Vtec electrical problems info post

dutchinterceptor, Feb 15 2006, 03:37 PMI don't know if this is related or not but the other day I stopped for gas.  Turned the switch on and the lights flickered then stayed on but I didn't have any readout on either screen.  I turned it to off then back on and it was just fine.  I haven't been able to ride much since that happened.  I have occasionally smelled that "strange burning smell" though.  Checked the wiring and fuse but it looks ok so far.

HispanicSlammer, Feb 15 2006, 03:55 PMI have backups of the database dateing back to before I started the huge purge.  I may be able to rebuild the post but its raw data so it will be a biaotch. I start my workweek tonight (graveyard 12 hrs for the next 3 nights) so dont expect it any time soon, and well I need to get motivated to do it too LOL.  Ya know pych myself up to do grunt dirty data work.

I had to get midevil after Robert (the owner of the server I rent space on) fixed the webspace counter, it was saying I was always ok then one day he fixed it and all of a sudden I was 300mb over the limit LOL opps howdathappen?

dutchinterceptor, Feb 15 2006, 04:45 PMMy apologies...it's gone.

We lost all the great and important info related to the Vtec's wiring harness problems and I wanted to try and rebuild all the great info that was in the old post that included problems, cures, dealing with your Dealer's and Honda related to repairs. Contact numbers to file complaints with American Honda, customer service contacts and all the results members had with fighting to get these repairs done by Honda even when their bike was out of warranty.

Please post your past problems and stories here related to our 6th Gens wiring harness issues. All this old info was used many times with service repair numbers provided by other members that help them convince both Honda and their Dealer that this is a common problem and should be repaired. Even pushing for a Recall through the NHSTA(?) or whatever.

The only purpose here is to help anyone with future problems and repairs related to Vtec wiring harness issues. Please help! :thumbsup:

Thanks.

We lost the post "My first electrical problem" and " something's burning" among other's. i f you posted in any of these please re-post.

PS Vtec bashing not welcome from non-Vtec owners! Thanks <_<

I have backups of the database dateing back to before I started the huge purge. I may be able to rebuild the post but its raw data so it will be a biaotch. I start my workweek tonight (graveyard 12 hrs for the next 3 nights) so dont expect it any time soon, and well I need to get motivated to do it too LOL. Ya know pych myself up to do grunt dirty data work.

I had to get midevil after Robert (the owner of the server I rent space on) fixed the webspace counter, it was saying I was always ok then one day he fixed it and all of a sudden I was 300mb over the limit LOL opps howdathappen?

I have the dreaded melted 30 amp fuse holder in the battery harness syndrome. An 03 that has under 20k and live a pampered life...

I didn't want to screw around -- and because I wil not trust the bike to some unreliable boy-mechanic I have opted to replace the main harness and the battery subharness. Plus, I felt comfortable digging into the electrics--i've had plenty of experience chasing electrons on my beemer. I bought the harnesses from Ron Ayers--alot cheaper than the dealer and most other online parts places.

I'm just about done--I haven't been in a hurry-a few hours every weekend so I can do it right--dielectric grease and tape in all the right places--I hope. But I have to tell ya--It is a PITA snaking the harness even with all the major ( and alot of minor) stuff off the bike.

I've ordered a Centech AP-1 fused bus to connect all of the accessories (jastek plugs for GPS and heated vest; heated grips; motolight diving lights, autocomm...) , and now I can position all of the relays better since I've got the bike completely apart. Oh, I am installing a C volt digital voltmeter before I'm done...

I'll give a report when I'm done and offer any help (thats if I put all this sh*t back together right)..... :huh:

From: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...topic=16632&hl=

LaneyIf your harness and fuse looked like this --

[image: friedfuseholder.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

[image: fusefry.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

then it seems it's a common problem. 

Ask the guy at the shop to tell you which other models, Honda or otherwise, get corroded and end up looking like this after 2 years and 26K miles.

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ProMedFrom: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...topic=16632&hl=

Thanks for the link ProMed ! :huh:

Please contact Customer Service at Honda to complain ! Many VFRd members have had their bike repaired by Honda even with out being under Warranty, but it takes some pushing and being able to show 5, 10, 30 samples of other VFR owners having the same problems will help back you up.

I would love to have a list of every Vtec owner who has had these elec. issues and their bike Vin #'s to pass around to new members to bring to their Dealers and send to Honda when trying to get a repair covered.

Posted this in other thread yesterday - bu tif you want to keep consistent - heres my $.02......

I have an 02' and after I saw Bailey's post about his burned up 30 amp fuse, I checked mine. HEre's how mine looked:

[image: DSC03104.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

[image: DSC03102.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

ANd here's how I fixed it - :

Lead from the battery:

[image: DSC03109.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

30 AMp fuse with 10 guage wire:

[image: DSC03108.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

I used heat shrink tubing, fibre loom for heat protection, and dielectric grease on the connectors. HAsn't been a problem since.

I will be pulling the BLue connector at the front apart before riding season - make sure the ground wire is still good.

Here is the NHTSA web site(thanks to another member)

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems...laintsearch.cfm

I think every Vtec owner that has had the Headlights shut off or the bike Die in mid ride should file a Safety complaint with the NHTSA, because either issue is a major Safety concern and should be documented.

This will help all Vtec owner's down the road and help get Honda's attention. :huh:

Now if like me your wires just melt and the bike might not start, that's not really a Safety issue and so it may not help to file.

rocket0606Question:  is it the green wire at the bottom edge?  It is green with a silver stripe?  should it go to ground?  I know that some mentioned that they just jumpered around it. I was trying to go one better.

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Green w/black stripe, green w/pink stripe, and solid green are the only colors in the entire wiring harness that go to a chassis ground (i.e. to the battery negative). Anything else is a signal ground and I wouldn't recommend connecting that to the chassis ground, as some very bad things might happen to your ECU if you did...

Chris

Thanks, the blue connector looks fine.

Okay, weird thing. the 30 amp fuse that I had replaced with the radio shack literally melted today after I added the additional ground wire.

2 changes I made today:

1. I ran a ground wire to the wiring ground connectors where they bolt on the chassis.

2. Moved my heated grips to draw from the headlight power 12 v.

3. Dielectric grease everything I could get to with all fairings off.

Either of those changes could suddently make the main 30 amp melt with the aftermarket radio shack special?

ViffedGreen w/black stripe, green w/pink stripe, and solid green are the only colors in the entire wiring harness that go to a chassis ground (i.e. to the battery negative).  Anything else is a signal ground and I wouldn't recommend connecting that to the chassis ground, as some very bad things might happen to your ECU if you did...

Chris

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Viffed, Feb 19 2006, 12:50 PMGreen w/black stripe, green w/pink stripe, and solid green are the only colors in the entire wiring harness that go to a chassis ground (i.e. to the battery negative).  Anything else is a signal ground and I wouldn't recommend connecting that to the chassis ground, as some very bad things might happen to your ECU if you did...

Chris

dscottf, Feb 20 2006, 12:03 PMCould anyone elaborate on this? I just added DualStar grips through a relay. Both the relay and the grips are grounded to the frame (is that a chassis ground?)

What is a "signal ground"? why would a "chassis ground" do very bad things to an ECU?

Thanks

Alrighty then, electrical woes (I'll post pics when I get home):

2002 VFR, one owner, meticulously maintained by one dealer and garage stored. Current milage: 50K.

08/2002: VFR dies at 80mph on the FL turnpike. Culprit: worn insulation on the front wiring harness (left side headlight relay) shorted and blew the main fuse.

04/2004: VFR dies at 50mph on US1 in the FL Keys. Culprit: blue connector between the front and main wiring harnesses shorted and melted together at the ECM ground wire connector pin.

05/2005: VFR dies at 30mph on Tarawa Road. Culprit: fried ECM. ECM has a visible bulge and crack which is too hot to touch and is oozing smoke. Crack is at the ECM ground wire connector pin on the ECM.

06/2005: VFR dies pulling into the driveway. Culprit: ECM ground wire is fried somewhere in the main wiring harness.

02/2006: Short wire at the 30amp fuse holder of the battery wiring harness is discolored and brittle.

The bike was dropped off at the dealership for repairs since that 30amp fuse holder wire is ready to go. Everything has checked out (read: they can't find the cause of the electrical woes) so my dealer asked if I wanted the wiring repaired or replaced. Duh. They're calling Honda today to fight to get me all new wiring harnesses (Front, Main and Battery) since they know this bike has been an electrical nightmare. I'll update this post when I hear back from them today or tomorrow.

I would be interested to see a count of those VFR owners who have had electrical woes compared to those who did/did not do the stator upgrade. I'm wondering if the wiring on the VFRs can't handle the higher output from the stator upgrade.

Hav <--- knows nothing about electrical systems

HispanicSlammer, Feb 20 2006, 03:37 PMhav were you also the victim of a fastener rubbing against the harness chafing off the insulation and shorting out something too?

rocket0606Okay, weird thing.  the 30 amp fuse that I had replaced with the radio shack literally melted today after I added the additional ground wire.

2 changes I made today:

1.  I ran a ground wire to the wiring ground connectors where they bolt on the chassis. 

2.  Moved my heated grips to draw from the headlight power 12 v.

Either of those changes could suddently make the main 30 amp melt with the aftermarket radio shack special?

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My money'd be on #2, especially if you were using the heated grips and didn't have them wired quite right. Are you using a relay setup off the battery to power the heaters (using the headlight wiring to turn the relay on), or are you drawing power directly from the headlight wiring? The first shouldn't cause a problem, but the second definately will. The headlights do have their own 20A fuse, but that fuse gets it's power through one of the 30A main fuses. Have you tried the highbeams with the grip heaters on? If you're using the headlight wires to power the grip heaters directly, this will pop the fuse, as there isn't enough headroom in either the fuse or the wire to support the added load.

Check your wiring setup and report back, more information is needed!

For those that are wondering about chassis (power) grounds and signal grounds, they're quite easy. Chassis grounds are used to carry large amounts of power, while signal grounds are primarily used for low current applications, or to eliminate noise and interference. Most things on the bike use a chassis ground, but some things dont. Most of the "sensors" use a signal ground, for instance. The fuel injectors have special controls too, they get a constant +12V and instead have their ground connections switched off and on by the ECU.

Another oddity you may enounter if you work on the horn system of most cages: They use a switched ground in the steering wheel to actuate a relay, which in turn switches the positive side of the horn circuit... smile.gif

Chris

baileyrock, Feb 20 2006, 11:20 PMHey Hav, you back in the States?

-- SNIP --

From what I understand the Alt. up-grade only starts charging sooner in rpms and does Not add/increase system output at all!  huh.gif

HispanicSlammerhav were you also the victim of a fastener rubbing against the harness chafing off the insulation and shorting out something too?

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Bailey's right -- that was the 08/2002 short. Front wiring harness was rubbing against the front fairing stay where a sharp edge rubbed the insulation off and shorted.

I also just remember that in between the actual failures I had the bike in to the dealer to look at the bike kept shutting off at speed and the bike running but with no headlights. I'm assuming these were precursors to an actual failure and would have to check my service records for exact dates.

Hav

Here are the promised pics:

08/2002 - Worn insulation in front wiring harness

[image: short.wiringharness.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

04/2004 - Blue connector fused so the dealer bypassed it

[image: OriginalDealerFix.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

05/2005 - ECM ground wire fried in the main wiring harness. I took the original dealer splice and grounded it to the frame.

[image: GitmoFix02.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

Unfortunately I forgot to take pics of the ECM and I didn't have my camera on me at the dealer when I found the 30-amp fuse wire. I'll have them save the part so I can take photos when I pick it up.

Hav

I have an extended warranty until 2007, so I haven't paid a cent for any of these repairs (including my dealer picking the DOA bike up off the side of the road twice). I have a good dealer that I go to so I rarely have to fight about anything.

Most of the problems were fixed with a bit of solder and some bullet connectors. The front wiring harness was snipped, spliced and wrapped in electrical tape. The front/main harness connector meltdown was snipped and spliced. The fried ECM ground wire was spliced and grounded directly to the frame.

The ECM was replaced, although Honda America refused to pay for this and I never got a good explanation as to why. My dealer picked up the cost of the expensive arse ECM so I didn't ask too many questions.

My dealer is trying to get approval to replace every wiring harness in the bike (front, main and battery) since this is a recurring electrical issue that I'm getting tired of dealing with. I haven't heard from them regarding Honda America's response to the request. They did warn me, however, that Honda has become really bad about approving warranty repairs and to expect a fight from Honda since the dealer is unable to pinpoint the cause of the problem. My existing call/complaint to Honda (and the NHSTA) may help with this but they asked me to be prepared to have to call and bitch at Honda directly.

Paul

jhughI took a quick look through all the post so far and it looks like the '02 model has the most responses as having electrical harness problems. Is this just because it's been out there longer or was there something different about the "early" VTECs?

Also, it would be interesting to see if others (outside the US) are having the same problems. If I remember right, Honda sells a lot more VFRs in Europe than they do in the US.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I compared all of the part numbers for all the wiring harnesses, battery, etc. between 2002 and 2005 models. The only changes were the part number for the battery was updated several times, no other wiring had changed according to the fiche at Ron Ayers.

I am very glad that Baily brought this issue back to life as I had never noticed it before. After reading the initial posts in this and another thread on this topic I found my fuse was melted and the wires were very burned and brittle. I replaced that part with new 10g wire and some wire loom, and am working on cleaning and greasing all my electrical connections. I still have yet to do the ones under the front fairing but have the sides and rear done.

I also just had to replace my R/R as it was putting out 16+ volts over 5500rpm with the brights on which may have contributed to the melted fuse. The bike is a 2002 with 32K miles, I bought it in September 05 with 14K miles.

A quick update: still waiting on Honda America to "diagnose" the problem via pictures they requested from my dealer. No ETA and no info beyond being in limbo waiting for them to say whether they will replace all the wiring under warranty. I made sure Honda America knew I was pissed, didn't like not having an ETA, fully expected this to be a warrantied repair and that any unsatisfactory ruling on their part would result in a loyal VFR owner riding an FZ1 come the end of the year.

I don't think it made a dent.

[uPDATE] It did make a dent. The next time I called back I was forwarded directly to a guy at Honda Customer Service whom I now get to speak to each time. The first time I called him he apologized for the delay, etc. and promised me an answer by the end of day. Of course that was a week ago. I found out on Saturday that HCS wanted my dealer to resend the pictures (which I guess HCS somehow managed to lose) which my dealer has resent. Now it's back in HCS' realm. Back in limbo.

[uPDATE 03/15/2006] HCS is full of crap. I've had my dealer send them the requested photos three times in three weeks and HCS says they're not getting them and that my dealer is unresponsive to their requests for the photos. I had my dealer send them for a fourth time and had them CC me on the email and I've received the attached photos fine. I've posted them on my website and placed a call to HCS asking them to call me to confirm the've received the photos. If they haven't gotten them I'll make them download them off my site. One thing I did notice is that the photos have pictures of the entire battery tray (I'm assuming to see if I have any electrical accessories hooked up) and of the headlights (I'm assuming to see if I'm running high-draw aftermarket bulbs). If I get any flack from HCS I'm gonna be annoyed.

(I find that the longer I go without having a bike to ride the more annoyed I become.)

Paul

[3/16/06] Honda finally said they had received the photos and would look into them. Honda had been blaming my dealer for improperly sending the photos and being unresponsive to their calls and requests. I let my dealer know that Honda had the photos and my dealer let me know that the owner of the dealership had called the regional support manager directly to complain.

[3/17/06] I got a call first thing this morning from Honda Customer Service... every wiring harness in the bike is being replaced under warranty. Main, front and battery wiring harnesses. The parts have been ordered and I'll have my bike next weekend.

Paul

Here are my symptoms and solutions...

Symptom: ABS light flashing when brights are turned on

Solution: New R/R

More Info: Read code from ABS ? charging system problem. Discovered 16+ volts when brights were on above 6K RPM. Normal voltage when brights were off.

Symptom: Idle would drop to 600 for a few seconds and engine would stop.

Solution: Replaced 30 amp fuse and wire at battery

More Info: This would happen very randomly, only at idle. Not 100% sure the fuse is what fixed it, but it has not happened since it was replaced.

Kanadian Ken30 AMp fuse with 10 guage wire:

[image: DSC03108.jpg] border='0' alt='user posted image' />

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Hey Ken, that's the exact same fuse block I bought today from "Autobarn" here in Australia. I think it was "Narva" brand.

I'm curious how you ran your wiring though. The Narva fuse block has two short wires coming off it - did you solder joint these to longer wires?

Kaldek

Right. I've fitted my replacement fuseblock tonight and encountered no problems. I'm not sure what other people have done but I used the existing Red/Yellow wire from the battery and spliced that into the wire provided with the fuse block. I could not remove the wires from the connector that connects to the ECM (and other electrical subsystems), so I just cut it out and directly spliced this wire into the fuse block as well.

I'll have to attack it later with some connectors (and sometime other than a weeknight!) and tidy the job up.

As for symptoms, my bike was cutting out whilst riding, and it started happening yesterday afternoon on the way home from work. No EFI fault codes lit up because the symptoms were of the EFI system losing power completely, then coming back. If I stopped the engine would idle at very low revs then stall unless I gave it some gas. My existing 30-amp fuse block was yellowed, with burn marks in places. The lead from the fuseblock into the connector (to the ECM/front of the bike) was extremely stiff and brittle, and so was its sheath. Today when I managed to get to work I noticed that this fuseblock was extremely hot. My fuse was also partially melted.

My only concern now is whether I have fixed the problem or merely moved it from one location to another. I hope that the old fuseblock wasn't acting as the pressure release point in the system - and now some other weak part will now suffer?

Kaldek

Summary of Symptoms:

- Bike running but no headlights. Eventually the headlights would come back on.

- Engine dies for no reason. Sometimes she started right back up, other times she wouldn't start for a few minutes. Eventually she wouldn't start at all. =)

- Bike won't start and there's a buzzing coming from behind the dash (one or more of the various relays back there).

- FI warning light comes on and the fuel pump does not prime.

Fix #1: Spliced the green wire (ECM ground wire) at the blue connector (front to main wiring harness connector) which had melted together. The bike ran fine for a while.

- The symptoms described above came back only the ECM now had a hot spot (complete with bulge in the plastic and cracks in the gel sealant around the connectors) and was slowly oozing wisps of smoke (from the crack in the gel sealant).

Fix #2: Replaced the ECM. The bike ran fine for a while.

- The symptoms described above came back. After a really long time testing every electrical component under the sun (per the Honda Service Manual) I diagnosed a broken ECM ground wire (the same old green bastard from the first time) in the main wiring harness.

Fix #3: I grounded the ECM ground wire directly to the frame bypassing the wiring harnesses completely.

