. Fuel pump on these bikes is useless, just one more thing to fail.
Have you run your bike at the track? Just wondering if its an issue under hard cornering/braking etc. I'm pretty sure the tank is vented already, so I don't think an additional breather is necessary. I can't imagine there being a flooding issue whilst the bike is running with gravity feed. I know there have been issues with NC30 taps leaking when the bike has been sitting causing flooding and eventually engine damage(from fuel filling up the sump), don't know if that would be an issue with the 750 tap though.
So... I have been hunting for a decent gauge set that will work well with most of the factory wiring and isn't ginormous since I'll be running this with no fairings. It seems I have two choices:
The Trail Tech Vapor, which I'm not really a fan of...
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Or there's the Koso gauges which I like but are pricey...
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So, I am thinking of ripping apart one of the gauge sets I currently have from the VFR and reorganizing them into a nice compact little set that will definitely work with the factory wiring.
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Here's the layout I think I'm going to go with.
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it's much more compact that the stock gauges.
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I do think I will make a much smaller version for the fuel and temp gauge as well and figure out a nice spot to mount them as well.
Has anyone done anything like this on here before? I did a search and went through about 8 pages of search results with no luck.
NakedViffer I've been running gravity feed with the factory unmodified tank for some time. Fuel pump on these bikes is useless, just one more thing to fail.
Thats promising.. might have to take u up on it....
Remember my spanner telling me the pump was just for safety shut off in the event of something happening, that was some years ago?
But then remember a thread here was mentioning fuel pressure and scavenging fuel from tank when low?? Handy also?
Have similar questions about extreme braking on track etc? Will be right back on that power and want good fuel availability?
Bike in rebuild mode now with a new rear ally sub frame .. the rear is not plumbed in yet as im to finish a carbon nose fit.
Dont want to change pump and COPs at same time... Unless am gonna stick me neck out...
Na just decided, pump first test- with normal coils
COPs maybe after..they are here and ready once basics are plumb.
NakedViffer I've been running gravity feed with the factory unmodified tank for some time. Fuel pump on these bikes is useless, just one more thing to fail.
Thats promising.. might have to take u up on it....
Remember my spanner telling me the pump was just for safety shut off in the event of something happening, that was some years ago?
But then remember a thread here was mentioning fuel pressure and scavenging fuel from tank when low?? Handy also?
Have similar questions about extreme braking on track etc? Will be right back on that power and want good fuel availability?
Bike in rebuild mode now with a new rear ally sub frame .. the rear is not plumbed in yet as im to finish a carbon nose fit.
Dont want to change pump and COPs at same time... Unless am gonna stick me neck out...
Na just decided, pump first test- with normal coils
COPs maybe after..they are here and ready once basics are plumb.
You really need to do up a thread on your bike KGS, one of my favorites on here.
I've not had it on a track, but when I ride, I really ride. Compared to a lot of people, I torture by bike, and I live in the mountanis so its been through tons of hard cornering, braking, wheelies, full throttle launches. I've never had it act like it was starving for fuel except on occasion when I run it dry. And when its out, thers nothing left in the tank. The pressure differential inside the carb can act like a siphon and keep drawing fuel as long as theres no restriction on the flow.
I recently worked on a 67 Buick special, and it had been running and driving for years, until the fuel filter got changed, couldn't figure out why it wouldn't run.. Well it turned out someone bypassed the mechanical fuel pump on the block and had it coming straight from the tank. Which is onviously lower than the carb atop the v8. It was just apparently full in the line when it got hooked up and kept pulling it up as needed. But once the line was empty the carb vacuum wasn't strong enough to pull it back out from the tank.
So even though the petcock is close to carb level, it gets a great feed. One thing probably worth mentioning is that I don't run a fuel filter, and that helps it flow freely. I've heard of some guys running with no pump and a filter, but theres no telling how hard they were pushed.
Has anyone done anything like this on here before? I did a search and went through about 8 pages of search results with no luck.
a few times.
first here with a 3rd gen, using just carbon sheet and a few led's. Was not the best, but ran well and was cheap.
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Then was the 4th gen which was the best look. Using CBR fireblade clocks.
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Have now trimmed the speedo similar to the HRC RC30 manual, which gives a better factory finish.
not sure what to do about idiot lights yet....will see. There are actually three round spaces i could drill into and mount a light in each. They mount the foam. Visible in pic there.
Could only really use a green neutral, a red oil pressure and a reserve fuel lamp.
kostritzer
You really need to do up a thread on your bike KGS, one of my favorites on here.
cheers,
will see how my net connections go and how soon i can find time to put bike 2gether...
am 2 busy robbing everyone elses ideas at the moment.. haha
Just fyi, i looked at my buddies magna and the cable mount bolts to the block right where our frame bolts to the engine. With a little engineering one could just make one to go on the outside of our frame and be just fine.
jeremy77So... I have been hunting for a decent gauge set that will work well with most of the factory wiring and isn't ginormous since I'll be running this with no fairings.