I didn't wait for the problem to recur. My bike is now having every wiring harness in the bike replaced. When I get the bike back (sometime this decade) I'll let you know if the symptoms come back. No one at my dealer or Honda America can tell me what was (still is?) causing this problem.

Hav

vfrqqqMan, this post is like 3 years too late for me.  I had my 30A fuse burn up long ago and already went through the issues of my headlights/display dying on me in the middle of a ride from a blown fuse.  I ended up taking of the front fairing, jiggling some wires, putting everything back together and now, no problems  <_< .  Never really found the issue but I'm guessing a bad gound in a wiring harness somewhere.  F-ing BS  +1.gif

Some guys had the harness rub through the protective cover (insulation) and short out against the bike, sounds like this might be your problem.

Actually this post was several years old with some fantastic info, but was lost or deleted some time back and I have been trying to get it rebuilt again with the help on members. Very Slow process! :huh:

I have been "away" a while (SNOWBOARDING!) and just got back in the saddle, and on line here since getting the bike back after my ordeal.

I can NOT believe that "my first electrical" post got deleted! that was my original post...

I also have not read all of this thread... sorry, short on time lately.

if you suffer from this crap, be SURE to get honda to fix it!!!! to add to my already long list of gripes... the dealership had my bike over 3 months before they STARTED working on it! that means everyday it sat in the sun outside the garage, bleaching everything! AND THEN? now that I have had the viffer sitting on a charger on and off a few times in the garage, and actually rode it a few times - poof! battery is TOAST!

argh!

replaced... all's well - so, how is everybody's burnt fuses?! :lol:

hope honda takes care of you!

-c

OK, here's my reader's digest version....last November I noticed that the 30 AMP fuse holder was a little discolored, but no melted insulation. My accessories include heated grips, 2 jastek plugs (for garmin-very little draw; and the rear mounted jastek for the heated vest), fork mounted driving lights, autocom...all within the alternators load capacity (yup, I did the math).

The funny thing was--I had the bike in the garage, with a multimeter hooked up to check voltage and @ 2000 rpm the voltage spiked to 18.2 and then the bike died. Fried 30 AMP fuse holder, melted battery harness at the holder and melted fuse. Battery toast. Hmmm, timing is everything.

Now, It's an '03 with an extended warranty, but I didn't want to dick with the worthless dealer ("VFR, thats a Yamaha, right")and with all the accesories on the bike, so I inspected the wiring harness and decided that I could do the main harness swap. I purchased the main and battery harness, RR and Ron Ayers. Battery I got locally.

The swap was a PITA. But I shielded, covered, and dielctric greased the crap out of everything. I mean everything. Plus I took the opportunity to rewire and conolidate the accory wiring with an aux fuse box and install a digital voltmeter....

So, I know I didn't report it, scream about it or poke Honda in the chest--but I didn't need the extra stress--I threw my money and time into it. My choice, but at least I know some pimple face 18 YO excuse for a mechanic touch my bike after waiting for the bike to become sun bleached while waiting for its turn to be worked on....

See ya next week at the Gap. I'll be the one with extra 10 GA wire.....

Putting my engineers hat on for a moment....running hi beams continuously means around 210W (2x50 & 2x55) continuous power draw, which is 17.5A at 12v. Add to this the other lights that are on continuously...2 tail lights, marker lights etc, that adds another 20w. Add to this whatever else is going on and you have at least 20+ A continuous current draw.

There is no way that main fuse wiring is up to carrying that kind of current continuously.

So even of I replace the fuse block, what kind of state is the wiring harness in ?

Maybe time to stop running hi-beams, or wire up a switch to switch of lo-beams for daytime use ???

I guess I should have been more specific==I tried to maintain my load under 25 amps thru my own switchology (never high beams, aux, heated grips and vest on at the same time), etc...

However, I probably was at 25 AMPS load constantly when it was cold and dark....couple that with alot of corrosion, and crappy honda connectors probably fried the harness. I can't explain the RR failure, tho.

HVRLVRI'm interested in this whole thread and the contact numbers for Honda.

Motorcycle Division

American Honda Motor Co., Inc.

P.O. Box 2220

Torrance, CA 90509-2220

Mailstop:100-4W-5B

866-784-1870

Hav

I don't know if this is useful to anyone or myself, but I don't know where else better to post this sort of thing.

Winter '04 I installed Piaa extreeme white same watts as stock bulbs, either low or hi, don't remember which were first.

Summer '04- added the other set of bulbs h4s or h7s, whichever was left.

Fall '04-had stalling and starting probs, which initially went away by unplugging the headlights or headlight fuse. Incidently, the bike revved to approx 4k rpm & consistantly stalled @ that pt before unplugging the headlights.

I returned the Piaas & ran stock bulbs.

The problems of stalling & variably starting got worse w/ time, until unplugging the headlights was of no use.

The alt was already upgraded, but dealer checked that, the RR & replaced the PGM FI unit to no improvement.

Jan. '05- Finally, after at least 2x in the shop, 10 wks & $1,400 of my money, (out of warranty,) the main & sub wiring harnesses were replaced & the bike ran fine for about a year.

Jan '06-Installed Piaa Extreme White H4s & H7s + Piaa's $300 runnning lights

Yesterday the bike choked-up on the highway & regained power, then stalled & restarted, eventually, 3 more times on the last few miles home.

Now I don't know much about electrics, I do still have my old main harness, & know of info on VFRD & a Yahoo Groups: Vtec VFR Owners has some info too, (msgs #9455, 9456, 9457, 10039, 10044, 10045, 10047 are particularly helpful.)

A guy, Francois St. Laurent, from Sport Touring Accessories in Deal's Gap, NC has been helpful in directing me to the yahoo group & w/ some generousity to help out.

Honda customer noservice did nothing the first time around, (when I bugged the heck out of them,) & today I got nowhere fast.

They did send me a replacement saddle bag that leaked, & the new one leaks also.

The dealer told me to contact cust svc & cust svc told me to wk w/ the dealer, back in '04/'05. Even the district svc mgr told me I ought to fix it myself.

I heard from Bill @ Honda cust nosvc that a VFR expert was just down the hall fr him, in his office, but Bill was slow to consult him, I could not speak w/ the VFR expert directly & the regional svc mgr did not have time 4 this owner of 5 Honda motorcycles, 3 of them VFRs and a Civic. The only reason the district svc mgr spoke w/ me, was I noticed him 1 day @ the dealer, wearing a corporate shirt.

I was told today, that I could take my bike to a dealer & they would look into it, but since it is out of warranty, there is little chance of any $ coming through.

So, I am done dealing w/ Honda cust nosvc, have been done w/ the local dealer & pretty much plan 2 wk w/ a local independent shop, & my own research & abilities.

I do run w/ the hi-beams & driving lights on during the day, have had no car port for the past 2+ years & ride in all weather conditions, year round, in GA.

I have been planning a ride from Atlanta 2 Seattle & now have 2 fix the bike again.

I will check the connector, wire guage & fuse holder ideas out w/ my local mechanic, Andre @ The Motorcycle Shop, read some more & try & perm fix it up.

I hope this time I don't need a whole harness, but I am not convinced that replacing the whole thing was necessary the 1st go around.

I am learning the hard way, but it seems that I am not alone.

I am happy 2 answer any questions & appreciate the recreation of this topic.

Hopefully, btw me, my mechanic and some thorough research, all will be well.

Wish me luck this time around, best of luck 2 u all as well, Todd

BTW, Piaa wrote me a letter & swears they know of no other probs & do much R & D work 2 ensure the safe application of their bulbs on motorcycles such as ours.

(Funny thing, Piaa & Honda both don't want 2 take any responsibility for anything.)

HELP!!!

I had my stator & RR replaced & did the 30 amp fuse fix...the holder, connector and thicker wire deal. When I picked up the bike, it stalled completely after 2 miles...I stopped, put it in neutral and restarted the bike...then I went back to the mechanic & it stalled again in less than a mile. My mechanic increased the idle, upon my suggestion, from 1100 to 1250 RPM. I got all the way to Nashville from Atlanta, when it happened again, three times at least, the bike stalled and this time, at night, I could tell that the lights went out & the last time, the dash dimmed, a buzzing came from the console area and it would not restart for a few minutes this time. I still have the PIAA lights, and when on they drop the volts from 14 something to 13 something...but the thing is, I hardly even used them at all today. By the way, Francois helped guide my mechanic with the 30 amp fuse fix...just like in the pictures on the first page of this topic, according to my mechanic, who looked at this topic for the first time, today, at my request. I have not grounded the green wire from the blue connector, but both my mechanic and Francois are not convinced that doing that is called for. I relly hope that my RR & stator are okay...I just shelled out $!000 for all my work and I hoped this would do it. The BBQed previous stator & the current one are both the upgraded ones called for in the Honda service bulletin. I am bound for Vancouver, BC, Canada over the next 6 weeks and tomorrow is Sunday and I have to either fix the bike myself or wait until Monday or Tuesday, in Nashville, for a real mechanic to help me out here, or to talk to Francois and my mechanic in Atlanta.

Anybody got any ideas? I don't know what I am looking for, I have little mechanical knowledge. Francois has many lights and powered accessories and his bike is doing fine with the 30 amp fix for 20,000 + miles now. Anybody know a good mechanic in Nashville or Memphis if I can make it there. Anybody live in the Nashville area? I don't know what to do next, but wait for someone to reply to this post or for motorcycle shops to reopen Monday or more likely Tuesday. Please HELP!!!

Should I cut & splice the green wire together or even ground it to the frame, (though I lack the skills to do the latter, at this point.

By the way, I got caught in bad traffic a few tens of miles out from Atlanta & saw 241 degrees on the temperture gauge. I never saw more than 230 degrees in even the hottest weather, in traffic before. The bike seems to be running hot, and I am wondering if I am cooking my bike. Also, when I spoke to Francois, today, before heading to Tennessee, he said to make sure the kick stand switch, or something like that, was connected properly.

I know this is a bunch of details. I hope I can sort this out with you guys' help. I have planned this trip for much of the past 15 years, am now engaged and this may be the last chance I get to do this until I retire in a few decades...again, HELP!

toddvfrI am now in W. Memphis, AK & my '02 VFR stalled & would not start until it cooled off from about 223 degrees, when it suddenly cut out. The bike ran fine from Nashville to Memphis, TN, until it got hot around town. I had to push it a couple of blocks to a hotel. It was buzzing from the cockpit, dimming the dash & I believe the headlights went out, when it stalled. A few minutes later, at about 167 degrees, it started up just fine. I hope to make it at least to Boulder/Denver CO, where I have my next friend to stay with. He has some cars and bikes and I can hang out while I can try & get it fixed...some more. Any ideas are appreciated. Thanks, Todd

I wish you were still in Nashville were I live and I would help you out. I can almost say with 100% cirtainty that it's the Gound wire issue at the Blue connector!

Go to the nearest Radio Shack or any store that carries elec. stuff(auto parts stores) and buy a foot of wire 10-16 ga. a few connectors and the crimp pliers and be done with it.

Check out my fix a few post earlier! I would just splice into the forward side of the blue connector green ground wire and ground it to the frame for now(trip)!

PM, email or call me!

kevin

my post http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=22332

Here's is some information I Googled that may be relevent to the bad ground issues from:

Dielectric vs. Conductive Grease to Protect Connectors and Grounds.

[Query:] You have repeatedly recommended the application of dielectric grease to underhood wire connections. Isn't the insulating property of such grease counter to the goal of IMPROVING the integrity of electrical connections? I would think that a conductive paste (such as Eastwood's Kopr-Shield) would be better. The only potential downside I can think of is that sloppy application could cause short circuits, but care and common sense should preclude this.

[Response:] This is a good question and one that I have received several times. Yes, it is true that the dielectric grease is non-conductive. However, in the context of connections that carry voltages larger than 1 volt, the grease will not result in a bad connection. The male and female connectors will wipe enough of the grease off at the mating surface so that the electricity will flow just fine. The important part is that there is no chance of the grease creating a conductive path between adjacent terminals in a multi-terminal connector. The main purpose of the grease is to seal the terminals against oxidation which creates a high resistance barrier and moisture and dirt which can result in shorts and ground paths.

For the GROUND connections - especially those in the engine compartment where the ground leads are fastened to aluminum surfaces like the intake manifold, I recommend using one of the conductive greases like OxGuard. These are found at electrical supply houses and are typically used by electricians to treat the end of aluminum electrical cables to prevent the very high resistance aluminum oxide from forming at connections - this was a common cause of house fires. The same high resistance oxide plays havoc with engine management system signal voltages. You can eliminate the problem by cleaning the aluminum surfaces and treating with the conductive grease. Also note that many of the spade type crimp on terminals that are available are made of aluminum. It is very difficult to find copper ones.

I am now on my 3rd R/R on my 6th gen because of voltage of 16 or more. Seems, the voltage is in the 15.3-15.9 range for a couple of months and then it starts going up to 16 -16.5 causing ABS system to freak out and batteries to die, until a new R/R brings it back down to the 15s again.

I have done all of the electrical system test including the stator and all have always checked out fine pointing to a bad R/R, but now that I have had 3 I think the problem lies elsewhere. My only guess is the stator so I am going to get a replacement. Is there any other possible causes that I am not thinking of?

toddvfrWhat other grounding issues is Baileyrock referring to? Where is that post? Keep on ridin, Todd

Todd, check out this new info here about "Ground Clip"

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...30entry263400

Bike - 2003 Non-ABS

Symptoms - Bike dying at idle and at highway speeds

Cure - Fuse panel with additional grounds

Purchased components - Blue Sea 6 connector Fuse Panel, 4 terminal grounding block, 10 gauge marine grade wire in wrap, and 16 gauge marine grade wire.

Additional components I had and used - Wire loom, stainless steel mounting hardware, 1/4" aluminum plate

First I removed fairings, air box, and battery. I then located where I wanted to mount the fuse panel (thank you to those who have already done this mod - I already had a good idea where it was going). I then determined what my bracket was going to be. I made a cardboard template to verify size and positioning. I then layed this out on a piece of 1/4" aluminum plate and cut to size. I drilled and tapped for mounting the fuse panel and terminal block. I used all stainless steel hardware. I used 5/16" carriage bolts to mount the plate to the bike. The square head locks into the slot so no wrench is required on the back side and I used nylon locking nuts to secure. Next was determining how and where to run the wires. I ran along the frame next to the main harness past the engine. I enclosed the wires in loom for protection and neatness. See the following pics:

Mounting location.jpg

Bracket and Fuse Panel.jpg

Wire routing.jpg

Wire routing #2.jpg

Next was adding the additional grounds. From all of my reading, I decided upon this grounding location with multiple frame grounds and the blue connector. I will add more later if needed. I figured these 2 should take a significant load off of the harness and as connections corrode prevent problems. I soldered all of my connections and used waterproof shrink wrap. This shrink wrap has an adhesive inside that seals the connection when shrunk. The blue connector pic only shows the wire stripped, not the additional wire added to it. I forgot to take that picture. See the following pics:

Grounding point.jpg

Blue connector - Additional ground.jpg

Fusel panel with soldered connections.jpg

Everything seemed to go together nicely resulting in a clean install. I rode 100 miles immediately after finishing the install and it has not died or shown any of the prior symptoms. So short term, this has appeared to fix my problem. Below are a few more pictures showing the completed project. You can also see my Speedohealer in the pics. I will be adding satellite radio, a radar detector, and power connection for my Chatterbox very soon through the fuse panel. I will post pics of this as soon as it is completed.

Fuse panel mounted and everything hooked up.jpg

Fusel panel mounted and everything hooked up #2.jpg

Fuse panel mounted and everthing hooked up #3.jpg

Battery and connections.jpg

Also, I had purchased a new 30 amp fuse connection but mine appeared to be in perfect condition showing no problems. So I will keep a close eye on it and replace if necessary. The reason for using marine grade wire is it has a coating or plating on the wire to help prevent corrosion. Please do not hesitate to ask any questions if I did not elaborate enough or if something is not clear. :goofy:

Update 6-18-07 My 30 amp fuse connection fried! I followed posted directions and replaced.

Also added pictures back into this post.

Ahhhhhh! sad.gif

Now I've got a problem that I hope some of you smart guys can help with.

Short version: A week or so ago, on a ride after lunch I started the bike up on the side stand and got FI codes. Rode home and the bike ran fine. Looked the codes up in the shop manual and from my best guess I was getting a 23/24 code which says it an 02 sensor prob. Now I've got the 02 elims so I thought that was wierd. Also, when turning the key to the "on" position the dash would go through it's normal "boot" up procedure but I was hearing the whine from under the tank(fuel pump?) that normally stops.... keep going and not stop?

Was going to pull the fairing and remove 02 elims and re hook up 02 sensors but first I propped the tank up to look at stuff and while the tank was up I did turn on the key and heard all sorts of wired relay type noises under the dash and the headlights were really dim etc.

Checked hoses, wires under the tank and all looked OK but moved a few around thinking that maybe something got pinched. Put the tank back down and turned the key on and all seemed OK......no codes, normal boot up etc.

Today I went riding and all was fine. Stopped for dinner. Started the bike to leave and the same FI codes appeared and saw some smoke coming out on the left side just in front of the tank area :blink: ...the area where that wiring harness and blue connector is you guys were talking about.

Got home with no problems thankfully and am stil getting the FI codes when the side stand is down(while riding the FI light is on constantly).....When turning the key back on I'm still getting that whine from underneath the tank that I described earlier that normally stops when the bike is booting up....but it doesn't stop......hearing some relay clicking sounds also....turning the key on and off gives the same results with the exception that the "whine" did stop like normal one time but didn't all the other times.

I checked the 30amp fuse holder back by the battery and it looks OK.

Does this make any sense to anyone..................help sad.gif

RiemskiDB - Sorry to hear about the problems. Give a little history of your bike. Have you ever had any of the above mentioned electrical problems? Have you added any additional grounds? Have you inspected the blue connector and ECU connectors? Have you added any electrical accessories? So for so many questions, just need to know what we are up against.

Thanks.

The bike's an '03 with about 18,5K miles....no problems up to this point other than an apparent PCIII failure a month or so ago.

I haven't had any of the mentioned electrical problems. No electrical accessories added other than the PC but that has been out of the bike now for a few weeks. I had ridden the bike post PC removal for approx 400 miles with no problems.

I have not added any grounds or anything...bike is stock in that respect.

I have not yet looked at this "blue" connector....but this smoke which was a "translucent white" color was coming up from that general area.

Also, what I'm getting FI code wise is this:

Flaaaaaash Flaaaaaash Flash Flash Flash.........followed by

Flaaaaaash Flaaaaaash Flash Flash Flash Flash.........from the shop manual 's description what I got was a 23/24 code which are 23=Faulty no. 1 o2 sensor heater....24= faulty no. 2 o2 sensor heater.

Wierd as I mentioned becuase I still have my 02 elims installed?

OK here's another wierd thing.

I just lifted the tank. I turned the key to the on position and as I mentioned earlier the dash goes through it's start up procedure but the lights(low beams) are extremely dim and there's a buzzing under the dash and I didn't hear any "whine" from the typical under tank(fuel pump I think) at all.

So, I put the tank back down and turned on the key and everything goes back to normal, ie no FI codes, boot up procedure is normal, etc....................what the heck does this mean?

BTW, I am in no way shape or form an electrical or mechanical genius :lol: ....just thought I'd better make sure that is understood :D

RiemskiThis Grounding Clip. Does anyone have a picture of it or where exactly it is on the bike? I have seen the schematic, but could not actually find it on the bike. I would add an additional ground wire at this point if I could find it. This isn't the same as what I called the grounding point is it(See above pic)?

No, I thought it was in this tread, but it's in another. I'll see if I can find it!

The grey clip with the burned section IS the main ground clip. It's on the main harness about a foot down from the connectors to the front sub harness though it's not deplicted in the wiring diagram anywhere but is on the exploded view (thanks BikeBandit). It isn't a plug, each of the individual device's ground wires (lights, ECU, instruments, etc) are routed to it, with 2 wires (the burned ones at the crispy area of the clip) leading from it to the frame as the final ground. My plan is to give the front sub harness it's own ground, using either 12 or 10 gauge stranded wire and remove 250 watts of load from that central clip...

De Clip

Check out Post 43 for the pic here: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...mp;#entry264323

OK, check this out :blink:

Checked all the connections talked about here and everything looked fine...clean connectors, no burned wires, etc. Everything looked normal.

So, in messing around with all this I tried putting the tank back down and lifting it up as I mentioned before. This time, in both the raised and lowered position all was fine when I turned the key on, i.e. normal boot up, normal sounds, no FI lights/codes.

Then, with the tank in the lowered postion and athe key on, I started moving it slightly from side to side and as I pushed it towards the left, relays started clicking and the dash went wacko. Pushed the tank back to centered and all went back to normal.

So I lifted the tank and while viewing from the right side of the bike, I noticed that the forward tank mount bracket on the tank had a little burned looking area.

[image: gallery_326_40_82880.jpg]

Tank mounting point grounded out on oil hose This is where my tank had rubbed through the oil hose and grounded out

Looked down to the contact point when the tank is lowered and noticed that the little metal tube(now know it's the oil hose) that's covered with a plastic insulation sleeve(for obvious reasons now) was worn through the plastic sleeve and was down to the metal oil hose.

[image: gallery_326_40_462250.jpg]

Oil hose that tank had rubbed through The rubber insulation got rubbed through by the tank creating big problem

So, I taped up the exposed oil hose with some electricians tape, put the tank back down, turned the key on and pushed the tank all over the place and lo and behold.......no problems.

Now all seems to be fine with the tank lowered and the key on as well as with the tank raised and the key on.

Does this make sense to the brain trust here as the cause of my problems? Would this have done it...Im thinking yeah even with my limited knowledge in this area.

I'm so excited I can hardly stand it :P

Not a good thing DB, you tank is looking for a ground and shouldn't be. Grounding the the Linked Brake tube not good either.

Someone else here had thier tank teather cable start acting as a ground to and was getting hot to the touch. You have a ground problem/issue somewhere and the Tank is the current spot.

Did you pull the Blue connector apart or just look at it. My bike just had a ground circut failure that was very tipical of the Blue connector groung wire melting/failure, but my connector was fine! <_< I added the new groung at the blue connector and all was fixed! :thumbsup:

This was my post about it, read through it.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...mp;#entry264323

Also look through this post for the Hot teather cable subject, I think it's in this post.

Das BoneSorry Kev, yes I did pull it apart and it was very clean and all looked good. I also tried (with it reconnected) turning the key on and pulling and moving the wires coming out of the connector around and this created no problems at all. I did the same with all connections that I could see.

Remember, I did not have the bike stalling etc. problems that some of you had. I was just intially getting the FI codes(bike ran normally) and then the incident last night......again with the bike running normally.

With what I've done with sealing up the two areas where the insulation was worn now, when the key is on I'm not getting any problems indicated, ie no codes, normal boot up, normal fuel pump sounds etc.

So, you're saying that the two problems I found were not the only cause of my problem.......that really has me worried :blink: i.e there's no way that these things could have caused my symptoms even though they were not the same as many have had?

aaaaargh sad.gif

IMO Bone, you still have a ground issue that will rear it's head sometime down the road with other problems until you find the cause.

Like I said neither your Tank or tether wire should be carry any load, current or ground, But they "ARE" and that's a problem. Your bike is looking for grounds that it no longer has or that are no longer good enough the carry the load that need to carry. :blink:

I had all the same symptoms of a failed Blue connector ground wire without the failure and I had done all the preventitive measures(I thought) to prevent the problem (cleaning every connection and adding dielcetric grease) but it didn't help. These bikes have a Major design flaw within the ground side of the wiring harness that will eventually fail at some point on every bike IMO.

DB - Part 1 - Okay, I have been reading the service manual and studying the wiring diagram. The fuel pump does work off of the common 'Green" wire ground that passes through the blue connector. It also receives its power through the blue connector via the brown wire. This brown wire then leads to the fuel cut relay which is tied to the engine stop relay which goes to the bank angle sensor which uses the common 'Green" wire ground. Long and the short, everything seems to be tied through the blue connector and the 'Green' ground wire in one way or the other. Someone supposedly figured out the load on this wire which showed it being to small for the application, so I would just add the additional ground between the front harness and the blue connector. What do you have to lose? It won't hurt anything.

Part 2 - The fuel level sensor. This is tied through a different connector which leads to the dash/display panel. This panel is also tied to the 'Green' wire ground which passes through the blue connector - No surprise there. Then the ground wire out of the fuel level sensor appears to be grounded to what I call the 'Grounding point' at the back edge of the tank (See my pics). I would also ground this point directly to the battery.

I still am not sure what exactly is causing your tank to become electrified, but from all of the known electrical problems on these bikes I would add the additional grounds which have solved many issues where the exact cause was never found. If you have a good multimeter, I would think you would be able to test resistance and continuity of different connections which might show some of the problem. But without knowing what these values are really supposed to be, it would just kind of be a guess if a value looked a little off. Just remember that electricity follows the path of least resistance. So I would say your tank is providing less resistance than your ground circuit. Unfortunately, it is even less resistance acting like a spark plug(your gas tank to the metal hose) than your wire circuit. Kind of scary. :blink: So, add some additional ground wires and ride on! :beer:

Das BoneOK, I picked up some ten gauge wire and will re read everyone's posts on the grounding wire fix.

Thanks to Kev, Rienski, and Jeff for all your help :thumbsup:

Hopefully all will be well in VFR wiring/grounding world :P

While you're still messing with this, check voltage and resistance through the tank. I think you need to find the source of voltage to your tank, as a short there sounds like your problem. (Or, a problem, at least.) As BR has emphasized, you should not have power running through the tank. Simply preventing it from going to the frame/oil line or wherever, is masking the problem, not solving it. Also, I agree that the extra grounds on both sides of the blue connector are a good idea. Good luck.

I did not cut my wire in half, but stripped it in the middle with a craft knife and then soldered in my additional wire. This caused some problems for waterproofing this connection. I used some 'Liquid Electrical Tape'. It is a coating that seals and waterproofs the connection. I then wrapped it in regular electrical tape. But if I were to do it again, I would just cut the wire so that you can slip some waterproof shrink wrap onto it. Since you are soldering anyway, it wouldn't matter that you cut it. Also for safety sake and because I like to overkill everything I do, wherever you are running your additional ground wires to, run a wire directly to the battery. This way there is no question about how good your ground source is. :blink:

DB - Could you take a pic of this bulge in the main wire harness? If you think you found it, it would just help narrow my search. Thanks. :beer:

Welp, add me to the club. I initially posted my experience here http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=23632

but thought I'd elaborate for this thread.

I've never had any elec. gremlins. The VFR is a 12/01 build '02 with approx. 10K miles. It had a PCIIIR on it at one time, and still has O2 elims in place.

Thankfully I was only about a mile from home, and as I was turning left onto another road it died. Glad no cars coming.... With the key on the lights worked, and lights on dash came on. There was no FI light and the whirring fuel pump priming noise was absent.

After reviewing the issues in this thread, I had a look at the 30 amp fuse block and found this [image: gallery_935_768_266266.jpg]

My blue connecter up front seems fine and comes apart nicely, and has no discoloration.

I'm not too keen on battling with the dealership to get the wiring harness replaced out of warranty, while it sits and sits, either.

So I'm thinking I'm no electrician, but I could prob. put a diff. fuse block in, if it wasn't too difficult - perhaps some one could tell me some of the specifics of where to splice the new larger gauge wire in at, and whether I should add the green wire ground up front too. THere is a ton of diffuse info in this thread but nothing seems to put all the steps together for a novice like myself smile.gif

ToastR - See page 4 - Post#113 on this topic. I did a complete write up with pics of adding in the grounds. The only thing not there is the 30amp fuse because mine is currently fine. But this is pretty self explanatory and spoke of earlier in the post. Once I find the grounding clip and add a ground to this point, I will update my post with those instructions as well.

"I need a VERY simple explanation of how to check the possible current through the tank stuff you suggested."

Set the meter to volts dc. Check a couple of known things as a test and practice. For instance, put the red lead on the batt pos and the black lead on the batt neg to get battery voltage. You should see 12v + or - about 1.5. Switch the leads and you should see the same voltage with a (-) . With the red lead on the pos terminal of the battery, put the black lead to various metal surfaces on the bike. This will show you what is a good ground. You should see very close to battery voltage with a good ground. This is because the battery negative terminal is grounded to the frame.

Then, put one lead on the tank where it was touching the line, and the other end to ground as just determined. (The neg post of the batt, or any bare metal part on the frame, engine, etc.) The lead on the tank needs to touch bare metal as was present when you found the problem. Do this first with the key off. You should see no voltage. Next test the same with the key on and run switch to "run". Finally, test with the bike running. You should not see voltage during any of these tests, although I suspect you may after hearing your problem description. If you see a reading it means there is a short in/at the tank. This means that a power source (to the fuel pump, sensor, etc.) is getting from the wire or the component to the tank itself. That electricity will seek the path of least resistance, which apparently it found to your oil line (or whatever line was rubbed through.) I would do these checks before you add the new grounds, if you haven't already done them.

So, what do you do if there is voltage through the tank? Unplug the connections to the tank one at a time until voltage goes away to find the source.

Good luck; post again if you run into questions.

MQ

Das BoneOk, thanks.

You're saying that I should also run a wire to the battery ground as well as the one we've all been speaking about.....OK, so where sould this wire run to the battery ground from?

Also mq105 or anyone else, I need a VERY simple explanation of how to check the possible current through the tank stuff you suggested.

I do have a multi meter but have no clue as to 1) what setting it should be on, 2) where I will attach the two probes from the multi meter, 3) what I will be looking for in terms of the multi meter's reading and what it will mean.

Sorry for my lack of knowledge on this stuff....so step by step explain it if possible like I know nothing :P

Riemski,

I will try and get a pic for you of that area...don't know how it will come out as it's dark/shadowed, and kind of tight in there. When I got home later I'll see if I can get something for you B)

Thanks again all

The wire should run from the negative battery terminal to wherever your additional ground wire terminates. So you have your new wire connected to the wire at the blue connector and wherever you chose to ground that(I would assume a frame bolt - I used a terminal block), attach from that same point(frame bolt) to the wire that goes to the battery. This just ensures that the ground is "perfect". A frame ground should be adequate, but this eliminates the 'should'.

To add and compliment mq105's post -

Multimeter - Okay, now I am no expert, but know enough to be dangerous. Read your manual from your meter to get it set to the right functions. It is different from brand to brand.

To check voltage through the tank. Lift the tank or make sure it is not grounding through your steel line(What has currently been your path of least resistance). Set the meter to measure voltage on a 12 volt or lower scale. Red wire from the meter on the tank(make sure you get to bare metal - maybe your burnt/arced spot would be a good place) and black wire from the meter to ground(Negative battery terminal). If you have any voltage, it is showing a poor ground.

Continuity test - (Just checks that the circuit is complete - no broken wires, etc.) Set the meter to test continuity. Generally just a beep or tone will be emitted from your meter if the connection/circuit is complete/good. Unplug the fuel pump and fuel level sensor from the gas tank. Then from the ground wires of these connections check for continuity. Red wire from the meter in ground wire of plug and black wire from the meter to ground(negative battery terminal). If you get a tone, then you know no wires are broken, but it still does not mean you have a great connection.

Now check resistance. Use the same connections as you did during the continuity test, but with the meter set to check resistance. Now this is what I don't know what the values really should be, but if one or the other of these is significantly different from the other, I would think the one of higher value is the one causing your problem. Because the high resistance is causing it to look for another path, hence your tank to the line arcing. But this is a questionable test as one may be going through many more connections thus raising resistance. So I am not 100% sure of the accuracy of this test.

This was a brief instruction, as I don't really want to write a book here. Hope it is enough to get you started anyway. :blink:

Ok here's a couple of pics of what I think is this "ground connector". You need to have the tank up and possibly the left fairing off(mine's off now so not sure how visible this area is with fairing on) to be able to see it. It's directly below the "lower throttle body adjuster" which you can kind of see in the pics(tough to get an angle)....you guys probably know what it is anyway but for ease it's the round wheel in that area that the throttle cables run through.

General shot for location purposes:

[image: gallery_326_40_92561.jpg]

100_0161.JPG Mysterious Ground Connector....general location

And close up....If this is that grey grounding connector that's actually pictured in the other thread, I think his pics were with the black tape around this connector removed and that's why it looks different. So it's the "boxy" looking black tape covered part that you can see some of in this pic:

[image: gallery_326_40_465769.jpg]

100_0162.JPG Mysterious Ground Connector: close up....essentially directly below lower throttle body adjuster...completely wrapped in black tape

Hope that helps enough.

Now to my situation:

I followed and did all the tests with the multi meter that you guys(mucho thanks again) suggested and found no unwanted voltage running through the tank...key off and key/run on. I tested both fuel pump and fuel level sensor plugs and continuity was fine. The only test I did not do was the resistance test, but followed both MQ's and Riemski's posts to the letter otherwise.

So, I don't appear to be getting any current running amok through my tank so hopefully I wll not explode :beer: :P ......so I suppose I should still do the extra ground wire fix anyway.............any other thoughts or comments?

So, I don't appear to be getting any current running amok through my tank so hopefully I wll not explode blink.gif tongue.gif ......so I suppose I should still do the extra ground wire fix anyway.............any other thoughts or comments?

No current is good, except... What was the source of the arcing between the tank and the line? Did you test with the tank down? With the meter set to continuity, check from the spot you used from the tank to ground. Make sure there is continuity so you know that you have a good connection on the tank. When you had this problem before were there any other sources of power connected, like to accessories? Did you have a tank bag or something pressing down on the tank? Any circumstances different that may effect the electrical system?

This is why electrical problems can be such a bear. At any rate, I suggest adding the extra grounds. It's easy, and our bikes seem to need it.

Thanks DB for the pics. I have torn into mine and here is what I found:

[image: gallery_771_1887_15687.jpg]

Ground Clip #1 Ground Clip #1

[image: gallery_771_1887_1669.jpg]

GroundClip #2 GroundClip #2

Has anyone else gone into this clip? I know it has been talked about, but I have not seen any pics of this. I am getting ready to trace some of these wires and do some investigation before I start cutting and soldering. I will update with my progress. If anyone else has added a ground here, please speak up now. +1.gif

baileyrock

We lost all the great and important info related to the Vtec's wiring harness problems and I wanted to try and rebuild all the great info that was in the old post that included problems, cures, dealing with your Dealer's and Honda related to repairs. Contact numbers to file complaints with American Honda, customer service contacts and all the results members had with fighting to get these repairs done by Honda even when their bike was out of warranty.

Please post your past problems and stories here related to our 6th Gens wiring harness issues. All this old info was used many times with service repair numbers provided by other members that help them convince both Honda and their Dealer that this is a common problem and should be repaired. Even pushing for a Recall through the NHSTA(?) or whatever.

The only purpose here is to help anyone with future problems and repairs related to Vtec wiring harness issues. Please help! :thumbsup:

Thanks.

We lost the post "My first electrical problem" and " something's burning" among other's. i f you posted in any of these please re-post.

PS Vtec bashing not welcome from non-Vtec owners! Thanks <_<

They finished the job in a day and all was good. Then, a week later I was called again by Honda HQ, and they offered me a new '04 as a replacement. They've really gone out of they're way to maintain a good relationship in this respect, but I still kick myself for not holding out for some hard bags;-) The rest of their service has been only so-so at best, and I've vented about that here as well.

So, here are all the names and numbers you need to proceed with Honda and NHTSA, best of luck to you all:

Steve Chan

Safety Defects Engineer - This is the NHTSA person most familiar with our issue.

ODI/NHTSA

(202) 366-8537

(202) 366-7882 fax

Steve.Chan@nhtsa.dot.gov

Art Ridgeway, National Service Manager, North American Honda

310-783-3815 x17567

Chris Capicci, Honda North America

310-783-3989

Mary-Ellen, sales and service North American Honda (liason - Impartial Services Group)

310-783-3741

FactoryRC46So, here are all the names and numbers you need to proceed with Honda and NHTSA, best of luck to you all:

+1 on the Thanks for all the contact info. I took my seat off last week, and found the 30 A fuse was getting all rippled from heat, and the wiring was even more cooked.

When the first 30 A fuse blew and I got stranded last Fall, I cleaned everything with contact cleaner, and used dielectric grease. A while back I'd noticed the fuse looked somewhat stressed again, and now it looks really bad.

I decided I'd better check this thread again to read the latest news on the problem(s). Mine's an '02 with around 12K, and it has an extended warranty, but when I last called a dealer about the problem, the Service Manager claimed if I put dielectric grease on the all the contacts it wouldn't happen again.

I asked the Service Manager if he could tell me why my other bike, with 45K on it , hadn't ever had a bit of dielectric grease on anything but had never blown a fuse, and he couldn't explain that one... :joystick:

Das BoneThinking of going out both days hopefully. Don't have anything specific for tomorrow....maybe the Santa Monica Mtns to be near some cooler air but might be open to other options?

Sun. may be going out with another group...not sure yet?

Any interest?

Craig

Cooler air sounds awfully good... Tomorrow's out, but Sunday maybe - if my newly repaired back is ready for a longer ride. It's been three weeks, it's not going to mess anything up, it just may hurt a little more than I'd like, but - smile.gif

I pulled the "Blue" connector apart today (the one that is on the left side of the bike, above the left Rad). I was looking to see what kind of shape the internal connection was on the GREEN ground wire terminals.

It was absolutely perfect. No buildup of any corrosion or crud, immaculate.