The CBR600F4i dash goes onto the VFR pretty easily.
Haven't done much on the VFR lately. The gasket kit I ordered came and was marked for the VFR750F but it was just wrong... The gaskets were for some V-four but not the VFR... A least not a 4th gen.
So, now I need to find a gasket set that does fit and see if I have money to cover it while I am waiting for the refund to process back to my PayPal account.
jeremy77So... I have been hunting for a decent gauge set that will work well with most of the factory wiring and isn't ginormous since I'll be running this with no fairings.
The CBR600F4i dash goes onto the VFR pretty easily.
Can the O.P. please post a picture of the area right behind the radiator on his bike? I'd like to see what kind of room there is behind that between the head and valve cover.
Can the O.P. please post a picture of the area right behind the radiator on his bike? I'd like to see what kind of room there is behind that between the head and valve cover.
Mine is completely disassembled right now... maybe somebody else? IIRC there isn't much space between the fan and cylinder cover.
one thing you should note is that i have removed a large plastic shroud cover thing between the air box and radiator. this is a third gen, but i can't imagine that there would be any real differences from the forth gen.
I could probably do something with some RC stuff. Those motors weigh nothing, are pretty skinny, and can spin plenty fast. Just need a way to limit current to a set point, and hook it into the existing fan switch.
Maybe the magna has a smaller fan, plus the shround can be cut down a little if the object is to just make the coil packs fit. That magna radiator defiantly looks smaller and would be a better fit for a steet fighter. The stock rad is too big.
Two WeMoTec microfans would probably flow just as much air as the stock fan. Probably more.
Disagree on those being a possible solution. There are a bunch of big issues with this. One is that you will need to keep the fan blades as close to the radiator as possible to ensure air is being sucked through the radiator and not just around the side. The other is that an RC brushless motor requires a 3-phase power source normally provided by the ESC. I can get a motor and prop that would be a bit thicker than an inch I think. Mounting wouldn't be too hard either. Might be able to get a programmable ESC and set it so when it receives power to turn on to a set level, which will prevent the RC motor from drawing too many amps and frying something.
The EDF you listed will be much thicker, and being ducted, will only pull air from a small area. There are no off the shelf EDFs that are thin that I know of.
A better solution would be to find a DC motor and eliminate the ESC.
Im talking about blowing the fans onto the radiator not drawing through it. And id probably just use a small dc brushed motor and not worry about an outrunner brushless.
Still collecting parts and tools to finish this project. I am planning to do my own powdercoating to save money and to learn something new. Here's what I've added to the garage to make this project a reality.
My oven, Craigslist for $60... I added casters to make it easier to move.
The new cord for the oven, so I can plug it in the laundry room... $65. Strikes me funny that it cost me more to plug the oven in than I paid for the oven.
I'm a little nervous about my compressor, it's pretty small... Not sure it will keep up on the blaster. But we will have to see. I plan to start coating some small parts this week, then I'll fashion an extension for the oven to do the wheels and frame. I'm pumped!
I forgot to mention that I also picked up a bellypan to cover the front headers. I'm pretty excited, because I think the lines are going to work perfectly with the CBR1000RR tail fairing.
All parts were blasted with 80 grit glass beads and wiped down with acetone. The parts with paint were stripped with Aircraft stripper, then blasted. The glass beads are pretty slow to remove paint.
The obligatory before pic:
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After... I masked off the splined hole for the clutch lever:
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I thought about masking the machined areas on the clip ons, but decided not to. In the end they still fit on the fork uppers just fine. I will have to run a tap through the threads to clean them out, but the powder didn't get too deep.
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Here's the brake side reassembled:
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I'm feeling pretty happy with how they're turning out with my home powder coating setup! I'm using a 20% gloss black that is UV resistant from www.powderbuythepound.com. There is almost a slight metallic look to it.
I thought about doing a detailed how-to write up for someone else wanting to do the same, but a lot of the info is on here already. If anyone is interested, let me know and i'll throw down a write up on what I did.
Alright, now I'm officially on board with the DIY powder coating thing and have to start sourcing the necessary equipment and appliances. I have you to blame for making those parts look so good!
If you're on a budget and want an inexpensive gun tat gets the job done... The craftsman gun from amazon is a really great deal at $35. It's completely self contained, no compressor needed.
No doubt! I found myself wandering the garage looking for what else I could powder coat.
I've also been looking at this product LIQUID 2 POWDER that you mix with your powder, spray onto any material (not just metal) and then bake like powder... I wonder if it will work with fiberglass. I'd love to powder coat my tail fairing and bellypan too!
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![[image: Posted Image]](http://cdn.cheapcycleparts.com/images/HO/14MZ5RE1/MZ54F3100A.png){kind=link}
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