My 02' had the beginnings of the 30 AMP main link wire burning up issue, but I snipped it and spliced in a serious duty 10 gauge wire and heavy duty fuselink about 18 months ago.

I wonder if the preventive measure I took on the 30 AMP link, had something to do with the Green ground terminals inside the BLUE block being in such good shape?

THe blue block is easy to seperate - just push the tab in, and using a small flat head screwdriver, gently split the connector in two. Piece of Cake to inspect, and worth your time - I did it cause I changed the oil and had the fairing off today.

:thumbsup:

Because of an issue i had with my '02 last weekend, I'd like to check into this post and post my issue....even though i dont have the fix yet....

Took the bike from LA to Portland. Everything was perfect. Riding up at Mt St Helens one day, i hit a very large bump in the road, which caused the bike to die out upon the front end hitting it. Shut off instantly, like someone turned off the key. No sputtering or anything. Then, a second later it was back on. Of course i got nervous and turned around to head back to portland. Hit every bump i could for the 45 minute ride back, and the bike was fine, even though i couldnt find any that were as severe as the one that caused the bike to die. I left the bike at my buddy's place in portland after i flew home here; he called yesterday to say he was riding it and it died at a stoplight, but started right up again. Just sitting there; no bumps or jostling of the bike at all. It was fine for him the rest of the day, which was about another 3-4 hrs of riding.

Now thinking back, i did have a problem with the headlights not turning on a few weeks ago. At this time, i cycled the key and highbeam switch to get them back on, and to my knowlege has been fine since. But, most of my riding is during the day, so they may have failed since then and i didnt notice it.

Last fall, i did have the main wiring harness replaced by the dealer per the extended warranty because of worn through/broken wires which resulted in a misfire. Should i still be looking at the infamous blue connection? Upon hitting this bump last week, i was thinking that maybe the bank angle/stop sensor up front got jostled around too much, but then the headlight thing popped into my head as i read some of the previous posts on this thread.

So basically, intermittent dying out which only started after hitting a severe bump. And previous headlight failure. There was alot to scroll though in this thread, so dont scream at me too much yet for not looking back before posting. Thanks in advance.

02 18,000 miles

Symptoms i had:

headlights died to a very faint dim

motor shut down, and blipping the throttle made it bog like flooding the motor

the dash lights flashed from dim to bright eratically

and a buzzing sound from behind the dash like a relay going crazy.

the fuel pump would not prime.

it usually started back up after a couple seconds, but after about the 10th time it finally quit for good. Only seemed to do it at night hence running my high beams.

Solution: I took a wire and ran it from the ground in the blue connector up front to the frame and it started right up. I just spliced that wire into the ground and grounded it at the frame and its working great.

Well I've joined the 30 amp fuse problem brigade. '02 with over 20,000 miles. I had checked it before and saw nothing that would cause me any alarm. Labor Day weekend I went to go for a ride and all I got was the relay clicking. I keep my battery on a maintainer so this surprised me. I checked voltage and it was very low. It was in the 'dead" range of below 10v. I put the battery on the charger and left it until it showed charged. The bike started OK. I had charging voltage but the little wire became extremely hot! The insulation began to discolor. I shut the bike down and checked voltage the battery had dropped to below 12v. I inspected the wire; there had actually been some deformation of the insulation (melting) at the connector that has been identified before. I put the battery on a special charger I had and was able to confirm that it was dead. $ Years I can live with. Hot wires I can't.

I separated the connection and noticed it was a very loose fit. I used a very small glasses screw driver to bend the female end so that it made a tighter connection, used dielectric grease and assembled the whole thing. Put in my new battery and started it up. The wire became warm but no where near as hot as it had been with the bad battery. I rode to work on a cool morning and when I got there I quickly took the seat off and checked the wire, it was cold. Hmmm. Rode home and did the same thing, the wire was warm. In the morning the temp had been in the mid 50s F in the evening it was in the 80s. Rechecked the connections and went for a short ride. The wire was warm. Hmm I ran the bike in the garage until the fan came on - wire temp shot up! The bike was pretty warm by now and the fan kept running the wire got pretty hot though again not as hot as with the bad battery.

I have not had any of the other problems as far as losing power and I have checked many of the other connections. It appears that there's a problem right with the one connector creating a hot spot. Possibly a bad crimp took place on some bikes. I plan on contacting Honda to at least let them know. I?ll take some pictures as well. Funny thing when I checked for alternate 30 amp fuse holders and connectors in the aftermarket they all seemed much heavier duty and weather protected then the stock set up. Not impressed by what looks like something that Honda just had left over being put in.

Well it looks like I am in the club. I have checked my 30 amp fuse and wiring since new. Bike is an 04 with 15k miles. I have never seen any discoloration, and they always look fine. I have not had any problems. I checked yesterday and the plastic at the fuse and the small wire connector are discolored slightly. The short wire is hard and brown. The short wire started getting so hot and melted some plastic in the battery tray and the red plastic sheath on the wire to the battery. Looks like I am going to radioshack.

I do not see a good how-to on installing this fuse block. I am sure it is simple, but it is not clear to me exactly what I need for the wiring, except for the radio shack block with 10g wire.

I also noticed some photos towards the beginning of the thread have been lost, as well as some important thread links.

Fuse Stock 2002 fuse holder

Please help me replace this bugger!!

1. Am I supposed to replace the larger red wire on the left of the photo with 10G wire? If so where does it lead to or terminate?

2.The other small connector that has red/white coming out of both ends does all of that wire get replaced with 10g wire and again where does the end that disappears lead to or terminate?

3.Do the metal clips inside the main fuse and the other smaller connector just pull out?

4.I am assuming that if I am replacing with 10g wire that I have to get new male or female connectors?

5.Does the new fuse holder from RadioShack support the use of 10g wire and connectors?

6.How much dielectric grease should be used, where does it go, and how is it applied?

I would also like to know if the stock fuse holder is typically just kind of tucked away or is it supposed to mount some where or attach to something. Thanks

drb

Fuse Stock 2002 fuse holder

Please help me replace this bugger!!

1. Am I supposed to replace the larger red wire on the left of the photo with 10G wire? If so where does it lead to or terminate?

2.The other small connector that has red/white coming out of both ends does all of that wire get replaced with 10g wire and again where does the end that disappears lead to or terminate?

3.Do the metal clips inside the main fuse and the other smaller connector just pull out?

4.I am assuming that if I am replacing with 10g wire that I have to get new male or female connectors?

5.Does the new fuse holder from RadioShack support the use of 10g wire and connectors?

6.How much dielectric grease should be used, where does it go, and how is it applied?

I would also like to know if the stock fuse holder is typically just kind of tucked away or is it supposed to mount some where or attach to something. Thanks

you are replacing the thick red wire, the fuse holder, anf the red/white wire.

clip off the connector on the wire harness side on the red/white wire.

remove the fuse holder and thick red wire which goes to the battery+.

connect your new wire to battery+ terminal and run it to your new fuse holder.

from the new fuse holder solder splice to where you cut off the connector on the wire harness side

just tuck the new fuse in where the old one was

Thanks for the details too.

Wouldn't clipping it between the harness and connector still leave a lot of thin gauge wiring throughout the harness?

I'm sure doing this would help temps come down between the battery (through the fuse) and harness, but after saudering the 10gauge wire to the harness, heat can build up downstream.

Are the harness wires able to handle 30amp? Sounds like its at the threshold of burning up. What if we did this mod and add in a 25amp fuse?

What systems are in need of 30amp? I'm guess at least the low and high beam lights, which in turn may blow up the fuse smile.gif So is there a way to limit the draw of current down to 25amps? I'm sure there's folks out there that use more than 25amps with grip heaters, high beams, GPS, etc....

Well I only have 2k on mine, seems like I'm going to have to check the power and ground wires like I check my underwear.

Also decided to buy some of that "liquid insulation" think covering the ground wire on the blue connector should help.

Man, VFRs remind me of the Star Trek Enterprise. Nice ship, love her, but remember how many electrical/plasma issues that ship has...when it gets jolted a little but..EPS conduits explodes out of no where and your control panels. Wouldnt it be great whenever your computer decided to crash or gets a virus your keyboard and monitor goes BOOM!

Wanted to add this post from a member sharing his problem with us, he mentions a Regional Honda Service admitting a problem/defect in the harness.

thanks 442soul :thumbsup:

442soulOK - '03 ABS with one major problem related to main wiring harness. (How's this for a doozy - the western region Honda service rep. asked me not to mention this problem on a discussion board).

While riding the bike it would kill, slow speeds, highway speeds!, it didn't matter (thank goodness for an alert OTR truck driver), usually after warming up for approx. 15 minutes. It would sometimes kick right back over and off I go until it rapidly happened again. This was a very scary/disturbing thing to happen to a recreational/commuter type rider. I took it to one shop who could not repeat the problem. I was wondering if I had bad fuel or needed the valves adjusted - just sort of grasping at straws, but had those items checked to no avail. When it happened again and I had it towed down to a different shop an interesting thing occurred. It's down at the shop and I am trying to explain this gremlin to a mechanic, he gets called in the background and tells me I'm in luck, the Western Region service rep. happens to be there on his rounds and wanted to tackle this problem.

After a week or so, this rep calls me back and states that there is a defect in the main wiring harness that manifests in voltage dropping as the bike heats/warms up. These voltage drops resulted in complete shut down of the bike - he stated it was a recall issue and that Honda would handle parts and labor on the repair. I got the bike back and haven't had the problem again going on over a year now.

I hope this helps a Viffer out there somewhere.

Just want to add my 2c to this rather leangthy post.

I checked my 30 AMP fuse wire and had to replace it as well. Just like all the rest, my wire, just the short 2in portion that leads from the fuse holder to the conector, was brittle and discolored from temperature.

Unlike others that replaced the entire red wire all the way from the battery + terminal, I only replaced the fuse holder and the connector by cutting them off and splicing in a new fuse holder with a 12GA wire.

In my opinion, the red/white wire that comes from the battery as well as the one that leads past the connector is not the problem and does not need to be replaced. The problem is the smaller guage 2in wire between the fuse holder and the connector.

After making this change, I noticed an improvement in the way the bike starts. Apparently, the smaller guage wire had acted as a resistor and reduced the current available to starter. My starter would sometmes stumble during startup before. Each stumble was accompanied by a momentery loss of power, which would reset the clock and the trip meters. After the fix, this no longer happens, so I guess the fix worked fine.

While I was "there", I also used dielectric grease on ALL terminals and connections that I could get to with ferrings off. Now, the electric system should be bulletproof :goofy:

RiceJust want to add my 2c to this rather leangthy post.

I checked my 30 AMP fuse wire and had to replace it as well. Just like all the rest, my wire, just the short 2in portion that leads from the fuse holder to the conector, was brittle and discolored from temperature.

Unlike others that replaced the entire red wire all the way from the battery + terminal, I only replaced the fuse holder and the connector by cutting them off and splicing in a new fuse holder with a 12GA wire.

In my opinion, the red/white wire that comes from the battery as well as the one that leads past the connector is not the problem and does not need to be replaced. The problem is the smaller guage 2in wire between the fuse holder and the connector.

After making this change, I noticed an improvement in the way the bike starts. Apparently, the smaller guage wire had acted as a resistor and reduced the current available to starter. My starter would sometmes stumble during startup before. Each stumble was accompanied by a momentery loss of power, which would reset the clock and the trip meters. After the fix, this no longer happens, so I guess the fix worked fine.

While I was "there", I also used dielectric grease on ALL terminals and connections that I could get to with ferrings off. Now, the electric system should be bulletproof +1.gif

Not So, I did everything you mentioned and more and still had the Failure with the No Start, Buzzing behind dash, etc. which is typical of the Blue Connector failure but w/o the blue connector failing. Added the extra ground to frame like done when the blue connector fails and it fixed the problem. My Blue connector is still perfect(looking). :goofy:

Was asked to post this up from another How-To i made here:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=29737

There was a writeup before, and a couple different people saying how they did things, but no pics. So we were replacing Teague's last night ( and mind even though mine wasn't shorted out, just for prevention ), and I decided to take a few pics of the process. Any questions let me know.

[image: 30amp_02.jpg]

[image: 30amp_03.jpg]

[image: 30amp_04.jpg]

[image: 30amp_05.jpg]

[image: 30amp_06.jpg]

Here's a photo of my fried ORIGINAL fuse, alongside a new one.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...i&img=20668

Someday I will figure out how to paste pics directly to the message. :huh:

Wow! I finally got signed in to this VFR board and got caught up on all the wiring harness issues. I identified this problem back in 2003 and performed the connector bypass with thicker wire and changed the OEM fuseholder to a beefier and more sealed automotive design. I might have been the first one to do this, which I docuemented on the Yahoo board back then. I'm not trying to blow my horn, I'm just perplexed and dismayed that this problem persists on later model years and Honda still doesn't look like they have addressed the problem (at least not stateside.)

For the record, my original fix is still going strong. I periodically check it after running the bike in hot weather (after the cooling fan has been kicking in) and it barely gets warm. My blue connector has never shown any sign of heating either.

Paul Kolbo

02 VFR

94 ST1100

clyHI all, sorry if I missed the answer to this question, but I'll ask anyway smile.gif

I'm having an overcharging issue on my 02 vfr, the battery will get so hot that it actually makes a buzzing noise for 20 minutes or so. I found that out because I had to ride it home, and it hummed for quite a while.

Now, after researching, I'm thinking it's the regulator, my question is this; Is there anyway to test the R/R without the bike running?/battery fully charged? The reason I ask is that now my battery won't hold a charge, and I didn't want to buy a new battery just to do the test, and then ruin the new battery also somehow. Any help?

Buy the new battery to do the test. You are not going to fry the new battery in the time it takes to do the test. Just hook it up and turn it on and check the system voltage immediately. If it is under 16 volts, let it warm up and test it with high beams at 5500rpm. If it is over 16, check the R/R monitor wire, and go through the troubleshooting for the R/R and stator.

If you are really worried about frying an expensive Yausa, any 12v battery will do, I think you can get generic 12v batteries at wall mart for $20-$30 that would work fine to test it out with.

This is why I love this board. Everyone knows just about anything. As some of you may know I am brand new to the Viffer and biking community. I was taking my first extended Saturday ride and I decided to make my way to downtown Atlanta from Marietta. (About 20 miles, all streetway no interstate) I figured this way I'd learn some throttle control with of of the start/stop traffic. Anywho, I get to downtown ATL and the women are all gawking at my bright Orange/Yellow/Woodgrain marvel then all of a sudden...NOTHING! The instrument panel went blank and the bike stopped, in the middle of the main street in the ATL (Peachtree). I pulled over to the side walk and after screaming for about 10 minutes I called my motorcycle guru, who happens to own a Blackbird. After telling me to calm down he told me that my main fuse probably went out. Unfortunately I left my owners man at home and I had no idea where the main fuse was. After looking under the seat I found what I thought was "something important" and it turned out to be the main fuse. I put a 30A fuse from Autozone in it and I was back running again. 20 minutes later, the fuse blew again. Luckily I had some spares and I reinstalled another fuse. I got back home with no problems. But now I am paranoid. What if this happens on the interstate? I want to know if there is something a novice like myself can do to solve this without shelling out a fortune or effing up my whole electrical system?

Figured I would post this from a different thread since its pretty well related to this one:

tinymindsGot my bike ripped apart rewiring everything I can think of and decided to add the RR>Battery rewire to the list. Did mini writeup. Most of the stuff should have been covered through the rest of this post, but heres a couple pics of what I did. Haven't got the bike back together to test it but I'll let you know what my results are when I finished, hopefully by Sunday.

[image: rrpost1.jpg]

[image: rrpost2.jpg]

[image: rrpost3.jpg]

[image: rrpost4.jpg]

[image: rrpost5.jpg]

ChevIt sits at 15.0 at just above idle (~1300 rpm), but if I rev it, it does not fluctuate much. The real test will be the riding test. I hit 16V between Rolla and KC yesterday, and that scared me.

tinymindsSo relating to what you posted about running high voltage, I finally got my bike back together after doing the wiring mods, then hooked up multimeter, started her up, woooooooo 16.0vdc. Not cool. Well that wasn't right thats for sure. So, I got a different Multimeter because I have blown several Amp fuses in that meter and was thinking maybe somehow I damaged the meter, since I pretty much just use that meter for amperage testing. So, new meter, boom..... 16.0vdc. Well, I wasn't happy. So, I remember Jeremy mentioning to me that he had this problem and it was an issue with the R/R's Monitor Feed ( Black Wire > Ignition ). So pull that fairing off again, backprob the 'black wire from R/R with one multimeter, while leaving the other multimeter hooked directly up to the battery, ( Battery showing: 16.0vdc, Black wire showing: 12.3vdc ). Cha..ching! So, pulled the black wire out of the stator connector harness, hooked it separately ( out of the connector ) up to the battery direct to she if this helps the problem, plugging the harness back up which connects all the wires but the ' black > white / black '. So hooked this wire up, boom, voltage charge dropped instantly from 16.0vdc to 14.7vdc. So hook up a perminant wire from stator voltage monitor wire ' black wire ' to battery, still solid 14.7vdc. Slapped fairing back on, good as gold.

Edit:

if you run a new wire from black monitor wire to the battery, you have to, have to, have to disconnect the black wire to white/black wire from eachother in the harness. If you don't when you turn the key off, the bike will keep running because it wills end a reverse 12v feed to the ignition switch, tricking it to thinking the key is still on.

Edit End:

Come to find out, this high voltage problem has been going on for a while I suppose ( haven't checked voltage in about a month, was good then though ), but didn't test voltage before I started this project, so... lesson learned, but problem solved. So, back to what this thread is about. I ran the two new 12guage stator wires ( red/white ) from regulator to battery to lower resistance while keeping an additional 30amp fuse in each wire. So, pulled the fuses out of the new wires, tested voltage, 14.5 vdc, put fuses back in and tested voltage, 14.7vdc. Not a huge improvement in my case, but dropped resistance on the feeds for sure. Have been pretty constant on doing a lot of preventative stuff without any problems, excluding the new R/R monitor wire I stated above, which has been my first electric issue thus far. Some people get better results than others, but its a peace of mind and worth the time to prevent issues before they occur for me, instead of waiting for things to blow then figure out what happened. :thumbsup:

ChevSo, does this wire need to be switched? My black lead into the R/R is not hot when the bike is turned off. I don't have me service manual on me, so I can't double check what wire is what, and verify that this is the voltage regulator monitor wire.

tinymindsYou can run it constant w/ no problems, but you have to disconnect it from the 'White/Black' wire on the female side of the R/R Connector and cut it off or tape that wire off or it will send a 12 volt feed backwards to the ignition, causing the bike to keep running even when you turn the key off. You don't have power to that black wire when the key is off because its reading voltage from the ignition, but its just monitoring the voltage, not actually putting it to use. Running it constant instead or switching it the way it is factory, makes no difference, all the R/R cares about is how much power is at the battery, when the bike is off, voltage is still feeding to the monitor wire, but its just sitting there, no current draw from it at all. Next week I'm going to look at trying to track down exactly where and what is causing the resistance problem in that 'white/black' wire that seems to be a known issue. Not sure if its a short somewhere in the wire or a connector problem along the way. Its a tiny wire, so short could easily be a problem, but it appears to be a progressive problem, slowly getting worse and worse, which makes me think its heat related. Will keep you informed. If that doesn't make sense let me know, I'll draw up a diagram.

Mine did this again at ~ 32K miles. Same BS, 30 amp fuse holder melted and wires. I still think it's a problem with the R&R, full wave, 3 phase SCR controlled rectifier, SCR = silicon controlled rectifier and they can lock on, must be reversed bias to turn off or commutate and if not you have a line to line short and high current. It's not the voltage at all. Energy or heat = current = I^2R. Checked mine with clamp on DC amp probe, high current > 30 amps and like before finally goes away. Fuse and wires hot to the touch. R&R hot to the touch. I still have my replacement R&R as I never ended up needing it as it did the samething, it just stopped doing it. 2 days later, current running about 12 amps, normal, low beams are 55watt over 12 vdc = 110/12 = 9 amps, add in running lites and you get about 12. So it's gone again. Rewired fuse and wires, carry on and just hope it doesn't do it again for another 4 years. But like all good Hondas I knew it was acting up, FI lite flashing, ABS lite flashing, haul butt home, smell burnt wires, dies in the driveway. Pull seat, wrap the 2 bare wires together, ride it to the barn. Fix it the next day.

Three weeks ago I had the same problems associated with the blue molex plug on my 2002 ABS model. Buzzing relays, would not start without pulling the headlight fuse, etc. I had all of my buddies helping me figure out the problem, one was a VTEC owner - he called me and told me about the ground wire at the blue plug fix, I fixed it with a jumper, everything was cool, I thought.

I then checked the main fuse, it was cooked so bad at he two inch 14ga wire that the wires had fused together, bypassing the fuse!

I replaced the harness with a homemade heavy gauge one as described in previous posts. Everything was cool. However, I own two Acuras, one Civic, a ST1300, a Honda mower, and this VFR. All of this stuff, with the exception of the mower, is on the Honda owner link. The guys at Honda could tell instantly that I am and have been a dedicated Honda customer. I then called Pat at 1-866-784-1870 and reminded her of this.

Both of these issues are a PITA, but more important - they are SAFETY issues. If you don't crash from a dead engine in traffic then you get to burn up!

Pat was very nice, worked with my local dealer who is also very nice, and together they provided me with two new wiring harnesses #s HO32100-MCW-L10 (main) and HO32102-MCW-A00 (front) along with a new battery cable #HO32401-MCW-D00 and starter motor cable #H032410-MCW-D00.

$360.00 worth of labor and $407.30 worth of parts, $767.30 total, all paid for by American Honda. Cool! I thought.

I got the bike home it ran fine, etc. They had screwed up my accessory harness and horn wiring, but that was easily fixed. I then went for a ride.

Once the bike got up to temperature, 171 degrees, the engine temp fluctuated from that to 240 degrees within minutes, then back and forth. The fans never came on. Also, the fuel gauge fluctuated from four bars to red , then back. +1.gif

I took the bike back to the dealer. They got on the phone with their tech guy and together they determined that my combination meter was bad due to the grounding problem that had just been fixed. Part # H037110-MCW-L11 and 1.2 hours labor later, I was good to go. $463.26 parts, $72.00 labor, all paid for again by our friends at American Honda.

Total bill $1,302.56, Honda did me right on this one. Sometimes it just pays to raise a little hell. :D

PKPK

jcarruthPat was very nice, worked with my local dealer who is also very nice, and together they provided me with two new wiring harnesses #s HO32100-MCW-L10 (main) and HO32102-MCW-A00 (front) along with a new battery cable #HO32401-MCW-D00 and starter motor cable #H032410-MCW-D00.

<snip>

Total bill $1,302.56, Honda did me right on this one. Sometimes it just pays to raise a little hell. :D

Unfortunately you didn't cure the problem John. The replacement parts will also be prone to heating.

How do you know this?

Do you know that Honda has not updated the harness and connectors? I don't.

I do know that the infamous short wire on the main fuse holder is a heavier gauge than the original 2002 version, it appears to be 12 ga rather than 14 ga. So is the one on my buddie's 2004 model, which is in perfect condition. The main fuse harness that I fabricated from a 30amp auto fuse holder was more robust than even the replacement harness, but now I know what to look for and if anything else messes up and I have a dealer history to fall back on and not homemade repairs.

My reason for doing this was to make Honda aware of the problems that I had and seek a remedy. It worked. Hopefully their database will become so full of these complaints that they will issue a safety recall on all affected bikes like they did with the ST1300 a few years ago.

In any case, Honda did right by me on a five year old bike.

I read the entire post and I am dizzy.... I have made notes to bring to the dealer mechanic to give him some direction....would I have any luck with honda doing/paying for anything?

here is my problem briefly, any feedback would be appreciated to see if it agrees with the notes I've taken.... I am handy but don't have all the tools or the time, I like the free time to ride , not repair....know what I mean?

Thanks for any input

here goes:

I have a 2002 VFR with about 17k miles. This bike has seen a lot of

rain but

the dealers have said it shouldn't matter. one dealer replaced all 4

headlights, headlight relay and turn signal relay, no different, their

next

suggestion was to change the ENTIRE wiring harness....I couldn't go

along

with that. They said they called the tech line and that Honda has never

heard of this problem.

Now its at another dealer waiting to be looked at, some of the

mechanics

suggestions were to look at the battery and alt conditions.

When I was bringing it to the 2nd dealer, I went over a "selfislhy wasting bandwidth" and the

headlights came on but shortly after went back out. whenever I use the

turn

signals, even on the highway, the engine dies. I noticed that when I

turn

the ignition switch on anf the FI light on the dash illuminates and the

sound from the fuelpump sounds very week and doesnt stop after a few

seconds

like usual, it just keeps hummming, like it's dieing. Oh, and the

instrument

cluster isn't as bright as it used to be, kinda dim.

I'm thinking some sort of short but didnt want to replace the entire

harness and pay for it anyway.

then it be something like an ignition switch, fuel pump or just the

battery.....

any suggestions, I really like this bike still but don't want to try to

rebuild it from the ground up (electrically anyways)

Hi Everyone,

I would like to add to the list of electrical issues.

I'm a new (used 2002) VFR owner and rider (but rode Motocross a bunch as a kid). Anyway I have been reading all the great posts on the site and learning a ton. My thanks to you all!!!

After reading about the main fuse wire (red/white stripe) issues I checked mine and sure enough it needed replacement. I took care of that two weeks ago.

After that I was hyper sensitive about electrical issues and bought a battery tender and read up on everything I could find. Then I noticed a burning smell, like burning nylon rope (not quite electrical burning - I know that from years of MGB ownership!). Anyway it seemed to be coming from the right hand side of the bike near the upper fairing. It would come and go, being more noticeable when stopped in at a light - anyway I decided to check it out today and pulled the right hand fairing.

This is what I found...

Right side - problem is the toasty lower connector.

Doesn't look too bad.

Might have a problem.

Plastic oozing from inside connector - not good

Closeup of the melt.

White connector block with cover pulled back.

Totally melted white connector block.

I assume that the three yellow wires coming out of the frame are from the stator. They were all 16 gauge wires going into the white connector block but 14 gauge coming out of the block and going up to what I assume is the Regulator / Rectifier (r/r) near the steering head (fins visible when you look down onto the frame on the right hand side).

Anyway I clipped the wires on either side and rewired everything. I marked them with colored shrink tube just in case it mattered (and accidentally may have mixed them up anyway - f##$!).

Rewire almost complete

2002 VFR Stator and RR wiring diagram

I would have put another connector block in but I needed to get to work and this was all I had. I did need to extend the yellow wires a bit to make up for the missing block. I also threw some electrical tape on the right had radiator hose temporarily. Mine was rubbed by the fairing more than I liked (see first pic) - you might want to look at yours.

Here are some thoughts and questions though:

1. Do the three yellow wires come from the stator and go to the r/r ? (pretty sure they do from wiring diagram)

2. Does it matter which yellow wire goes to which? (again, pretty sure they do from wiring diagram)

3. After the rewire, I started the bike I notice that ONE of the yellow wires got quite hot - hot enough that I was thinking about putting a fuse in there. The other two yellow wires seemed normal. Any thoughts on this?

4. Could this be an indication of a problem with the stator? What about the r/r?

5. The previous owner never rode this bike for a year and the battery was weak but has never let me down. Even when I connect a Battery Tender Jr to the battery it goes into established mode (green light) in just a few minutes. Could this be a battery issue?

6. Prior to the main fuse wiring improvement, I had the right fairing off for cleaning before and I noticed the brown discoloration on "clear" rubber boot - so I don't think that the repair to the main fuse wiring harness caused the meltdown on the opposite side. BUT I did notice the smell more AFTER the main fuse wire fix. Your thoughts? Did the improved main fuse wiring cause another problem?

7. The bike has tipped over twice before (once before I bought it and once my fault ). It has also been exposed to west coast salt air (I noticed one of the wires has some copper corrosion on it). Could the tip over or the corrosion have caused enough damage or resistance to cause the white block to melt?

Note: I don't really think the tip over hurt the block - just throwing it out there in case someone had some info.

8. Lastly, I called three Honda dealers and passed on my VIN. They say there are no outstanding recalls for my bike. For you Canadians (or other countries) out there...has Honda replaced your Alternator as per the 2002 USA recall?

rocket0606

Hmm,

I did not use a relay. I tapped directly into the headlight positive connector. I do have a 5 amp fused between the grips and the headlight. I have the variable adjustor on the heated grips, so there is no resistor.... It only draws the power it needs to heat, thus the actual draw is low. No popped fuses.

However, per your suggestion, I'll look at adding a relay this weekend.

I did replace the wiring around the main fuse again. I cleaned it up with a larger wire. IT gets mighty warm, but no discoloration or fuse melting...

thanks fo rthe in put.

----Sounds like you have Hot Grips like i do with the variable resistor (controller). I used the wire coming right off the ignition switch to energize the 30Amp relay's coil. You can take the power from the head light to energize the relay coil also. Then the 5amp fuse connected to the battery goes to the relay main contacts and then to the grips and then to a convenient ground. This way the coil will only be energized and power will only be available to the heat grips via the 5 amp fuse, when the bike ignition is energized (bike is on) so you can never forget to turn off your grips and accidently drain your battery. More importantly the amount of current needed to energize the relay is real small (approx. 100mA)and easily supplied by the headlight circuit without any overload/overheated of the installed wire harness.

OK guys, something of interest for those who bypassed the ground green wire around the blue connector because the latter can't be opened (fused plastic inner bits), you may be uncomfortable (as I was) knowing that any routine maintenance that requires this blue connector to be opened will require dealing with this stuck connector. The local Honda tech here in Montreal found a clever way to undo the blue box halves: there are 2 clips on the front side of the connection (towards the front of the bike) held in place by flexible plastic bits (in 'S' shape on picture, provided by a member here, thanks!), open these up and the individual connections will be exposed, undo the ground wire connection and a few others, use a flat screwdriver to push the terminal out of the socket (may require a bit of force) and voila. Put in generous amounts of grease, use the bypass and enjoy the peace of mind of knowing all connectors can be opened, as they should be, should need be.

pic blue box copy.jpg

Interestingly, Honda acknowledges that this connection must be checked during any inspection (tech call) so they are aware of the problem. For any Montreal owners experiencing this problem, see Richard at Excel Honda, he's an ace.

Regards,

Bruckner

I didn't look closely at current wire size but from the pic it looks like no more than 12 gauge max. In fact, the whole time I have been doing the wiring thing on my bike I haven't seen a wire larger than 12 gauge with the exception of the main ground and starter wires (cables actually).

And while doing some research on fuse sizes and wiring I found this website...

www.the12volt.com - targeted at auto electrical installers (ie stereo, alarms etc).

Anyway I found two little jems:

ONE

Realize that the "absolute ground" of the electrical system is not the battery negative terminal or the vehicle chassis, but is the case of the alternator itself. This is why perhaps the most important cable among the Big 3 is the engine ground strap, as this is what connects the alternator ground to the vehicle's chassis. Be certain the resistance between the alternator case (the engine block assuming the alternator is properly bolted to the engine) and the battery negative is minimized. (Thanks to the12volt for pointing this out!)

- makes me wonder if the Reg/Rec would be considered the alternator on a bike since the stator has no ground - I think?. Anyone???

and TWO

This is an old GM Technical Service Bulletin, but it should help anyone wanting to verify that their amp has a good ground:

METHOD OF VERIFYING ' GOOD ELECTRICAL SYSTEM GROUND ' #87-8-139 - (04/07/1987)

VEHICLES AFFECTED: ALL MODELS

When diagnosing electronic systems for incorrect operation, it is often necessary to verify that ground circuits are good. This article is intended to clarify what is meant by the term "good ground" and the preferred tools and methods for verifying it.

A "good ground" is a ground circuit that has a resistance of zero OHMS.

Ground circuit resistance can be measured in OHMS using a digital volt OHM meter (DVOM). When using a DVOM, it must be set on the 200 OHM scale to obtain an accurate measure of the circuit resistance. Many meters have both a 200 OHM scale and a 200 K scale. The 200 K scale will not measure zero OHMS accurately. If you are not sure how the meter is to be set for the 200 OHM scale, refer to the meter operating instructions for proper settings. If the meter is an autoranging or self-scaling meter, read the meter carefully to be sure which scale it is setting itself to.

Before measuring resistance in any circuit, the resistance of the meter should be measured by touching the leads together. A meter with a good battery and leads in good condition will read less than .2 OHMS usually zero. If the leads measure anything more, an accurate measure of the circuit resistance may not be possible.

Always remember - resistance cannot be measured accurately on a "live" circuit, All current flow through a circuit must be stopped by disconnecting its power source before measuring resistance.

Ground circuit resistance can also be checked by measuring the voltage drop across the circuit with a DVOM set on, the 2 volt scale. The voltage drop will be zero across a "good ground" circuit.

Remember, fully understand a meter's functions before using it!

To add to this, a good ground for car audio applications will have a return resistance reading of 1/2 ohm or less. I have yet to have a return reading of 0 ohms. If a ground return reading cannot be made to get below 1/2 ohm by means of the "BIG 3", then it is adviseable to ground direct to the battery. Electricity is an algebra equation, what you do to one side you must do to the other. Pay as much attention to the ground wire as you do the power wire.

The BIG 3 is a great place to start for a good ground, however it is the assumed proper method of grounding. What we are talking about here is the older and wiser 4th brother to the BIG 3 (the BIG 4).

So a proper ground wire will be as follows.

- clean of residue and paint.

- secure.

- have a resistance return of 1/2 ohm or less.

- be of adequate guage to carry the return as compared to the power wire.

To simplify the measuring of the return, use your meter as described. Disconnect the - battery terminal and disconnect the ground wire from you amp. If your dmm probes are not long enough, you will need to create a jumper extension out of some primary wire or whatever wire you have handy. Measure this wire for any resistance reading and subtract it from the total.

Many installers are not aware of this nor practice this method. It takes time and time = $ so don't get all pissy if you had a professional install done and this was not checked. A poor ground connection or high resistance reading may seem trivial under no load, but once you are pounding your nice new amp and it is drawing large amounts of current, this little reading has become a monster reading that has caused many an amp to fail for no apparent reason. It may be noticeable as a extremely hot running amplifier in a short time period, poor output levels or diminishing levels and of course a blown power supply or output section in the amplifier.

While the original article was written for the years gone by, it still is applicable to the newer generation of vehicles. A good ground is not about the amount or size of the metal in the return to the battery but about the resistance through it. Todays vehicles are a combination of metals, spot welds, glued together unibody panels and isolated chassis components. The return through these components is where the resistance reading comes into question and this is what we need people to understand, why the BIG 4 needs to be done if the BIG 3 does not solve the problem.

___________________________________________

Rob @ Forbidden Audio Ltd.

CFB Comox, BC, Canada

Oh - and according to these guys...

Power & Ground Cable Specs

Cable Size/Wire Gauge = Current Capacity/Amperage (amps)

2 = 225 amps

4 = 150 amps

8 = 100 amps

10 = 60 amps

12 = 40 amps

14 = 25 amps

16 = 15 amps

I'm sure that the little stock "red wire" that burns up is no bigger than 14 gauge (protected :beer: by a 30 amp fuse!). No wonder that sucker gets toasted.

My turn now. I just checked my 30A and it's getting worse looking as is the short section of red/white wire.

Obvious I need to make the change now, but with all the missing pics and data and what appears to my "un-educated electrical" brain, there seems to be differing ways of doing the fix so now I'm totally confused :goofy:

Ken's ex. on pg 1, Jeremy's explanation on pg 6 and Tinyminds on pg 7 I realize are all achieving the same fix but seem somewhat different in their methods??????

What I get is that we are essentially replacing the red wire coming from battery +, the 30 fuse holder, and here's the part that I'm unclear on....the red/white wire that has a connector in line. Are we replacing the entire red/white wire connector and all(and if not...why not) or just a section of it?

If BR or any one can help out with some pics that show exactly what's kept and what is removed, or some very simple verbage that my non-electrical brain can follow it would be much appreciated. Specific part #'s etc. would be great if anyone still has that info.

Much thanks,

Craig

Das BoneMy turn now. I just checked my 30A and it's getting worse looking as is the short section of red/white wire.

Obvious I need to make the change now, but with all the missing pics and data and what appears to my "un-educated electrical" brain, there seems to be differing ways of doing the fix so now I'm totally confused :goofy:

Ken's ex. on pg 1, Jeremy's explanation on pg 6 and Tinyminds on pg 7 I realize are all achieving the same fix but seem somewhat different in their methods??????

What I get is that we are essentially replacing the red wire coming from battery +, the 30 fuse holder, and here's the part that I'm unclear on....the red/white wire that has a connector in line. Are we replacing the entire red/white wire connector and all(and if not...why not) or just a section of it?

If BR or any one can help out with some pics that show exactly what's kept and what is removed, or some very simple verbage that my non-electrical brain can follow it would be much appreciated. Specific part #'s etc. would be great if anyone still has that info.

Much thanks,

Craig

sounds like you are confusing 2 different fixes. this is the 30 amp fix post:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...7&hl=30+amp

and this is the r/r sensor fix:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...c=34762&hl=

the first one fixes a wire going to the starter that is carrying too much current for its size

the second one insures your r/r is getting an accurate read on the voltage hitting your system so it doesn't overcharge and blow electronics.

hope that helped.

OK, so I went and got some parts(thanks Jeff/Last Chance)........10 gauge wire, shrink wrap and a new fuse holder. I didn't notice til I got home but the wires coming out of the new fuse holder are 12 gauge....will this be OK?

So, I guess what I'll be doing, again thanks to Jeff's help, is unhooking and removing the battery......cutting the large red wire leading to the OEM fuse holder at the OEM fuse holder, as well as cutting the red/white wire below the small connector(i.e. at the end farthest away from the OEM fuse holder)............splice/solder one side of the new fuse holder's wire to the large red OEM wire..........and the other wire from the new fuse holder will be spliced/soldered to the red/white wire minus the connector/smaller gauge OEM red/white wire.

So, I'm essentially getting rid of the OEM fuse holder and the OEM small connector/small gauge red/white wire(the one that seems to be causing all the problems).

So, does this sound right and am I OK with the new fuse holder's wire's being 12 gauge?

Thanks guys,

Craig

Das BoneOK, so I went and got some parts(thanks Jeff/Last Chance)........10 gauge wire, shrink wrap and a new fuse holder. I didn't notice til I got home but the wires coming out of the new fuse holder are 12 gauge....will this be OK?

So, I guess what I'll be doing, again thanks to Jeff's help, is unhooking and removing the battery......cutting the large red wire leading to the OEM fuse holder at the OEM fuse holder, as well as cutting the red/white wire below the small connector(i.e. at the end farthest away from the OEM fuse holder)............splice/solder one side of the new fuse holder's wire to the large red OEM wire..........and the other wire from the new fuse holder will be spliced/soldered to the red/white wire minus the connector/smaller gauge OEM red/white wire.

So, I'm essentially getting rid of the OEM fuse holder and the OEM small connector/small gauge red/white wire(the one that seems to be causing all the problems).

So, does this sound right and am I OK with the new fuse holder's wire's being 12 gauge?

Thanks guys,

Craig

Sounds good - 12 Gauge will be fine. I posted a how-to on this subject - rolling everyones ideas into one big article here... "Electrical Upgrade - How To With Pics"

ok ive double checked my 30a fuse and its looking toasty and the wire is brownish.

ive been reading as much as i can and think this is something i can do rather easily and id rather not buy the harness thats being offered.

but i highley suggest anyone who doesnt know this stuff enough buy it as it makes this issue alot easier to deal with.

so my 2 issues are this:

1.i need to replace the fuse holder and the wires leading into it.

fix= http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=29737

2.fix the sensor wire thats causing the system to overcharge in the first place.

fix= http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=34762

am i off base here or will doing these 2 things fix my issue as long as no other damage is found?

i admit im a bit confused as to why the fuse wires are overheating.

is it directly related to the R/R not getting a good signal from the sensor wire?

should i do just the fuse fix only or do both?

while looing at tightwads harness im seeing stuff that doesnt seem to match up with these 2 fixs.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/uploads...3273_326816.jpg

can someone tell me what the black plug at the top left of the pic goes too? everything else follows the fixs im reffering to tho.

My initial fix, prior to developing the harness currently being offered, was to run a fused, relayed wire from the battery to the sensor wire going to the RR. I simply removed it from the plug, using a jewelers screwdrive(any small thing screwdriver works of course) and then used a female terminal to connect. Taped over the terminal so it wouldn't short out on anything and I was good to go. I also replaced the short piece of wire in the 30 amp fuse assembly with a 12 gauge wire and soldered the connection.

This steadied my voltage at 14.37 at 5k rpm, or 14.32 with high beams on. I was still worried about overloading the system, which is when I developed the harness. This brought the voltages to 14.45 at 5K rpm all the time.

tightwad just dont answer my pm,it will save you from saying stuff 2x.i appoligise for the confusion as you answered this so fast i didnt even need to send the pm. smile.gif

jeremy- i take it i should pull the black wire out of its harness and tap it to the battery with a fuse and ill be good to go?

i just cant leave it connected in the harness and splice into it without a relay.

i seen the blue connector ground wire fix somewhere in all this reading so i know what your reffering too.

i think its in this thread so ill backtrack and find it.

found it: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...st&p=402525

this one?

also any connectors i use should i dab dielectric grease on them? im guessing i should to stop corrosion.

Easiest way to the monitor wire fix is to remove the wire from the connector on the R/R side with a small screw driver, then use an insulated female quick disconnect to connect to your fused wire from the battery.

Deathstar13i seen the blue connector ground wire fix somewhere in all this reading so i know what your reffering too.

i think its in this thread so ill backtrack and find it.

found it: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...st&p=402525

this one?

Yep, that is it. I used some of those crimp on quick splices into the wire on each side of the connector and grounded it...

[image: blueconnectorground.JPG]

wow,what a long day.

i just finished up the bike and test rode it to check for issues.

cost was $17 in parts alone so who ever buys the harness from TIGHTWAD is getting a great deal.

it wasnt hard work,just nerve racking a bit knowing i could be screwing up a perfectly good running bike as mine was just starting to show issues on the wire turning brown but it ran perfect.

i added all 12 guage wireing and 12 guage wired fuses.

a 30a on the fuse replacement and a 10a mini fuse on the RR sensor wire.

also i did the grounding mod,even tho im not even sure what it does but ive learned to not second guess people when it was so easy.

can you tell me why it needs done?

i could definetly seeing a shop charging $500 to do this work and mabey not even fix it correctly.

again ty guys for all the help and advice.

I know there are a lot of posts on this topic, but my experience was a little different and I wanted to throw it out for consideration. Over the past couple of months my 02 had developed some really serious drivability issues. Once she got over about 180deg she would start missing at constant throttle settings. In the mildest form it felt like the lean surge problem, and in its worst form you could hear individual cylinders dropping in and out and it felt like it was going to die. Moving the throttle a good bit would cause everything to pick back up but it was very annoying, and sometimes scary if you were in a corner. The problem didn’t exhibit itself constantly. Some times she would run smooth as butter for a couple of days. I had been watching the 30A B fuse for a while and it was starting to show the typical wiring insulation discoloration and signs of heat so I did one of the recommended repairs. This lowered the fuse wire temp, but it was still getting warm and the drivability problem was still there. I checked the main and front harness ground wires next – no signs of heat or discoloration, the connectors separated easily etcetera, so I didn’t implement any of the repairs suggested. I did apply some super duper Volvo electrical connector grease given to me by a friend to the blue and gray connectors. (Seems modern drive by wire Volvos occasionally develop electrical gremlins and the fix is to put this stuff on the connectors). Still no change. So, I got out the service manual and started to work my way through the wiring diagram and learned the following:

The B fuse (the one that melts) does not supply working circuits in the front harness. The power passes through the front harness to be switched by the control relays (fuel cut and I think one other), but no working circuits. This means the grounds from the front harness are not really associated with the B fuse, and the fact that both melt is a coincidence, not a cause and effect relationship. So when we fix the front grounding problem we are fixing problems related to accessory circuits and the A fuse.

This led me to start looking at the main harness. It appears the B fuse supplies all of the engine management circuits – ignition coils, injectors, TPS, O2s, etcetera. Loss of voltage in these circuits would logically seem to cause drivability problems, so I popped of the right fairing and pulled all of the engine management connectors apart. Nothing appeared to be wrong, no visible corrosion or anything, but I checked all of the female connectors and attempted to tighten any that looked to be too open, applied magical Volvo grease, and plugged everything back together. Viola! Drivability problem gone – smooth as glass at any steady throttle setting from 3500rpm up and now the B fuse is cool to the touch. Why did the problem seem heat sensitive? The only thing I can determine is a couple of the right side electrical connectors lay against the upper radiator hose, and once the coolant started to flow the connectors heated up and raised the resistance in already marginal connections.

The message here – when you’re working on your B fuse problems, check those engine management harness connectors!

I apologize for the long post, but I hope it helps someone else.

Quick Update. Two weeks, 1000+ miles, ambient temps from 47 - 94, and coolant temps from 170 - 223, still smooth. No surging, no missing, and the B fuse is staying cool. I've owned this bike for two years and 17,000 miles (had less than 2k on it when I bought it) and it has never ran this well at steady state cruise speeds. Now it's no not just fun to ride, but a pleasure to ride!! fing02.gif

mclaarGreetings. I've been lurking here for several years. Picking up tips and advice on the numerous problems that came along with my '02 VFR. I've become more familiar with electrical systems than I ever thought possible. Thanks for all the help.

Now though, I have something to add to the mix. Good news in fact.

I just got off the phone with my Honda service manager. He informed me that Honda has just issued a "stop selling" order on VFRs and that a recall for the electrical problems is immanent. He didn't have any details on what the recall will replace. He just was informed it was coming. So, after years of -investigating-, we may have a real solution soon.

Keep your fingers crossed.

Cheers

Yes, it's here. See "recall" post from 8-31-07.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...c=35937&hl=

This problem does in fact affect 06's, mine is sitting at Dreyer Honda here in Indianapolis with these EXACT problems. Honda customer service has called me every day since I called them to give me the same update, but at least they called. My dealer has told me that they dont think Tech has a fix and cant find the reason for the problem. They asked the dealer for up close pics of everything and they still haven't called back yet {as of today}. The service manager seems to think that Honda is just going to replace the entire wiring harness because they are just scratching their heads. Honda itself cant just patch up bad spots like we have found here I guess, they will have to make a whole new harness I am informed. Tomorrow will be 2 weeks that my bike has been sitting there and my Jeep is costing me $25 a day in gas just to get to work and home. I did ask the dealer and made clear with them that they need to STOP right now if Honda is going to hose me. I dont have the money to pay them $80/hr. to fix what I think I could have at home with Tightwads fix.. BTW Tightwad, where is my harness I am so eagerly awaiting for, I went ahead and got the fuse box too. Dreyer Honda seems to be doing me right for all of you guys out there with the same problems if you are in Indy, they are nice people. (Been calling everyday).

Its now Monday the 24th and I still dont have my bike back and Honda Tech doesn't seem to know how to fix the damn thing. Last I heard Sat. from the dealership was that "Honda" was deciding whether or not they were gonna warranty it since I added heated grips. Its freakin August, how many times this summer do you think I used the damn things. This is BS, the grips didn't F it up, Honda did when they "redesigned" the harness. Its funny how mine did the exact same things that the 02-05's did but they are in question about whether or not its a recall deal. You can bet your ass though that if that thing causes me to have an accident, because of the thing shutting off midride or in the middle of a corner, I'll file a suit so fast they'll wish they had just fixed the thing. As far as I know yet, they dont know how to fix it. I hope the guys at Honda are reading this because this may be the last Honda I buy. This was my first Honda streetbike but I have owned I think 8 Honda dirtbikes since I was about 7. Sorry for the rant guys but I am pissed.

It melted the red and white wire and the fuse holder was brown next to the battery. The blue connector is fine, but the fuel pump would only work intermittently. Sometimes it would just crank over and over and not start, and then the next time it would fire right up. The dealer said they found the fuel pump relay upside down and that the rubber protective boot had water in it. My bike gets ridden every day, rain or shine, I've even been caught in snow coming home from work twice. I ordered the wire fix and fuse block from Tinyminds, but I want Honda to step up and fix what is wrong. This is my daily driver, 100+ miles a day, and I need it back. I talked to customer service tonight and they assured me that a descision would be made tomorrow as to what will happen now.

i have an update to this thread concerning the 3 fix's i did on my 04.

today it wouldnt start,no fuel pump whine coming from teh tank so i at least knew what was being affected.

of course i went back and inspected all the wiring i had done for loose connections or more damage done.

after jiggling the wires it fired up,but more jiggling would couse it to die.

problem was the fuse holder on the 30A line i replaced was not holding the blade fuse securly.

after some tighting of the crimps all is fine again.

im just posting this as a reminder to people that even tho we fixed one problem it does give room for more issues to arrise.

anyhow if anyone is wondering the 30A fuse and the line its on are what feeds power to the fuel pump.

i could also see why people with a weak battery and possibly corroded and burnt 30A lines having issues with the bike running erradicaly.

PKPK

RivcykoSome folks don't trust the dealer, or Honda's, (what I'm pretty sure will be the minimal), fix. Folks here had this figured out LONG before Honda owned up.

Except he took the bike to the dealer to get the harness fixed the first time (despite having the information available to fix it himself the first time as I recall.) Might as well just bite it and take it in for the recall.

I'll admit that I am probably not taking mine in. I did the 30A fuse cure three years ago and did the blue connector ground bypass and monitor wire fix this summer. I am curious about some of these guys finding burned connectors elsewhere and wondering if maybe I don't want that recall harness. Sure would like to put it in myself though.

Honda "fixed" my wiring harness last April with new parts, same part #s as the originals! :beer:

I found out for sure today. The recall parts are different #s. Honda is going to do the recall on my bike, parts are on order. They have already spent over $1300 on this problem with my machine alone. My dealer has been super, and has had plenty of practice with this recall with my buddies' bikes.

jeremy556

toddvfrIdle is set at about 900 RPM, is that correct?

No, it should be 1200-1500 when warmed up.

Set it closer to 1400-1500.

I just put a deposit down on an 2007 w/ABS.

Didn't see any mention of these problems in the 2007 model year.

Has this been sorted out at the OEM?

Thanks,

Mike

bmxracer50I just put a deposit down on an 2007 w/ABS.

Didn't see any mention of these problems in the 2007 model year.

Has this been sorted out at the OEM?

Thanks,

Mike

Either sorted or too new to see many issues....most Honda Electrical issues require some time before they show their head.

Ok, Im a newbie here and purchased a used 2006 VFR800 ABS from a used motorcycle shop last saturday. Drove it 145 miles home, Sunday drove it to church and on the way home the head lights, gauges, and taillight quit working. Although the bike continued to run! It has a little over 7000 miles on it! And after seeing all these wiring issues and me not being to mechanically inclined I think im going to take it back. After reading these posts im not sure if this problem will ever go away? The problem also is that the dealer I bought it from is 145 miles away. They told me bring it back and we will fix it no problem which is good! but far away if this happens again! What do you guys think? if you had the oppratunity to get something different would you?

Thanks, Kelly

HighSpeedWobbleOk, Im a newbie here and purchased a used 2006 VFR800 ABS from a used motorcycle shop last saturday. Drove it 145 miles home, Sunday drove it to church and on the way home the head lights, gauges, and taillight quit working. Although the bike continued to run! It has a little over 7000 miles on it! And after seeing all these wiring issues and me not being to mechanically inclined I think im going to take it back. After reading these posts im not sure if this problem will ever go away? The problem also is that the dealer I bought it from is 145 miles away. They told me bring it back and we will fix it no problem which is good! but far away if this happens again! What do you guys think? if you had the oppratunity to get something different would you?

Thanks, Kelly

Hey Kelly, welcome to VFRD! :musik20:

Not sure if the 06 up were as affected as the earlier Vtec's with this issue, but I would just check your fuses first. If it is a blown fuse, it could be a simple case of a harness wire that has rubbed through the insulation on a single wire and shorting on something metal. This can happen from either the poor re-installation by a Dealer tech after a service or a drop repair.

I can't remember if the ABS model has the dues box in the same place as the standard model,which is under the right dash access panel.

If you don't have a shop manual you can download one right here in VFRD download section.

:laugh:

BR

Baileyrock

HighSpeedWobbleOk, Im a newbie here and purchased a used 2006 VFR800 ABS from a used motorcycle shop last saturday. Drove it 145 miles home, Sunday drove it to church and on the way home the head lights, gauges, and taillight quit working. Although the bike continued to run! It has a little over 7000 miles on it! And after seeing all these wiring issues and me not being to mechanically inclined I think im going to take it back. After reading these posts im not sure if this problem will ever go away? The problem also is that the dealer I bought it from is 145 miles away. They told me bring it back and we will fix it no problem which is good! but far away if this happens again! What do you guys think? if you had the oppratunity to get something different would you?

Thanks, Kelly

Hey Kelly, welcome to VFRD! :goofy:

Not sure if the 06 up were as affected as the earlier Vtec's with this issue, but I would just check your fuses first. If it is a blown fuse, it could be a simple case of a harness wire that has rubbed through the insulation on a single wire and shorting on something metal. This can happen from either the poor re-installation by a Dealer tech after a service or a drop repair.

I can't remember if the ABS model has the dues box in the same place as the standard model,which is under the right dash access panel.

If you don't have a shop manual you can download one right here in VFRD download section.

:goofy:

BR

Thank you so much for pointing me in the right direction. I had no owners manuel so didnt even know where the fuse box was. I downloaded the manuel and found out my bike has two fuse pannels on left and right side, luckly I toke your advise and started on the right once I figured out how to take fairing pannel cover off. Replaced the 10 amp fuse and ssshes up and working again, so my test ride for tomorrow is going to honda and getting some spare 10 amp fuses. Thanks for your help!

Kelly

HighSpeedWobbleThank you so much for pointing me in the right direction. I had no owners manuel so didnt even know where the fuse box was. I downloaded the manuel and found out my bike has two fuse pannels on left and right side, luckly I toke your advise and started on the right once I figured out how to take fairing pannel cover off. Replaced the 10 amp fuse and ssshes up and working again, so my test ride for tomorrow is going to honda and getting some spare 10 amp fuses. Thanks for your help!

Kelly

Your welcome, that's what were here for! :goofy:

I purchased my 2005 VFR in October this year. Barely a week after the buy, the flicker stopped working as well as the tail light and one of the relays buzzed under the dash when switch the bike on. Honda replaced the relays and the problem appeared to have gone, but it happened soons after.

After Honda stopped being helpful, my brother and I decided to have a look our selves - this sounded lik a grounding problem. After stripping almost all the covers, and my brother figured out that the green and silver wires are the earth wires seeing that they are the only ones present on all the components, he traced it to a single connector that bridged all the earth wires. This plug was brown from rust/burnt? We cleaned it and the problem immediately dissapeared.

Its now two months down the line - problem is still gone. This connector is located behind the small cover just left of the dash.

Bean

I purchased my 2005 VFR in October this year. Barely a week after the buy, the flicker stopped working as well as the tail light and one of the relays buzzed under the dash when switch the bike on. Honda replaced the relays and the problem appeared to have gone, but it happened soons after.

After Honda stopped being helpful, my brother and I decided to have a look our selves - this sounded like a grounding problem. After stripping almost all the covers, and my brother figured out that the green and silver wires are the earth wires seeing that they are the only ones present on all the components, he traced it to a single connector that bridged all the earth wires. This plug was brown from rust/burnt? We cleaned it and the problem immediately disappeared.

Its now two months down the line - problem is still gone. This connector is located behind the small cover just left of the dash.

Hi and welcome to VFRD to you there in Cape Town! :goofy:

Yes, like discussed in this thread that dash buzzing is a direct indication of the common Ground wire issue. There is only one ground point on the entire bike and that's at or near the rear of the tank on the frame, I don't know what connector that you are referring to under that small cover.

This is the link to the repair needed to the blue connector for grounding issues to the front sub harness.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=34394&st=0&p=411780entry411780

If you haven't done this repair already, I Strongly suggest you do it ASAP as this is the only source of grounding to the front harness.

Here in the USA Honda did a RECALL of all VFR's 05-down to replace the wiring harness. Seems many other countries did Not get a recall! :fing02:

PS the previous owner probably got rid of that bike because it started having that issue before you ever had it! :laugh:

BR

BaileyRock

Bean

I purchased my 2005 VFR in October this year. Barely a week after the buy, the flicker stopped working as well as the tail light and one of the relays buzzed under the dash when switch the bike on. Honda replaced the relays and the problem appeared to have gone, but it happened soons after.

After Honda stopped being helpful, my brother and I decided to have a look our selves - this sounded like a grounding problem. After stripping almost all the covers, and my brother figured out that the green and silver wires are the earth wires seeing that they are the only ones present on all the components, he traced it to a single connector that bridged all the earth wires. This plug was brown from rust/burnt? We cleaned it and the problem immediately disappeared.

Its now two months down the line - problem is still gone. This connector is located behind the small cover just left of the dash.

Hi and welcome to VFRD to you there in Cape Town! :wheel:

Yes, like discussed in this thread that dash buzzing is a direct indication of the common Ground wire issue. There is only one ground point on the entire bike and that's at or near the rear of the tank on the frame, I don't know what connector that you are referring to under that small cover.

This is the link to the repair needed to the blue connector for grounding issues to the front sub harness.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=34394&st=0&p=411780entry411780

If you haven't done this repair already, I Strongly suggest you do it ASAP as this is the only source of grounding to the front harness.

Here in the USA Honda did a RECALL of all VFR's 05-down to replace the wiring harness. Seems many other countries did Not get a recall! :fing02:

PS the previous owner probably got rid of that bike because it started having that issue before you ever had it! :pissed:

BR

Thanks BR

I will check that link you posted out and fix that asap.

The connector I was refering to is a small plug in the wiring that is like a connection point of all the earth wires from different components in the front of the bike. I think then that from here the one wire maybe goes to the earth point. This is just a plug where 16 earth wires or so connect to, and inside plug is simply a bridge that connect them all together. Like I said - this plug had some serious corrosion and after cleaning it and properly seating the bridge plate again, all was well. Worth a look anyways if things turn south...

Thanks for this awesome website for proud VFR owners!

Bean

Thanks BR

I will check that link you posted out and fix that asap.

The connector I was refering to is a small plug in the wiring that is like a connection point of all the earth wires from different components in the front of the bike. I think then that from here the one wire maybe goes to the earth point. This is just a plug where 16 earth wires or so connect to, and inside plug is simply a bridge that connect them all together. Like I said - this plug had some serious corrosion and after cleaning it and properly seating the bridge plate again, all was well. Worth a look anyways if things turn south...

Thanks for this awesome website for proud VFR owners!

Yeah that is the grounding block which another member discovered a few years back, it's located on the left inside of the frame rail 1/2 or 3/4 the way along the engine or something like that. A plastic POS with all the green ground wises in it and only a few out going wires to the grounding point on the frame. :fing02:

I'm not sure what thread it's in, but someone covered it pretty well and it doesn't seem to be as common of a problem area.

BR

Hey guys - looking for some regurgitation on this stuff. Some of the links and pics are gone so I need some fresh help.

Been looking for a reason why I'm losing battery charge and I thought it was all related to my recent install of HID's and leaving the bike not charged for several weeks. Checked the Stator and it's fine, checked the RR and don't know what I'm looking for, and then looked at the 30A fuse at the battery and it looks like it's on it's way to meltage.

So - would that 30A fuse be enough to create a lot of problems?

Thanks for any help you can offer!

I've got an '07 with only about 3700 miles on it. No problems yet but I'm about to start looking at these areas of concern. Anybody with and '07 or newer having any problems?? Or have they been sorted by the factory???

luckylendy

I've got an '07 with only about 3700 miles on it. No problems yet but I'm about to start looking at these areas of concern. Anybody with and '07 or newer having any problems?? Or have they been sorted by the factory???

Actually 06-up had a factory update, but as far as I can tell there are still issues for these later models per member complaints. :sad:

The '06 and newer bikes still have a weak 30-amp connector, just beefier wiring than the earlier bikes. Essentially there's a wiring connector (one potential source of resistance), followed shortly by a non weather-proof fuse holder (another potential source of resistance). This whole area can corrode, which causes resistance. Resistance causes heat, which can make the fuse holder, wires, and fuse itself overheat and melt. When this happens, you can get heat-induced circuit breaks where the bike will just trip out on you suddenly and then power will come back. This is common behaviour for a high resistance connection.

Anyway, this isn't likely to be your cause of poor charging. You need to hook a voltmeter up to the bike while its running - most likely your regulator or stator is dead or on the way out. What stator tests did you perform? The only valid test is the one where you check the AC voltage with the bike running.

As always, follow the Electrosport fault finding diagram. It is THE source for finding charging issues.

http://www.electrosp...ing-diagram.pdf

I just posted this about an hour ago in electrical - I have an 06 and just hit 10K - had a problem that I didn't know about until I compounded it with an HID install.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/69136-stop-with-the-worry-stop-with-the-stressjust-order-yourself-a-vfrness/

kaldek

The '06 and newer bikes still have a weak 30-amp connector, just beefier wiring than the earlier bikes. Essentially there's a wiring connector (one potential source of resistance), followed shortly by a non weather-proof fuse holder (another potential source of resistance). This whole area can corrode, which causes resistance.

Where is this wiring section located? I have an 08 and could take some photos if that would help clarify the design in the later models.

Also - are later models subject to the common ground issue?

I have an 07 I just replaced the fuse holder and wires and I am still getting very hot wires and fuse?

voltage is running about 14.2-14.6 any ideas?

hootiehoo

I have an 07 I just replaced the fuse holder and wires and I am still getting very hot wires and fuse?

voltage is running about 14.2-14.6 any ideas?

What rpm are you getting that voltage?

now I'm getting 15.8 15.9 volts at 4500-5000 rpms and I tried to run a wire from the r/r sending to the battery with the same results

maybe I need a new r/r? the bike has 14000 miles on it

I have used these links http://www.vfrdiscus...age__hl__30 amp and http://www.vfrdiscus...nitor-wire-fix/ .

I also added the ground wire on the other side around the blue connector to the tank strap bolt just incase that would help http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/34394-6th-gen-blue-connector-ground-fix-how-to/page__hl__%2Bblue+%2Bconnector+%2Bground

I have removed every connector on each side to check for any sign of burn or corrosion, everything looked ok , I added dielectric geese while I had them apart.

My local honda shop is not the place to get it fixed because while it was under warranty one of the the front cams had started making noise I thought it need a valve adjustment when I pulled the cams out I noticed that one of them was eating in to the cam journal.

I took it to them and they told me I must of done a wheely and that caused the cam to eat in to the head because of lack of oil to that spot... I had to replace the head myself after weeks of talking to honda service and the 800 number they gave me for warranties. they wanted 5600$ to do the work so i did it myself

do you think this can help? vfrness http://www.wiremybik...products_id=266 or did I cover that stuff?

hootiehoo

now I'm getting 15.8 15.9 volts at 4500-5000 rpms and I tried to run a wire from the r/r sending to the battery with the same results

maybe I need a new r/r? the bike has 14000 miles on it

That's WAY too hot of voltage there! That will cook the battery and a lot of other things running that much juice. I think the RR is the only thing that could cause that problem unless that monitor wire you mentioned earlier is not hooked up anymore! .

BR

Being an ex-VFR owner (5th and 6th gen.) I think it was as shame that Honda didn't deal with and beef up the 5th gen. electricals and front forks (as they did with the 6th gen forks) then call it a great bike. It could have used 20 to 25 more HP which would have been enough for me. Even if they wouldn't have put the bike on a diet, the 5th gen. VFR's were capable of serious performance with a skilled rider while being comfortable to ride from light to dark. Did it a bunch of times multi-days in a row. What bike can do that now with a killer V4? I know a bunch of people are going to answer the 7th gen. is great but I simply can't get into that bike. A lot of people can so I respect their feelings.

A lighter weight V4 with a little more power, genuine performance suspension, and good performance ergos that could be ridden all day would be the bees knees. Honda coulda done it.

Oh well, mankind has a solid record of screwing up good things. BTW, this isn't a derail job since Honda has weak electricals on all the 5th and 6th gens.

Speaking of screwing things up....how many miles do you have without a valve adjustment on your poor abused black bike, Mr. Bailerrock-star? Hope you and the entire gang of "old buddies" are doing well. :smile:

Who is this "Bent"guy? Must be a scammer!

The problem still exists on 07's. On the freeway around 80 and the whole dash went out. No tach, speedo, gas gauge. It was daylight so I later learned that I had no taillight or headlight. Bike ran fine but I went straight home as a precaution. First time bothering to read this thread but I'm glad it's here. My 30 amp fuse is not blown and the red wire looks fine but the 30 amp connector is starting to discolor. Sounds like I need to look thru all my fuses. Do I need to run thru all of my wires to look for chaffing?

The problem still exists on 07's. On the freeway around 80 and the whole dash went out. No tach, speedo, gas gauge. It was daylight so I later learned that I had no taillight or headlight. Bike ran fine but I went straight home as a precaution. First time bothering to read this thread but I'm glad it's here. My 30 amp fuse is not blown and the red wire looks fine but the 30 amp connector is starting to discolor. Sounds like I need to look thru all my fuses. Do I need to run thru all of my wires to look for chaffing?

Check your stator outputs on all three phases... check resistance as well as see if any of the 3 are "communicating" that is, short circuiting beetween them... the specs are in the workshop manual (download it from the corresponding section)

Also I highly recommend you do this: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/62525-byc/?hl=%2Bkentucky+%2Bfried+%2Bconnector

SlumpbusterThe problem still exists on 07's. On the freeway around 80 and the whole dash went out. No tach, speedo, gas gauge. It was daylight so I later learned that I had no taillight or headlight. Bike ran fine but I went straight home as a precaution. First time bothering to read this thread but I'm glad it's here. My 30 amp fuse is not blown and the red wire looks fine but the 30 amp connector is starting to discolor. Sounds like I need to look thru all my fuses. Do I need to run thru all of my wires to look for chaffing?

If your 30 amp connector is discoloring, its probably resistance in the connection, causing heat build up, its good to prep them with wd40 and do a resistance check on both sides of the connection(less than 1 ohm). The 06 + models have electrical connector improvements , they've even added some waterproof connectors on the 09's, But you still need to prep your wiring for the long haul with some wd and a continuity check, and occasionally recheck.

Baileyrock

We lost all the great and important info related to the Vtec's wiring harness problems and I wanted to try and rebuild all the great info that was in the old post that included problems, cures, dealing with your Dealer's and Honda related to repairs. Contact numbers to file complaints with American Honda, customer service contacts and all the results members had with fighting to get these repairs done by Honda even when their bike was out of warranty.

Please post your past problems and stories here related to our 6th Gens wiring harness issues. All this old info was used many times with service repair numbers provided by other members that help them convince both Honda and their Dealer that this is a common problem and should be repaired. Even pushing for a Recall through the NHSTA(?) or whatever.

The only purpose here is to help anyone with future problems and repairs related to Vtec wiring harness issues. Please help! :thumbsup:

Thanks.

We lost the post "My first electrical problem" and " something's burning" among other's. i f you posted in any of these please re-post.

PS Vtec bashing not welcome from non-Vtec owners! Thanks <_<

I know this thread is a bit old but am having the same problem with me 2008 VFR800 Interceptor which is an American model I bought in Jordan from Honda Dealer. All details are at this link: http://vfrworld.com/forums/6th-generation-2002-2009/43143-help-fed-up-honda-maintenance.html#post409543

I was told the problem was fixed but the only thing done was one fuse and one major wire replacement. I am just waiting for that stator to fry or fuse to fry or both :unsure:

I really wish Honda could see our frustration and DIY mods to solve problems we are stuck with because of their poor manufacturing! to be honest I am starting to doubt Honda's reputation of having reliable bikes!

well it just happened to my 05 vfr smoked 3 yellow wires from alt. 106,660 mi. i forgot how to fix um.

First verify the battery is good, charge it up and have it load tested at dealer. Replace if fails.

With a good charged battery test the stator per the Honda shop manual. Replace if fails.

If stator connector is fried replace with Stator Hardwire Kit from Wiremybike.com http://www.wiremybike.com/vfr-specific-parts-2000-2001-vfr-parts-stator-hardwire-kit-p-693.html

Check the 30 amp fuse holder near the battery, replace if heat damaged with automotive type holder.

If after checking and/or replacing these parts the voltage is not correct then check and repair all wiring between stator and battery. If wiring is OK then replace the rectifier.

Stators typically last 50k miles

I guess this is not a new question, but wasn't able to find the needed information:

-How do I check if my used 2003 VFR had the recall done or not?

If I take the front cowl off and post some pictures of the left side, and the insides of the translucent protective cone, could someone confirm the status?

-Should I call Honda Germany and ask them to check the VIN ?

Thanks!

Just looking for confirmation of my VFR's charging system. I'm taking a long trip from Vancouver, BC to Austin, TX in April for the MotoGP and I want to ensure the VFR is working fine.

So:

2002 VFR with 47,000 km. Bone stock. Main harness recall done from the documentation I have. It looks like it lived a good life from the last owner, lots of maintenance.

So at idle I'm making 13.0-13.1 volts

~5000 RPM it makes 13.8-13.9 volts

~5000 RPM with high beams, signals, brake lights on it makes 13.7-13.8 volts

This sounds like it's all good in the hood and I just need confirmation to make myself feel better.

I'll be bringing a volt meter on my trip(s) anyway ;)

Looks good right now but that can change in a second.

Switchblade

Looks good right now but that can change in a second.

That's good enough for me. I am meticulous with my bikes and will keep on top of it. My best friend has a first gen VFR and has fitted a digital volt meter for obvious reasons. I may do the same :) For the time being, my touring kit has a volt meter in it now. First time I've felt the need to carry that. :)

Ugh, my '04 has been at the local shop now on it's fourth week with the shop and Honda USA trying to figure out the correct fix. So far it seems Honda is willing to do both (I believe there are two recalls...) recalls but for some reason both sides are scratching their collective heads about getting the main harness to plug in correctly.

I've had the bike for a little over two years (my first bike in my old age) and have no idea what work was or wasn't done on it prior.

Very frustrating.

My local dealership is having me call Honda to lean on them to continue giving help to get this figured out and finally fixed.

Quick update - one call to Honda USA yesterday and my vfr was ready today. Couldn't stop smiling, man I love my Interceptor.

Phongeer

Quick update - one call to Honda USA yesterday and my vfr was ready today. Couldn't stop smiling, man I love my Interceptor.

Love hearing that! And good on Honda USA for taking care of you.

:cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

Beginning to worry they had sold it. I have heard of stories where dealer sold customers bikes while in for repair .

If your can stick both fingers in your ears and you have a multimeter, you can test the R/R and the Stator. -- So, do you have a multimeter?

Sounds like a good time for a accidental fire ..

Hey guys, I am joining the electrical gremlin club. I have a 2006 with 50000+ and I have had the fried fuse hold wire and draining battery problem. My dashboard only seems to flicker when my battery is about to die. I did get a new battery after the fuse holder fix. I fixed the fuse holder and my battery isnt draining as fast on a 20 min ride, but it still isnt charging and by the time I go back the battery was down to 11vdc running. From what I have gotten in the many hours of reading here and anywhere else is that my stator is going.? On the three plug connector I am getting 13acv ish on one pin and 9acv ish on the others while idling and only going up to 14acv on the one and 11ish on the others with 5000rpm. Does that sound like the stator? I have check my r/r and the diodes seem to all go down to 001. Can the r/r cause a battery drain when off? My connectors are looking good still. even the notorish blue, r/r, and stator connectors are still in good shape.

Thanks for all the imput so far. You guys have giving me hope when the cost of this things at the shop where outside my price range.

Almost all fixed!! New found burnt wires??

Help please!!

You guys have saved me another riding season. Alright I have replaced my r/r and stator with Rick's stator and R/R. Just before I found that it was my stator plug that was draining my battery over night. My diods number on my r/r were off as well. Between the two and the new battery that problem has vanished along with the warmer weather here in Michigan, but I smelled another farmilar plastic burning today. It would seem that the z folded ckp sensor wires(w/y&y) are burnt going into the sensor. The connector looks good but so did my stator and r/r plugs and both units were dead and dying. So question (tightwad) and others who I have followed what is the ckp sensor and what are and what do they do the A32-SG2 and B22-PCP from the wiring diagram going to the ecm terminal. More importantly does the VFRness have connector to these small burning wires or allow them not to folded like they were from the factory? Also what can I excpect to happen now that they are brittle and building resistance. Help please I was feeling so proud even though the stator and reg fix took me 8hrs with two runs for tread lock and gasket maker.

PCIII USB does not light up.

Fuel Pump does not prime.

Is this a fuse issue or has my PCIII failed.

All the usual stuff gets power when turning on key.

Tuzo

PCIII USB does not light up.

Fuel Pump does not prime.

Is this a fuse issue or has my PCIII failed.

All the usual stuff gets power when turning on key.

Kill switch - either off or needs cleaning? Maybe shoot some contact cleaner in, cycle the switch a couple of times and see what happens.

Tried that already - I've made the kill switch mistake before (bumped it while working on bike) so I check that first now.

Starter works. Lights work. Dash lights up.

I'll check further next weekend but me thinks my PCIII might have tanked. No way I'm going back to the old fueling (low speed on-off sensitivity and relatively rough V-Tec transition) so I may have to replace it.

Tuzo

Tried that already - I've made the kill switch mistake before (bumped it while working on bike) so I check that first now.

Starter works. Lights work. Dash lights up.

I'll check further next weekend but me thinks my PCIII might have tanked. No way I'm going back to the old fueling (low speed on-off sensitivity and relatively rough V-Tec transition) so I may have to replace it.

First step is to always disconnect the PC first and go from there if needed.! :wink:

ok, so i had the main fuse wiring short out at the useless white connector so i cut it out patched it up and installed the VFRness, which gave me great charging numbers but then later at night (tonight actually, just installed the VFRness this morning) it felt sluggish and i had my suspicions that i was getting low numbers again and i was right. barely 12.8 - 12.9 at idle and 13.5 at 5K RPM, anyone got any ideas about what else it could be? bad rectifier? thanks for the help

Stator or R\R I would go head and replace both ..

Switchblade

Stator or R\R I would go head and replace both ..

yea, that's what i was afraid of, i just turned the bike on and it gave me the correct readings this morning but it is annoying as shit to not be able to trust the bike.

update: yep it was a bad rectifier, replaced it and it's charging like a champ now! www.wiremybike.com is awesome!

v13

update: yep it was a bad rectifier, replaced it and it's charging like a champ now! www.wiremybike.com is awesome!

:cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader: :cheerleader:

You the man ...

First off I'd like to thank everyone for taking the time to document the problems and corrective actions they've take to fix our VFR's, since joining the Brotherhood this site has been instrumental in helping identify and fix my electrical woes. A month after getting my 2004 the Stator Fried the R/R and eventually itself, or vice versa, this site was a godsend in aiding in diagnosing the problem and leading the was to Tightwad's VFRNess.

That's the good...

The bad is that the Blue Connector kicked my butt and left me stuck on the side of the road 80 miles from home. Which was bad, what was worse was having to ride those 80 miles two up on an FZ1(insult to injury if every there was such a thing.) Clearly I know the problem and corrected it via the jumper across the connector and the frame, my question is this though... With the old girl tore apart right now is there anything else that needs to be done to improve reliability to prevent a third stranding? Or have I made the required improvements to be able ride without fear of the engine stalling out on the Blue Ridge Parkway?

Check all connectors and ground. Make sure the grounds are touching metal .

I use Oxgard on my connectors. Every winter whilst doing maintenance I make it a point to inspect the critical connections to be sure all is well. Everything's still looking good.

[image: 81RY1BEsYTL._SY355_.jpg]

I haven't posted in a while, but guess what I'm doing today...

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/29737-how-to-replace-30amp-fuse-wires/

[image: BycEvmu.jpg?2]

[image: BycEvmu.jpg?2]

Hey guys, guess 40k miles is time for me to get on the electrical gremlin bandwagon here with my 2002 non ABS.

The issues began about a month ago, at work. Key on, hit starter, and she was dead. I tried to jump start the bike, but the second I removed the auxiliary battery, it died. Went to Interstate (In a 52hp Diesel Jetta) to get another battery, installed it, ran great. I figured the battery was sulfated and it had an internal short.

Fast forward another month and it did the exact same thing. I knew about the R/R and stator issues, so I figured I would tear her down and see what was up. Lo and behold...whoa

So the R/R to stator connection was bad. I assume this means the R/R is bad also. I ohmed the stator out per sec. 17 of the shop manual, and everything was within spec. All I have read on the R/R is that I cannot test it at home. I figure it's bad though since the connector was fried.

Really fried.

I checked voltage through the battery negative as I did in the first place to determine if there was still a current drain and there was, I calculated it to approximately 0.4 amps, more than enough to kill a battery in a night. This being the case I made my way through the wiring diagram, looking over all the fuses, and I ran across a couple of items. The first was the red connector over the green starter relay. It was melted on the terminal that takes the RED wire. I pulled the fuse (30 amp, main fuse A), which caused the current draw from the battery to stop. I also noticed the holder for main fuse A was slightly discolored, but I do not view it as a contributing issue yet. Disconnecting that fuse did nothing to my current draw.

Once I isolated the current draw to that circuit, I followed the red wire to the keyswitch, which tested good per sec. 20-21 of the manual. I then followed the red/green wire to the instrument panel and unplugged that 20 pin connector, which stopped the current draw.

To summarize,

This bike keeps killing batteries

I found a totally destroyed R/R to stator connection

Stator ohmed out OK

Battery still is being drained whilst R/R is NOT connected (0.43A @ 12.7V battery voltage)

30 amp Fuse A connector is melted at green connector (red wire)

30 amp Fuse B connector is beginning to discolor.

Current draw ceases once Fuse A is pulled

Current draw ceases if instrument panel (20 pin) plug is disconnected (no discoloration on this connector)

I am pretty stumped as to why this is happening as it seems nobody mentions instrument panel, nor the fuse on the starter solenoid. Any suggestions on what I should test/replace? I figure I am in it for a new Rectifier and fuse holder, but I fear it could be more.

Here's what you need.

[image: 2002-2007VFRnesswFusePanel.jpg]

http://www.wiremybike.com/

Roll On .

And a tube of this . . .

[image: 81RY1BEsYTL._SY355_.jpg]

[image: BAND-AID-tin-ca-1980s-90s-sm-491x600.jpg]

Some of theses also.

Thanks for the fast responses guys. I will get a standard VFRNess on order today. Should I go ahead and replace my rectifier? The current draw from the battery at key off is worrisome, but as long as the VFRness fixes it, we should be good.

Nelso90

Thanks for the fast responses guys. I will get a standard VFRNess on order today. Should I go ahead and replace my rectifier? The current draw from the battery at key off is worrisome, but as long as the VFRness fixes it, we should be good.

I would just for the piece of mind .

Roll On ..

I have to do for sure the 30 amp mods , i would like to do the blue harness connector mod too , but my harness is different from yours. (see the pics)

!! no ground on the fwd side of the blue connector !!

problems encounted : engine die while running the highway, my dashboard was like a christmas tree, i don't know for the headlight lamp it happens during the day.

What solution or mods should I do?

thank you in advance guys

Has the wiring harness recall been done?

yes ,I just call honda this morning, they said they can't see my vin number , so they think its done

Should be a mark on the VIN plate if recall was completed .

Install the VFRness harness .

do you talk about the sticker on the left side of the frame .

what should I look for?

Should be a punch mark on the VIN sticker on the left side of the frame.

Switchblade

Should be a mark on the VIN plate if recall was completed .

Install the VFRness harness .

sorry switchblade , It was too late last night when i took my messages. i was reading your answer without realizing that was the answer :blush: :blush: :biggrin: :biggrin:

i didn't saw the answer last ,,,,, too tired,,, :blush: :blush: :biggrin: :biggrin:

I have tested my system this morning,

I have checked :

reg/rec---ok

stator continuity---ok

stator voltage at idle----ok (almost all the same)

charging circuit--- connecting the black lead from multimeter to positive battery and red lead from multimeter to red wire coming out from reg/rec

this should give 0.2 volt from the fault finding chart of electrosport.

and i got 0.8 volt. the chart said more than 0.2 is : "Bad connection in the positive lead from RR to battery(+)

then I touch the 30 amp holder (who is the positive wire), ouch omg that was hot

so I ordered a vfrness from wiremybike. 2 to 5 days to canada.

give you some news when its done

Switchblade

Switchblade

Should be a mark on the VIN plate if recall was completed .

Install the VFRness harness .

Every time .

Get a tube of Oxgard while you're at it and treat all the connectors and grounds. It keeps 'em happy.

I checked on my vin plate, theres nothing punched

thanks for the help guys.

finally I have installed my harness BUT

I don't know which connectors to use. could someone can help me with that?

see my pic.

which one goes with the "A" ?

which one goes with the "B" ?

Is it possible that I have 2 extra connectors left ?

A2 and B1 they only connect one way .

What you are connecting is a split of the R\R output plug. The VFRness splits the output voltage of the R\R.

thank you , now I can ffinish my installation.

one more thing.... in the instruction , in testing section , line 5. " retest the voltage at the accessory wire....."

is this line is only for people who took the option with the vfrness.?

at idle i should have 13.5 to 14.5 i have 14.2 thats good. but when I rev the bike at 5k. I still have 14.2 , the instruction says 14.3 to 14.7volts

do you think my bike is ok now?

Matrixxcat19

thank you , now I can ffinish my installation.

one more thing.... in the instruction , in testing section , line 5. " retest the voltage at the accessory wire....."

is this line is only for people who took the option with the vfrness.?

at idle i should have 13.5 to 14.5 i have 14.2 thats good. but when I rev the bike at 5k. I still have 14.2 , the instruction says 14.3 to 14.7volts

do you think my bike is ok now?

Your are good to go !

thanks a lot

I have a new problem now ,

I have done the vfrness mod , everythings seems to be good . I took my bike to go to work in a hot hot day!!! 38 degre C

while a was riding my clock reset to 1:00am all by itself.

then after a few kilometers the motor stops ,so I pull the clutch and release it to start the bike . i did it 3 times before it starts ( was riding around 90 km/h).

another thing!!! my fuel tank has a fuel level problem it says its always empty or almost empty even after a refill.

do you think that this problem can cause my motor to stop ( computer wise )

Have you tested your battery?

The clock will reset anytime the voltage drops below a specific level when you hit the Start button, wether it's a bad connection, component or battery causing the drop.

BR

The battery is new and fully charge .all the connections has been tighten

Stator ...

stator good too on the last time I tested

Matrixxcat19

stator good too on the last time I tested

BR

i just think something, could it be my switch stand (failed) :smile2: !!!!???????? :wink: :wink: :wink:

Matrixxcat19

i just think something, could it be my switch stand (failed) :smile2: !!!!???????? :wink: :wink: :wink:

A bad stand switch won't cause the clock to reset...

Check all connections and grounds as suggested but also get the harness recall done!

Hello all, I just recently got my 2003 vfr800 with 25000 miles on it. I was riding for about 100 miles then stopped to eat. Got back on the bike and started riding when my riding partner told me my lights were out. Sure enough they were and so was my whole dash! (Clock was on though, blinkers worked, and brake light worked). Rpm, speed, odometer ect didn't work. So then I got it home and looked at the fuses and they were all good. I cleaned the contacts on the battery because one looked corroded. I hooked back up the battery and now the bike won't start! Before the fuel pump would turn on even without the light comming on for it but now nothing. The bike will still crank but not start. Now I check the fuses again and the third one up is now blown. Also the plug that plugs into the starter relay is burnt. This is the only burnt wire that I found on the whole bike but this wouldn't cause the lights and dash to go out right?? I cleaned all of the connectors while I have everything off and they all look good. My bike does have the recall done because the blue connector only has the green wire on one side. Im stumped as to what would be causing this. Battery reads 12.6 when sitting. Can someone give me some things to check? Or should I just replace that fuse and connector to the relay and I should be good. It's wierd how the fuse wasn't blown before but the lights and dash still went out. Thanks in advance I need some help!!

203vfr

Hello all, I just recently got my 2003 vfr800 with 25000 miles on it. I was riding for about 100 miles then stopped to eat. Got back on the bike and started riding when my riding partner told me my lights were out. Sure enough they were and so was my whole dash! (Clock was on though, blinkers worked, and brake light worked). Rpm, speed, odometer ect didn't work. So then I got it home and looked at the fuses and they were all good. I cleaned the contacts on the battery because one looked corroded. I hooked back up the battery and now the bike won't start! Before the fuel pump would turn on even without the light comming on for it but now nothing. The bike will still crank but not start. Now I check the fuses again and the third one up is now blown. Also the plug that plugs into the starter relay is burnt. This is the only burnt wire that I found on the whole bike but this wouldn't cause the lights and dash to go out right?? I cleaned all of the connectors while I have everything off and they all look good. My bike does have the recall done because the blue connector only has the green wire on one side. Im stumped as to what would be causing this. Battery reads 12.6 when sitting. Can someone give me some things to check? Or should I just replace that fuse and connector to the relay and I should be good. It's wierd how the fuse wasn't blown before but the lights and dash still went out. Thanks in advance I need some help!!

Go to the electrical section under Forums, read the pinned posts and follow the threads - they'll guide you through what to do.

So I smelled burning wires last night. I took off the fairings today and found that the the stator/RR connection on the right side for the bike was burned/melted. Is this a sign of the RR dying or is it just a bad connector? Bike runs fine, but I did take the cover off of the stator and I noticed that part of it is dark, part of it isn't. Bike runs great and battery stays charged.

The way to tell with the R/R is to first repair the connector. Then check charging voltage across the battery to see what you have. If that's good the R/R is likely fine. My 6th gen stator looked like it had been BBQ'd at 18,000 miles. It tested good and I was getting good charge voltage, but its days were numbered, so as long as I had it out I replaced it. Difficult to tell with stators - the good die young - but some go close to 50,000 miles with no problem. My decision was easy as I often ride in remote areas far from home and cannot afford that kind of failure where there is no help.

I finally foud my problem for what the clock was resetting alone. I got the melting problem of the starter relay !!!

the starter relay was melted arond the fuse 30amp where the green plastic is , the red connector around the 4 terminals too.

now I have to change the wire with the white plastic connector.( change color)

One of my colleague at work went to his harness recall and they changed the small harness for the battery and starter relay for free.

guess who`s gonna show at honda next week?

Matrixxcat19

finally I have installed my harness BUT

I don't know which connectors to use. could someone can help me with that?

see my pic.

which one goes with the "A" ?

which one goes with the "B" ?

Is it possible that I have 2 extra connectors left ?

With that many connectors, the bike has already had the wiring harness recall completed. Before the wiring harness update, you would only have one battery connection (6-pin connector, 2 red, 2 green, 1 black/white, and a blank) to the R/R, the updated front wiring harness includes a piggy-back type connector which makes 2 of these 6-pin connectors.

Matrixxcat19

I finally foud my problem for what the clock was resetting alone. I got the melting problem of the starter relay !!!

the starter relay was melted arond the fuse 30amp where the green plastic is , the red connector around the 4 terminals too.

now I have to change the wire with the white plastic connector.( change color)

One of my colleague at work went to his harness recall and they changed the small harness for the battery and starter relay for free.

guess who`s gonna show at honda next week?

Common problem with this bike , my 03 did the same thing .

Switchblade, 10/13/2015 at 4:23 PM

Common problem with this bike , my 03 did the same thing .

David, I think your bike did it from all the Dragon rash on it!   :beer:

13 hours ago, Baileyrock

David, I think your bike did it from all the Dragon rash on it!   :beer:

Never crashed at the Dragon on it, it got totaled on Blood Mountain on 60. 

Switchblade, 8/24/2016 at 9:22 AM

Never crashed at the Dragon on it, it got totaled on Blood Mountain on 60. 

Just messing with you anyway, so details are not that important.  :goofy:

Where you been man???  :unsure:

Baileyrock, 8/25/2016 at 6:19 PM

Just messing with you anyway, so details are not that important.  :goofy:

Where you been man???  :unsure:

Right here in God's country !

Rode the   Dragon 3 times this week and went to Fraklin  for lunch Tuesday on the 51.

So many legendary 51's.  P51 . . .  Area 51. . . and of course RC51.  Lots of good company! 

9 hours ago, Switchblade

Right here in God's country !

Rode the   Dragon 3 times this week and went to Fraklin  for lunch Tuesday on the 51.

That's right, you finally got a Real bike to play on!  :blush:

12 hours ago, Baileyrock

That's right, you finally got a Real bike to play on!  :blush:

It's awesome, install a set of Met M7rr's and started pushing it hard the front forks bottom out 3 times BUT still what a blast to ride .

My friend is an electrician and i have the problem same like this and he helped me out to fix the issue. 

DaveM, 8/31/2007 at 4:44 PM

I know there are a lot of posts on this topic, but my experience was a little different and I wanted to throw it out for consideration. Over the past couple of months my 02 had developed some really serious drivability issues. Once she got over about 180deg she would start missing at constant throttle settings. In the mildest form it felt like the lean surge problem, and in its worst form you could hear individual cylinders dropping in and out and it felt like it was going to die. Moving the throttle a good bit would cause everything to pick back up but it was very annoying, and sometimes scary if you were in a corner. The problem didn’t exhibit itself constantly. Some times she would run smooth as butter for a couple of days. I had been watching the 30A B fuse for a while and it was starting to show the typical wiring insulation discoloration and signs of heat so I did one of the recommended repairs. This lowered the fuse wire temp, but it was still getting warm and the drivability problem was still there. I checked the main and front harness ground wires next – no signs of heat or discoloration, the connectors separated easily etcetera, so I didn’t implement any of the repairs suggested. I did apply some super duper Volvo electrical connector grease given to me by a friend to the blue and gray connectors. (Seems modern drive by wire Volvos occasionally develop electrical gremlins and the fix is to put this stuff on the connectors). Still no change. So, I got out the service manual and started to work my way through the wiring diagram and learned the following:

The B fuse (the one that melts) does not supply working circuits in the front harness. The power passes through the front harness to be switched by the control relays (fuel cut and I think one other), but no working circuits. This means the grounds from the front harness are not really associated with the B fuse, and the fact that both melt is a coincidence, not a cause and effect relationship. So when we fix the front grounding problem we are fixing problems related to accessory circuits and the A fuse.

This led me to start looking at the main harness. It appears the B fuse supplies all of the engine management circuits – ignition coils, injectors, TPS, O2s, etcetera. Loss of voltage in these circuits would logically seem to cause drivability problems, so I popped of the right fairing and pulled all of the engine management connectors apart. Nothing appeared to be wrong, no visible corrosion or anything, but I checked all of the female connectors and attempted to tighten any that looked to be too open, applied magical Volvo grease, and plugged everything back together. Viola! Drivability problem gone – smooth as glass at any steady throttle setting from 3500rpm up and now the B fuse is cool to the touch. Why did the problem seem heat sensitive? The only thing I can determine is a couple of the right side electrical connectors lay against the upper radiator hose, and once the coolant started to flow the connectors heated up and raised the resistance in already marginal connections.

The message here – when you’re working on your B fuse problems, check those engine management harness connectors!

I apologize for the long post, but I hope it helps someone else.

Quick Update. Two weeks, 1000+ miles, ambient temps from 47 - 94, and coolant temps from 170 - 223, still smooth. No surging, no missing, and the B fuse is staying cool. I've owned this bike for two years and 17,000 miles (had less than 2k on it when I bought it) and it has never ran this well at steady state cruise speeds. Now it's no not just fun to ride, but a pleasure to ride!! fing02.gif

Thanks for the post...i've got the same problems (thought it was a problem with synchonisation of the throttle valves....but after a few days it was the same...and getting worse faster day by day...) I'll go and check those connectors at ECU and next to the radiator.....Greetings, Lars.

Wiremybike.com for the VFRness wiring upgrade is perfect, I can build one for the ama track and this one is what I would build and be damn proud of. Upgraded to a caltric stator with a a back up ready if needed and added the Anitgravity restart ATZ-10. Started the bike with the high beams on minutes at a time started the bike 40 times randomly in a 12 hour period after the first ride. Never charged the battery immediate incredible powerful rip start every time! Dash lights and high beams are unimaginable bright compared to before. I install Glow Tek HID lights for the primary. That kit is awesome.too. I ride the country roads with no fear of needing a jump. Kn air oil filter, Power commander V and Delkevic slip ons it runs very well. Smooth as glass linear acceleration through all the gears and the vtec hits so hard now with the boosted power, you can the hear and feel the valves slam open at 6800 rpms! Wow! It truly feels like a sport tourer hitting a CR500R power band! GEEETTT ITTT! New racing Vortex sprockets and chain Her name is Hellcat! IBUYPOWERSPORTS@GMAIL.COM. I have the full build photod and video taped in professional fashion. Hit me up I'd you are interested in buying a kit with world class tutorials! Or just the tutorials. Thank you Ronnie!